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    Default Cold Iron Dragon (3.5, ToB dragon)

    Cold Iron Dragon
    DRAGON
    Environment Any mountains
    Organization Wyrmling, very young, young, juvenile and young adult: solitary or clutch (2-5); adult, mature adult, old, very old, ancient, wyrm or great wyrm: solitary, pair or family (1-2 and 2-5 offspring)
    Challenge Rating Wyrmling 4; very young 5; young 7; juvenile 10; young adult 13; adult 15; mature adult 18; old 20; very old 21; ancient 23; wyrm 24; great wyrm 26
    Treasure Triple standard
    Alignment Usually Lawful Good
    Advancement Wyrmling 8-9 HD; very young 11-12 HD; young 14-15 HD; juvenile 17-18 HD; young adult 20-21 HD; adult 23-24 HD; mature adult 26-27 HD; old 29-30 HD; very old 32-33 HD; ancient 35-36 HD; wyrm 38-39 HD; great wyrm 41+ HD
    Level Adjustment Wyrmling +5, Very Young +6, Young +6

    You see a wingless dragon with a forward-pointing horn above each eye and another on the tip of its snout. A line of spikes runs down its back. The muscles of its limbs bulge beneath its shiny scales.

    Cold iron dragons are the descendents of a dragon population which sacrificed most of their magical abilities in pursuit of physical power and the ability to counter the magic of others. This has resulted in them being rather distrustful of magic and highly militaristic. They also tend to be rather gruff compared to most metallic dragons and those that arenít good are usually aggressive and highly territorial. They also tend to be show offs, especially when it comes to acrobatics. Some researchers believe that this is overcompensation due to their inability to fly. Cold iron dragons tend to be long and flexible with muscular legs. On hatching, they have dull grey scales which gain a metallic sheen as they get older. The older dragons eventually start developing a reddish tint. Cold iron dragons love to climb and jump and therefore tend to lair in craggy areas. Cold iron dragons will occasionally use their alternate form ability to join a humanoid military, they enjoy the opportunity to use armour and weapons which they are highly appreciative of. Cold iron dragons mainly eat meat.

    Combat

    A cold iron dragon will normally leap down from above in order to shock and impress trespassers if it is able to. If it has decided to attack beforehand then it will attempt to land upon its victim. Cold iron dragons are melee combatants and fight as such, using their breath and spell-like abilities to neutralize magical threats. Those old enough to know maneuvers will not hesitate to use them if they believe that they will be helpful.

    Winglessness (Ex): Cold iron dragons lack wings and therefore, unlike most dragons, can neither fly, nor use wing attacks.

    Antimagic presence (Su): Instead of a frightful presence, cold iron dragons have an antimagic presence which acts like an antimagic field, null psionics field and soulless waste (Magic of Incarnum). The dragon can deactivate its presence as a free action (and needs to do so to use any of its spell-like or supernatural abilities such as DR other than its breath weapon) and reactivate it as a swift action. Anything that is immune to a dragonís frightful presence due to it being a draconic presence (eg. dragons) rather than it being a far effect is also immune to this presence.

    Maneuvers: Instead of learning spells as a sorcerer, cold-iron dragons learn maneuvers and stances as a warblade of their initiator level. A cold iron dragon's natural weapons are treated as assosciated weapons for all warblade disciplines and overcome DR as if they were made of cold iron.

    Breath weapon (Su): A cold iron dragonís breath weapon is a line of dispelling. This acts as a dispel magic/greater dispel magic except that it applies to everything in the area of effect (which is now a line) and there is no caster level cap. This breath weapon is not suppressed by antimagic presence.

    Alternate form (Su): A cold iron dragon with its presence inactive may assume the form of a humanoid of medium size or smaller and return to normal up to three times per day. The dragon can remain in its humanoid form until it wishes to adopt a new form or return to its normal form.

    Dragonís disjunction (Sp): This ability works exactly like Mageís disjunction except items are merely suppressed as if in an antimagic field for a number of rounds equal to the dragonís charisma modifier (minimum 1).

    Other Spell-like Abilities: 3/day - Remove curse (adult or older); 3/day - Break enchantment (old or older); 1/day - Spell turning (ancient or older).

    Skills: Balance, jump and martial lore are class skills for cold iron dragons.

