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    Halfling in the Playground
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    Default Re: Tooth and Tentacle [3.5 base class PEACH]

    Quote Originally Posted by Owrtho View Post
    Well, having recently gone through all the features and augments again with things being cleaned up, I came across a few things that are being changed. Most are just minor rewordings, or removing text that is no longer needed with changes that have come about, but a few are worth mentioning:
    [list][*]Small Fins: will be able to reduce the cost to a minimum of 1 rather than 2. I've decided the ability to increase your swim skill bonus by 1 per fin (by making two small ones) when not using any other augments isn't too powerful.[*]I'll add in a note that when spawn are used in a lure trap, they must use the ability to create the spawn when triggered.[*]On Cystic flesh, the part about damaging weapons will be optional (as it was pointed out not everyone keeps track of weapon hp).[*]Sticky Stomach will be changed, and another augment added in. Sticky stomach will now be:
    Required Level 16: Creatures that come into contact with the stomach's wall, floor, or ceiling must succeed on a DC 10 + ˝ your class level + your charisma modifier strength check or else be entangled for 1 round per Sticky Stomach augment applied to the same stomach. The DC to climb out of your throat decreases by 4. Climbing creatures take a -3 penalty to checks to avoid becoming entangled, and must make a check every 5 feet they move. This augment can be added to the same stomach multiple times. Each time after the first the DC to avoid becoming entangled increases by 2, the DC of climbing throats decreases by 1, and the penalty to checks to avoid being entangled by climbing creatures increases by 1. You may not have both this augment and the Slick Stomach augment applied to the same stomach.

    The other augment will be Slick Stomach:
    Required Level 16: The inside of the stomach is covered with a slick coating. Treat all surfaces of this stomach as if under the effects of the grease spell with a DC of 10 + ˝ your class level + your charisma to avoid falling. The DC to climb out of your throat increases by 10. This augment can be added to the same stomach multiple times. Each time after the first the DC's increase by 2. You may not have both this augment and the Sticky Stomach augment applied to the same stomach.[*]I also came to the conclusion that the only feature that can't really be mimicked by the ozodrin is spikes (common on many monsters). For that reason I plan to add the following feat:

    Darkspawn (Aberrant)
    The abnormalities of your aberration-tainted heritage grow more pronounced. Bone-like spikes jut out from your flesh.
    Prerequisite: Aberration Blood, one other aberrant feat.
    Benefit: You grow spikes. If wearing light armor or lighter, you are treated as having fine sized armor spikes and are considered proficient with them, though you are not proficient with armour spikes actual armor spikes. They are considered to be a size category larger for every 3 aberrant feats you possess.
    Special: If you are an ozodrin, you gain access to the Spike feature.

    Spoiler
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    Spike: Cost - 1
    Appearance: You have a spike growing out of you.
    Required Level: 1 and Darkspawn aberrant feat.
    Benefits: You grow a spike somewhere on you. Spikes always start out fine sized before augments and deal 1 piercing damage (see armor spike damage table for other sizes). When grappling, you may only have one spike affect the grappled creature each round, though you may choose a different spike each round. Unlike most features, you may also apply the spike feature to tentacles, limbs, and fins (only one spike may be applied to a single such feature). If you do, that feature adds the spikes damage onto its own when it deals damage (if it lacks an attack it gains a secondary sting natural attack that deals the spike's damage). If a spike is added to a stomach, the stomach is treated as having caltrops that deal the spikes damage in one square (if the formed stomach augment is applied), or if the formed stomach augment is not applied it gains a secondary natural attack against a single creature inside it per spike dealing the smallest spike's damage.
    Special: You may remove the spikes gained by the darkspawn aberrant feat to gain one additional form point + 1 per size category larger than fine they are.
    Augments:
    Large Spike: Additional cost +4
    The spike counts as a size category larger. You may apply this augment to the same spike multiple times to a maximum size of colossal. The effects stack.

