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    Default The Debaser [3.5] [PEACH]

    Debaser


    Taste your demise as I taste your soul...
    -- Iolus Hosh, "soul-sucking bastard"

    Disease, pain, suffering, and blight is everywhere. One just has to look for it. In some cases, searching for a source leads to a creature. This creature may be a debaser. In those cases, beware, for the corruption that creature can cause is beyond what most mortals know. For this reason, debasers have come to be known as "soul-sucking bastards."

    Adventures: A debaser may adventure for several reasons. If they're evil, a common reason is to simply increase their power by practicing on settlements and innocents. They adventure for the purpose of being the best (by throwing others down). One who is not so evil or corrupted may decide to adventure on a whim, letting fate take them where it will, or they might adventure because of a higher-up ordering them to in a guild or organization. There are all kinds of reasons to adventure, but the least common for debasers is helping others. In contrast, a debaser might want to save the world or some part of it because that is what they revel in destroying and reducing.

    Characteristics: Debasers cast spells similar to the way a beguiler does. They focus on spells that "debuff" an enemy or multiple enemies. The same goes for their class features. Fell drain saps life from an enemy and powers the debaser with the energy, and the debaser's other class features have similar effects, like the debaser's curse, the namesake of the class. Altogether, a debaser is about weakening enemies so that they may take over them more easily.

    Alignment: Of the alignments, debasers are most commonly evil, but some are neutral. Their abilities focus on weakening and debasing others, so it's no wonder there are so very few good debasers. Even those who are have trouble staying on the path, usually tending more towards neutral in the end. Debasers also tend towards chaos, with their scourge bringing such to the lands they visit.

    Religion: Debasers worship neutral and evil gods, and sometimes (although rare), a debaser might even follow the path of a good deity, although their views most likely conflict in a few ways. One debaser could be a trickster of sorts, relying on making others sick for short periods of time to show them a lesson, worshiping Olidammara. Another could be a follower of Nerull, bringing a blight upon whomever they meet.

    Background: A debaser could come from anywhere. One could be a demon from the abyss, using fell magic and drains to sap the life out of the world. Another could be a simple human from a life of peasantry, learning how to use their power to advance in life. Yet another could be a king, keeping others below him by weakening would-be usurpers.

    Races: Any race can be a debaser, but the more savage populations tend to steer clear of this particular profession. Those races that tend to have a population of charismatic individuals often become debasers.

    Other Classes: Debasers don't often get along with paladins, as their conflicting views on the subject of morality come into play. Barbarians tend to dislike debasers as well, with their views on the occult, furthered by the debaser's outlook on life--a thing to be drained. Sorcerers and bards might enjoy the company of someone sharing their abilities. Rogues, having similar combat skills and sometimes philosophies, often associate with debasers. Wizards often welcome another user of magic into an adventuring party, but those with a less necromantic view of magic might find their use of it repulsive. Clerics sometimes like to have a debaser on their team--especially war clerics. Druids are sometimes alright with debasers--until they pick on nature. Monks hold a fairly neutral view of debasers, and the same goes for rangers, although they sometimes take to the druid point of view.

    Role: Debasers are usually indirect support characters. They can hold their own in melee (usually after cursing their target) with their weapons of choice, which usually happen to be the most painful or the most wicked, but much of their power comes from controlling the battlefield, weakening enemies so allies and possibly the debasers themselves can wade in and crush them easily. Essentially, the debaser is the opposite of the bard. While bards power up their allies, thereby ending enemies, debasers power down enemies, thereby ending them in a different way.

    GAME RULE INFORMATION
    Debasers have the following game statistics.
    Abilities: Charisma improves almost all of the debaser’s abilities, and is their primary spellcasting ability. Dexterity helps with certain targeted abilities requiring attack rolls, such as their fell drain ability. Constitution improves Concentration and hit points, both of which help greatly.
    Alignment: Any nongood.
    Hit Die: d8.

    Class Skills
    The debaser’s class skills (and the key ability for each skill) are Bluff (Cha), Concentration (Con), Craft (Int), Decipher Script (Int), Diplomacy (Cha), Intimidate (Cha), Knowledge (arcana) (Int), Knowledge (the planes) (Int), Listen (Wis), Profession (Wis), Spellcraft (Int), and Spot (Wis).