    Typical list of maneuvers known:
    Spoiler
    Show

    Young: Punishing stance, Sapphire Nightmare Blade, Stone Bones, Sudden Leap
    Juvenile: Punishing stance, Sapphire Nightmare Blade, Stone Bones, Sudden Leap, Claw at the Moon, Emerald Razor
    Young adult: Punishing stance, Absolute Steel Stance, Iron Heart Surge, Bonecrusher, Flesh Ripper, Sapphire Nightmare Blade, Sudden Leap, Claw at the Moon, Emerald Razor
    Adult: Punishing stance, Absolute Steel Stance, Ruby Nightmare Blade, Lightning Recovery, Iron Heart Surge, Bonecrusher, Flesh Ripper, Sapphire Nightmare Blade, Claw at the Moon, Emerald Razor
    Mature adult: Dancing Blade Form, Absolute Steel Stance, Dancing Mongoose, Ruby Nightmare Blade, Lightning Recovery, Iron Heart Surge, Bonecrusher, Flesh Ripper, Sapphire Nightmare Blade, Claw at the Moon, Emerald Razor
    Old: Dancing Blade Form, Absolute Steel Stance, Leaping Dragon Stance, Iron Heart Endurance, Dancing Mongoose, Ruby Nightmare Blade, Lightning Recovery, Iron Heart Surge, Bonecrusher, Flesh Ripper, Sapphire Nightmare Blade, Emerald Razor
    Very old: Dancing Blade Form, Absolute Steel Stance, Leaping Dragon Stance, Avalanche of Blades, Swooping Dragon Strike, Iron Heart Endurance, Dancing Mongoose, Ruby Nightmare Blade, Lightning Recovery, Iron Heart Surge, Bonecrusher, Flesh Ripper, Sapphire Nightmare Blade
    Ancient: Dancing Blade Form, Absolute Steel Stance, Leaping Dragon Stance, Avalanche of Blades, Raging Mongoose, Swooping Dragon Strike, Iron Heart Endurance, Dancing Mongoose, Diamond Nightmare Blade, Lightning Recovery, Iron Heart Surge, Bonecrusher, Flesh Ripper, Ruby Nightmare Blade
    Wyrm: Dancing Blade Form, Absolute Steel Stance, Leaping Dragon Stance, Wolf Pack Tactics, Strike of Perfect Clarity, Feral Death Blow, Avalanche of Blades, Raging Mongoose, Swooping Dragon Strike, Iron Heart Endurance, Dancing Mongoose, Diamond Nightmare Blade, Lightning Recovery, Iron Heart Surge, Bonecrusher, Flesh Ripper
    Great wyrm: Dancing Blade Form, Absolute Steel Stance, Leaping Dragon Stance, Wolf Pack Tactics, Strike of Perfect Clarity, Adamantine Hurricane, Girallon Windmill Flesh Rip, Feral Death Blow, Avalanche of Blades, Raging Mongoose, Swooping Dragon Strike, Iron Heart Endurance, Dancing Mongoose, Diamond Nightmare Blade, Lightning Recovery, Iron Heart Surge, Flesh Ripper



    Cold Iron Dragons By Age
    {table=head]Age|Size|Hit Dice (hp)|Str|Dex|Con|Int|Wis|Cha|BAB/Grapple|Attack|Fort|Ref|Will|Dispelling Breath and Spell-like Abillity Caster Level
    Wyrmling|
    M
    |
    7d12+14 (59 hp)
    |
    17
    |
    12
    |
    15
    |
    12
    |
    11
    |
    8
    |
    +7/+10
    |
    +10
    |
    +7
    |
    +6
    |
    +5
    |
    1

    Very Young|
    L
    |
    10d12+30 (95 hp)
    |
    21
    |
    12
    |
    17
    |
    12
    |
    11
    |
    8
    |
    +10/+19
    |
    +14
    |
    +10
    |
    +8
    |
    +7
    |
    2

    Young|
    L
    |
    13d12+39 (123 hp)
    |
    25
    |
    12
    |
    17
    |
    14
    |
    11
    |
    10
    |
    +13/+24
    |
    +19
    |
    +11
    |
    +9
    |
    +8
    |
    3

    Juvenile|
    L
    |
    16d12+39 (123 hp)
    |
    29
    |
    12
    |
    19
    |
    14
    |
    11
    |
    10
    |
    +16/+29
    |
    +24
    |
    +14
    |
    +11
    |
    +10
    |
    4

