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    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    molten_dragon's Avatar

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    Default Shadowcraft mage Issue

    I'm currently playing a wizard2/Master specialist3/Shadowcraft mage 3. My forbidden schools are enchantment, evocation, and abjuration, and I'm focusing on illusion (obviously). My general MO in combat is to mimic useful conjuration spells, mostly battlefield control and debuffing, with some occasional summoning to help the rogue get sneak attack damage, since we have no frontline fighter-type. I realized of course that spell resistance could be an issue, but between assay spell resistance, earth spell, a ring of arcane might, and a create magic tattoo, I'm not all that worried about it.

    In our most recent session however, I ran into a bit of a roadblock, a stone golem. Since it was completely immune to anything that allows SR, I was pretty much screwed at that point, since I didn't have any actual conjurations prepared. The most help I could offer in that fight was to haste the party.

    Obviously, I don't like feeling useless, so I'm trying to figure out my best option for dealing with that if it comes up again in the future. I realize I have several, but I'm just not sure what the best is. Below is what I've thought of.

    1. Prepare a couple actual no-SR conjurations that I could use against it. I'm hesitant to do this, since it seems like a waste of spells, since I can generally just mimic those same spells no problem against 99% of the enemies we face.
    2. Prepare more party buffs with my non-illusion spells. This could help some, but since we have no frontliner, it's hard to figure out who would be the best person to buff.
    3. Pick up a runestaff/knowstone with some (lesser) orb of X spells, so I could at least blast it, even if I have nothing prepared that would be useful against something like that.

    Anyone got any other suggestions or thoughts on which might be the best option out of those?
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    Keld Denar's Avatar

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    Default Re: Shadowcraft mage Issue

    There are still some good Conjourations. I'd keep at the bare minimum a Grease, a Glitterdust, and a Solid Fog. Those are really good spells. Thats what I would keep, at least.
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    ElfRangerGuy

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    Default Re: Shadowcraft mage Issue

    Scrolls and/or wands: the perfect solution for spells you don't need very often but want to have on hand.
    "Nothing you can't spell will ever work." - Will Rogers

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    gallagher's Avatar

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    Default Re: Shadowcraft mage Issue

    if you have no frontliners, why did you ban abjuration?
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    PId6's Avatar

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    Default Re: Shadowcraft mage Issue

    Against mindless magic-immunes like golems, use actual image spells like Silent/Minor/Major Image. Mindless creatures shouldn't interact with them most of the time since they're essentially preprogrammed, so if you use image spells to make walls and pits, they should never even realize that they're not real. (If they do start interacting with those images, and the golems don't usually walk into walls/pits, then you should call shenanigans on your DM.)
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    Default Re: Shadowcraft mage Issue

    (If they do start interacting with those images, and the golems don't usually walk into walls/pits, then you should call shenanigans on your DM.)
    Or summon an actual wall of stone and demand the same treatment. ^_^
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    Troll in the Playground
     
    Chimera

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    Default Re: Shadowcraft mage Issue

    Invis the entire party and walk right by? Golems have no skills, and so have no chance of spotting you at all.

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    Default Re: Shadowcraft mage Issue

    Quote Originally Posted by PId6 View Post
    Against mindless magic-immunes like golems, use actual image spells like Silent/Minor/Major Image. Mindless creatures shouldn't interact with them most of the time since they're essentially preprogrammed, so if you use image spells to make walls and pits, they should never even realize that they're not real. (If they do start interacting with those images, and the golems don't usually walk into walls/pits, then you should call shenanigans on your DM.)
    I don't understand this. Why mindlessness means no interaction? IMO, being mindless, if the golem is focused on chasing an enemy, it may just walk through any obstacle, crushing it if necessary, instead of stopping.
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    PId6's Avatar

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    Default Re: Shadowcraft mage Issue

    Quote Originally Posted by Salbazier View Post
    I don't understand this. Why mindlessness means no interaction? IMO, being mindless, if the golem is focused on chasing an enemy, it may just walk through any obstacle, crushing it if necessary, instead of stopping.
    A mindless enemy can't think, so it shouldn't be able to deduce that the wall that just popped in front of it might not be real. If it's been reprogrammed to walk around obstacles, then it wouldn't try to go through the illusory wall.

    Yes, the golem could be predisposed to walking through obstacles. But then I'd expect consistent behavior with real obstacles, and not just illusory ones. If there's an actual pit or wall of stone in front of it, I'd expect the golem in that case to walk right into the wall or fall into the pit. Since it's mindless, its behavior should be consistent and unthinking.
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    molten_dragon's Avatar

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    Default Re: Shadowcraft mage Issue

    Quote Originally Posted by gallagher View Post
    if you have no frontliners, why did you ban abjuration?
    2 reasons. First off, we have a cleric, who has access to several of the same spells, and secondly, I thought we were going to have a druid in the party, which would give us two good frontliners. Unfortunately the druid was the DMs girlfriend and dumped him, so she won't be coming back.
    If build a man a fire, he'll be warm for a day.

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    Default Re: Shadowcraft mage Issue

    The way I am going to do it with my shadowcraft mage is with Signature Spell(Silent Image). I don't think you got the feat(s) to spare but the fun with Signature Spell + Shadowcraft mage is that you can spontaneous cast all "imitated spells" and prepare your spell slots with normal spells.

    But unless your DM is exploits weaknesses don't worry to much about fully SR-resistant encounters and just get some wands/scrolls/runestaff/knowstone for the case it does happen.
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    Lord Vukodlak's Avatar

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    Default Re: Shadowcraft mage Issue

    Quote Originally Posted by Rannil View Post
    The way I am going to do it with my shadowcraft mage is with Signature Spell(Silent Image). I don't think you got the feat(s) to spare but the fun with Signature Spell + Shadowcraft mage is that you can spontaneous cast all "imitated spells" and prepare your spell slots with normal spells.

    But unless your DM is exploits weaknesses don't worry to much about fully SR-resistant encounters and just get some wands/scrolls/runestaff/knowstone for the case it does happen.
    That's what I did for my shadowmage, the other advantage of signature spell is with the earth spell feat. Heighten silent image to 5th level and it counts as a 6th level spell.

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