    Multiple Spikes: Additional cost +1
    Requires Large Spike: Instead of one large spike you have multiple smaller ones. The spike counts as a size category smaller, and gains +1 to damage. You may apply this augment to the same spike up to as many times as large spike had been applied to it.

    Horn: Additional cost +2
    Requires Spike be at least as large as one size category less than you, and that it not be placed on a feature: Instead of acting as armor spikes, this spike instead grants a primary gore attack. A medium horn deals 1d8 damage (use standard table to adjust for size).

    Enchanted Spike: Additional cost X
    Required Level 6: You may exchange an amount of the enhancement bonus to the spike's attack granted by the unearthly power ability for an enchantment that counts as an enhancement of that amount. This amount may not exceed 1/3 your class level rounded down - 1. This costs twice amount of the enhancement bonus being traded. You may add this multiple times to the same limb. The effects stack.


    So, feedback is welcome. Changes will most likely be made to the first post sometime this week.

    Edit: Missed Markus Darkmind's post. Anyway, there are some vague ideas to eventually expand the class into epic, but no concrete ideas have yet been formed. Also, there is no size limit on mouths or other features unless they say there is. So yes, you could make a colossal++++++++++++++++ mouth.

    Owrtho
    I agree with all of your changes. Everything seems ok...
    The Darkspawn feat is awesome! I can already see my character make a very long and small tentacle, move it in an enemy square, and sunddenly forming huge spikes from below...

    Now then, about colossal+++++++++ mouths: this comes with huge possibilities in my opinion. I'll give you some feedback in the form of a small part of our last session.

    Me and my two evil fellows (we play an evil trio with Pathfinder rules and a couple of templates on top of classes) had disguised one of us as a noble to enter in the king's court. However, I didn't care as a couple of men involved in my background were in a tavern and I wanted to retrieve them. So my DM says, "you can't get inside and kidnap them in time, it would take too much". And I made the only possible thing... A very colossal mouth, and swallowed the entire tavern. Then I went to the king, disguised as a doctor, bluffing my way out of questions about the little scream coming from my belly.

    The thing is, I believe this class it's great not only for combat, but expecially for mad plans like this: if you max out bluff and diplomacy, swallowing taverns and make everyone inside believe it was just a problems with lights it's enterely possible! And awesome, in my opinion.

    About epic, may I suggest some way to directly improve your ability scores? Such as a muscles features, or a skeleton one, or maybe a brain feature... also, I'd say a good idea would be improve the strange movement ability in some way, maybe let you go in some otther places apart from some metres away...

  2. - Top - End - #362
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    Default Re: Tooth and Tentacle [3.5 base class PEACH]

    Well, the spike feature isn't intended to be as powerful as most other features (otherwise no one wouldn't take it). As for poison, well you could likely get that with a combination of enchanted spike and secreting flesh. The throwing spikes seems like a possibility though. For that matter, a venomous spike augment could be added that would act like enchanted spike, though I don't know much about how various poisons work or how balanced that would be (would likely require it be used on a spike that is providing a sting attack).

    On the strange movement advancement, there is already a feat that increases your strange movement limit (can be taken multiple times). There is also the travelling tentacle, that lets you use 5 feet of strange movement to travel to any point on the tentacles length. Combine that with sinister image and shifting shape, and you can spend 10' of strange movement to travel to any picture of yourself or to someone scying on you.
    That aside though, perhaps an epic feet or ability allowing the ozodrin to sense if there has recently been a portal in the area (such as within the last hour and an area of 20' or so), and if so, use strange movement to travel to the destination of said portal (might take 10 feet of it).
    Not quite sure about the ability score boosting though.

    Owrtho

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  3. - Top - End - #363
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    Default Re: Tooth and Tentacle [3.5 base class PEACH]

    Dang, I was making a class with spikes as 10th level (lost the thumb drive). Aw well, guess I'll just help with the current spikes and add it's class features as feats.Note, all these feats are aberrant feats.

