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Thread: Erfworld 162

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    Default Re: Erfworld 162

    Quote Originally Posted by Jølly View Post
    I read this page and reached the bottom without even acknowledging that the word wasn't censored. Five seconds after finishing it my brain clicked and I went back to make sure I saw what I thought I saw.

    An amazing ending! Sucks that its so long until book 2 begins...Its become a part of my life to check to see if there is a new page every day. I can't wait!!
    Truth, and also truth. This has convinced me to join the Erfworld site.
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    Default Re: Erfworld 162

    Quote Originally Posted by Thanatos 51-50 View Post
    You're missing the point.
    The use of the word **** is signifcant as each and every other time Parson cursed, we were greeted with a merry little 'boop'. An affect of the universe our Protoganoist found himself stuck in. Aftewr his long and harrowing trial and battle, he has a conversation with the universe there, and devlops a will strong enough to activly break the rules.

    It is possible to use vulgarity in an artistic manner, you know.

    I don't see it as an attempt at Dark and Edgy, but rather just that.
    Art.
    That was one point, the in-story point. The broader point was that it is hypocritical in our world (as in Erfworld) to sensor swear words and allow violence (even murders and rapes) to be shown in various media. A point SouthPark has also made in one wonderful episode about "sh!t".

    Also, don't feed the troll

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    Default Re: Erfworld 162

    Hmm, so not liking a strip is trolling, and is indicative of inferior intellect? Ayup, even with all the rules here, it's still the ol' internet.

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    Default Re: Erfworld 162

    Quote Originally Posted by Simanos View Post
    That was one point, the in-story point. The broader point was that it is hypocritical in our world (as in Erfworld) to sensor swear words and allow violence (even murders and rapes) to be shown in various media. A point SouthPark has also made in one wonderful episode about "sh!t".

    Also, don't feed the troll
    You mean "the broader point may be", not "the broader point is".
    I don't really think they were going for a cheap dig at censorship, and to be honest, I think if they were, it weakens the comic immensely.

    It cheapens it from a comic about self determinism and free will and our place in the universe, to a petty squabble about saying **** on teh interwebz.
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    Default Re: Erfworld 162

    A hearty round of applause, well deserved.

    Interesting point about what one defines as profanity, too often forgot if one takes newscast as reference, wherever in the world you are.

    Can't wait 'til book 2
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    Default Re: Erfworld 162

    Quote Originally Posted by Rollory View Post
    The whole guilt trip thing is particularly untenable. It's a game world. The people in it exist (pop) for the purpose of fighting and dying. There can't possibly be any guilt involved in making that happen and doing it well.
    I do not see how Erfworld is fundamentally different from our own. I've always thought of it as a metaphor for our own history. Except that maybe our history is a lot more brutal.

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    Default Re: Erfworld 162

    And so ends Book 1: Water Fellowship of the RingsA New HopeThe Battle for Gobwin Knob. One thing is that in the protection of GK, only one major of the elite (Misty) died. So, I sort of say that Parson did manage to protect most of the "Player Characters" on his side, sort of.
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    Default Re: Erfworld 162

    YAY! PROPER SWEARWORDS!!!

    This is a really strong ending for book 1 - the hero against the "system" of the whole world!!!

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    Default Re: Erfworld 162

    A decryped gobwin should have dived into the lava, after the sword.
    'I shall be pleased and proud to have been the first who completely enjoyed the fruits of his writing, just as he wished, for my only desire has been to have people reject and despise the false and nonsensical histories of the books of chivalry, which are already stumbling over the history of my true Don Quixote, and will undoubtedly fall to the ground.' -Miguel de Cervantes, Don Quixote (Edith Grossman)

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    Default Re: Erfworld 162

    Quote Originally Posted by Fafnir13 View Post
    I was kind of hoping to see the Tool return, be amazed, and declare his new plans for world conquest. Something that would at least give a solid direction to be anticipated. Now I'm left with literally no real idea what's going to happen next and won't get to find out for ages. Arg! Ultimate cliffhanger!
    You consider two weeks to be "ages"?
    I seem to have the ability to misinterpret the most obvious of meanings and to completely miss the points of statements for no obvious reason. Just a warning.

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    Default Re: Erfworld 162

    In my opinion using the f-word is rude and never justified.
    In your opinion that swear was important way to show parson's control over his own fate
    Is my opinion right? For me it is. Is your opinion right? For you it is. I expressed my opinion that Erfworld tries too hard to be edgy and you call me troll.Well maybe that makes me a troll, I don't know. I do see the reason behind the swear and I see why you all thought it was important but I didn't. The great thing about life is that people can disagree and choose for themselves what to believe.
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    Default Re: Erfworld 162

    Quote Originally Posted by Jamin View Post
    In my opinion using the f-word is rude...
    Glad you think so, since it was probably supposed to be rude. At this point, Parson hates the world around him (more than he hates himself for what he has become) and lashed out at it with one single strike. It remains to be seen if that will be repeated, although I hope not so the moment will not lose its impact.

    Never justified? Never say never.