    Skill Points at 1st Level: (4 + Int modifier) x 4
    Skill Points at Each Additional Level: 4 + Int modifier

    DEBASER
    Level Base Attack Bonus Fort Save Ref Save Will Save Special 0 1st 2nd 3rd 4th 5th 6th
    1st +0 +2 +0 +2 Debaser's curse, fell drain, armored mage 2 - - - - - -
    2nd +1 +3 +0 +3 Bolster curse 1/day 3 0 - - - - -
    3rd +2 +3 +1 +3 Corruption aura 1/day, debasement focus +2 3 1 - - - - -
    4th +3 +4 +1 +4 - 3 2 0 - - - -
    5th +3 +4 +1 +4 Mettle 3 3 1 - - - -
    6th +4 +5 +2 +5 Greater debaser's curse, corruption aura 2/day 3 3 2 - - - -
    7th +5 +5 +2 +5 - 3 3 2 0 - - -
    8th +6/+1 +6 +2 +6 Bolster curse 2/day 3 3 3 1 - - -
    9th +6/+1 +6 +3 +6 Overwhelming drain, corruption aura 3/day 3 3 3 2 - - -
    10th +7/+2 +7 +3 +7 - 3 3 3 2 0 - -
    11th +8/+3 +7 +3 +7 Debasement focus +4 3 3 3 3 1 - -
    12th +9/+4 +8 +4 +8 Corruption aura 4/day 3 3 3 3 2 - -
    13th +9/+4 +8 +4 +8 - 3 3 3 3 2 0 -
    14th +10/+5 +9 +4 +9 Bolster curse 3/day 4 3 3 3 3 1 -
    15th +11/+6/+1 +9 +5 +9 Supreme debaser's curse, corruption aura 5/day 4 4 3 3 3 2 -
    16th +12/+7/+2 +10 +5 +10 - 4 4 4 3 3 2 0
    17th +12/+7/+2 +10 +5 +10 - 4 4 4 4 3 3 1
    18th +13/+8/+3 +11 +6 +11 Domination drain, corruption aura 6/day 4 4 4 4 4 3 2
    19th +14/+9/+4 +11 +6 +11 Debasement focus +6 4 4 4 4 4 4 3
    20th +15/+10/+5 +12 +6 +12 Scourge, bolster curse 4/day 4 4 4 4 4 4 4

    Class Features
    All of the following are class features of the debaser.

    Weapon and Armor Proficiency: Debasers are proficient with all simple and martial weapons. Debasers are proficient with light and medium armor, but not with shields.

    Spells: Debasers cast arcane spells, which are drawn from the debaser spell list given below. They are able to cast any spell they know without preparing it ahead of time.
    To learn or cast a spell, a debaser must have a Charisma score equal to at least 10 + spell level. The Difficulty Class for a saving throw against a debaser’s spell is 10 + spell level + Cha modifier.
    When the debaser gains a new spell level, they automatically know all spells of that level.

    Debaser’s Curse (Su): A debaser may call upon the darkness within to bring a curse upon an enemy as a swift action. When using this ability, the debaser chooses from two of the following effects, combining them to make the debaser’s curse, targeted on an enemy within 60 feet. The debaser must have line of sight to the target.
    Disable -– -2 penalty to Strength
    Debilitate -– -2 penalty to Dexterity
    Devastate -- -2 penalty to Constitution
    Disenable -- -2 penalty to Intelligence
    Depress -– -2 penalty to Wisdom
    Disgrace -– -2 penalty to Charisma
    Cripple -– -10’ penalty to speed
    Hinder -– -2 penalty to skill checks
    A creature’s speed may be reduced to a minimum of 5’ in this manner. This ability can lower a creature's abilities to a minimum of 1. Debaser’s curse can be used 1 + Cha modifier per day. If the opponent succeeds on a Will saving throw of DC 10 + ½ class levels + Cha modifier, no uses are wasted. The effects of debaser's curse last for an hour.

    Fell Drain (Su): The debaser may conjure a blast of destructive energy connected to their own essence as a full round action, aimed at an enemy. If the debaser successfully hits an enemy with a ranged touch attack with a range of up to 60 feet, the debaser may drain power from the target. The debaser gains +2 Armor Class and +2 to all saves for 3 + Cha modifier rounds, and the enemy suffers 1d4 Strength or Dexterity damage. Fell drain can be used once per day per class level.

    Armored Mage (Ex): The debaser has trained extensively in casting spells that lower their opponents' capabilities. So extensively, in fact, that they can cast arcane spells in light armor with no chance of spell failure. Spells granted from other classes still have a chance of failure from wearing armor, unless they also grant the ability to cast in armor.

    Bolster Curse (Su): At 2nd level, a debaser can add an additional choice from the list of curse options to their debaser's curse once per day. This does not grant an extra use of debaser's curse. Rather, it allows the debaser to alter a use of it to gain one additional effect.
    At 8th level, and every 6 levels after (14, 20), the debaser is allowed another use of bolster curse.

