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    Winterwind's Avatar

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    Jun 2007
    Southwestern Germany

    Default Re: GitP WarCraft 3: The Frozen Throne group (thread II)

    Sounds pretty much right. A couple comments:

    Quote Originally Posted by 742 View Post
    heroes: never ever ever ever ever use a paladin except against undead
    I assume you meant to say "as first hero" here. I pretty much agree with it then; however, as secondary or (more often) tertiary heroes, paladins work great to keep your army and especially your primary hero alive (the most popular hero choice for Humans is to play with three heroes: Arch Mage - Mountain King - Paladin).

    Quote Originally Posted by 742 View Post
    mountain king is my hero of choice, and is good against rushes or for early creeping. archmage is good and versatile, great ult, but squishy. blood mages are devastating against buildings late game, so against players that tend to cluster them, a blood mage is a good second choice.
    To elaborate some more:

    The Mountain King's primary purpose is as nuker - with stun bolt, he either finishes wounded units and heroes, or hurts them and prevents them from running away, so the rest of your army can finish the job.

    The Arch Mage excels at creeping with his Water Elementals, and also provides a powerful unit to the army in early battles. His aura is crucial to make other heroes and casters (who typically are a major part of a Human army) more effective. In bigger games or in late-game it is a good idea to switch to Blizzard (use a Tome of Retraining, if necessary), to hurt those big clustered armies really bad. Especially effective against ranged units, as you can hit them more easily without hitting yourself.

    The Blood Mage works primarily as either harassment hero or anti-hero hero - flamestrike is devastating to workers, mana leech and banish can totally disable enemy heroes.

    Quote Originally Posted by 742 View Post
    with undead: rod of necromancy is a good thing. its versatile and helps with offence, defence, harassing, major battles, and creeping.
    And scouting, that's important, too. Send out two skeletons to two different gold mines, and you may detect a pesky expansion before it can come up.

    Just make sure to pick moderately fresh ones. It won't do you no good if they fall apart one screen away from their goal.

    And remember, you can use corpses from the graveyard (including enemy graveyards) and from critters (like sheep, deer and such) for the rod of necromancy, too.

    Quote Originally Posted by 742 View Post
    remember your good regeneration on blight, send injured units back to heal if your DK is OOM or you picked a different hero.
    While there are situations and alternate strategies where a non-DK as first hero makes sense (the most common one being UD vs. UD), I'd actually file that under "advanced". For new players, I think I'd actually recommend going DK first 100% of the time.

    Quote Originally Posted by 742 View Post
    nerubian towers are very very good, better than spirit towers for the cost, especially if you plan the towers only to be a delay until your army can get there. even if you mass spirit towers (i cant think of a time when this is a good idea) be sure to mix in nerubian towers for the slow effect.
    Mhh... I don't really agree here.
    Spirit towers are far more damaging than Nerubian ones. Plus, they have pierce (as opposed to the Nerubian's normal), which increases their effectiveness against huntresses, casters and (almost all) air units greatly.

    Personally, I'd say: If you merely need to hold off the enemy until your army arrives, or want to prevent harrassment (that last point is important. Slowed, enemy heroes, far seer wolves and such are no longer faster than your accolytes), one or two Nerubian towers is all that you need. If, on the other hand, you want the defence to actually be able to deter, damage or hold off the enemy effectively, it should consist primarily of Spirit Towers (though I agree that one Nerubian for slow is a must).

    Quote Originally Posted by 742 View Post
    DH for initial support/muscle, DL for initial support, CL for some rushes, lich is a great second, and especially against a human nuke a dark ranger (mercenary) is not unheard of but undead is not my race. take my advice only if no other is offered.
    I'd say: Death Knight is pretty much obligatory (not necessarily as 1st, but both his coil to keep your army and other heroes alive, and his aura to assist your army are difficult to work without). Dread Lord is decent at creeping and works well to disrupt enemy hero activities (anticipate when they might cast a spell - critical healing spells like holy light or death coil would be a great example - and make them sleep just before they get to cast it). Lich is raw and massive damage output and (as only ranged UD hero) important to have someone carry the incredibly critical orb around (I cannot stress enough how crucial it is for an UD to have the orb of corruption!); he's best used as second, though works excellently as first hero in UD vs. UD games, too. And the Crypt Lord is primarily for rushes, indeed.

    Quote Originally Posted by 742 View Post
    DH/KOTG for harassing and extra muscle, POTM/KOTG for support, warden/KOTG/POTM for good seconds
    I'd argue the Warden and Priestess of the Moon work quite well for harrassment, too - Shadow Strike makes for easy kills, Searing Arrows give the PotM a damage output of a magnitude difficult to match in the early game.
    Last edited by Winterwind; 2009-05-08 at 08:49 AM.
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