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Thread: Dwarf fortress

  1. - Top - End - #571
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    Default Re: Dwarf fortress

    Can it be? A way to make alcoholic beverages out of mere plants? Amazing!

    In other news, my flush-o-matic is taking a bit longer than expected; building a free-standing water pump isn't as easy as it seems. It's almost done now, but it looks like I'll have to wait a while before I can test it. A caravan from my parent civilization has just arrived, and I don't think the King will appreciate me flushing away his merchants.

  2. - Top - End - #572
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    You don't have to build the pumps right on site. If you dig a tunnel underground that emerges near the depot, you can pressurize the water in a tower far away (or use a hilltop lake even), then use floodgates to control when (and where) the water is allowed to flow.

  3. - Top - End - #573
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    Hmm, the first design didn't work. The wiki says power is transferred between vertically adjacent pumps, but apparently, that isn't true for muscle-powered pumps.

    So now I'm building a water wheel to power the pumps. Due to limititations of the existing construction and my patience, it will not have an off switch. I do not foresee any problems.

    Edit: As I wasn't able to find a qualified architect, I've drafted a random peasant to work out the schematics of the water pump. Don't worry, it'll all work out fine. Urist says he saw a waterwheel at a human town when he was young, and he's reasonably sure he knows how it's supposed to work.

    Another edit: It works! The water wheel is pumping water into the reservoir! Huzzah!

    Yet another edit: Amazingly, it didn't go horribly wrong. Apparently, water can never be pumped higher than the highest pump, so the reservoir can't overflow. Now to test the flooding mechanism...

    Last edit, I swear: Awesome! It worked perfectly! A huge torrent of water blew everything out of the trade depot, and what's more, the pumps are powerful enough to keep up the torrent indefinitely. It blew everything away; empty bins and cages, discarded clothing, dead goblins, all my trade goods... uh... oh, crap.
    Last edited by Lord Herman; 2009-06-28 at 06:03 PM.

  4. - Top - End - #574
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    So, instead of making just another random fortress with no real plan, I've decided to give my next one a real goal. I could build a big monument, but that seems to common. Instead, I'm going to try something hard: Make the biggest fortress I can possibly make and fill it with dwarves. I'm talking a population in the thousands, if I can manage it. If all goes to plan, every single level will be packed to the brim with housing and workshops and barracks and so on. And once I run out of Z-levels to dig down into? I'll build up. I want to push this system to the limit. For science!

    Right now, I'm planning to use a "block" system. Basically, my fortress is divided up into a number* of 23x23 unit blocks, with roads dividing these blocks to provide easy movement throughout the city. The actual fortress facilities are inside of these blocks, for example I would have a "housing block", a "workshop block", and so on. Now, I just have to figure out how many of each will make a single, fully functioning "group".

    Each housing block has 32 2x3 rooms, and will serve as the basic house for a good long time. I'll have just a bed in each to start, but as I get more dwarves, I'll add a cabinet, table, and chair to each. I'll also have specialized blocks for nobles and legendaries, with less in each, and if I eventually get a baron or some such I'll give him an entire block to work with.

    Industrial blocks have room for 20 3x3 workshops and 2 5x5 workshops. The 5x5 areas are for siege workshops, kennels, and shops, if I need them, otherwise they'll work as a normal workshop.

    Farming blocks hold 4 10x10 farming plots, for a total of 400 squares of farming. How many dwarves can that feed? 256? 512? I don't want too much food, but I don't want too little either. 50% more food than I absolutely need seems about right.

    So far, I'm thinking each "group" will consist of: 1 farming block, 8 housing blocks, and workshops. If I want to have a workshop for each and every dwarf, that would be 12 workshop blocks, but I don't think I need that many. However, I don't know how many I would need. To figure that out, I need to know how much of a day a typical dwarf spends working in his shop, and how many of my dwarves will be working in workshops.

