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    Pixie in the Playground
     
    Kobold

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    Default [SWSE] Lightsaber damage too low?

    My friends and I have recently started playing the Star Wars RPG, but we're puzzled about how a lightsaber can do 2d8 and a blaster pistol can do 3d6. I realize they're about the same, but it just seems a lightsaber should do more.
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    Default Re: [SWSE] Lightsaber damage too low?

    Don't lightsabers always wound, instead of dealing vitality damage like other weapons?

    I probably mixed up the terms. Not a SWSE player.

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    Default Re: [SWSE] Lightsaber damage too low?

    Quote Originally Posted by DeathBD View Post
    My friends and I have recently started playing the Star Wars RPG, but we're puzzled about how a lightsaber can do 2d8 and a blaster pistol can do 3d6. I realize they're about the same, but it just seems a lightsaber should do more.
    It's true that the lightsaber does less damage than a blaster, but there are many ways to increase its damage output that can't be done for a blaster. You can't power attack with a blaster, for instance.

    Not only that, but you also can't sever a limb with a blaster.

    Oddly enough, you can't do it with a vibroaxe, either...
    Last edited by TheCountAlucard; 2008-12-24 at 09:01 AM.
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    Default Re: [SWSE] Lightsaber damage too low?

    Quote Originally Posted by Tengu_temp View Post
    Don't lightsabers always wound, instead of dealing vitality damage like other weapons?

    I probably mixed up the terms. Not a SWSE player.
    You're thinking the old Star Wars d20 system. In Saga Edition, lightsaber bypass all damage reduction (which on things like blast doors is nothing to sneeze at) and, as melee weapons, can get many more bonuses to damage (Strength bonus to damage, Power Attack, wielding two handed, etc.). Not to mention the defensive benefits with the Block, Deflect, and Redirect Shot. Both have their pros and cons, which I think was the point. Other classes can compare to Jedi in SWSE, unlike in older editions, where Jedi outshone every other class, pretty much all the time.
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    SamuraiGuy

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    Default Re: [SWSE] Lightsaber damage too low?

    On one hand, the damage for lightsabers is a bit low. However this is a balance choice, as there are other things to consider.

    Like the poster above stated, there are more ways to increase damage with the lightsaber than with a blaster. The lightsaber has incredible utility and is a great defensive weapon even at lower levels.

    Once you get to prestige classes, the damage can easily even out.

    Others will have better advice on exactly how to ptimize it.

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    Default Re: [SWSE] Lightsaber damage too low?

    Lightsabers benefit more from Rapid Strike than blasters do from Rapid Shot, too.
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    SolithKnightGuy

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    Default Re: [SWSE] Lightsaber damage too low?

    Less damage? Low damage? Not at all!

    Ranged weapons get 3d(whatever) plus half level. Then you have a bunch of talents and feats to increase past that (Rapid Shot, Aiming feats, Weapon Spc)

    Melee weapons (lightsabers/advanced) get 2d(whatever plus half level plus strength modifier (or plus DOUBLE strength modifier wielded two-handed). Then, you have talents and feats (Rapid Strike, Power Attack, Weapon Spec). For most characters with decent strnegth, that +str modifier (or double strength modifier) is HUGE. A character with 12 Strength makes a lightsabe and a blaster roughly equal in damage (plus the lightsaber's habit of ignoring DR!). A character with decently high strnegth and a two-handed swing of the lightsaber? Breaking damage thresholds every chance they get and killing people in just a few blows.

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    Default Re: [SWSE] Lightsaber damage too low?

    And don't even get us started about some of the force powers that'll boost your damage, such as Battle Strike and Dark Rage.
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    Default Re: [SWSE] Lightsaber damage too low?

    Quote Originally Posted by ShaggyMarco View Post
    Less damage? Low damage? Not at all!

    Ranged weapons get 3d(whatever) plus half level. Then you have a bunch of talents and feats to increase past that (Rapid Shot, Aiming feats, Weapon Spc)

    Melee weapons (lightsabers/advanced) get 2d(whatever plus half level plus strength modifier (or plus DOUBLE strength modifier wielded two-handed). Then, you have talents and feats (Rapid Strike, Power Attack, Weapon Spec). For most characters with decent strnegth, that +str modifier (or double strength modifier) is HUGE. A character with 12 Strength makes a lightsabe and a blaster roughly equal in damage (plus the lightsaber's habit of ignoring DR!). A character with decently high strnegth and a two-handed swing of the lightsaber? Breaking damage thresholds every chance they get and killing people in just a few blows.
    High strength OR high dexterity (ataru makes your dex bonus work the exact same way as strength bonus...even doubling it two handed.) And honestly, if you don't have high strength and/or dexterity, you aren't really expected to be a combat-monkey anyway.
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    ElfRangerGuy

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    Default Re: [SWSE] Lightsaber damage too low?

    I agree that it seems low when you look at it, but that it works out well in practice.
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    Default Re: [SWSE] Lightsaber damage too low?