    Young Adult|
    H
    |
    19d12+95 (218 hp)
    |
    31
    |
    12
    |
    21
    |
    16
    |
    13
    |
    12
    |
    +19/+37
    |
    +27
    |
    +16
    |
    +12
    |
    +12
    |
    5

    Adult|
    H
    |
    22d12+110 (253 hp)
    |
    33
    |
    12
    |
    21
    |
    16
    |
    13
    |
    12
    |
    +22/+41
    |
    +31
    |
    +18
    |
    +14
    |
    +14
    |
    7

    Mature Adult|
    H
    |
    25d12+150 (312 hp)
    |
    35
    |
    12
    |
    23
    |
    18
    |
    15
    |
    14
    |
    +25/+45
    |
    +35
    |
    +20
    |
    +15
    |
    +16
    |
    9

    Old|
    G
    |
    28d12+196 (378 hp)
    |
    39
    |
    12
    |
    25
    |
    18
    |
    15
    |
    14
    |
    +28/+54
    |
    +38
    |
    +23
    |
    +17
    |
    +18
    |
    11

    Very Old|
    G
    |
    31d12+248 (449 hp)
    |
    41
    |
    12
    |
    27
    |
    20
    |
    17
    |
    16
    |
    +31/+58
    |
    +42
    |
    +25
    |
    +18
    |
    +20
    |
    13

    Ancient|
    G
    |
    34d12+306 (527 hp)
    |
    43
    |
    12
    |
    29
    |
    20
    |
    17
    |
    16
    |
    +34/+62
    |
    +46
    |
    +28
    |
    +20
    |
    +22
    |
    15

    Wyrm|
    G
    |
    37d12+370 (610 hp)
    |
    45
    |
    12
    |
    31
    |
    22
    |
    19
    |
    18
    |
    +37/+66
    |
    +50
    |
    +30
    |
    +21
    |
    +24
    |
    17

    Great Wyrm|
    C
    |
    40d12+440 (700 hp)
    |
    47
    |
    12
    |
    33
    |
    22
    |
    21
    |
    20
    |
    +40/+74
    |
    +50
    |
    +33
    |
    +23
    |
    +27
    |
    19
    [/table]

    Cold Iron Dragon Abilities By Age
    {table=head]Age|Speed|Initiative|AC|Special Abilities|Initiator Level|SR
    Wyrmling|60 ft., climb 30ft.|
    +1
    |18 (+1 Dex, +7 natural), touch 11, flat-footed 17||
    -
    |
    -

    Very Young|60 ft., climb 30 ft.|
    +1
    |20 (+1 Dex, +10 natural, -1 size), touch 10, flat-footed 19||
    -
    |
    -

    Young|60 ft., climb 30 ft.|
    +1
    |23 (+1 Dex, +13 natural, -1 size), touch 10, flat-footed 22|Alternate form|
    1st
    |
    -

    Juvenile|60 ft., climb 30 ft.|
    +1
    |26 (+1 Dex, +16 natural, -1 size), touch 10, flat-footed 25||
    3rd
    |
    -

    Young Adult|60 ft., climb 30 ft.|
    +1
    |28 (+1 Dex, +19 natural, -2 size), touch 9, flat-footed 27|DR 5/magic|
    5th
    |
    25

    Adult|60 ft., climb 30 ft.|
    +1
    |31 (+1 Dex, +22 natural, -2 size), touch 9, flat-footed 30|Remove curse|
    7th
    |
    27

    Mature Adult|60 ft., climb 30 ft.|
    +1
    |34 (+1 Dex, +25 natural, -2 size), touch 9, flat-footed 33|DR 10/magic|
    9th
    |
    30

    Old|60 ft., climb 30 ft.|
    +1
    |35 (+1 Dex, +28 natural, -4 size), touch 7, flat-footed 34|Break enchantment|
    11th
    |
    32

    Very Old|60 ft., climb 30 ft.|
    +1
    |38 (+1 Dex, +31 natural, -4 size), touch 7, flat-footed 37|DR 15 magic|
    13th
    |
    33

    Ancient|60 ft., climb 30 ft.|
    +1
    |41 (+1 Dex, +34 natural, -4 size), touch 7, flat-footed 40|Spell turning|
    15th
    |
    35

    Wyrm|60 ft., climb 30 ft.|
    +1
    |44 (+1 Dex, +37 natural, -4 size), touch 7, flat-footed 43|DR 20/magic|
    17th
    |
    36

    Great Wyrm|60 ft., climb 30 ft.|
    +1
    |43 (+1 Dex, +40 natural, -8 size), touch 3, flat-footed 42|Dragonís disjunction|
    19th
    |
    38
    [/table]

    Any advice and error finding is welcome.

