Greedy Player Problem

[Beelzebub1111]

I have a problem. Whenever I try to run a pre-generated module like from out of dragon magazine, My players won't even go for it unless they ask for 3-5 times the ammount of gold given as a base reward! (Even After I modify it so that 6 people can get the reward instead of 4) It's very annoying since I can't run the module without them, and I really don't have anything else planed. They simply won't DO anything unless I offer them a huge monetary reward, I give them a promise of treasure and loot, but they still refuse any job that doesn't pay up front. They also like half payment in advance and consistantly asked to "Be equiped" for the encounter, like they think they need more equipment BEFORE they get to the new location.

Again, Like I said, it tends to drive the game to a standstill and Wealth is being broken.

[TheYoungKing]

Let them go without work then.

A little bit of time doing Profession checks and being turned down by benefactors who have shinier things should teach them a lesson.

That is assuming you can't talk them out of it OOC. If you can't, DM hell in the form of an unemployment line.

[TricksyAndFalse]

It's very annoying since I can't run the module without them, and I really don't have anything else planned. They simply won't DO anything unless I offer them a huge monetary reward

They have you over a barrel. They know you want to run the module. They know you have nothing planned. They know they can extort these things from you because running the module is important to you.

First, how much does it matter if they have all this wealth and gear? Sure, the rules describe an ideal amount of wealth the players should be getting, but if everyone is having fun, does it matter?

One possibility if the wealth matters, and they want all this payment and gear up front, is to cut the amount of loot present in the rest of the module to balance. They get their payment up front, but the monsters and bad guys have less loot. (If you are playing 3.5, this can be a problem when fighting opponents who are supposed to use the loot they have as gear).

Another possibility is to plan something else. They refuse to help the small town in need unless paid more than the town has in wealth? Okay, fast-forward to when the town is wiped off the map by the threat. This might spur some adventure ideas. Or, plan nothing and let them clown around for a few hours. When they get bored, they will go find trouble.

The last thing I have to say: You mention this happens when you try to run a pre-genned module. Does this not happen when you run something of your own making? If the problem doesn't exist for your home-brewed adventures, just run those. Or, don't tell your players it's a pre-genned module. If you've only tried pre-genned modules, then I definitely suggest trying out the 'plan something else/let them find their own trouble' approach. Yeah, you'll have to wing something, but it sounds like your players will enjoy seeing you sweat, and I think you'll find it rewarding too.

[Soonerdj]

This can be solved with 5 words:

Metal Equipment and Rust Monsters :P

[hewhosaysfish]

This can be solved with 5 words:

Metal Equipment and Rust MonstersDragons :P

Thinking too small

[Duskranger]

Give them everything they want, and put down a big ambush. Than steal everything, and give them no reward at all except for what they killed (one bandit had a rusty longsword and stuff :P)

[Vangor]

They simply won't DO anything unless I offer them a huge monetary reward, I give them a promise of treasure and loot, but they still refuse any job that doesn't pay up front. They also like half payment in advance and consistantly asked to "Be equiped" for the encounter, like they think they need more equipment BEFORE they get to the new location.

Simple solution for people who want to get rerolls on statistics, who want 32+ point buys, who want more starting gold, who want lax interpretations of rules, who want special provisions for their characters, and so forth is to adjust the campaign accordingly. Sure, if they want 15,000 gold immediately to outfit themselves and 15,000 gold after they have cleared a kobold den, they need to be prepared to spend most of this on chugging potions, using scrolls, expending wands, carrying situational gear, and more. Power is relative, and when you meet someone, or in this case much of a party, who feels the need to be greedy, give them a reality check. People more powerful and more resourceful than they exist, and they are in the positions they are from hunting down and destroying people who may threaten them.

Plus, I would imagine local but extensive thieving guilds would know if such a vast amount of money or resources changed hands, and might want to procure a small amount. The campaign may be premade, but you can add and change all you want.

May I ask the level of your players? When my party all around 17 became cocky upon expanding to 8 people who were devastating dragons and such, I unleashed a 7 Cleric/10 Ghost-Faced Killer on them. Nothing brings you back to reality faster than deciding which of you three fortunately only has to carry one body.

[electricbee]

Introduce a rival group of NPC adventurers.

Send them off to do the adventure for the asking price. Let the players actually miss out on a few opportunities due to the rivals (who don't need the players help). Sucks to still be in town haggling while the Heroes come back and get the reward in front of you.

[Beelzebub1111]

The last thing I have to say: You mention this happens when you try to run a pre-genned module. Does this not happen when you run something of your own making? If the problem doesn't exist for your home-brewed adventures, just run those. Or, don't tell your players it's a pre-genned module. If you've only tried pre-genned modules, then I definitely suggest trying out the 'plan something else/let them find their own trouble' approach. Yeah, you'll have to wing something, but it sounds like your players will enjoy seeing you sweat, and I think you'll find it rewarding too.

I tend to avoid "service sellers" for my home-brewed adventures. I make it clear that the treasure IS the adventure. Like I said, greed is the average party's biggest motivator.

