New Star Trek Movie

**Dervag** · 2009-05-10, 03:15 PM (ISO 8601)

Originally Posted by LCR

I liked the movie, but it wasn't really Star Trek anymore. I do have a couple of questions/nitpicks, though:

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1) Why are Sulu and Chekov older (or at least more senior) than Kirk? I always thought the Original Series Chekov/Sulu were meant to be younger and to be tutored by the older Kirk. How does time travel change those age differences?

2) Who in God's name promotes a completely inexperienced cadet to first officer? And what kind of mock-military then promotes said cadet to captain of the flagship? I would have understood if they had promoted him to lieutenant right away (he'd still would have skipped two ranks this way), but to captain? Come on ...

3) Are there no senior officers in Star Fleet to man the bridge on the Federation flagship? The whole bridge crew seems to consist of newly commissioned cadets (except for Spock).

4) Why does McCoy attend Starfleet Academy? He's already a doctor when he boards the shuttle with Kirk and shouldn't have to go through the whole drill.

5) Why has the Enterprise more than one Warpcore? And why looked main engineering like the engine room in a 19th century steam ship? Even engineering in Enterprise (that other mostly godawful prequel) looked more futuristic than this.

6) Why did the Old Spock just accept Vulcan's demise? He's obviously quite smart and knows about time travel (did it himself quite a few times). He could just fix everything, yet seems to be contented by picking out a new planet for the few surviving vulcans.

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1) Kirk enters Starfleet academy late. Instead of going into the academy in his teens in response to his father's example, his being raised by a single mom (with some implied child abuse) leads him into a dead-end life as "the only genius-level repeat offender in the Midwest." He doesn't join the Academy until he's 21 or 22, which means that by his junior year, officers several years younger than him (like Sulu and Chekov) are now his fellow students.

2) It's strongly implied that Starfleet has effectively no experienced officers available to man the seven ships sent to relieve Vulcan. That's why they draft the Starfleet Academy trainers and cadets en masse. Those ships are in the yard for one reason or another, and they haven't had full officer complements appointed, so the most promising cadets get pulled on board to take up the slack... which leads to

3) In that case, it's quite possible that Pike, God help him, has no one he considers more qualified to act as first officer than Kirk. He may have other commissioned officers aboard, but only in specialist tracks (you don't want the medical officer commanding the ship in combat), or have them be nothing but time-servers who aren't suitable for a crisis situation- like the previous comm officer Uhura replaces, who can't identify Romulan transmissions).

By contrast, Pike has been grooming Kirk's tactical instincts and command skills for three years. He's just proven his tactical instincts by correctly predicting that they were flying into an ambush. And (this is important) Pike doesn't seriously expect anything to happen that would force Spock to relinquish command... and Spock is qualified.

4) Yes, McCoy should have to go through at least an abbreviated version of Starfleet Academy before being assigned aboard ship. He must become familiar with shipboard life (note that he's deeply uncomfortable with space travel at first). He must learn military procedures and the use of military hardware. And he's going to need specialized training in the kinds of injuries and diseases a Starfleet doctor is most likely to face (phaser burns are probably not a common problem back in Georgia).

5) The Enterprise has multiple warp cores for a good engineering reason- failsafes. Several smaller cores have a big advantage over one large one; you can shut down one before a malfunction becomes serious, because you have others to take up the load.

Also, to me at least, the Enterprise engineering compartments look as much like the insides of a modern nuclear reactor than like a Victorian engine room. It's likely that in the future, people will pay more attention to making machinery accessible for maintenance than they will to making everything look all ergonomic and futuristic, just as they do today or did in the past. At least, they will if they're smart. By that standard, the Enterprise engineering room is good- you can get at things without having to cut apart the walls.

6)Without the "red matter" or the advanced tech aboard his own ship, it's likely that he can't specifically arrange a time travel operation to save Vulcan. At the very least, any such operation would have to be carefully planned and prepared if there was to be any chance of actually stopping Nero. Who says that at the end of the movie, he isn't in the planning stages of an operation like that? Even if he wants to do it, it would be grossly illogical to go off unprepared, with limited resources and a tech base over a century inferior to the stuff his enemy has.

Moreover, even if Spock does exactly that, he'll probably just be creating another alternate timeline. It might be worthwhile, but it won't save the universe.

