Erfworld 139 The Battle for Gobwin Knob, Page 126

[SteveMB]

Why do we need a mechanism here? Ansom is saying that he will "fine" them their spoils if they fail to follow his orders.

True; he may be looking at a hefty penalty clause if he fails to deliver Lord Hamster alive and fining a faction their cut may be intended to recoup (and perhaps only in part) that cost.

As somebody already noted, Ansom does come across as high-handed to his allies (for all they know, he's insisting on taking the enemy chief warlord alive, possibly at greater risk to allied units, simply so he can have the pleasure of croaking him personally to avenge that taunting Thinkagram).

[SinsI]

If Ansom is smart, he'll kill Parson and claim it was an unavoidable mistake.

Charlie's contracts are magically binding - Ansom has to do everything to fulfill his part of agreement.

[DevilDan]

Charlie's contracts are magically binding - Ansom has to do everything to fulfill his part of agreement.

Plus, Ansom may be the sort who keeps his word anyway. It would be the "honorable" thing to do.

[Manoftyr]

Wow, so shockamancy=4chan and its floodgate of hellish spawn.

Come to think of it, that's really, really, REALLY appropriate...shockamancy must be some truly fearsome and terribly magic indeed.

I wonder what the boop Wanda was planning to do with it all?

[Turbidus]

I'm not sure if the coalition warlords' poor self-defense might not have something to do with Maggie and Thinkamancy - suggesting "let's step away from the bodyguard with the other warlord for a quick private chat" and "normally I'd keep my sword within arm's reach, but it'd be impolite to reach for it when pulled aside by a fellow warlord". Maggie is supposed to target leadership, too.

As for a Dirtamancer used to burrow up: I think Ansom saw this as a defensive measure, a way to save a caster. Sure he failed to realise its full potential, but it's not like he wouldn't have expected it if a similar situation (valuable target in distress) came up again.

Why isn't a "it came from below"-attack a well known and anticipated trick? Just guessing again but perhaps burrowing movement is prohibitively expensive in terms of movement points, thus only really useful in a city defense (free movement). How many Dirtamancers have defended a city in the history of Erfworld? How many of their Overlords and Chief Warlords have defied the conventional wisdom of keeping casters to the rear? I do find it plausible that no one has ever seriously considered the trick. If there are coalition survivors, expect to see a rise in freshly popped Dirtamancers.

I'm starting to sound like a bit of a fanboy, I note. It's a good comic and apparently I want to interpret everything that happens as having a thought-out reason and explanation.

[Stormthorn]

4Chan Huh? I read on wiki that this is a hacker group? What do they have to do with anything?

Well i suppose in that i is a hangout for the mass off sociopaths and low-end hackers know as Anonymous. They are only really a threat in that there are enough of them to DOS you if you **** with them. Recently they have been too busy attacking the church of scientology and people with epilipsy to bother you perosnaly however. They liek to do things like go into sim-mmos' and make giant swashticas (probably mangled the spelling on that.) and whatnot.

I wonder what the boop Wanda was planning to do with it all?
__________________

Do you...really want to know...?

[Kender Wizard]

Wow, the last few updates have been excellent. Trying very hard to restrain myself to the current topic of the thread.

IMHO Parson has set himself up a solid win. First off, he has the squad of golems (metal and rock classed as heavies, strike as hard as a garrison unit (presumably extremely hard-hitters, though we have not seen a garrison unit in combat) when led by Sizemore, can apparently pinpoint and attack select targets without having to engage enemy stacks while in transit, whose golems can be healed by Sizemore, whose crap golems apparently have a self-destruct special attack triggerable by dirtamancer, and so on) attack and eliminate the leadership.

He and Wanda will assault the enemy forces. If memory serves, there are still two uncroaked warlords left.

Parsons stack - himself, 1 uncroaked warlord, Bogroll, at least the top 5 remaining knights (full chief warlord bonus + stack bonus for at least 8 units + uncroaked warlord bonus + high lvl and heavy units in the stack)

Wandas stack - herself, 1 uncroaked warlord, at least 6 weak uncroaked (her massive bonus to uncroaked + uncroaked warlord bonus + stack bonus for at least 8 units + chief warlord partial bonus (see recent Transylvito vs Stanley fight) - weaker unit types)

Keep in mind that more troops can probably be cycled in as needed.