    Corruption Aura (Su): At 3rd level, the debaser is able to evoke a dark aura. Once per day, a debaser can activate the corruption aura at a mental command as a free action, lasting for 3 + Cha modifier rounds. Enemies within 30 feet of the debaser slowly decay, unless they succeed on a Fortitude saving throw of DC 10 + 1/2 class levels + Cha modifier. Each enemy is subject to 1 Constitution damage each round they are within the area. If an enemy is within the area for more than 5 rounds, negative levels start to apply every round after. If an opponent leaves the area for more than one round, the count is reset, and they take Constitution damage if they go back in range of the aura.
    At 6th level, and every 3 levels after (9, 12, 15, and 18), the debaser can use corruption aura one more time per day.

    Debasement Focus: At 3rd level, the debaser gains a +2 bonus to overcome spell resistance when casting from the debaser spell list.
    At 11th level, this bonus increases to +4.
    At 19th level, this bonus increases to +6.

    Mettle (Ex): At 5th level, a debaser gains an even more resistant body and mind, allowing a Fortitude or Will saving throw against spells that can be reduced in effectiveness by an ordinary Fortitude or Will saving throw. This ability, however, allows the debaser to avoid all damage and negative effects from such spells.

    Greater Debaser’s Curse (Su): At 6th level, the debaser’s curse strengthens, further penalizing enemies, and providing another option for the curse.
    Disable -– -4 penalty to Strength
    Debilitate -– -4 penalty to Dexterity
    Devastate -- -4 penalty to Constitution
    Disenable -- -4 penalty to Intelligence
    Depress -– -4 penalty to Wisdom
    Disgrace -– -4 penalty to Charisma
    Cripple -– -20’ penalty to speed
    Hinder -– -4 penalty to skill checks
    Mutilate -- -4 penalty to armor or natural armor bonus (whichever is higher) to Armor Class
    This ability can lower a creature's abilities to a minimum of 1. The mutilate property allows an opponent's armor or natural armor bonus to fall to a minimum of 0. The cripple property allows speed to be dropped to a minimum of 5'.

    Overwhelming Drain (Su): At 9th level, the debaser's drain power improves. The benefits now improve to +4 Armor Class and +4 to saves. In addition, the debaser can now choose to gain +4 to attacks instead of the bonus to saves. Ability damage improves to deal 1d6 + 1.

    Supreme Debaser's Curse (Su): At 15th level, the debaser's curse reaches its pinnacle, further increasing the penalties imposed, and offering yet another option.
    Disable -– -6 penalty to Strength
    Debilitate -– -6 penalty to Dexterity
    Devastate -- -6 penalty to Constitution
    Disenable -- -6 penalty to Intelligence
    Depress -– -6 penalty to Wisdom
    Disgrace -– -6 penalty to Charisma
    Cripple -– -30’ penalty to speed
    Hinder -– -6 penalty to skill checks
    Mutilate -- -6 penalty to armor or natural armor bonus (whichever is higher) to Armor Class
    Magebane -- -2 penalty to caster level for the purposes of spell effects
    This ability can lower a creature's abilities to a minimum of 1. The magebane property allows caster level to fall to a minimum of 1. The mutilate property allows an opponent's armor or natural armor bonus to fall to a minimum of 0. The cripple property allows speed to be dropped to a minimum of 5'.

    Domination Drain (Su): At 18th level, the debaser's fell drain ability is at its high. The benefits improve once more to +6 Armor Class and +6 saves. The debaser may choose to substitute +6 attack for the bonus to saves. Ability damage is improved once again to 1d8 + 2.

    Scourge (Su): At 20th level, the debaser has reached the pinnacle of debasing. Once per day as a full round action, the debaser can release a huge wave of dark energy to make defeating their enemies a breeze. All enemies within 60 feet take a penalty of -10 to all ability scores, damage rolls, critical confirmation rolls, saves, skills, and initiative for an hour. A successful Will saving throw of DC 15 + 1/2 class levels + Cha modifier negates the penalties.