Originally Posted by puppyavenger

[spoiler] The Drill over earth reach through the atmosphere and the drill was powerful enough to reach the earths core in a matter of minutes/hours. S, even assuming that there's some special shield around the drill to concentrate energy (a very good idea, and the only possible way Kirk and co could have done their attempted heroics on Vulcan) how does whats basically a space elevator falling form the sky have no affect on the local climate? shouldn't it cause some mass destruction? yet the academy that (from what I understand from one viewing) is on the same bay that the drill was directed at is completely unharmed from the events of the movie.

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The space elevator in question isn't nearly as long as a conventional one; to use it, Nero's ship has to hover in low planetary orbit. The drill cable itself may "only" be fifty to a hundred miles long. It's not extremely massive, either- large, but not huge.

Moreover, we don't know how much time passes between the destruction of the drill and the ceremony in the final scene. If it were several months, it's quite possible that with Federation-level technology,the needed repairs to get the Academy running again could be made.

Damage to the Federation capital would be severe, but it need not be all-encompassing (especially if most of the drill cable fell out in the Pacific, and not onto the city itself)

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also, should the Black hole from all those red matter droplets be bigger, rather then smaller then the one made from only one?

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Perhaps- but on the other hand, it may be that to get full effect from a given droplet of red matter you have to enclose it in a specially designed device. For example, any large block of plutonium will explode, but to get a gigantic mushroom cloud explosion you must use shaped charges to compact the plutonium into a denser mass. So what we're seeing here is an uncontrolled red matter reaction, instead of the precisely controlled ones used before. Despite using a much larger total mass, you might get quite a bit less in the way of singularity.

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Originally Posted by Dumbledore lives

Just saw it and I thought it was very good, though my opinion of Star Trek is based on a couple episodes of the original series, I really haven't seen much Star Trek at all. The black holes didn't really make much sense, but the rest of the movie makes up for it. Also I liked how they mainly adhered to the no sound in space.

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With the final explosion I swear they were right by Earth, considering the warp took basically no time. And wouldn't the huge black hole affect something negatively, just maybe.

Given that Star Trek warp drive operates at speeds tens or hundreds of times the speed of light, even a few seconds in warp drive at relatively leisurely power levels would be enough to flick them millions of kilometers from Earth.

**Seraph** · 2009-05-10, 04:02 PM (ISO 8601)

Originally Posted by Dervag

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Perhaps- but on the other hand, it may be that to get full effect from a given droplet of red matter you have to enclose it in a specially designed device. For example, any large block of plutonium will explode, but to get a gigantic mushroom cloud explosion you must use shaped charges to compact the plutonium into a denser mass. So what we're seeing here is an uncontrolled red matter reaction, instead of the precisely controlled ones used before. Despite using a much larger total mass, you might get quite a bit less in the way of singularity.

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The way I saw it, red matter worked by becoming a core of a singularity and drawing in surrounding matter to increase its mass. (yes I know that tat sentence makes no sense, bear with me.) you could get dramatic reactions from planets and supernovae because there's a lot of matter around to fuel the reaction, but the black hole at the end was relatively small because it was only feeding off a single ship, even if it did have significantly more red matter to work as a catalyst.

**kamikasei** · 2009-05-10, 05:05 PM (ISO 8601)

Originally Posted by Dervag

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Damage to the Federation capital would be severe, but it need not be all-encompassing (especially if most of the drill cable fell out in the Pacific, and not onto the city itself)

A nit:

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Paris is the Federation capital, not San Francisco. San Francisco is just the site of Starfleet Command and Academy. The capital of Earth, in turn, may be somewhere else again (New York?).

Originally Posted by Dervag

Given that Star Trek warp drive operates at speeds tens or hundreds of times the speed of light, even a few seconds in warp drive at relatively leisurely power levels would be enough to flick them millions of kilometers from Earth.

In the movie, warp drive seemed absurdly fast, so if they enter warp at all they should be able (from a narrative standpoint) to go from any point in a system to any other.

**Dervag** · 2009-05-10, 07:28 PM (ISO 8601)

Originally Posted by kamikasei

A nit:
Paris is the Federation capital, not San Francisco. San Francisco is just the site of Starfleet Command and Academy. The capital of Earth, in turn, may be somewhere else again (New York?).

That really isn't a spoiler, if you ask me, since the only way you'd ever find it out is by looking at stuff that isn't in the movie. Certainly it's not a plot point.

That said, I'll take your word for it.
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In the movie, warp drive seemed absurdly fast, so if they enter warp at all they should be able (from a narrative standpoint) to go from any point in a system to any other.