    Sever Laceration
    You learn how to use your sharper parts to escape from being eaten.
    Prerequisites: Jaws that Bite
    Benefits:When Swallowed Whole, or when something attempts to do so to you, you may make a full-round attack using any features that deal slashing or piercing damage. This ignores the usual restrictions on attacks while swallowed whole.

    Genetic Aberration
    You use your nature to gain control over your own genetics.
    Prerequisites:Aberrant Monstrosity
    Benefits:You may gain mutations by paying form points equal to 5 times the mutation point cost of the mutation.You may also gain 3 time the mutation point cost in form points by taking negative mutations.

    True Monstrosity.
    You selectively control what you are from all parts.
    Prerequisites:Aberrant Monstrosity
    Benefits:You can count any of you're types as both being and not being when it is advantageous to you, as long as you have more than one type(example:A half-dragon Human with aberrant monstrosity:ooze and 10 ozodrin levels can pick between whether it counts as a dragon, human, ooze or aberration at-will).

    Sticky Secretions
    You begin to secrete sticky substances, and you use these to help you move.
    Prerequisites:Feature(limb)
    You may move as if you were under the affects of Up the Wall. You don't have to be psionically focused to do so.

    Note: these spikes augments were a capstone originally, so they may be a bit to powerful.

    Spoiler
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    Hollow spikes: Additional cost 3
    Spikes with this augment can be poisoned like a normal weapon. In addition, when an Eternal Sentinelozodrin succeeds their fortitude save against a poison or disease, then they can choose to fill a hollow spike with one dose of whatever disease or poison they were exposed to. This cannot use ingested poisons unless the ozodrin uses Sever Laceration class ability feat. This cannot be used for inhaled poisons.

    Gas-Spewing Spikes: Additional cost 4
    Requires Hollow Spikes: The spikes with this augment can now use inhaled poisons by creating a cloud of poison on the square it targets.

    Self-Sufficient Spikes: Additional cost 2
    Requires Hollow Spikes: The spikes can no longer be poisoned like a regular weapon. However, they will recreate any poison gained from successful fortitude save, thus allowing the spike to continually use the poison.

    Flying Spikes:
    Additional cost 3
    These spikes can be shot at an opponent. These count as dart meant for a creature the size of the spikes. The spikes cannot be used for 1d4 round, or until picked up. If the 1d4 comes first, the spikes regrow and the first set rots away.

    Aerial Spikes: Additional cost 3
    Requires Flying Spikes:The spikes now count as javelins sized for a creature of the spike's size.




  4. - Top - End - #364
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    NecromancerGuy

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    Default Re: Tooth and Tentacle [3.5 base class PEACH]

    Would it be too crazy to add in Spikes as a regular Feature? Something about needing a feat to complete the set seems kind of... i dunno... odd. 4th 5th 7th and 8th are all fairly open. Heck, even 1st to give them something mildly offensive at 1st level.

    Edit: It granting one spike by default seems odd too. Maybe it should be "Covered in spikes" by default (as armor spikes, Damage stays the same) and "Instead of spikes, one big horn (or sting, or one for each)" and "Adds spike damage to fins etc" as augments.

    Edit Edit: Oh, btw. I made the changes you listed. I'll add the details of this new feat(ure) when you're done with it.
    Last edited by Jarrick; 2010-10-31 at 11:59 AM.
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  5. - Top - End - #365
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    Default Re: Tooth and Tentacle [3.5 base class PEACH]

    @Necroticplague: Well, based on the class abilities, it seems like it could be an interesting class, even without being unique in having spikes. You could likely make it require darkspawn as a prerequisite an split the augments you planned between the levels. Some of the abilities are quite nice as well.

    @Jarrick: Well, it could be put to a vote if the spikes should be added to the main class (and what level). As for the number of spikes, I'd actually intended it to be more of a single larger spike or equivalent in smaller spikes. Might be that it could use better wording on that though.
    Good to hear about the clean up being almost done.

    Also, don't forget that the ozodrin would make a great class for any Halloween themed games done to celebrate today (provided they are horror inclined).