    EDIT: I should also credit DracoDei as his Beige dragon inspired some of the changes I made before posting.

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    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    Griffon

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    Default Re: Cold Iron Dragon (3.5, ToB dragon)

    Reserved in case I need it as dragons often require extra stuff.

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    Default Re: Cold Iron Dragon (3.5, ToB dragon)

    Just looking over it:
    Normally DR X/magic is a supernatural ability and thus completely loss in an antimagic field. So it might be better just to note that due to their DR being Supernatural it is also negated when their aura is active.
    Otherwise:
    Spell-like Abilities: Normally go off Age Category or Sorcerer level whichever is higher. I assume this would go off of either Age Category or Initiator level but you might should note that, or note that it goes off of something else (breath weapon caster level?).

    No fly speed makes me sad since I love the image of a flying dragon, otherwise why Spider Climb instead of just a Climb Speed?

    Edit: Also do they get stances or just strikes/boosts/counters? The two progressions are half-seperated so I'm not sure which way is intended.
    Last edited by Zaydos; 2010-01-03 at 11:25 PM.
    Peanut Dracolich avatar by Emperor Ing.

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    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    Griffon

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    Default Re: Cold Iron Dragon (3.5, ToB dragon)

    Ok, I have to go soon but I'll just quickly reply first.

    Quote Originally Posted by Zaydos View Post
    Just looking over it:
    Normally DR X/magic is a supernatural ability and thus completely loss in an antimagic field. So it might be better just to note that due to their DR being Supernatural it is also negated when their aura is active.
    Yikes, I forgot about that! Do you think that it would be better to give them a different type of DR, say that it is an exception or just go with your originol suggestion?

    Otherwise:
    Spell-like Abilities: Normally go off Age Category or Sorcerer level whichever is higher. I assume this would go off of either Age Category or Initiator level but you might should note that, or note that it goes off of something else (breath weapon caster level?).
    Yes, they go off the higher of the age category or initiator level (breath weapon does to but it's listed for ease of use).

    No fly speed makes me sad since I love the image of a flying dragon, otherwise why Spider Climb instead of just a Climb Speed?
    Flying was just something that didn't feel right for it in my opinion but I'm willing to change it if most people want me to. Spider climb was cribbed off copper but you're right it is better with a climb speed.

    Edit: Also do they get stances or just strikes/boosts/counters? The two progressions are half-seperated so I'm not sure which way is intended.
    They get stances as well.

    Oh, and I should probably credit DracoDei, his Beige dragon inspired some of the later changes. In fact I'll edit that in now.

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    Default Re: Cold Iron Dragon (3.5, ToB dragon)

    This is pretty awesome. One suggestion about the DR: Consider making it DR/Warheart, to reflect its martial inclinations. High level adventurers are likely to carry enchanted weapons, but might not be as likely to have warheart weapons. You can rule that this type of DR is Extraordinary in nature, and perhaps also rule that all martial maneuvers (regardless of whether they are delivered via a warheart weapon) bypass this kind of DR.
    Last edited by Merk; 2010-01-04 at 12:08 AM.

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    Default Re: Cold Iron Dragon (3.5, ToB dragon)

    For the DR thing I'd say it depends upon what power you want them at. Fluff-wise I could see them with DR X/adamantine but that is more powerful than having them have to choose between DR and antimagic.

    Another question: do they still have wings? If so you might want to give some explanation of why they cannot fly (such as they are weak and vestigial) possibly with an additional reduction to damage from wing attacks and a racial bonus to jump checks (even possibly a glide speed). If not you may need to note that they lack the wing attacks of normal dragons (which makes them a little weaker, but most Strikes can't be used with full attacks anyway).

    I figured spider climb came from copper dragons, just thought a climb speed might be more accurate to the fluff.
    Peanut Dracolich avatar by Emperor Ing.

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    Default Re: Cold Iron Dragon (3.5, ToB dragon)

    I'd encourage a fly speed. I'm planning to rewrite and repost my ToB PrC for Dragons fairly soon, and it has flyby attack as a prerequisite.
    Looking for a monster?