Incidentally, IMO, it is unlikely that the warlords were taken prisoner, simply because Parson did not give that order. Secondly, Sizemore would have to take time out to restrain them at the very least, and Maggie and Wanda (the only two currently in GK shown to be capable of thinkamancy spells) are most likely too busy to deal with prisoners right now. It could have happened, but given Sizemores' current attitude and orders, I wouldn't say its very likely.

And, now for Maggie:
[spoiler]He also has Maggie casting thinkamancy at the leadership. She knows Parson believes (and likely believes herself) that the coalition is close to breaking. You remember thinkamancy? The stuff that can modify loyalty? Assuming Maggie acts at any point in the near future, the lovely redhead might end up loyalty-spell-modded to leave or to attack Ansom (she may be only a few solid nudges away from that now, given her previous sharp, vocal disagreements and the recent scat bomb) [\spoiler]

The only pinch now is Ansom himself. Looking forward to the next update.

[Turbidus]

He and Wanda will assault the enemy forces.

I agree that Parson and Wanda will be combat leaders soon. But would it really be best to have two separate stacks? As far as I know, only the bonus for stacking units maxes out at 8 units. The bonus for the Chief Warlord being in the same hex and the bonus for being in the Chief Warlord's stack add up according to Vinnie. The "huge" Croakamancer bonus to Uncroaked in the stack could be cumulative with those, and so could the Dirtamancer bonus with the Golems. Parson has his back to the wall. If he cannot be outmaneuvered (the Coalition has only one way to attack him now), why not make one superstack with everything (excluding perhaps Maggie) in it? It could be far superior to having lots of small stacks optimized for stack bonus (the conventional way) but missing out on maximising the other bonuses. Parson should be able to calculate the odds. It would expose the casters to risk, but what is there to save them for if this stand fails?

Now supposing Parson formed a superstack, Ansom might be tempted to do the same. Except that having just experienced a surgical strike from below, he might prefer staying in the air instead of joining the infantry.

[Godskook]

Stomp-stomp-clap, stomp-stomp-clap...

That one requires Sizemore.

[HandofShadows]

IIRC Paston said he would be with Wanda. Since she is still injured, I think he would want to be VERY close to make sure nothing happens to her. That puts them both in the same stack. sm

[gatitcz]

Great page. One thing I'm wondering now: If the Coalition warlords for a side die, what happens to that side in the Coalition? Can Ansom still control them if command hasn't been transferred? Or does it automatically transfer? Or do they just hang around, not attacking allied sides but not moving to attack anyone else who doesn't engage them?

"Croaking him will forfeit your spoils."

...Ansom's deal with Charlies: that he has to capture Parson and turn him over to Charlie in the event that the RCC is successful in its assault against GK.

But I think it also reveals two other things:

1. he issues an order in the context of a threat but doesn't bother to explain why. It's just a matter or do this or face negative consequences.

2. Charlie's contract: ...if Parson is booped, then the price of the contract for Ansom increases.

Both good points. The first is in line with the "fined-if-you-disobey" theory, and it's probably what the RCC warlords are thinking if Ansom hasn't bothered to explain, which may affect morale. But look at it another way. It's probable that whoever croaks a unit gets that unit's equipment. If Charlie can't have Parson, he still wants that bracer. Hence contractual obligation.

Dirtamancers have very utilitarian functions

There's also a very utilitarian function that makes Sizemore very useful

Actually, the way I heard it in my head upon first reading more resembled the guttural "SNORLAX" sound from Smash Brothers. Only, you know, saying "FOUR-CHAN", which is infinitely more horrific.

I heard it like "Fatality!" myself

Parsons stack...

Wandas stack...

If Wanda's in Parson's stack, both uncroaked Warlords would get and give bonuses. Bigger multiplier. Plus there may be some item/artifact bonuses from the sword, glasses, and bracer.