    Owrtho
    Last edited by Owrtho; 2010-10-31 at 12:06 PM.

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    NecromancerGuy

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    Default Re: Tooth and Tentacle [3.5 base class PEACH]

    Yeah, sorry about it taking so long, I've had my hands in other things and had a rough week besides. As usual, there are a few notes for your perusal as well. I'm re-ordering the augments right now as requested, expect to find it in your inbox later this afternoon.
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  7. - Top - End - #367
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    Default Re: Tooth and Tentacle [3.5 base class PEACH]

    I like the idea of adding the spikes as a low level feature. Both because they seem fun and if you add them to the class you could add more augments.

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    Default Re: Tooth and Tentacle [3.5 base class PEACH]

    So, anyone else have an opinion on spikes?

    Owrtho

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  9. - Top - End - #369
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    Default Re: Tooth and Tentacle [3.5 base class PEACH]

    Well, am I going to be the one to say it? *Sigh*

    It needs an Augmentation to make the Spikes spin, so that you may be the drill that pierces the heavens!

    It could also be an interesting way to by-pass damage reduction or damage resistance >___>
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  10. - Top - End - #370
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    NecromancerGuy

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    Default Re: Tooth and Tentacle [3.5 base class PEACH]

    A drill is a man's romance, owrtho. He has a point.

    My vote is for level one for spikes as a standard augment. Anyone else care to weigh in? (Hey, I voted today after all!)
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    Default Re: Tooth and Tentacle [3.5 base class PEACH]

    I'd like to suggest spoilering the augments to features so I don't have to scroll past a bunch of stuff to find what I'm looking for. ^^;

  12. - Top - End - #372
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    Default Re: Tooth and Tentacle [3.5 base class PEACH]

    Quote Originally Posted by Matar View Post
    Well, am I going to be the one to say it? *Sigh*

    It needs an Augmentation to make the Spikes spin, so that you may be the drill that pierces the heavens!

    It could also be an interesting way to by-pass damage reduction or damage resistance >___>
    Erhem... My drill is the drill...THAT CREATES THE HEAVENS!!!

    That said perhaps giga drill breaker should be a feat.

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    Default Re: Tooth and Tentacle [3.5 base class PEACH]

    A twisting spike augment perhaps? Allows it to ignore a point of DR or Hardness equal to the the number of times added + Spike size above tiny. If added to a digging fin, allows you to dig through material with a hardness of less than that which the spike can ignore?

    Added spoilers to the augments, and made the changes mentioned in my other post (though haven't updated with the full clean up yet, waiting till it's done for that, but a few changes for that were made). Also changed gateways name to entryway, and entryway's name to doorway, as Jarrick pointed out it could cause confusion the other way.

    Also, forgot to mention this before, but Unearthly Fin is missing an effect for fins that don't have the wing or digging fin augments. As such this needs to be corrected, but I am unable to think of anything for it at the moment. So feel free to give suggestions.

    Huh, still only 2 votes to add spikes to the main feature roster. Interesting. Perhaps I should mention that if I added spikes to the class normally, the Darkspawn feat would have to do something more for them, like remove the size cap on spikes.

    Owrtho
    Last edited by Owrtho; 2010-11-02 at 12:52 AM.

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    Default Re: Tooth and Tentacle [3.5 base class PEACH]

    I like spikes. XD Vote +1 for them.
    Also for drilling spikes. You can never have enough memes. Needz more pylonz heaven piercing drills.
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    Default Re: Tooth and Tentacle [3.5 base class PEACH]

    Until I have a more solid grasp of the class, I can't judge spikes, but they seem a reasonable concept. Mind "solid grasp" means "having played it and felt it in testing" which may happen soon.

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    Default Re: Tooth and Tentacle [3.5 base class PEACH]

    I vote for adding spikes to the class. This way every "base" ozodrin will have every natural attack ever conceived. Feats that add unique features should be more different from the rest of the class in my opinion, or maybe just an add on to old ones... Don't know if I am very clear...