    Debaser Spell List:

    0 -- Daze, flare, touch of fatigue, prestidigitation, sonic snap (SpC), stick (SpC), slash tongue (BoVD)

    1st -- Bane, cause fear, doom, dispel ward (SpC), incite (SpC), inhibit (SpC), impede (CC), obscuring mist, grease, sleep, color spray, chill touch, ray of enfeeblement, karmic aura (CM), resinous tar (CM), death's call (CM), buzzing bee (SpC), wall of smoke (SpC), distract (SpC), distract assailant (SpC), shock and awe (SpC), spirit worm (SpC), ray of clumsiness (SpC)

    2nd -- Blindness/Deafness, silence, sound burst, death knell, curse of ill fortune (SpC), wave of grief (SpC), bewildering visions (CC), execration (CC), mark of the outcast (SpC), fog cloud, black karma curse (PHBII), blade brothers (PHBII), daze monster, hideous laughter, touch of idiocy, ghoul touch, scare, arcane turmoil (CM), torrent of tears (CM), escalating enfeeblement (CM), wall of gloom (SpC), Kelgore's grave mist (PHBII), curse of impending blades (SpC)

    3rd -- Bestow curse, hold person, contagion, dispel magic, invisibility purge, wrack (SpC), clutch of orcus (SpC), nauseating breath (SpC), sink (SpC), curse of arrow attraction (PHBII), energy vulnerability (PHBII), hesitate (PHBII), sleet storm, stinking cloud, deep slumber, halt undead, ray of exhaustion, vampiric touch, slow, karmic backlash (CM), caustic smoke (CM), pall of twilight (CM), prickling torment (CM), unluck (SpC), ray of dizziness (SpC), mass curse of impending blades (SpC), mind poison (SpC), spider poison (SpC), spell vulnerability (SpC), shivering touch (FrB)

    4th -- Poison, confusion, castigate (SpC), doomtide (CD), confound (CC), consumptive field (SpC), hypothermia (SpC), moon bolt (SpC), negative energy aura (SpC), unholy blight, enervation, solid fog, crushing despair, shout, fear, finger of agony (CM), horrid sickness (CM), touch of years (CM), sensory deprivation (SpC), sword of deception (SpC), suicidal thoughts

    5th -- Insect plague, symbol of pain, symbol of sleep, bewildering mischance (CC), bleed (CC), mark of sin (CC), mass contagion (SpC), mass curse of ill fortune (SpC), symbol of spell loss (SpC), vulnerability (SpC), wall of dispel magic (SpC), condemnation (PHBII), mana flux (PHBII), cloudkill, feeblemind, mind fog, blight, waves of fatigue, resounding thunder (CM), cryptwarden's grasp (CM), touch of vecna (CM), freezing fog (SpC), spiritwall (SpC), night's caress (SpC), vulnerability (SpC), gelid blood (FrB), disrupt spell resistance

    6th -- Antilife shell, greater dispel magic, symbol of fear, zealot pact (SpC), weight of sin (CC), cold snap (SpC), ghost trap (SpC), rejection (SpC), antimagic field, hold monster, eyebite, karmic retribution (CM), endless slumber (CM), transfix (SpC), aura of terror (SpC), fleshshiver (SpC), imperious glare (SpC), ray of entropy (SpC), spectral touch (SpC), greater shout, heartfreeze (FrB), greater disrupt spell resistance, mass suicidal thoughts
    Last edited by Temotei; 2014-04-09 at 08:16 PM.
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    Default Re: The Debaser [3.5] [PEACH]

    I weakened debaser's curse by taking away one option, and added another ability called bolster curse, allowing three options instead of two to be chosen. I'd love to hear on this class.
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    Default Re: The Debaser [3.5] [PEACH]

    I like it. It feels like a fixed Hexblade, which is something I approve of greatly. Looking at it though, the Hit Die is lower than I thought it would be for what it is. It seems like it's going to be a melee combatant most of the time, but d6 and light armor? And, poor weapon proficiencies isn't helping.

    The other nitpick I have is if you could mark the sources on the spells, that'd be best. I don't recognize them all off the top of my head, and I am fairly versed in such things.

    All that I say applies only to myself. You author your own actions and choices. I cannot and will not be responsible for you, nor are you for me, regardless of situation or circumstance.

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    Default Re: The Debaser [3.5] [PEACH]

    Quote Originally Posted by arguskos View Post
    I like it. It feels like a fixed Hexblade, which is something I approve of greatly. Looking at it though, the Hit Die is lower than I thought it would be for what it is. It seems like it's going to be a melee combatant most of the time, but d6 and light armor? And, poor weapon proficiencies isn't helping.

    The other nitpick I have is if you could mark the sources on the spells, that'd be best. I don't recognize them all off the top of my head, and I am fairly versed in such things.
    Will do. I had a general list in another thread that cited the sources, but not each spell specifically. I'll do that. Would you like the citations right by each spell, or at the end?

    I'll increase the hit die to d8, and add the kukri to the weapon proficiencies.