Even if warp drive isn't "absurdly" fast, it is by definition an FTL drive or the Federation wouldn't even exist. Any FTL drive can be used to travel very fast inside a solar system.

**Finn Solomon** · 2009-05-10, 08:14 PM (ISO 8601)

Originally Posted by Texas_Ben

I disagree:

But that's my point. If Chris Pine had played it over the top he would have come across as Pine playing William Shatner playing Kirk. As it is he brings his own take to the character, and doesn't come off as imitating Shatner.

**adanedhel9** · 2009-05-10, 08:24 PM (ISO 8601)

Saw it last night; I think I need to see it again to decide whether I really liked it or not. The movie runs at such a frenetic pace that I didn't really have time to think about most of it.

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On the "supernova that threatens the galaxy": my immediate thought was that Spock was speaking metaphorically (since the literal interpretation is just absurd). At the end of DS9 and the TNG movies, peace between the Federation and Romulus was a distinct possibility. Romulus (or another nearby star) going supernova could have certainly threatened the potential galactic peace.
On the new look of engineering: The engineer in me appreciates the ease of access, clear labeling, etc. But the trekkie in me would've liked at least a shot of the "pillar" warp core style. I could see that configuration making sense when surrounded by the new style.
How did the warp core detonation keep the Enterprise from falling into the black hole? The force in an explosion isn't some intangible energy - it's carried the exploding matter. The exploding matter would be affected by the black hole just as much as the Enterprise; it shouldn't have had any effect on the Enterprise's fate.

**Llama231** · 2009-05-10, 09:23 PM (ISO 8601)

I finally got around to seeing it making it the last real movie that I have seen in theaters since Pirates 3. I have my nitpicks (pretty much the same as everyone else), but overall I found it quite awesomesauce. It kind of seems like they are setting it up for a new series with all of this alternate reality stuff, a less experienced Kirk, and an annoyingly done romanticism.

**The Tygre** · 2009-05-10, 10:23 PM (ISO 8601)

Saw it last night.
Loved it.
'Twas awesome.
And I will definitely be seeing it again.

**SOdhner** · 2009-05-11, 02:03 PM (ISO 8601)

I had One Major Complaint but other than that it was a lot of fun.

Yes, there were some odd things with the science or logic or whatever, but I expect a certain amount of that from Star Trek and this was well below what it would have needed to be to bother me.

I was very pleased, and I'm looking forward to more.

**BRC** · 2009-05-11, 04:06 PM (ISO 8601)

I discussed it with my friends today, and we realized something major.

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So, Nero wants to destroy Earth and Vulcan. He has a ship full of black-hole creating red matter, and he has a giant drill thingy that can go straight to a planet's core. Either one of these, on it's own, could destroy a planet. Either by eating it up in a black hole, or simply by rewriting it's climate and topography by digging a hole with a giant laser. That alone would cause plenty of problems.

And yet, he seems determined that he must use both these weapons. Black Holes are very nasty things, just detonating some of that red matter near the surface of the planet should be enough, you don't have to dig a big hole in it first.

**The Tygre** · 2009-05-11, 04:07 PM (ISO 8601)

The science and technical stuff doesn't really weird me out. I just expect any given Sci-Fi movie to miss some details. Besides, years of Enterprise has dulled my senses to logic and good Star Trek.

**Graybacca** · 2009-05-11, 07:41 PM (ISO 8601)

Originally Posted by BRC

I discussed it with my friends today, and we realized something major.

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So, Nero wants to destroy Earth and Vulcan. He has a ship full of black-hole creating red matter, and he has a giant drill thingy that can go straight to a planet's core. Either one of these, on it's own, could destroy a planet. Either by eating it up in a black hole, or simply by rewriting it's climate and topography by digging a hole with a giant laser. That alone would cause plenty of problems.

And yet, he seems determined that he must use both these weapons. Black Holes are very nasty things, just detonating some of that red matter near the surface of the planet should be enough, you don't have to dig a big hole in it first.

Yes, but think of it form a revenge crazed Romulans point of view, whats more fun watching a planet be pulled apart peace by peace from the outside or watching a planet pull it's self apart form the inside out.

**Thrawn183** · 2009-05-11, 09:14 PM (ISO 8601)

Well, it certainly wasn't the worst trek movie, but it wasn't a fun experience for me.