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    Default Re: Tooth and Tentacle [3.5 base class PEACH]

    I also like the spikes.

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    NecromancerGuy

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    Default Re: Tooth and Tentacle [3.5 base class PEACH]

    I also like the spikes, and I think it's an interesting idea to tie it to a feat.

    Actually, now that I think about it, maybe it should be the Spawn feature that's feat-connected and the spikes that are given by the class, eh?

    And on an unrelated note, I also like Slick Stomach. I just have one question: How does it interact with Sticky Stomach?

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    Default Re: Tooth and Tentacle [3.5 base class PEACH]

    So 4 votes for spikes being added to the main class, 1 vote to add it to the class and make spawn a feat, and one vote that it be level 1.

    Well, on the stomachs, it states you can't have both in the same stomach, so it doesn't really interact with it.

    Owrtho

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    Default Re: Tooth and Tentacle [3.5 base class PEACH]

    I think spikes should be added, also, but I don't think spawn should be made a feat... if Epic Features wouldn't work out, why not just make it a regular epic progression? Give it a feat every 2 or 3 levels and say it continues gaining Form Points (at the increased rate that it gets because of the level 20 capstone) and call it a day.
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    Default Re: Tooth and Tentacle [3.5 base class PEACH]

    Quote Originally Posted by Magicyop View Post
    I think spikes should be added, also, but I don't think spawn should be made a feat... if Epic Features wouldn't work out, why not just make it a regular epic progression? Give it a feat every 2 or 3 levels and say it continues gaining Form Points (at the increased rate that it gets because of the level 20 capstone) and call it a day.
    Mainly because it's so much easier to go into prestige classes and the like instead... I believe that an Epic Ozodrin should at least take new features from feats, like the Epic Binder...

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    Default Re: Tooth and Tentacle [3.5 base class PEACH]

    Quote Originally Posted by Markus Darkmind View Post
    Mainly because it's so much easier to go into prestige classes and the like instead... I believe that an Epic Ozodrin should at least take new features from feats, like the Epic Binder...
    Most classes don't get that. The couple that do are nice, don't get me wrong, it's cool. But most of them just advance class features gained before that and give bonus epic feats.

    Not to mention that if nobody can think of good epic features, they shouldn't be forced just to squeeze out an epic progression. I'm just throwing it out there that if it seems like most of the good archetypal features already come in the base class progression, a standard epic progression would work too.
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    Default Re: Tooth and Tentacle [3.5 base class PEACH]

    Oh... Whoops, didn't notice that. Sorry.

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    Default Re: Tooth and Tentacle [3.5 base class PEACH]

    Why can't slick and sticky be applied to a stomach? It doesn't really make it to overpowering (you could already grapple people and drag them back down to stop them). If you need some fluff to go with crunch, then heres my suggestion: Make it so sticky only kicks in after slick. Think of it as a bottom layer of glue, with a thin layer of oil over it. the oil will get out of the way under to much weight, thus revealing the glue underneath. So in terms of mechanics, sticky only kicks in if slick fails.

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    Default Re: Tooth and Tentacle [3.5 base class PEACH]

    You've got mail, Owrtho.

    As far as the Spawn feature is concerned, I could live with or without it being part of the main class. Personally, I think they'd almost make a better PrC than a feat, but either way is good, as is leaving it a part of the main class.

    As for unearthly fin... I've got nothing.

    ...This was not a helpful post...

    Edit: @^above. Their effects are really kind of the opposite of each other, a lot of the bonuses/penalties would just cancel each other out. I think it's better to keep them apart.
    Last edited by Jarrick; 2010-11-02 at 07:32 PM.
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    Default Re: Tooth and Tentacle [3.5 base class PEACH]

    Question: The level required for certain features. Is that Class level or Character level?

    'Cause that would be really good to know xD Or is it that in DnD you're supposed to assume that it's Class level?
    Last edited by Matar; 2010-11-02 at 11:45 PM.
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    Default Re: Tooth and Tentacle [3.5 base class PEACH]

    The levels for features and augments are class levels, though this will likely include most PRCs for the ozodrin (or will, given they will state that they count as ozodrin levels for feature advancement).