    And thank you. The class was based partly off the beguiler, and partly off the hexblade. It started out as a sort of hexblade fix, but I ended up creating an all-new class focused on debuffs. I took out unluck aura and replaced it with corruption aura. I gave it a nice capstone. Et cetera. I do put so much work into these classes, so I appreciate the comments from everyone. Saintjebus already sent me a PM on it, but will be posting in this thread on my request. I can't thank you guys enough for the time you spend in reading the class, and the comments just add to my gratefulness.
    Last edited by Temotei; 2010-01-04 at 05:54 PM.
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    Default Re: The Debaser [3.5] [PEACH]

    Why the strange weapons? Sap/short sword/whip/kukri? Why those?

    Personally, any system that makes the spells clear is good for me. I like asterisks and whatnot myself, but that's just me.

    All that I say applies only to myself. You author your own actions and choices. I cannot and will not be responsible for you, nor are you for me, regardless of situation or circumstance.

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    Default Re: The Debaser [3.5] [PEACH]

    Quote Originally Posted by arguskos View Post
    Why the strange weapons? Sap/short sword/whip/kukri? Why those?

    Personally, any system that makes the spells clear is good for me. I like asterisks and whatnot myself, but that's just me.
    What weapons would you choose?
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    Default Re: The Debaser [3.5] [PEACH]

    Quote Originally Posted by Temotei221 View Post
    Domination Drain (Su): At 18th level, the debaser's fell drain ability is at its high, ready to steal power from enemies readily. The benefits improve once more to +6 Armor Class and +6 saves. The debaser may choose to substitute +6 attack for the bonus to saves. Ability damage is improved once again to 1d8 + 2.
    Huh? You what?
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    Default Re: The Debaser [3.5] [PEACH]

    Quote Originally Posted by Random_person View Post
    Huh? You what?
    Oops. Thanks for catching that.

    The spells are now cited. A few I lost. Silly me. I think I'll ask where they are on the roleplaying board.
    Last edited by Temotei; 2010-01-04 at 07:32 PM.
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    Default Re: The Debaser [3.5] [PEACH]

    Quote Originally Posted by Temotei221 View Post
    What weapons would you choose?
    Either give them some fluff to explain it, or give them martial weapons. They are a hybrid melee/martial class, they need weapons that don't shoehorn them.

    Then again, I personally feel that weapon prof should be basically free and at option, so take that as it is.

    I do like it though, it's something I may nick for my own use actually, alongside the Hexblade, Shadowcaster, and Binder as the Cabal of Strangeness (baddie group I'm working on for my campaign).

    EDIT: Spell list noted, and much thanks! It's pretty kind of you to note for us folks.
    Last edited by arguskos; 2010-01-04 at 07:37 PM.

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    Default Re: The Debaser [3.5] [PEACH]

    This was what I originally sent to Temotei:


    Quote Originally Posted by Saintjebus

    That curse seems really powerful. At level one you have a save or lose 4 times per day. That's.... really good. and it only gets better.

    I'm not sure how to balance it. Maybe the curse starts out as negatives, for example, 1st level curse = -1 to AC, -1 Attack. Next time it scales, increase. -2 to AC, -2 attack. Later,(like level 9-10) start adding some ability damage. then that increases.

    The problem is that the curse mimics higher level spells. Blindness/Deafness is a 2nd level spell. The first time I an find anything like ability damage is Bestow Curse, a 4th level spell
    I think I may have now been ninja'ed... haven't read through all of the other responses..
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    Default Re: The Debaser [3.5] [PEACH]

    Quote Originally Posted by Saintjebus View Post
    This was what I originally sent to Temotei:




    I think I may have now been ninja'ed... haven't read through all of the other responses..
    Actually, it's changed now, so you can take a look at the edited version with the new ability. No one commented until after I did that.

    Quote Originally Posted by Arguskos

    Either give them some fluff to explain it, or give them martial weapons. They are a hybrid melee/martial class, they need weapons that don't shoehorn them.

    Then again, I personally feel that weapon prof should be basically free and at option, so take that as it is.

    I do like it though, it's something I may nick for my own use actually, alongside the Hexblade, Shadowcaster, and Binder as the Cabal of Strangeness (baddie group I'm working on for my campaign).

    EDIT: Spell list noted, and much thanks! It's pretty kind of you to note for us folks.
    Fluff is incoming. Right now, I just want the mechanics to be balanced. I might give them martial weapons since that won't really give them that much more of an edge (no pun intended).

    As for the spell list editing...you're welcome. If you do play with the class, would you mind telling me how it goes?
    Last edited by Temotei; 2010-01-04 at 07:46 PM.
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    Default Re: The Debaser [3.5] [PEACH]

    Hey, if that means I have your permission, then I'm fine with telling you how it performs at level 1 (my new game starts at level 1, and so will the baddies).