May I ask the level of your players? When my party all around 17 became cocky upon expanding to 8 people who were devastating dragons and such, I unleashed a 7 Cleric/10 Ghost-Faced Killer on them. Nothing brings you back to reality faster than deciding which of you three fortunately only has to carry one body.

They are 4 of them at level four 3 at level 3...and because of their shenanagins (and my underestimation of some potential from gambling), they have +1 keen Falchion, the warforged has +4 adamantine armor plates, and...well, you get the picture.

Thanks for the advice, I'll try to plan more for them.

[Tinydwarfman]

I tend to avoid "service sellers" for my home-brewed adventures. I make it clear that the treasure IS the adventure. Like I said, greed is the average party's biggest motivator.



They are 4 of them at level four 3 at level 3...and because of their shenanagins (and my underestimation of some potential from gambling), they have +1 keen Falchion, the warforged has +4 adamantine armor plates, and...well, you get the picture.

Thanks for the advice, I'll try to plan more for them.

+4 armor plates?!? Why and how did they get that?

Also, What alignment are they? Good characters should still help regardless of whether the person they help can pay. If they refuse to take on a job, say OK, and have town/world/them be destroyed as the BBEG carries out his plans.

[SpikeFightwicky]

They are 4 of them at level four 3 at level 3...and because of their shenanagins (and my underestimation of some potential from gambling), they have +1 keen Falchion, the warforged has +4 adamantine armor plates, and...well, you get the picture.

Thanks for the advice, I'll try to plan more for them.

I think you shoul remember that you are, in fact, the DM, and can mitigate shenanigans (preferably in an in-game realistic way). Also, where are your PCs gambling? D&D's Monte Carlo? What do the players do when the money runs out? Or when the person offering the reward for whatever quest has no more money to offer?

Rather than take everything away from your players, you can assume word got out that they're wealthy, and up the price of everything accordingly. How much for this potion of cure moderate wounds? -> for you? 2000 gold.

[Vangor]

They are 4 of them at level four 3 at level 3...and because of their shenanagins (and my underestimation of some potential from gambling), they have +1 keen Falchion, the warforged has +4 adamantine armor plates, and...well, you get the picture.

Undead, Oozes, and Barbarian Orcs. Keen means nothing against monsters you cannot crit, and having creatures who will blow Rage and charge heedlessly effectively negates armor. Plus, Oozes are often acidic...enjoy.

As well, someone mentioned their alignment, any with restrictions or who would really not want to shift? If the cleric has a deity, if a paladin exists, if any have exalted feats, potentially even if any is a monk, they really need to stop haggling and wanting gold. This is not evil, but this is not good, and accepting a reward does not diminish being good, but refusing a reward is a good act while being dissatisfied with a reward is somewhat evil from a selfish aspect.

[Just_Ice]

Two words: Gold elemental

[Duskranger]

That's why there is a special clausule in the DMG for this kind of things it's called DM overrules. And nothing says that better than a meteorswarm from a lvl 18 wizard.

Or a high level roque that steals even the armorplates of the Warforged (somehow, your the boss).

Rumor has it that dragons are also greedy .....

[Leon]

Pay them in Fools gold/counterfeit coins/foreign currency etc up front and then have them earn the real stuff after they get burned on the fake/problematic

[Emmerask]

Make the world not pc centered if they refuse to do the job let other adventurers do it and go into great detail how they are praised by the locals when they return triumphant. A whole week of festivities, official buildings and streets named after them, statues build at the central plaza.

And if they leave town have bards carry the word of those awesome adventurers to every tavern they visit and go again into great detail how these mighty warriors and cunning wizards destroyed the evil they refused to fight

Oh and after that the next module is of course not balanced for their current level but the level they would have had if they would not be greedy bastards and they will die... oh well sucks to be them.

Don´t get me wrong a bit of haggling for the reward is absolutely fine and should in fact be encouraged but using metagame reasons to haggle ie pay us 1000000000000000 gp because without us there is no adventure is NOT fine.

[bosssmiley]

I have a problem. Whenever I try to run a pre-generated module like from out of dragon magazine, My players won't even go for it unless they ask for 3-5 times the ammount of gold given as a base reward! (Even After I modify it so that 6 people can get the reward instead of 4) It's very annoying since I can't run the module without them, and I really don't have anything else planed. They simply won't DO anything unless I offer them a huge monetary reward, I give them a promise of treasure and loot, but they still refuse any job that doesn't pay up front. They also like half payment in advance and consistently asked to "Be equipped" for the encounter, like they think they need more equipment BEFORE they get to the new location.

Pushy little toads, ain't they? You ought to remind them that heist capers do not work that way.

If the players want to play hardball over pay and conditions before they will partake of the prepared content, then you just have to play it back. Hackmaster (and WFRP) have entire sections on ways to keep the PCs poor and hungry. The DM giveth; the DM taketh away.

Again, Like I said, it tends to drive the game to a standstill and Wealth is being broken.

Excess wealth is especially easy to fix: taxes. Tax evasion, smuggling, and the fallout therefrom can be the basis of entire campaigns.