- Previews: I closed my eyes when I saw previews for movies that I want to see, but they were so loud covering my ears and humming didn't block out the sound. I'm really pissed about getting such huge chunks of the next Transformers movie spoiled.
- Time Travel. I'm seriously sick and tired of it. Time travel is the sign of weak writing. Yes, occaisionally an entire story will be based around it and it is interesting. Time travel as a plot device is a pathetic cop out to weak writing.
- The first quarter of the movie. Instead of switching to different cameras to view different characters, they pivoted the camera. Same with ship battles. You can show the ships being maneuverable without dancing the camera. When combined with the slight fuzziness of the picture, I got a migraine and almost puked my guts out all over the theater.
- Rewriting characters. Honestly, is it really that hard to write an interesting story without rewriting characters? I mean, this is just another sign of increadibly weak writing on a plot level scale, maybe not as bad as time travel, but definitely close.

That said, I liked kirk and the doctor and the rest of the characters. I liked that the action was more... dynamic. It just wasn't worth the money paid to see it in the theater. Rent it sure, but don't drop 13 bucks.

**Swordguy** · 2009-05-11, 10:01 PM (ISO 8601)

Frankly, I feel that this movie will revitalize Trek as a franchise - this crew needs their own series. It's good, and it's accessible. Sure, there's quibbles (the scale of the engineering spaces, for example, are almost certainly too large to actually fit within the ship, given the scale of the windows and the depth of the shuttlebay) but if you can't get past them, you're too jaded to be watching movies.

I was rather impressed at the conversation about the alternate timeline. It felt like it was aimed directly at the three hardcore trekkies sitting behind us and pointing out continuity errors. The only way it could have been better is if the actors had DIRECTLY addressed the camera and said something to the effect of "this is a whole new series, and nothing you know applies. Get over yourself. Yeah, you in the 9th row. Just shut up and watch the movie."

Also, I'm disappointed that not one of you mentioned the throwaway line regarding why Scotty was stuck in that remote outpost:

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"There was a transporter accident involving Admiral Archer's prize beagle."

"How long did it take him to materialize?"

"I'll let ya' know when he does..."

Poor Porthos!

**TheThan** · 2009-05-11, 10:22 PM (ISO 8601)

Yeah, your always going to get the hardcore nerds that can’t just sit back and enjoy the movie. It doesn’t take itself seriously, and the audience shouldn’t either.

**SolkaTruesilver** · 2009-05-12, 12:01 AM (ISO 8601)

Originally Posted by TheThan

Yeah, your always going to get the hardcore nerds that can’t just sit back and enjoy the movie. It doesn’t take itself seriously, and the audience shouldn’t either.

I dunnow. I consider myself a big fan, and my only beef is that Kirk is given a command at the end of the movie. Outside of this, the whole movie is very enjoyable.

I usually simply sit back and try to enjoy the media presented at me

But I guess some people can't even do that...

**chiasaur11** · 2009-05-12, 12:23 AM (ISO 8601)

Originally Posted by SolkaTruesilver

I dunnow. I consider myself a big fan, and my only beef is that Kirk is given a command at the end of the movie. Outside of this, the whole movie is very enjoyable.

I usually simply sit back and try to enjoy the media presented at me

But I guess some people can't even do that...

Ah, but remember:

He's James T Kirk.

They'd probably need to kill him to get him out of the chair, and he's just a bit too good a captain to brutally laser to death.

**Hell Puppi** · 2009-05-12, 01:41 AM (ISO 8601)

See...I thought of the time travel as more of 'this is in a different universe than the original star trek, so we are free to muck about with our own continuity' sort of thing, so that way one is free to do additional movies without the worry that you're screwing around with canon, or that you're going to invalidate the old trek in the eyes of fans by simply plowing along with your own storyline.

Also, Bones and Scotty were awesome.

I did like how everyone seems to have been 'updated' in a way in terms of character. Though I am kind of annoyed that even in the distant future I'd still have to wear a dang skirt, though I guess Uhura just wouldn't be the same without one.

**SolkaTruesilver** · 2009-05-12, 01:54 AM (ISO 8601)

Originally Posted by chiasaur11

Ah, but remember:

He's James T Kirk.

They'd probably need to kill him to get him out of the chair, and he's just a bit too good a captain to brutally laser to death.

It still doesn't mean that you hand over a command of a starship to an inexperience cadet who have shown brillance.

There is more to the duties of a Starfleet Captain than making one brillant plan to destroy the ennemy.