    Martial really does solve the issues. I mean, let's look at it's match, the Hexblade. He gets martial with no issues.

    As for the curse, eh, it looks great to me honestly.

    All that I say applies only to myself. You author your own actions and choices. I cannot and will not be responsible for you, nor are you for me, regardless of situation or circumstance.

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    Default Re: The Debaser [3.5] [PEACH]

    Quote Originally Posted by arguskos View Post
    Hey, if that means I have your permission, then I'm fine with telling you how it performs at level 1 (my new game starts at level 1, and so will the baddies).

    Martial really does solve the issues. I mean, let's look at it's match, the Hexblade. He gets martial with no issues.

    As for the curse, eh, it looks great to me honestly.
    Thanks. Before, I had it let you choose from three. Now there's an ability that lets you do that a certain number of days instead. Bolster curse.

    I might give it Martial Weapon Proficiency. It's an idea.

    Of course you have permission.
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    Default Re: The Debaser [3.5] [PEACH]

    Why can't the curse hit all stats? Why just those four? Seems kinda silly that it can only hit 4/6. Was there a reason for it?

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    Default Re: The Debaser [3.5] [PEACH]

    Quote Originally Posted by arguskos View Post
    Why can't the curse hit all stats? Why just those four? Seems kinda silly that it can only hit 4/6. Was there a reason for it?
    Honestly, I couldn't think of a name for the other two. If you have ideas, that would help a lot.
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    Default Re: The Debaser [3.5] [PEACH]

    Con: Devastate, Decimate
    Int: Disable, Decimate

    Those both sound alright.

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    Default Re: The Debaser [3.5] [PEACH]

    Quote Originally Posted by arguskos View Post
    Con: Devastate, Decimate
    Int: Disable, Decimate

    Those both sound alright.
    I like devastate.

    Decimate sounds like pure damage though.

    Disable...that's kind of offensive to people with disabilities. While I'm sure you didn't mean it in any offensive way, I'm going to avoid that. If you have any more ideas, I will gladly accept them.
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    Default Re: The Debaser [3.5] [PEACH]

    Quote Originally Posted by Temotei221 View Post
    I like devastate.

    Decimate sounds like pure damage though.

    Disable...that's kind of offensive to people with disabilities. While I'm sure you didn't mean it in any offensive way, I'm going to avoid that. If you have any more ideas, I will gladly accept them.
    Oh dears. I didn't mean it that way at all, I just thought it was a fitting term, you know, disabling the target and all.

    Uh, there REALLY aren't that many D-words that mean these sorts of things. Negate would be good, but it doesn't fit your D-theme.

    Ah! Disenable! Try that one on for size. It's a touch archaic, but it's a good one I think.
    Last edited by arguskos; 2010-01-04 at 11:36 PM.

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    Default Re: The Debaser [3.5] [PEACH]

    Quote Originally Posted by arguskos View Post
    Oh dears. I didn't mean it that way at all, I just thought it was a fitting term, you know, disabling the target and all.

    Uh, there REALLY aren't that many D-words that mean these sorts of things. Negate would be good, but it doesn't fit your D-theme.

    Ah! Disenable! Try that one on for size. It's a touch archaic, but it's a good one I think.
    Actually, it was a coincidence that I came up with so many "D" words. They struck me as the most appealing words for the job, and I figured once I had two or three that I would just keep it up. Disenable...nice.

    It's in.
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    Default Re: The Debaser [3.5] [PEACH]

    Awesome.

    Consider this totally stolen and used.

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    Default Re: The Debaser [3.5] [PEACH]

    Quote Originally Posted by arguskos View Post
    Awesome.

    Consider this totally stolen and used.
    Sweet.
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    Default Re: The Debaser [3.5] [PEACH]

    I was making up a cultist who is a level 1 debaser, and I found myself hating the name, actually. Might I suggest "Corruptor" instead, as a more flowing name?

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    Default Re: The Debaser [3.5] [PEACH]

    Cool class. If you don't mind me asking, what's the fluff behind these guys?
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    Default Re: The Debaser [3.5] [PEACH]

    Quote Originally Posted by arguskos View Post
    I was making up a cultist who is a level 1 debaser, and I found myself hating the name, actually. Might I suggest "Corruptor" instead, as a more flowing name?
    I had thought of that name, but I wanted the class to not sound completely evil. Neutral-aligned characters can take this class. Corrupter just sounds evil. Feel free to change it for your campaign though.

    Quote Originally Posted by The Tygre View Post
    Cool class. If you don't mind me asking, what's the fluff behind these guys?
    The fluff should be done in a bit. I've been kind of busy with schoolwork and such, so it's on hold for a little while. It's coming though.