    To figure out the second part, I need to find out how many of my dwarves are going to actually use workshops. And to find that out, I need to find out how many of my dwarves won't be using workshops So, what jobs can a dwarf do without a workshop? Farming and comes to mind, but I'm sure there's others. The farmers is easy enough to figure out, at any rate. I just need to know how much farmland each dwarf can work, and then find out how many of my dwarves in each "group" will need to be farmers.

    Anyways, for now I'm going to try and get a single group of blocks up and running, then when I've worked out some of the bugs, I'll add another block and see what changes. Hopefully, I can get everything running so that I can eventually manage everything less and less, so that I don't even need to look at individual dwarves at all, other than nobles and such.

    It'll be a long, hard process, but the mere fact that this all might be possible is more than enough reason to do it! And who knows, maybe I'll learn something.
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  5. - Top - End - #575
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    Default Re: Dwarf fortress

    I wish you luck, but I doubt you'll get there: your FPS is going to go to zero long before you get a population in the thousands

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    It's like reading an entire industrial tech book in 5 minutes...

    Well, anyhow, strike the earth and all that

    ... And then, you know, reach for the sky. Wait, that came out wrong
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  7. - Top - End - #577
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    I have finally encountered a problem the wiki can't solve. I have ordered a platinum sarcophagus made. I have plenty of platinum, a metalsmith, and platinum bars, but he just won't work on it, even when he has nothing to do! The ultimate tomb will not work out without the sarcophagus made of my best metal! I also have plans for platinum statues, but not untill the sarcophagus is done.
    PS: This will all be inside a pyramid, which will be built so that when a certain lever is pulled, the whole thing falls in upon itself to form a large sqaure. This will obviously be very entertaining.
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  8. - Top - End - #578
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    It'll also keep the kobolds and flies out.

    Also, I seem to have (FINALLY) solved the food problem.

    Also, I would love to have a biscuit made of strawberries. Don't look at me like that
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    Quote Originally Posted by kell the brute View Post
    I have finally encountered a problem the wiki can't solve. I have ordered a platinum sarcophagus made. I have plenty of platinum, a metalsmith, and platinum bars, but he just won't work on it, even when he has nothing to do! The ultimate tomb will not work out without the sarcophagus made of my best metal! I also have plans for platinum statues, but not untill the sarcophagus is done.
    PS: This will all be inside a pyramid, which will be built so that when a certain lever is pulled, the whole thing falls in upon itself to form a large sqaure. This will obviously be very entertaining.
    How did you order it made? Does the metalsmith fit the workshop's 'P'rofile? Does your manager have an office? Does the metalsmith have a path to the forge? Are you sure the metalsmith has the blacksmithing labor enabled? Metalsmith is the profession not just for blacksmiths but also for dwarfs with 2 or more smith skills of approximately the same level. Finally, is the job suspended? If it is suspended then it will have a red 'S' next to it in the workshop screen.
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  10. - Top - End - #580
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    And are you sure you haven't accidentally forbidden the materials, workshop, or both?

  11. - Top - End - #581
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rockphed View Post
    How did you order it made? Does the metalsmith fit the workshop's 'P'rofile? Does your manager have an office? Does the metalsmith have a path to the forge? Are you sure the metalsmith has the blacksmithing labor enabled? Metalsmith is the profession not just for blacksmiths but also for dwarfs with 2 or more smith skills of approximately the same level. Finally, is the job suspended? If it is suspended then it will have a red 'S' next to it in the workshop screen.


    Quote Originally Posted by Artanis View Post
    And are you sure you haven't accidentally forbidden the materials, workshop, or both?
    The metalsmith fits, he has access, he has the blacksmithing enabled, and what does a manager have to do with this? nothing is forbidden.THIS IS REALLY ANOYING!THE ONLY PURPOUS OF THIS FORT IS TO CREATE A LANDMARK, SO MY DWARFS ARE SLOW AND DROPING LIKE FLIES BECAUSE I CAN'T MAKE ANYTHING WORK! sorry about that. I must have been channeling 2 or 3 of my dwarfs.
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  12. - Top - End - #582
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    On a related note; the bane of productivity everywhere; not knowing how to brew.