    Age of Wariors,, A Homebrew Sequel to Tome of Battle (see also the original thread, disciplines table and prestige class table)

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    Default Re: Cold Iron Dragon (3.5, ToB dragon)

    I love that it doesnt have flight

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    Default Re: Cold Iron Dragon (3.5, ToB dragon)

    Thank you for giving me credit... but it would also be nice to know what I did in the first place.

    If it was swapping out the frightful presence, then that was in my turn inspired by the Dragon Ascendant PrC in Draconomicon.
    Best homebrew:
    Grace-Gift - Truly Defensive base class, Falling Anvil Discipline - Loony Slapstick as Martial Art, Mepholk - Snuggly skunk-people. , Wing Dragon Masters of flight Comment HERE, Organ Undead Mega-Thread livers, skins, etc.
    Filk: 4000 Years(to live)
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    For everything else see: Full list of Homebrew.
    My Homebrew is meant to be used, but, if you do, PLEASE tell me how it goes.

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    Default Re: Cold Iron Dragon (3.5, ToB dragon)

    Instead of posting a whole new thread, I'll just ask here where you ToB experts can answer directly.
    I'm looking for a discipline that is focused on ranged combat. What is it called? Where can I find it?
    Thanks in advance.

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    Default Re: Cold Iron Dragon (3.5, ToB dragon)

    Quote Originally Posted by Chrono22 View Post
    Instead of posting a whole new thread, I'll just ask here where you ToB experts can answer directly.
    I'm looking for a discipline that is focused on ranged combat. What is it called? Where can I find it?
    Thanks in advance.
    It? There are quite a few, falling star being the most well known.
    "It doesn't matter how much you struggle or strive,
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    Default Re: Cold Iron Dragon (3.5, ToB dragon)

    You probably need to explicitly state that their natural weapons are considered associated for all disciplines.

    Also, I think that giving them flight would be a mistake, if no other reason than because it would be a bit of fridge logic when they also have ranks in Jump if they take up Tiger Claw... speaking of which they need a non-standard set of racial skills to spend their skill points on.
    Last edited by DracoDei; 2010-01-04 at 01:26 AM.
    Best homebrew:
    Grace-Gift - Truly Defensive base class, Falling Anvil Discipline - Loony Slapstick as Martial Art, Mepholk - Snuggly skunk-people. , Wing Dragon Masters of flight Comment HERE, Organ Undead Mega-Thread livers, skins, etc.
    Filk: 4000 Years(to live)
    Running: Ruceeglaelsktinag: "Justifiable Genocide", Contradiction in terms? IC OOC Active Map: None.
    For everything else see: Full list of Homebrew.
    My Homebrew is meant to be used, but, if you do, PLEASE tell me how it goes.

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    Default Re: Cold Iron Dragon (3.5, ToB dragon)

    Steeldragon wyrm of war looks like it would be a better initiator.

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    Default Re: Cold Iron Dragon (3.5, ToB dragon)

    Just change the CR to be that of a greater dragon (like a red or silver) and tone down the SR appropriately. The great wyrm wouldn't even be a speedbump to a level 30 party.
    Sure it's tough but at epic levels? Even CR 27 is a stretch for it (just so you know, all metallic dragons and the red dragons qualify for epic spellcasting at great wyrm).

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    Griffon

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    Default Re: Cold Iron Dragon (3.5, ToB dragon)

    Quote Originally Posted by Merk View Post
    This is pretty awesome. One suggestion about the DR: Consider making it DR/Warheart, to reflect its martial inclinations. High level adventurers are likely to carry enchanted weapons, but might not be as likely to have warheart weapons. You can rule that this type of DR is Extraordinary in nature, and perhaps also rule that all martial maneuvers (regardless of whether they are delivered via a warheart weapon) bypass this kind of DR.
    Thanks for the advice but that would still feel suppernatural to me at least. It is a good idea though.

    Quote Originally Posted by Zaydos
    Another question: do they still have wings?
    Winglessness is stated in the italic flavour text. And I've been convinced that I was right to make them flightless.

    Quote Originally Posted by DracoDei
    Thank you for giving me credit... but it would also be nice to know what I did in the first place.

    If it was swapping out the frightful presence, then that was in my turn inspired by the Dragon Ascendant PrC in Draconomicon.
    Actually I had already decided to do that...and had to change the name as mundane presence was now taken. Its actually just simple stuff I should have worked out eventually anyway, like I knew that I couldn't give it scorcerer spells but you replaced the progression with that of an adept which I hadn't scene done before (even though I did know gem dragons) and I realised, "I can do that to!"