    I imagine the characters in the class to be fairly diverse. They could come into the class on accident as a young'un, learning small cantrips at first, then developing a drain attack (may happen when they get angry, or possibly when they hit someone...anything really) and curse (again, curse could come from anger or from insulting them, or literally cursing their name). They could come into the class as trained charismatic rogues, knowing that having the ability to weaken their foes before performing some daring acts could save their and their friends' lives. They could be Lawful Evil dictators, commanding legions of devils, showing their power in the torture chambers with fell drain, debaser's curse, and as a finale, scourge.

    They'll most likely work well with classes like the sorcerer and rogue, and neutral or evil clerics. Even druids might sync well with them. Maybe wizards.

    They'll probably have troubles with the paladins--especially if they're evil.

    Adventuring could be a way to profit, to show off their power and get stronger, or simply to end boredom.

    If you've got ideas for the fluff as well, I'd like to hear them.
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    Default Re: The Debaser [3.5] [PEACH]

    Quote Originally Posted by Temotei221 View Post
    I had thought of that name, but I wanted the class to not sound completely evil. Neutral-aligned characters can take this class. Corrupter just sounds evil. Feel free to change it for your campaign though.
    Well, I didn't want it to be straight evil, actually. The feeling I get from debaser is confusing and incomplete. Corrupter is more in line with someone who degrades others, corrupts their essence, and turns it against them, which is what this class does (very well). It does have some heavy evil overtones though, which is not really my intent. Corruptor would work if you gave it the flavor of someone who has discovered the darker side of life, someone who uses life force against those it empowers, they twist intentions and use their skills to cripple their foes, before finishing them off. It's not evil, not really, just like the druid who embraces the briar is not evil, merely broad in their use of nature.

    Merely a thought though. I really do love it though.

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    Default Re: The Debaser [3.5] [PEACH]

    Quote Originally Posted by arguskos View Post
    Well, I didn't want it to be straight evil, actually. The feeling I get from debaser is confusing and incomplete. Corrupter is more in line with someone who degrades others, corrupts their essence, and turns it against them, which is what this class does (very well). It does have some heavy evil overtones though, which is not really my intent. Corruptor would work if you gave it the flavor of someone who has discovered the darker side of life, someone who uses life force against those it empowers, they twist intentions and use their skills to cripple their foes, before finishing them off. It's not evil, not really, just like the druid who embraces the briar is not evil, merely broad in their use of nature.

    Merely a thought though. I really do love it though.
    Good point. If I use the name corrupter, I'll come up with some fluff to allow them to actually use that name without it being automatically evil.

    I'll be playing a debaser in a game in the Play-by-Post board. It should be fun.
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    Default Re: The Debaser [3.5] [PEACH]

    Quote Originally Posted by Temotei221 View Post
    Good point. If I use the name corrupter, I'll come up with some fluff to allow them to actually use that name without it being automatically evil.

    I'll be playing a debaser in a game in the Play-by-Post board. It should be fun.
    Sweetness. I built up one for my player's to fight. He's a CE half-orc debaser 1, and happily, Pathfinder half-orcs get a single +2 to put anywhere they want, so he's got a 17 Cha! Infinite cantrips (thanks again Pathfinder) make the debaser much scarier at level 1 too. He kind just stands behind some warriors and uses the curse and spams sonic snap and daze. To be honest, he might be TOO good for them to handle. I mean, swift action -2 to key stats (Con is painful at level 1)? That's rough, it really is. I might have to tone him done a bit.

    I'll let you know how it goes when it happens (this particular cultist should meet the PCs on Saturday). I've got some Binder+Debaser action planned, along with mixes of Binders, Debasers, Hexblades, and Shadowcasters, so they'll get action with a bunch of diverse classes.

    I've also been thinking about multiclassing a debaser into something like Knight. The Cha dependency carries over, the swift-action curses are great, the Knight's d12s would rock, it sounds like a match made in heaven, at least at low levels. Did you have any specific multiclasses in mind when you wrote the debaser? (Ooh, another good one would be Favored Soul/Debaser/Mystic Theurge, though it'd have terrible progression, it'd be damn fun.)

    Last question: do the bonuses from Fell Drain have a type, or are they meant to be untyped?
    Last edited by arguskos; 2010-01-05 at 08:20 PM.