    Seriously, I've been running teetotalers for the past few weeks (or, how many weeks? Three, maybe? Meh).

    No wonder my miner keeps stopping to sleep every few tiles
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  13. - Top - End - #583
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arachu View Post
    On a related note; the bane of productivity everywhere; not knowing how to brew.

    Seriously, I've been running teetotalers for the past few weeks (or, how many weeks? Three, maybe? Meh).

    No wonder my miner keeps stopping to sleep every few tiles
    Still, operated by a brewer, it has one task, "make booze".

  14. - Top - End - #584
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    My problem is semi solved. I'm going to kill the guy who goes in the tomb, drop it into the ground, and let him rest in his private H***. My entire suphering is that pyramid project, which I will now drop 3 z-levels when all is done.
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  15. - Top - End - #585
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    Quote Originally Posted by kell the brute View Post
    The metalsmith fits, he has access, he has the blacksmithing enabled, and what does a manager have to do with this? nothing is forbidden.THIS IS REALLY ANOYING!THE ONLY PURPOUS OF THIS FORT IS TO CREATE A LANDMARK, SO MY DWARFS ARE SLOW AND DROPING LIKE FLIES BECAUSE I CAN'T MAKE ANYTHING WORK! sorry about that. I must have been channeling 2 or 3 of my dwarfs.
    Some things require multiple bars for construction.

    The workshop must be fueled, be accessable, he must be able to get to the bars, he must have the labour enables, the workshop must allow him to work there in the profile and it must be his highest priority task before he will get around to it.

    If you're getting no error message it suggests it isn't a blacksmithing job. Enable all the metalworking jobs on him. Check the stocks for three bars and three fuel to make sure you have more than enough.

    If you are getting an error message it will tell you what you're doing wrong.
    Last edited by Player_Zero; 2009-06-29 at 03:30 AM.

  16. - Top - End - #586
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    Okay, my three axedwarf champions are now officially awesome. They waded into a horde of over 30 goblins, and completely slaughtered them without so much as a scratch. Goblins were constantly thrown halfway across the screen; one of them splattered apart into at least six separate parts on impact.

  17. - Top - End - #587
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    I reccomend having all your military train to legendary wrestler, shielddwarf, armor user, and (atleast) one chosen weapon. Wrestler effects their dodging, armor reduces damage taken, shielddwarf can negate damage entirely, and the weapon is obvious.
    Last edited by TheSummoner; 2009-06-29 at 07:09 AM.

  18. - Top - End - #588
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    Is one weapon better than another? I got my wrestler champions training to use swords since I can easily make masterwork obsidian swords. Of course my marksdwarves have been doing most of the killing.

    I think its the squad leader's example that has inspired her fellow marksdwarves. During an ambush she ran head long into the fight while carrying one of her babies and another kid behind her (she's a mother of 5). She dropped 2 goblins before they reached her and only suffered a broken leg when the goblins reached her. Fortunately my champion sworddwarves arrived to save her. She even managed to kill a 3rd goblin despite her broken leg.
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  19. - Top - End - #589
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    Depends on what you're fighting.

    Spears are nice because of the internal organ damage (crit), leaves less enemy body parts to clean up. But otherwise they're just a bit weaker than the blunt weapons. I don't like getting spears that much because it's similar to the crossbow, but the crossbow doesn't have the same crit boost. They say it's the best weapon for dragonslaying.

    Axes cause more severed limbs and bleeding. Swords are a hybrid between spears and axes, some of the bonuses of either one.

    Hammers and maces are guaranteed to be useful against any enemy out there (undead, creatures with no organs). I'm not sure what the difference between those two is. It doesn't say anything about it on the wiki, but I think there's a "knockback" effect with at least the hammer (and probably the mace but not others). Maybe add some danger to your fighting by channeling all around your entrance path so things fall in, but I wouldn't want to make an actual moat in case your dwarves fall in it (unless they all can swim).