If they had fast-tracked him into gaining a Command SOON, maybe. That'd make sense. But right away? Come on... He hasn't even served 1 day as a proper First Officer.

**kamikasei** · 2009-05-12, 02:21 AM (ISO 8601)

Originally Posted by Hell Puppi

I did like how everyone seems to have been 'updated' in a way in terms of character. Though I am kind of annoyed that even in the distant future I'd still have to wear a dang skirt, though I guess Uhura just wouldn't be the same without one.

Going by the early TNG seasons you wouldn't have to, you just have the option to, whether male or female. Hmmm, did we in fact see any be-pantsed female crew in this movie?

**SmartAlec** · 2009-05-12, 02:28 AM (ISO 8601)

Originally Posted by Thrawn183

- Time Travel. I'm seriously sick and tired of it. Time travel is the sign of weak writing. Yes, occaisionally an entire story will be based around it and it is interesting. Time travel as a plot device is a pathetic cop out to weak writing.

Was the time travel in this movie a plot device? It wasn't used to resolve anything; it was simply a frame for the story.

**Dervag** · 2009-05-12, 10:34 AM (ISO 8601)

Originally Posted by Graybacca

Yes, but think of it form a revenge crazed Romulans point of view, whats more fun watching a planet be pulled apart peace by peace from the outside or watching a planet pull it's self apart form the inside out.

My theory is as follows:

The drill cuts a bore only a few tens of meters wide. It's too small to destroy an entire planet- even if you cut the planet in half using the drill, it would take an enormous amount of time and gravity would just pull the halves together. You could scour the surface with the drill, but that would likewise take a long time. Moreover, we've seen that the drill is vulnerable to destruction, either from space or (presumably) from ground-based weapon platforms. Nero probably doesn't have an infinite supply of drills.

As for why he uses the drill on the planet, I can think of a reason. He wants the planet to be rapidly consumed by the black hole, so rapidly that escape is almost impossible. If the red matter impacts on the planet's surface, the resulting hole will form there, and will not have dramatic effects on the other side of the planet for quite some time- gravity due to a singularity drops off fast as you move away from it.

By forming the black hole deep underground, he can start causing nasty seismic effects quite rapidly, and the black hole will consume the planet faster.
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Originally Posted by Swordguy

Also, I'm disappointed that not one of you mentioned the throwaway line regarding why Scotty was stuck in that remote outpost:

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"There was a transporter accident involving Admiral Archer's prize beagle."

"How long did it take him to materialize?"

"I'll let ya' know when he does..."

Poor Porthos!

I find it rather unlikely that the Archer referenced is the Archer who captained the first Enterprise, given the chronology.

But you're right, I totally didn't notice that.
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Originally Posted by kamikasei

Going by the early TNG seasons you wouldn't have to, you just have the option to, whether male or female. Hmmm, did we in fact see any be-pantsed female crew in this movie?

I'm... pretty sure I did, but I can't be absolutely certain. Not going to watch it a third time just to check.

**Thrawn183** · 2009-05-12, 01:07 PM (ISO 8601)

Originally Posted by SmartAlec

Was the time travel in this movie a plot device? It wasn't used to resolve anything; it was simply a frame for the story.

Think about it like this: Nero was essentially an enemy with a really powerful ship because he was from the future. It's easy to write in him surprising enemies and such because... he's from the future, who would see it coming? Then, when the protagonists need to save the day? Another guy from the future. It actually made the antagonist weaker, because instead of him being a legitimate enemy (ie. someone who's put in the time an effort to say build a fleet capable of taking on the federation) he's just some dude from the future.

Long story short, if you need something time travel is a pathetically easy way to get it and as a result is a writing device for the weak.

Now, if the entire story was about time travel that would be different. It's not. It's about the crew of the enterprise. Time travel didn't make them more special somehow. 99% of the time, time travel just ruins whatever its put into. This is one of those times.

**SmartAlec** · 2009-05-12, 02:34 PM (ISO 8601)

Originally Posted by Thrawn183

Now, if the entire story was about time travel that would be different. It's not.

Are you sure? From where I'm sitting, the entire movie was about time travel. Not about time travelling, but rather about the effects that time travel has on a universe and the changes that result.

**kamikasei** · 2009-05-12, 02:53 PM (ISO 8601)

Originally Posted by SmartAlec

Are you sure? From where I'm sitting, the entire movie was about time travel. Not about time travelling, but rather about the effects that time travel has on a universe and the changes that result.