[Sieggy]

I am wondering just how much the RCC is aware of what happened on the top of the wall? Especially, are they fully aware of the deal Ansom made with Charlie? They know there's now an alliance, but Ansom made the deal separate and alone. Not to mention in an extremely tight situation. If he got bent over and rogered roundly, I really doubt he'd admit it . . .

From below, they saw Ansom being attacked, take a fall, then get back up on his carpet with the assistance of the Archons. From their perspective below and outside the wall, it's very unlikely they have any details. If they become aware of whatever it was that made Ansom balk, that may turn out to be a coalition breaker right there.

This may provide a lot of ammo for Maggie, who can use Thinkamancy to sow seeds of suspicion about just what Ansom agreed to up there . . . not that she knows herself, mind you . . .

Awesome page, BTW. The subtlety and savvy of the authors is remarkable.

I definitely think that the fact that we're reading the strip on a somewhat randomly updated basis gives us all time to speculate and kvetch about things that would never spring to mind if we were reading it all in one sitting. Dickens had the same problem with his serialized stories in the 19th century magazines; he was inundated with mail from people doing what we're doing now on-line.

[chaoschristian]

Charlie's contracts are magically binding - Ansom has to do everything to fulfill his part of agreement.

Charlie's contract with Parson is magically binding. We don't know the full terms, extent or parameters and means of enforcement regarding the new contract between Charlie and Anson (and by extension, presumably, the entire RCC.)

It could be magically binding. Or there could be really, really severe de-motivators included if Ansom fails to fulfill his part of the obligation.

[DevilDan]

IMHO Parson has set himself up a solid win. First off, he has the squad of golems (metal and rock classed as heavies, strike as hard as a garrison unit (presumably extremely hard-hitters, though we have not seen a garrison unit in combat) when led by Sizemore, can apparently pinpoint and attack select targets without having to engage enemy stacks while in transit,

I think that a "garrison unit" would have some sort of terrain bonus, but the idea was that the scouts would be taken out by an large force of heavies, such as would be kept in reserve and deployed when someone is sniffing around the core of you city, rather than by guards or a scouting party. Casters are commanders, so it's very much confirmed that units in his stack don't attack indiscriminately.

That doesn't mean that this is a slam dunk for Parson; he's outnumbered still and his units are of lower quality. Sizemore can heal his units, and maybe Wanda can heal uncroaked or provide additional buffs, but Ansom has what appears to be a good number of healers on his side. Parson's calculation was that he could "possibly" hold the garrison with Wanda's assistance.

It just occurred to me that one reason to take the warlords alive is that they could be convinced by Ansom (with Maggie's help?) to back out or stay back. He did list conversion and division as the two most important objectives.

[Lamech]

If those warlords got captured and get turned by maggie... Duke-Nozzel has the authority to pull his units out and I'm assuming blue clad could do the same.

They could "escape" through the tunnels just like Jillian... with spell on them just like Jillian... Duke-Nozzel won't have trouble fabricating reasons... the blue-clad shouldn't either after cracks start to form...

It will be even funnier if Ansom tries to call them out after Jillian didi the same thing.

[SteveMB]

If those warlords got captured and get turned by maggie... Duke-Nozzel has the authority to pull his units out and I'm assuming blue clad could do the same.

They could "escape" through the tunnels just like Jillian...

That would be a bit difficult to explain with the tunnel entrances sealed.

[Radar]

That would be a bit difficult to explain with the tunnel entrances sealed.

Hmm... now, that i read that page, i noticed, that Maggie was part of some plan allready in the previous turn. I wonder, what that was.

[fendrin]

That would be a bit difficult to explain with the tunnel entrances sealed.

It occurs to me that unless Sizemore sealed the tunnel entrance he just made behind him, it could give the RCC a way to get to the garrison without taking the courtyard walls.

[stsasser]

Parsons stack - himself, 1 uncroaked warlord, Bogroll, at least the top 5 remaining knights (full chief warlord bonus + stack bonus for at least 8 units + uncroaked warlord bonus + high lvl and heavy units in the stack)

Did Ansom also just make Parson all but invincible to RCC troops? Was that part of Charlie's plan?

[slayerx]

Hmm... now, that i read that page, i noticed, that Maggie was part of some plan allready in the previous turn. I wonder, what that was.