    Average of 2d8 = 9
    Average of 3d6 = 10.5

    1.5 damage? Not a big difference. Especially when you've got modifiers to the lightsaber.

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    Ogre in the Playground
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    Default Re: [SWSE] Lightsaber damage too low?

    Two-handed Str bonus and half your level soon zings the damage up.

    My Jedi 2/Scout 3 does 2D8+8 damage, courtesy of having Str 16, which is a lot more than the Jedi 5 who doesn't get a Strength bonus, so is just rolling with 2D8+2. Then there's Battle Strike, which adds dice.
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    Default Re: [SWSE] Lightsaber damage too low?

    As said before, damage is calculated differently between ranged and melee weapons

    Ranged is Weapon Damage + One-Half Level

    Melee is Weapon Damage + One-Half Level + Strength Mod, or Weapon Damage + One-Half Level + Double Strength Mod if you wield the weapon with both hands

    While there are various ways to get bonuses, that is how you determine Basic Damage

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    Ogre in the Playground
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    Default Re: [SWSE] Lightsaber damage too low?

    If you've got a character with decent Strength, Battlestrike, Weapon Specialisation (lightsabers) and Powerful Charge, you're golden. Unlike Rapid Strike (which I personally don't think is very good), Powerful Charge gives you attack and damage bonuses.

    As before, my character has Str 16, he's got no trouble laying on the smack, even though he only has one instance of Battlestrike per encounter. He's hardly combat-optimised either, yet he can keep pace with the pure Jedi even having lost a point of BAB for having Scout levels.

    Coll Arranda CL 5

    Medium Human Jedi 2/scout 3
    Init +9; Senses Perception +9
    Languages Basic

    Defenses Ref 20 (flat-footed 17), Fort 17, Will 18; Deflect, Evasion
    hp 63; Threshold 17

    Speed 8 squares
    Melee lightsaber +7 (2d8+5) or
    Melee lightsaber +7 (2d8+8) with both hands or
    Melee combat gloves +7 (1d6+6)
    Ranged blaster rifle +6 (3d8+2) or
    Ranged blaster rifle +1 (3d8+2) with autofire
    Base Atk +4; Grp +7
    Atk Options autofire (blaster rifle)
    Special Actions Shake It Off
    Force Powers Known (Use The Force +8) battle strike, move object, surge

    Abilities Str 16, Dex 14, Con 13, Int 10, Wis 14, Cha 12
    Talents Deflect, Evasion, Long Stride
    Feats Force Sensitive, Force Training, Martial Arts I, Shake it Off, Skill Training (2), Weapon Proficiency (lightsabers, pistols, rifles, simple)
    Skills Acrobatics +9, Climb +10, Endurance +8, Initiative +9, Perception +9, Stealth +9, Survival +9, Use the Force +8
    Next level will be Jedi and Block, along with more Force Training for added options (though I don't do directly offensive powers for this character, they'll be Negate Energy, Rebuke and Vital Transfer).

    As I said, he's not really optimised, yet we've got a 5th level character doing a lot of damage with a lightsaber. Had I gone pure Jedi I could have gotten Weapon Specialisation by now.
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    Pixie in the Playground
     
    Kobold

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    Default Re: [SWSE] Lightsaber damage too low?

    Thanks for all the help, guys! I didn't really think about all the bonuses. I don't have have that much experience with d20 systems.
    I've got a secret. It's on the tip of my tongue and on the back of my lungs, and I'm gonna keep it! I know something you don't know!

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    Ogre in the Playground
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    Default Re: [SWSE] Lightsaber damage too low?

    Quote Originally Posted by Tar Palantir View Post
    Other classes can compare to Jedi in SWSE, unlike in older editions, where Jedi outshone every other class, pretty much all the time.
    And just as importantly, you don't even have to have levels in Jedi either to be a good Force user, or indeed to be a Jedi.
    Last edited by Kiero; 2008-12-25 at 07:08 PM.
    Wushu Open Reloaded
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    In Sanity We Trust Productions - our podcasting site where you can hear our dulcet tones, updated almost every week.

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    Default Re: [SWSE] Lightsaber damage too low?

    We had a SWSE session last night in which our ninth-level party was confronted by a Dark Jedi. The Mandalorian and the party's assassin droid open fire on her. Only one shot manages to break her crazy-high Reflex Defense, and the damage roll was very poor. Realizing that we needed to get the heck out of there, the Jedi in our party attempts to charge her as a distraction, allowing the rest of us to escape. Since he realized he could only hit on a nat 20, he decided to Power Attack and Rapid Strike and all the rest.

    Bam. 20.

    After a few moments of cheering, we began calculating his damage, and he did upwards of 50 with that hit, more than enough to knock her down the condition track. After that, she fled into the night, and we decided not to stick around, in case she came back with reinforcements.

    So yeah...
    It is inevitable, of course, that persons of epicurean refinement will in the course of eternity engage in dealings with those of... unsavory character. Record well any transactions made, and repay all favors promptly.. (Thanks to Gnomish Wanderer for the Toreador avatar! )

    Wanna see what all this Exalted stuff is about? Here's a primer!

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