    Quote Originally Posted by DracoDei
    You probably need to explicitly state that their natural weapons are considered associated for all disciplines.
    Planned to do that for all warblde disciplines and forgot. Do you really think it should be all?

    Quote Originally Posted by deuxhero
    wyrm of war
    Template I'm not familliar with/have forgotten about?

    Quote Originally Posted by GoC
    Just change the CR to be that of a greater dragon (like a red or silver) and tone down the SR appropriately. The great wyrm wouldn't even be a speedbump to a level 30 party.
    Sure it's tough but at epic levels? Even CR 27 is a stretch for it (just so you know, all metallic dragons and the red dragons qualify for epic spellcasting at great wyrm).
    If you think so. I tried using The Vorple Tribble's and Fax_Celestis' CR calculators but either I made some errors or they don't work as effectively for very high CRs. I looked at it and thought "surely that can't be right" but I knew that dragons are normally considered under CR'ed and this is a pretty wierd dragon. I kind of wanted them to have a huge SR though as it's kind of their schtick.

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    Default Re: Cold Iron Dragon (3.5, ToB dragon)

    Given that Dragon Magazine's adamantine dragon's natural weapons count as adamantine for the purposes of ignoring DR and hardness, I'd say that this dragon's natural weapons should count as cold-iron.
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    Default Re: Cold Iron Dragon (3.5, ToB dragon)

    Quote Originally Posted by Sereg View Post
    I kind of wanted them to have a huge SR though as it's kind of their schtick.
    If it's there thing then by all means increase it a bit! Dragon SR is too low anyway.
    I'd say make their SR be CR+12.

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    Default Re: Cold Iron Dragon (3.5, ToB dragon)

    "Just the Warblade disciplines" is probably the right way to go.
    Best homebrew:
    Grace-Gift - Truly Defensive base class, Falling Anvil Discipline - Loony Slapstick as Martial Art, Mepholk - Snuggly skunk-people. , Wing Dragon Masters of flight Comment HERE, Organ Undead Mega-Thread livers, skins, etc.
    Filk: 4000 Years(to live)
    Running: Ruceeglaelsktinag: "Justifiable Genocide", Contradiction in terms? IC OOC Active Map: None.
    For everything else see: Full list of Homebrew.
    My Homebrew is meant to be used, but, if you do, PLEASE tell me how it goes.

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    Griffon

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    Default Re: Cold Iron Dragon (3.5, ToB dragon)

    Quote Originally Posted by hamishspence View Post
    Given that Dragon Magazine's adamantine dragon's natural weapons count as adamantine for the purposes of ignoring DR and hardness, I'd say that this dragon's natural weapons should count as cold-iron.
    Excellent point. I thought of that at one point but forgot to write it down.

    Quote Originally Posted by GoC
    If it's there thing then by all means increase it a bit! Dragon SR is too low anyway.
    I'd say make their SR be CR+12.
    That makes sense.

    Quote Originally Posted by DracoDei
    "Just the Warblade disciplines" is probably the right way to go.
    Alright.

    And I forgot to adress this:
    Quote Originally Posted by DracoDei
    speaking of which they need a non-standard set of racial skills to spend their skill points on.
    Already there as Balance, jump and martial lore.

    Thanks fopr the comments, advice and support so far.

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    Default Re: Cold Iron Dragon (3.5, ToB dragon)

    Wyrm of War is from Dragons of Eberron. Give up cleric casting for either bonus feats and proficiencies, or (what is relvant here) Tiger Claw access,

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    Griffon

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    Default Re: Cold Iron Dragon (3.5, ToB dragon)

    Quote Originally Posted by deuxhero View Post
    Wyrm of War is from Dragons of Eberron. Give up cleric casting for either bonus feats and proficiencies, or (what is relvant here) Tiger Claw access,
    Oh. Ok, I see what you mean then. I don't own Dragons of Eberron though. And I actually started designing this dragon back when I played 2nd edition so the ToB stuff wasn't the major concern. It just seemed to fit so well once I finally read ToB.

    EDIT: elliot20 requested a list of typical manuevers known, so I threw something together but my optimisation skills = no. Therefore, if someone can see any changes that would be appropriate I'd be glad to listen to your advice.

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    Default Re: Cold Iron Dragon (3.5, ToB dragon)

    Is a young wyrm meant to have an IL of 7 (IL is half of all non initiator hit dice, counting RHD)?
    Last edited by deuxhero; 2010-01-05 at 09:49 AM.