[Beelzebub1111]

I think you shoul remember that you are, in fact, the DM, and can mitigate shenanigans (preferably in an in-game realistic way). Also, where are your PCs gambling? D&D's Monte Carlo? What do the players do when the money runs out? Or when the person offering the reward for whatever quest has no more money to offer?

There was an arena fight last level, we worked out odds for the matches, and stupidly I set the maximum bet to 500 gold, when I should have set it to one hundred, it's a bit late to go back now, though.

[Emmerask]

There was an arena fight last level, we worked out odds for the matches, and stupidly I set the maximum bet to 500 gold, when I should have set it to one hundred, it's a bit late to go back now, though.

All the more wealth for the local thieves guild

/edit

Which brings me to another point don´t let them adventure for money, make it personal thieves stealing all their wealth, the bbeg killing a family member or holding them hostage etc

[Killer Angel]

I have a problem. Whenever I try to run a pre-generated module like from out of dragon magazine,
(snip)
Again, Like I said, it tends to drive the game to a standstill and Wealth is being broken.

and, exactly what were the pre-generated CR of the enemies?
If you cannot set the thing with the players, then the solution is simple: The PCs have more money-power? Increase the challenges accordingly.

[Anterean]

Introduce a rival group of NPC adventurers.

Send them off to do the adventure for the asking price. Let the players actually miss out on a few opportunities due to the rivals (who don't need the players help). Sucks to still be in town haggling while the Heroes come back and get the reward in front of you.

This is a brilliant idea.

I think I might actually do that, even though I don´t have this problem with my players.
Somehow I feel it would add to the world

[Emmerask]

This is a brilliant idea.

I think I might actually do that, even though I don´t have this problem with my players.
Somehow I feel it would add to the world

Coban (the barbarian) and his legion of six is one of the groups I often have running around in my campaigns ^^
Yes it does add to the gameworld in my opinion

[Mongoose87]

Never underestimate the power of destroying everything they own.

[RebelRogue]

Subtract from the treasure they will find during the adventure. And as suggested above, add a few rust monster here and there

[denthor]

years ago there was a little known clause in the DMG that went something like this. On rare occasions a summoning spell could transport a group of adventures anywhere in the universe.

What happens if they are "summoned" to another plane they find themselves in a room with three dead two mages one cleric. The last living breath is "how did this happen?" "Who are you?"

Now for the problem they are in a broken summoning circle so they can get out and move around what do they do they have nothing but ordinary clothes, no weapons, no magic just skill. They have no patron the room leads to wilderness do they sit there and die or do they use there skills to survive?

Two hundred feet in one(but any) direction (to make sure they find it) are signs of war a dead party that has wooden fighting equipment, no armor odds and ends for other equipment nothing special. They died fighting each other and they are clearly on the same side. Same symbols of worship same type of clothing etc. Wooden weapons do what ever normal weapons do minus 2 so a dagger 1d4-2.

You have nothing else planed they can sit in the room with out food, water or anything else and die or adventure. There choice.

Yes I am an a $$ of a DM but they are worse as players.

[Mastikator]

Tell them that their demands are unreasonable and it's irrational of them. Be calm and collected. If they don't immediately agree then tell them to find a new DM.

Sounds to me like you have an entire group of people who sabotage the game. Tell them that it in fact sabotages the game, and that it's pointless. Be strong and don't yield. You can find another group in another time.
If they agree then you've got what you wanted, if they don't then it was hopeless from the start. But that's a risk you're gonna have to weigh against letting them have more than they deserve.

[AtwasAwamps]

Fire.

It always works.

[Grommen]

You need the traveling merchants known and Dewy, Cheetem, How, and Often.

FANTASTIC items, FANTASTIC prices.....All cursed.

See if the party is greedy and demanding up front pay (actually not a bad option in my campaigns but you might have honest people in yours), and loads of it or they will not save the village from pending doom. We can then generaly assume that they are also greedy bastards. So when they see a wagon filled with +5 Holey, dancing, vorporal, luck blades for a new low price. Well...Who can say no to that... Just because it is a cursed back biter, and the matching gauntlets are actually Gauntlets of fumbling. Might not want to mention this to them right away though. At least till the wagon is out of site.

Now they might see that coming so you need to mix in a lot of mundain slightly broken stuff too. Like the Chainmail of Disappearance. "O sure it will never need cleaning after a battle. We have put special enchantments on to protect it from any scratch." Just never mention that the reason it is so pretty is that before a battle it "Disappears" into another dimension to stay safe

Ya it's a one time only DM dirty trick, cause they will never trust you again. But hey it will keep them honest.

[Kylarra]

I think it's time for a DM-player chat OOC.

After that be prepared to either heavily tweak the module or create your own campaign.

[Manga Shoggoth]

There was an arena fight last level, we worked out odds for the matches, and stupidly I set the maximum bet to 500 gold, when I should have set it to one hundred, it's a bit late to go back now, though.

You could always say that there were accusations of game rigging and that the PCs have been implicated/framed for them. Then the quest can become their punishment for the alleged crime.