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    Well, personal taste plays a factor (especially in Adventurer).

    As far as the wiki is concerned (Link-tastic), most weapons deal somewhat similar levels of damage, though exactly what they damage seems to vary.

    Bludgeoning weapons cause more external damage, and don't get stuck.
    Slashing weapons can hack off limbs (which is always awesome), but may get stuck.
    Piercing weapons cause more internal wounds ('specially organs), but often get stuck.

    Mauls, two-handed swords, and halberds do the most damage, but I'm not quite certain if you can make these
    (EDIT: Actually, Dwarves can't even wield them )

    The mace deals more direct damage than the axe, and somehow the sword does as well. The spear deals less damage than any.

    However, direct damage is not an accurate measure of usefulness.
    Internal wounds seem to knock them out with pain most often.
    Getting an arm lopped off is particularly unhealthy.
    It is very likely that a broken arm doesn't work quite as well.

    I prefer slashing weapons, particularly the axe. In Fortress mode, I rarely have access to metal (not the case in my newest-I found a massive deposit of magnetite), and thus my military ends up with crossbows primarily.

    But I have used bludgeoning weapons in Adventurer, and they can be very effective ("the head collapses into the body, an unrecognizable mass")

    The largest factor is the dwarves' ability to use them.
    Last edited by Arachu; 2009-06-29 at 11:16 AM.
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  21. - Top - End - #591
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    From what I can tell on the wiki, it seems as though the fort's economy can be a socialism.

    It goes perfectly with my Russian Dwarves idea

    ... Because, you know, I'll probably set up a training gulag in it... It's chronologically accurate!

    EDIT: I just checked the crafts list in my newest fort, and I found an Elf Bone Amulet. Whoops

    No, really, I didn't even get to enjoy doing that ._.
    Last edited by Arachu; 2009-06-29 at 04:24 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Herman View Post
    Okay, my three axedwarf champions are now officially awesome. They waded into a horde of over 30 goblins, and completely slaughtered them without so much as a scratch. Goblins were constantly thrown halfway across the screen; one of them splattered apart into at least six separate parts on impact.
    That's pretty much what my Captain of the Guard does. He's wearing all steel plate and carrying an obsidian short sword. At one point my fort was sieged, so I sent his squad of champions out to deal with it. He was nearest the exit, so he went first.

    He then proceeded to slaughter 50+ goblins by himself without taking a single hit.
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  23. - Top - End - #593
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    Err... My Captain of the Guard works under a wrestler, and broke his leg sparring barehanded
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  24. - Top - End - #594
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arachu View Post
    EDIT: I just checked the crafts list in my newest fort, and I found an Elf Bone Amulet. Whoops

    No, really, I didn't even get to enjoy doing that ._.
    If you're still trading with them, you should totally offer that to the next Elven caravan. For the lulz.
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  25. - Top - End - #595
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arachu View Post
    Well, personal taste plays a factor (especially in Adventurer).

    As far as the wiki is concerned (Link-tastic), most weapons deal somewhat similar levels of damage, though exactly what they damage seems to vary.

    Bludgeoning weapons cause more external damage, and don't get stuck.
    Slashing weapons can hack off limbs (which is always awesome), but may get stuck.
    Piercing weapons cause more internal wounds ('specially organs), but often get stuck.

    Mauls, two-handed swords, and halberds do the most damage, but I'm not quite certain if you can make these
    (EDIT: Actually, Dwarves can't even wield them )

    The mace deals more direct damage than the axe, and somehow the sword does as well. The spear deals less damage than any.

    However, direct damage is not an accurate measure of usefulness.
    Internal wounds seem to knock them out with pain most often.
    Getting an arm lopped off is particularly unhealthy.
    It is very likely that a broken arm doesn't work quite as well.