No, that was something that happened in the movie.

What the movie was about was the early days of the crew of the Enterprise. The time travel was used to tie this in to established continuity while giving the creators freedom to violate that continuity. For my money it would have been better to just say, "there will be changes. This stuff is now the story instead of the backstory, which necessitates changes for dramatic reasons. Now is not then, so there will be changes for that reason. Just relax and enjoy it." It worked for BSG, after all. (Obviously that was part of a much more comprehensive re-imagining, but it's not like all the changes made between series were necessary just to make the redesigned sets acceptable.)

Look at it this way: was the movie advertised as "Kirk and Spock battle time travelers!" or as "See Kirk and Spock just getting started!"? If the movie had not contained time travel would you be saying, "dang, that movie was about something totally different"? (Yes I know obviously not, but you get my meaning.)

**averagejoe** · 2009-05-12, 02:57 PM (ISO 8601)

Originally Posted by Swordguy

I was rather impressed at the conversation about the alternate timeline. It felt like it was aimed directly at the three hardcore trekkies sitting behind us and pointing out continuity errors. The only way it could have been better is if the actors had DIRECTLY addressed the camera and said something to the effect of "this is a whole new series, and nothing you know applies. Get over yourself. Yeah, you in the 9th row. Just shut up and watch the movie."

I agree. I usually hate time travel, and Trek's increasing dependence on them has been a rather sore point for me over the years (with some notable exceptions) but this was appropriate and, in some ways, hilarious.

Originally Posted by Dervag

I find it rather unlikely that the Archer referenced is the Archer who captained the first Enterprise, given the chronology.

And, even if not, Porthos would be long dead. Could have gotten a new beagle, but it wasn't Porthos.

**FatJose** · 2009-05-12, 03:10 PM (ISO 8601)

Movie rocked but the people behind that movie sucked on Nemoy's jobbles for too long. After a while I was wondering if he would ever step aside...never did.

Minor Nitpick on how a scene should have gone in my mind.

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Spock Prime: Our race is now in the thousands, if that. Your main concern and responsibility should be repopulating but you also have a great blah blah blah with Kirk. There are two of us. We should take advantage of this. You go with Kirk. Boldly go whe-
Spock: Ah Hell Nah! Let me get this straight. You're telling me, young and in his prime Spock, to go get myself in all types of danger while you, an old man, goes around "tending" to all the distraught She-Vulcans left alive?
Spock Prime: Why, ofcourse. It is only logical
Spock: No! You're the ObiWan here!
Spock Prime: Wrong franchise.
Spock: Whatever. If you got such a woody for that jerkbag Kirk, YOU go with him. You got like... a hundred years of experience over me. You go!
Spock Prime:...okay..*mutter mutter* but I wanted to get down with the Pon Farr...

**valis** · 2009-05-12, 06:32 PM (ISO 8601)

I don't know how to do the spoiler box so I left some space. There's only some minor spoilers so whatever.

I didn't like this movie and here's why.
*Nero's motivation makes little sense.
*Why he doesn't warn his home planet about there impending doom makes no sense
*Even if his motivation did make sense why didn't go to home planet and help build up an army then destroy Vulcan.
*Why he waits 20 years for the red matter when he can take out an entire fleet of star ships makes the movie pointless.
*Apparently I have to buy the four issue mini to understand the above flaws. **** that.
*Aside from Kirk and Spock all the other characters are wasted.
*I still don't understand how a black hole is the answer to a supernova.
*Spock becoming Captain then First Officer was a hat trick the movie didn't need.
*Product placement!!!! I never want to hear Beastie Boys ever again.
*I understand that Kirk cheats when taking the Kobiashi Maru but I know that when cheating on test you're supposed make it look like your not cheating. Honestly Kirk deserved to get caught.
*Chris Pine acts like a frat boy that uses roofies habitually. I drinking a soda when I was watching this movie and couldn't help but keep my eye on it just in case.

**Lerky** · 2009-05-12, 06:42 PM (ISO 8601)

Originally Posted by Finn Solomon

But that's my point. If Chris Pine had played it over the top he would have come across as Pine playing William Shatner playing Kirk. As it is he brings his own take to the character, and doesn't come off as imitating Shatner.

I figured Pine was playing it over the top. He was flirting with every girl he saw and passed Starfleet while hardly trying. Not to mention his "stunt" on that one simulation.

**Tyrant** · 2009-05-12, 07:00 PM (ISO 8601)