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    Default Re: The Debaser [3.5] [PEACH]

    Quote Originally Posted by arguskos View Post
    Sweetness. I built up one for my player's to fight. He's a CE half-orc debaser 1, and happily, Pathfinder half-orcs get a single +2 to put anywhere they want, so he's got a 17 Cha! Infinite cantrips (thanks again Pathfinder) make the debaser much scarier at level 1 too. He kind just stands behind some warriors and uses the curse and spams sonic snap and daze. To be honest, he might be TOO good for them to handle. I mean, swift action -2 to key stats (Con is painful at level 1)? That's rough, it really is. I might have to tone him done a bit.

    I'll let you know how it goes when it happens (this particular cultist should meet the PCs on Saturday). I've got some Binder+Debaser action planned, along with mixes of Binders, Debasers, Hexblades, and Shadowcasters, so they'll get action with a bunch of diverse classes.

    I've also been thinking about multiclassing a debaser into something like Knight. The Cha dependency carries over, the swift-action curses are great, the Knight's d12s would rock, it sounds like a match made in heaven, at least at low levels. Did you have any specific multiclasses in mind when you wrote the debaser? (Ooh, another good one would be Favored Soul/Debaser/Mystic Theurge, though it'd have terrible progression, it'd be damn fun.)

    Last question: do the bonuses from Fell Drain have a type, or are they meant to be untyped?
    I specifically made the fell drain bonuses untyped. I had thought of making them profane bonuses, but that's almost meant for evil.

    On multiclassing: I had thought about it. I never really keyed it to any specific classes, but I left it open for multiclassing for the most part.

    You're right about the Constitution. I think I'll switch it with the armor penalty option. That way, you can't just decimate early enemies by using the curse.

    Infinite cantrips? Do the makers realize you could abuse cure minor wounds?
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    Default Re: The Debaser [3.5] [PEACH]

    Quote Originally Posted by Temotei221 View Post
    I specifically made the fell drain bonuses untyped. I had thought of making them profane bonuses, but that's almost meant for evil.
    Ah, okies then! ^_^

    On multiclassing: I had thought about it. I never really keyed it to any specific classes, but I left it open for multiclassing for the most part.
    Ah, well then, fair enough.

    You're right about the Constitution. I think I'll switch it with the armor penalty option. That way, you can't just decimate early enemies by using the curse.
    Well, I'll try out the -2 Con for now, see how it goes. It's worth trying at low levels to see how it works out. Perhaps my fears are wrong, and it's not that amazing after all, just good.

    Infinite cantrips? Do the makers realize you could abuse cure minor wounds?
    1. Pathfinder removed Cure Minor.
    2. Even if it wasn't, at 1 hp a round what's the harm? Entering each fight at full hp is a good thing, since it means less resources spent on cure items (though, having a few wands of good cures is advisable, for time-sensitive missions). I've played with infinite cure minor wounds, and it's not an issue in most styles of play.

    I am considering a Knight/Debaser though, that'd be niiice. It could only be LN or LE though, which is mildly restrictive, but for a cult, they'd be great elite guards.

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    Default Re: The Debaser [3.5] [PEACH]

    Quote Originally Posted by arguskos View Post
    Ah, okies then! ^_^


    Ah, well then, fair enough.


    Well, I'll try out the -2 Con for now, see how it goes. It's worth trying at low levels to see how it works out. Perhaps my fears are wrong, and it's not that amazing after all, just good.


    1. Pathfinder removed Cure Minor.
    2. Even if it wasn't, at 1 hp a round what's the harm? Entering each fight at full hp is a good thing, since it means less resources spent on cure items (though, having a few wands of good cures is advisable, for time-sensitive missions). I've played with infinite cure minor wounds, and it's not an issue in most styles of play.

    I am considering a Knight/Debaser though, that'd be niiice. It could only be LN or LE though, which is mildly restrictive, but for a cult, they'd be great elite guards.
    Cure minor wounds could easily make your day that much better, and it makes the DM's job harder by basically forcing them to make encounters tougher. The upside is that the cleric never really has to worry about healing spells. Neither does the druid or paladin. The downsides: Full hit points at every fight + virtue = 1 hit point extra for most fights. Certainly not much, but it helps a little at early levels. Even at higher levels, there would be no point in not using virtue for that extra point. Also: Prestidigitation.

    I'll see about the Constitution as well. I'll take it back to what it was before, and then see how it works. If it's overpowered, I'll switch it to the upgraded version. Now that I think about it, I don't think it will be. -1 hp/level isn't that much at early levels. Sure, the orc might lose a hit point, but does it matter when you're already beating them to death in one hit?

    Oh, and yes, a bunch of cool guards that curse enemies and drain them, then follow up with some stabs would be cool. They might not even have to resort to that, if the knights that use ranged weapons do use ranged weapons.
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