    Is it possible to have the same dramatic impact in an epic story without using a swearword? See God of War and God of War II. The game is full of violence, nudity and implied sexuality and it's as epic as they come, but it does not contain a single swearword that breaks the PG-13 level (the game is rated M or R, I'm not sure).
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    Default Re: Erfworld 162

    As someone who read the first few strips way back when and thought "what a waste of time" and gradually changed his mind as things progressed I've now come full circle. A brilliant, unexpected, and yet totally appropriate ending. It accomplishes the incredibly difficult trick of changing the way you look at everything that's gone before without changing anything that actually happened.

    One of my complaints along the way has been the lack of almost any characters (other than Sizemore and to some extent Vinnie) that could be considered admirable. Parson has now joined that list big time.

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    Default Re: Erfworld 162

    Quote Originally Posted by Jamin View Post
    In my opinion using the f-word is rude and never justified.
    I fully acknowledge your opinion, and heartily support it. A question for you, however:

    Did any of the graphic violence appear justified to you? Did it disturb you as much as the swear word did?

    If not, did you ask yourself why a word that, while rude and coarse, refers to an act of procreation bothered you much more than numerous scenes of wholesale destruction, and what that says about our society in general?

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    Default Re: Erfworld 162

    Quote Originally Posted by Xenon View Post
    Everything melts in lava!

    looks like parson is finally free of a great many restrictions. not just the censorship- probably a lot of other rules of the realm as well. a Player.... well this will be interesting.
    Erm ... no.

    Why does everyone assume that ... just because he broke Erfworld's control for one fleeting second .. that he is now permanently free?

    It may have been a one time thing brought on by extreme emotion and stress. He's still *in* that world. When the next book starts, we may find he can't swear again. And then he may spend the next book or three trying to figure out how he broke free of the control of Erfworld -- of Fate Magic -- and still longer do it again.

    One second of free expression is not freedom. It may take the next book -- or many books -- for him to become truly free. Who knows? Perhaps when he does, he can also free the rest of Erfworld as well. God Emperor of Dune, anyone?

    But other posters are right -- There is a time and place for swearing, and THIS is why you swear. Not as a meaningless amplifier every third or fourth word because you lack appropriate vocabulary. In context, it's a powerful expression of the will of the individual defying Fate, a moment of freedom against the overwhelming determinism of Life that is Erfworld. If I were an English major instead of a software engineer, that last panel would give me fodder for many, many critical essays.

    Y'know, there are things I haven't liked about Erfworld. There are things I still don't like about it. But I will say this for it: It has artistic merit. It's great entertainment, but there's some real honest-to-goodness *thinking* that went into it. I applaud the authors.

    Respectfully,

    Brian P.

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    Default Re: Erfworld 162

    Quote Originally Posted by Baalthazaq View Post
    You mean "the broader point may be", not "the broader point is".
    I don't really think they were going for a cheap dig at censorship, and to be honest, I think if they were, it weakens the comic immensely.

    It cheapens it from a comic about self determinism and free will and our place in the universe, to a petty squabble about saying **** on teh interwebz.
    No I meant what I said. Parson spelled it out for you:
    "You're fine with this obscenity."
    The point is not saying f... on teh interwebz as you so eloquently put it. The point is hypocricy.

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    Default Re: Erfworld 162

    Quote Originally Posted by pendell View Post
    God Emperor of Dune, anyone?
    Please no. That book was awful. Last Dune novel I ever read.
    Quote Originally Posted by Midnight Roamer View Post
    I think he did the only morally acceptable thing by killing everyone.
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    Default Re: Erfworld 162

    this is totally AWESOME!
    A great book, and a greater end. Parson's inner strenght and the real comprehension of his situation, gives him the power to break (probably once-in-a-life?), the language laws of erfworld.
    Finally, Parson had his uncensored cuss word, and it's not even christmas, but i doubt that he's happy about it.

    Again, a great ending, also very well drawn.

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    Default Re: Erfworld 162

    I'm not sure if I think it'd be a good idea for Parson to start cussing more. On the one hand, cosnidering how much he said Boop, it'd be kind of odd. On the other, it would lessen the impact of this strip. Then again Parson cussing and Erfworlders reactions to it could be used to add even more emphasis how alien he is.

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    Default Re: Erfworld 162

    Quote Originally Posted by Simanos View Post
    No I meant what I said. Parson spelled it out for you:
    "You're fine with this obscenity."
    The point is not saying f... on teh interwebz as you so eloquently put it. The point is hypocricy.
    Pfft. "The point is" again.

    You think the point is. You don't know any more than I do. You're guessing intention. You are perfectly entitled to your opinion, but stating it as fact is just silly. (After all, the internet has been know to block those wands of detect thoughts).

    Personally, I think him breaking that bond is a a tiny window into how he is breaking the hold the universe has on him through sheer force of will.

    "I can fight the universe, I will fight the universe and I will win" is what it seems like to me, to you it seems like the end of the fight. "I can say ****! Yes! How cool is that!"

    The first makes him a hero, ready to undo creation to rebuild a better future for this world. The second makes him a 7 year old who just figured out what the word means and is giggling to himself.