I think phase two was uncroaking the enemy troops... Parson was just refering to maggie because she was the only one there with him and she handles much of the communications

Did Ansom also just make Parson all but invincible to RCC troops? Was that part of Charlie's plan?

It can be guessed that, given Ansom's insistence of capturing Parson, that there is a good chance that the capture of Parson and handing him over to charlie was part of the amended contract... Ansom wouldn't care about giving up the mathamancy artifact and might let allowing Charlie first dibs on spoils slide, but i think Ansom was looking forward to croaking Lord Hamster after what he's done... not to mention that capturing a chief warlord is bound to be very troublesome... hence Ansom's outrage over the amended contract


it actually makes me feel as though Parson may just still loose this battle... i mean, Parson's capture would lead to his survival, and we already know that Parson was planning on sending the casters to the magic kingdom if everything goes to boop... In Theory, if Ansom wins, most of the named characters will still make it out alive... the only questionable one being Bogroll, but it would not surpirse me if he died to save his lord

[Decius]

Use Sizemore once or twice more, whack a few warlords, uncroak them for some nice "Fighting in the Backfield" action.

Then have Maggie put a few suggestions... "That warlord and his troops are uncroaked and fighting against you."

Also, if Parson knows about the capture-only order, disguising Bogroll as Parson becomes massively powerful. How cool is "Regeneration" when the enemy refuses to kill you?

[Lamech]

That would be a bit difficult to explain with the tunnel entrances sealed.

If it wasn't for all these pesky facts my theories would work so much better...
Unless...

It occurs to me that unless Sizemore sealed the tunnel entrance he just made behind him, it could give the RCC a way to get to the garrison without taking the courtyard walls.

Although I'm sure they'll try the tunnels again. 'cause it worked to well last time. And down in the tunnels dirtomancers will be so much easier to protect against. No wait that doesn't make any sense fear will keep them out. Unless they think the dirtomancer died... Memory powder?

Secondly, I'm betting Charlie also asked for Parson's equitment. Ansom is going to be even more ticked off. I wonder if greed could set in and break the coalition even if they take GK.

[Tubercular Ox]

That doesn't mean that this is a slam dunk for Parson;

I agree. People need to remember Ansom's thick Plot Armor before declaring anything a solid win. It'll lead to a lot less disappointment later on. Something's going to go wrong, plans, contact with enemy, etc. Whether it's game changing remains to be seen.

[Welf]

People need to remember Ansom's thick Plot Armor...

Or his 6.000+ troops including lots of heavies and healers, his own impressive leadership bonus or his powerful ally up in the sky. He obviously can only survive by pure plotpowers.

[gatitcz]

If those warlords got captured and get turned by maggie... Duke-Nozzel has the authority to pull his units out and I'm assuming blue clad could do the same.

I don't know that a turned unit will retain any command over his former side. Even if it did, units are compelled to obey unless it goes against some higher power, like their Ruler, and betraying sides their Ruler's allied with would probably qualify.

[Suicide Junkie]

There wouldn't be much betrayal in doing exactly what their leader wanted to do before Ansom made his dash to the wall... cut your losses and retreat.

Once one of them goes, the rest should soon follow, and then it would just be Ansom and the Archons left to deal with.

[Welf]

I doubt that the warlords were captured, yet I hope it. Maybe they can be sold back to their kingdoms for ransom after the war, or even used to make their overlords break the alliance, if they were valuable chief warlords and nobles.

[MReav]

Or his 6.000+ troops including lots of heavies and healers, his own impressive leadership bonus or his powerful ally up in the sky. He obviously can only survive by pure plotpowers.

And artifact, you can't forget artifact.

[Yellowchopstick]

So how would capturing Parson work anyway? I would assume the normal way would be to knock out/beat someone within an inch of their lives and then drag them back. But no one can see Parson's hit points right? How would the Coalition forces know how hard to hit him, they'd end up holding themselves back to avoid overkill, since I assume Parson wouldn't go quietly.

[hobbes3]

I'm surprised no one mentioned this picture:

http://studentorganizations.missouri...helangelo1.jpg