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    Griffon

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    Default Re: Cold Iron Dragon (3.5, ToB dragon)

    Quote Originally Posted by deuxhero View Post
    Is a young wyrm meant to have an IL of 7 (IL is half of all non initiator hit dice, counting RHD)?
    That isn't the way I origonally intended it, but you make a good point.

    What if I said that the IL column gives their effective IL for choosing manuevers but it's added to half their RHD for all other purposes? Or do you think that I should do it differently?

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    Griffon

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    Default Re: Cold Iron Dragon (3.5, ToB dragon)

    Just bumping in the hopes of more advice.

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    DracoDei's Avatar

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    Default Re: Cold Iron Dragon (3.5, ToB dragon)

    Before I forget: Regarding the "Master of Nine Claws" PrC, in any game I ran I would just make an exception to the rule that they have to be able to fly to take it.
    Best homebrew:
    Grace-Gift - Truly Defensive base class, Falling Anvil Discipline - Loony Slapstick as Martial Art, Mepholk - Snuggly skunk-people. , Wing Dragon Masters of flight Comment HERE, Organ Undead Mega-Thread livers, skins, etc.
    Filk: 4000 Years(to live)
    Running: Ruceeglaelsktinag: "Justifiable Genocide", Contradiction in terms? IC OOC Active Map: None.
    For everything else see: Full list of Homebrew.
    My Homebrew is meant to be used, but, if you do, PLEASE tell me how it goes.

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    Default Re: Cold Iron Dragon (3.5, ToB dragon)

    Quote Originally Posted by Sereg View Post
    Just bumping in the hopes of more advice.
    I doubt you'll get any. It seems pretty flawless.

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    Griffon

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    Default Re: Cold Iron Dragon (3.5, ToB dragon)

    Quote Originally Posted by DracoDei View Post
    Before I forget: Regarding the "Master of Nine Claws" PrC, in any game I ran I would just make an exception to the rule that they have to be able to fly to take it.
    Thanks DracoDei, you make an excellent suggestion. Is that, by the way an indication that you would use this dragon. If so, I must say that I too would love to get feedback on how my creations fare.

    Also, any other comments about the maneuver list and/or initiator level? Those are what I am most concerned about at the moment. Or any other questions/comments at all?

    Incidentally, Iíd love to do a half-dragon template, butÖIím uncertain as to what changes are appropriate. Obviously Iíll have to remove the wings for Large/larger creatures, but what about things like breath weapon?

    Another thing, back when I was still thinking about posting this, I wondered if anyone would ask me if I was thinking of doing an alchemical silver equivalent. Well, I have thought of something, but of course we already have a silver dragon. So I was wondering, should it be called alchemical silver, true silver, silvered or something else that I have yet to think of?

    Quote Originally Posted by GoC
    I doubt you'll get any. It seems pretty flawless.
    Thank you! That does wonders for my ego.

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    Default Re: Cold Iron Dragon (3.5, ToB dragon)

    Argent Dragon maybe? Argentum is the Latin for Silver.

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    DracoDei's Avatar

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    Default Re: Cold Iron Dragon (3.5, ToB dragon)

    I have no particular plans to use it. I just don't plan that far in advance with my current campaign.


    If I do... well, my campaign logs are linked from my extended signature.
    Best homebrew:
    Grace-Gift - Truly Defensive base class, Falling Anvil Discipline - Loony Slapstick as Martial Art, Mepholk - Snuggly skunk-people. , Wing Dragon Masters of flight Comment HERE, Organ Undead Mega-Thread livers, skins, etc.
    Filk: 4000 Years(to live)
    Running: Ruceeglaelsktinag: "Justifiable Genocide", Contradiction in terms? IC OOC Active Map: None.
    For everything else see: Full list of Homebrew.
    My Homebrew is meant to be used, but, if you do, PLEASE tell me how it goes.

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    hamishspence's Avatar

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    Default Re: Cold Iron Dragon (3.5, ToB dragon)

    In 4E Draconomicon 2, it states that metallic dragons contain the relevant metal in their claws, scales, blood, etc.

    So a silver dragon's scales and claws are basically full of silver.

    So it might not be that much of a stretch to import it back into 3.5 ed and say

    "Optional houserule- Silver dragon natural attacks count as silvered weapons for the purposes of overcoming DR/silver (or DR/any combination that involves silver- such as DR/epic, good, and silver)"
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