    You may also wish to consider why it is the erfworld creators seem to agree so strongly with you when you're doing the interpreting. It may not be a coincidence.
    Last edited by Baalthazaq; 2009-05-24 at 10:43 AM.
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    Default Re: Erfworld 162

    Quote Originally Posted by Baalthazaq View Post
    Pfft. "The point is" again.

    You think the point is.

    <snip>

    to you it seems like the end of the fight. "I can say ****! Yes! How cool is that!"
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    Quote Originally Posted by Midnight Roamer View Post
    I think he did the only morally acceptable thing by killing everyone.
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    Default Re: Erfworld 162

    Now, a cluster of f-bombs all smacking into each other both cheapens the word, and just sounds just vulgar. Tropes are not bad, and if vulgar is the way you want to characterize a character, then spray and pray with the f-word is a great way to do that. Now all through the series, Parson has been 'trying' to swear. Now he succeeds, breaking the rules. This laser guided f-strike is part of that freedom, and the delicious tension it provides while we wait for the next installment is 'what else can he break'?
    This doesn't mean he's going to get permanently bestubbled, spout Duke Nukem one liners, and become Mr. Chunkwad McBeefcake.
    No, this is about freedom.
    I don't like swear words,I actively avoid using them.
    But this, in my opinion, is a well wrought use of a word in the English language. A word that through overuse would become tiresome, but is used well here, in my opinion.
    Last edited by Ravens_cry; 2009-05-24 at 12:55 PM.
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    Default Re: Erfworld 162

    Quote Originally Posted by Gez View Post
    Irony, thy name is Baalthazaq.
    You snipped an important part. "You don't know any more than I do."
    I figured the following paragraph would be obvious interpretation without further elaboration. Evidently not.
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    Default Re: Erfworld 162

    Excellent end for the chapter. Parson is pissed and NOT going to take it anymore. He is out to change the world around him and not be a tool.

    Cannot help but think this is exactly what Janis was looking for AND if Parson was brought by Erfworld, what Erfworld may want as well. Erfworld may not like what it is now. but cannot change itself. So it may be using Parson to force a change. Time will tell.

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    Default Re: Erfworld 162

    Quote Originally Posted by Baalthazaq View Post
    You snipped an important part. "You don't know any more than I do."
    I figured the following paragraph would be obvious interpretation without further elaboration. Evidently not.
    I'm talking about how you interpret Simanos' post in a way which really doesn't seem to be what he meant.

    Parson is rebelling against Erfworld for many reasons, which include both the hypocritical nature of it ("you're fine with this obscenity" is definitely calling it on its hypocrisy, being fine with gruesome violence and mass-scale massacres, but making everything look cute and child-friendly -- until half-melted bodies start falling down from the sky) and his affirmation of free will ("I won't be a gamepiece").

    Those two elements are there. Simanos points out the former, and you think he views it as just Parson doing a Beavis & Butthead routine. That's definitely not it.
    Quote Originally Posted by Midnight Roamer View Post
    I think he did the only morally acceptable thing by killing everyone.
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    Default Re: Erfworld 162

    Quote Originally Posted by Gez View Post
    Irony, thy name is may be Baalthazaq.
    Fixed it for you
    Thanks for explaining what I said (or may have said) to Baa.
    Last edited by Simanos; 2009-05-24 at 01:33 PM.

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    Default Re: Erfworld 162

    That was an awesome first book. Can't wait for the summer updates and book two in the fall! (not that anyone cares that I can't wait :P )

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    Default Re: Erfworld 162

    It may have been a one time thing brought on by extreme emotion and stress. He's still *in* that world. When the next book starts, we may find he can't swear again. And then he may spend the next book or three trying to figure out how he broke free of the control of Erfworld -- of Fate Magic -- and still longer do it again.
    This is a valid point. We don't know if this is permenant.
    ...

    Since I've been mentally inserting appropriate words instead of boop from day 1, I didn't even notice Parson wasn't censored when I read the comic the first time.

    why a word that, while rude and coarse, refers to an act of procreation bothered you is considered offensive much more than numerous scenes of wholesale destruction, and what that says about our society in general?
    Regardless of the comic, regardless of whatever opinion you have on F, B, S, other B, other F and other S words, this is a point worth thinking about. Just like pornography being seen more disturbing than carnography, there's simply no nonstupid answer to that question, and I'll put dough where my mouth is: A cookie to anyone who can answer me that.

    I'm also quite compelled to say FU to those who don't like the use swearwords, but that'd be too immature...
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    Default Re: Erfworld 162

    Quote Originally Posted by Gez View Post
    Please no. That book was awful. Last Dune novel I ever read.
    Funny, After God Emperor the series got really good again. I've liked every book since.
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    Default Re: Erfworld 162

    Quote Originally Posted by WarriorTribble View Post
    Hmm, so not liking a strip is trolling, and is indicative of inferior intellect? Ayup, even with all the rules here, it's still the ol' internet.
    Well, no one was called a troll for "not liking the strip." rather there were some unjustified accusations made and a few closed minded comments made that drew a negative response. If someone just came on and said, "The ending just didn't do anything for me." then they would not have been accused of trolling.

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