    Owrtho

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    Default Re: Tooth and Tentacle [3.5 base class PEACH]

    I am back! Well, until I start studying for yet another exam tomorrow.
    Still trying to get an Ozodrin avatar over at the avatar thread. Someday!

    Comments:

    Epic level stuff: I think being able to use sinister image while dead/soul trapped/obliterated would be pretty cool. Feels very far-realms horror-ish when anyone trying to kill you also hunts down and destroys all likenesses of your presences. It’d be fun to play a dead Ozodrin that depends on sinister image to interact with the world – from a PC perspective it passes the time to your true res and makes TPKs harder. It’s not like high level adventurers care much about dying in the first place. I almost think it could be added to the level 19 ability, but that might scare some DMs.

    Naught Morality: I think this might be rather hard to roleplay, but eh, level 17.

    Spikes: If we did add them as a new feature, I think level 7 would be the place to do it. Although my chart is somewhat out of date, there are currently a three augments given at level 7 (large limb, tremorsense, and blindsight), and spikes are pretty minor addition. The drill, dart, and poison stuff could be feats as we have a glut of augments at higher levels. A feat that gave Dart + drill + Javelin would thematically work. Must resist temptation to name it the “pierce the heavens” feat. Although toxic spikes at level 17 could be nice. Balance would be less of an issue as everyone and their dog is immune to poison at that level.


    Say, spikes could be a flesh augment. It’s like flesh, only hardened into points. And it can be applied to anywhere your flesh is, so it fits. It would be the 5th level 12 flesh feature, with maybe an augment at level 13. The passive uses of spikes fit in with the whole passive bonus theme the flesh augment has, although the horn augment kind of flies in the face of that. Maybe Horn + Dart + Drill would be the pierce the heavens feat instead. A level 19 toxic augment could effect both spikes and cystic flesh.


    Replacing Spawn with spikes doesn’t work out IMO because spikes are not much of a level 18 ability.
    Level 1 has enough abilities for a 1st level PC.

  29. - Top - End - #389
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: Tooth and Tentacle [3.5 base class PEACH]

    Quote Originally Posted by Magikeeper View Post

    Epic level stuff: I think being able to use sinister image while dead/soul trapped/obliterated would be pretty cool. Feels very far-realms horror-ish when anyone trying to kill you also hunts down and destroys all likenesses of your presences. It’d be fun to play a dead Ozodrin that depends on sinister image to interact with the world – from a PC perspective it passes the time to your true res and makes TPKs harder. It’s not like high level adventurers care much about dying in the first place. I almost think it could be added to the level 19 ability, but that might scare some DMs.
    Sure, but it would have to be more limited... Otherwise, any time you die for any reason, if someone doodled you somewhere, you can just stick a Traveling Tentacle out the picture and poof! You're alive again! You could basically churn out Phylacteries at the rate of one per round. Even if you die for good, all it ever takes is for someone to remember what you looked like and draw you, and you come back.
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  30. - Top - End - #390
    Orc in the Playground
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    Default Re: Tooth and Tentacle [3.5 base class PEACH]

    Quote Originally Posted by Magicyop View Post
    Sure, but it would have to be more limited... Otherwise, any time you die for any reason, if someone doodled you somewhere, you can just stick a Traveling Tentacle out the picture and poof! You're alive again! You could basically churn out Phylacteries at the rate of one per round. Even if you die for good, all it ever takes is for someone to remember what you looked like and draw you, and you come back.
    Yes, you shouldn't be able to use any features that require you to have your own body (since you don't).

    Hmm... would you be able to use your corpse as a depiction of yourself? That could be an issue.

    So place a ban on abilities that would reform your main body (like TT and otherworldly guise), and you can't use your own body as a depiction within 24hrs of your death. If you want to place features on a statue and 'live' as it, so be it. Or even some kind of far realms spider using a doodle of yourself at the center.

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