    I prefer slashing weapons, particularly the axe. In Fortress mode, I rarely have access to metal (not the case in my newest-I found a massive deposit of magnetite), and thus my military ends up with crossbows primarily.

    But I have used bludgeoning weapons in Adventurer, and they can be very effective ("the head collapses into the body, an unrecognizable mass")

    The largest factor is the dwarves' ability to use them.
    There's also the fact that maces and hammers don't cause have a critical hit bonus. That's why I use them, they make sparring less likely to cause yellow/red wounds.
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  26. - Top - End - #596
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    Meh, if you train your dwarves to legendary wrestling, and let them wear armor and use shields while doing it (they wont be legendary in these, but they'll have a nice level), chances are they'll be good enough to avoid being killed by eachother...

    I'm fond of axes for the flavor value personally... however I've always considered Crossbows most useful simply because they can attack from a range.

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    Quote Originally Posted by TheSummoner View Post
    Meh, if you train your dwarves to legendary wrestling, and let them wear armor and use shields while doing it (they wont be legendary in these, but they'll have a nice level), chances are they'll be good enough to avoid being killed by eachother...
    That may have something to do with how 2 of my recruits died...

    I'm fond of axes for the flavor value personally... however I've always considered Crossbows most useful simply because they can attack from a range.
    True enough, but they suck at melee range (did I spell 'melee' right?). It's somewhat prudent to balance Plus, bolts leave limbs where they are

    EDIT: I think I'll look for a glowing pit next... That'll certainly be Fun
    Last edited by Arachu; 2009-06-29 at 10:07 PM.
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  28. - Top - End - #598
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    Well... typically something good at taking out organs is your best bet against stronger creatures, however smaller ones aren't worth the time it'll take to finally hit their heart... So spears will take down elephants faster than hammers, but hammers will destroy wolves quicker than spears can.

  29. - Top - End - #599
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    I can never seem to get much of a challenge out of DF; I have some troubles initially, but most of that is due to having a high number of jobs and a low number of dwarves (though if I picked more dangerous areas I might have a bit more trouble). Once I get enough immigrants, I have a massive army, a just big enough to not annoy the nobles guard force, and a ton of small "apartments." Most of my dwarves are either crafters of some kind, or brewers.

    Generally my fortress will wind up looking like this with 80 population (non-noble):

    5 miners.
    20 military dwarves, mostly marksmen.
    8 Fortress Guard.
    4 Royal Guard. Most of the guard guys are injured.
    15 brewers/farmers/cooks, generally multi'd with misc hauling.
    One tanner.
    One clothesmaker.
    A couple woodcutters, generally multi'd with carpentry.
    One guy in charge of all the weapon and armor making.
    Three guys working on keeping the armor/weapons supplied with bars and fuel.
    5 bonecrafters for arrows.
    Three to five engineers/masons, a degree of mix and match with those.
    The rest are misc odd-jobs that aren't ever really necessary, like gem crafters or engravers.

    I'm looking for a mod that ups the general difficulty of the game, not just the combat; getting sieged on the first year isn't particularly hard to overcome by massing traps or, god forbid, getting your dwarves up to proficient in military skills when they would usually be mining out your next years worth of workshops and bedrooms.

    The problem (which will hopefully be alleviated when beer stops being made into food, if it hasn't already; I haven't played in a couple months) is that resource management is too easy. You are pretty much guaranteed to never run out of resources during the early years when your fortress needs to venture outside and rely on caravans for goodies, and by the time that you are self sufficient, the sieges reach their (rather low) high point. Then you have a self sufficient fortress and the sieges start to get much weaker, so it's generally a boring wait session; the only real problem might be running out of bones to train your marksdwarves. So a mod where actually keeping everybody well fed and making enough gear for your military dwarves would help, but the game would probably be a lot tougher if I couldn't make beer biscuits or make alcohol without water.

  30. - Top - End - #600
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    Default Re: Dwarf fortress

    Generally I'd just like sieges to get tougher...

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