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    Default Re: [BitP:R] BleachitP: Reborn: OOC Thread 12

    Quote Originally Posted by Kuroimaken View Post
    You mean his stealth devices aren't good enough?

    How about a Reiatsu capacitor?
    He's still detectable by at least the Quinta Espada when at rest. If he starts to "crank it up a notch" in a fight, he becomes more and more detectable.

    His goal would be a.)that even the Quinta can't detect him, and b.)the cloak completely masks his signature until he goes into Resureccion. Maybe make it tougher, too.

    Some form of defense against Serazel's Bala, or similar attacks, might be in order as well. Perhaps actual body armor...

    Edit: I should note that my intent would be for his progress on cloak designs to be incremental. So his next version will be slightly better. And so on. Probably 4-6 iterations before he's at his goal.
    Last edited by KnightDisciple; 2010-10-01 at 01:34 PM.
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    Default Re: [BitP:R] BleachitP: Reborn: OOC Thread 12

    Keep in mind that Serazel's Bala in particular become more worrisome not because of force of impact, but due to persistence and Reiatsu-seeking. So perhaps making the cloak itself sturdier against assault would be a good bet.

    I keep getting the feeling that a cloak is an ill-suited form for concealing his Reiatsu, though. Wouldn't a uniform perform better? You could add armor to it.
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    I met a girl with a really pensive look. I walk up to her, put a fifty cent coin in her hand, "For your thoughts. I know the going rate is supposed to be one, but I figure you play hardball."

    She gave it back, "Keep it. Pretty sure a guy with your charm can find a way to have them for free anyway."

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    Default Re: [BitP:R] BleachitP: Reborn: OOC Thread 12

    Quote Originally Posted by Kuroimaken View Post
    Keep in mind that Serazel's Bala in particular become more worrisome not because of force of impact, but due to persistence and Reiatsu-seeking. So perhaps making the cloak itself sturdier against assault would be a good bet.

    I keep getting the feeling that a cloak is an ill-suited form for concealing his Reiatsu, though. Wouldn't a uniform perform better? You could add armor to it.
    It's an in-progress thing. He might make it more like clothing once he's closer to perfecting it, but as-is, he feels it's better to keep it as something more easily removed and replaced on the fly.
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    Default Re: [BitP:R] BleachitP: Reborn: OOC Thread 12

    Uniform is likely to be eradicated by Resurreccion with each use. Cloak has the advantage of being easier to remove, and can hide a wider variety of physical forms than a set of armor or uniform.
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    Default Re: [BitP:R] BleachitP: Reborn: OOC Thread 12

    Quote Originally Posted by Frozen_Feet View Post
    Uniform is likely to be eradicated by Resurreccion with each use. Cloak has the advantage of being easier to remove, and can hide a wider variety of physical forms than a set of armor or uniform.
    The outline-masking form of a cloak is an advantage, to be sure.

    That said, I tend to think of Resurreccion as operating like 3.5 Druid Wildshape; that is to say, when you change forms, your clothes and such are absorbed, and rendered unusable. Hence no belt gadgets when Vicente releases.

    But I highly doubt when an Arrancar's release fades, their clothes are left utterly eradicated.
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    Default Re: [BitP:R] BleachitP: Reborn: OOC Thread 12

    Yeah, I think Grimmjow might serve as a good example to that effect... I think I remember him dying AFTER Ressurreccion, not while in it. But don't quote me on that.
    It's an in-progress thing. He might make it more like clothing once he's closer to perfecting it, but as-is, he feels it's better to keep it as something more easily removed and replaced on the fly.
    Point... it's more convenient, to be sure.
    The outline-masking form of a cloak is an advantage, to be sure.

    That said, I tend to think of Resurreccion as operating like 3.5 Druid Wildshape; that is to say, when you change forms, your clothes and such are absorbed, and rendered unusable. Hence no belt gadgets when Vicente releases.

    But I highly doubt when an Arrancar's release fades, their clothes are left utterly eradicated.
    The Wildshape equivalent thing isn't exactly a problem, considering the cloak won't be doing him any good if it doesn't work during Ressurreccion anyway.

    And I also doubt as much. Seriously, consider the female Arrancar on a mission. If they were successful in killing their targets, they'd have to go home naked!
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    I met a girl with a really pensive look. I walk up to her, put a fifty cent coin in her hand, "For your thoughts. I know the going rate is supposed to be one, but I figure you play hardball."

    She gave it back, "Keep it. Pretty sure a guy with your charm can find a way to have them for free anyway."

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    Default Re: [BitP:R] BleachitP: Reborn: OOC Thread 12

    Quote Originally Posted by Kuroimaken View Post
    Yeah, I think Grimmjow might serve as a good example to that effect... I think I remember him dying AFTER Ressurreccion, not while in it. But don't quote me on that.


    Point... it's more convenient, to be sure.


    The Wildshape equivalent thing isn't exactly a problem, considering the cloak won't be doing him any good if it doesn't work during Ressurreccion anyway.

    And I also doubt as much. Seriously, consider the female Arrancar on a mission. If they were successful in killing their targets, they'd have to go home naked!
    But Luppi's(sp?) ressureccion didn't change his base form by too much, and he therefore had his clothing still. Number 5 did too. The only ones who lose their clothes are ones who have a change in their physical body, such as gaining armor and such. Ones who gain limbs like Luppi and the number 5 retain their clothing.
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    Default Re: [BitP:R] BleachitP: Reborn: OOC Thread 12

    Quote Originally Posted by Kuroimaken View Post
    And I also doubt as much. Seriously, consider the female Arrancar on a mission. If they were successful in killing their targets, they'd have to go home naked!
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    Default Re: [BitP:R] BleachitP: Reborn: OOC Thread 12

    Quote Originally Posted by KnightDisciple View Post
    But I highly doubt when an Arrancar's release fades, their clothes are left utterly eradicated.
    I was thinking more of functionality of the uniform. It seems clothes a spirit wears are part of their spirit to some extent - souls come out clothed when they lose their bodies. Similarly, I think when leaving Resurreccion Arrancars generate their clothes from their leftover reiatsu a bit like they do their swords.

    But the uniform wouldn't be a 'native' part of a person, and Resurreccion is a rather intense event to go through - it might be the uniform would only be the 'same' as far as appearance goes. I don't think it's guaranteed an intricate device like that would survive undamaged.
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    Default Re: [BitP:R] BleachitP: Reborn: OOC Thread 12

    Hmmm. All things considered, Canon Bleach has an example or two of clothes that change their shape a little bit, but it's not by much...
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    I met a girl with a really pensive look. I walk up to her, put a fifty cent coin in her hand, "For your thoughts. I know the going rate is supposed to be one, but I figure you play hardball."

    She gave it back, "Keep it. Pretty sure a guy with your charm can find a way to have them for free anyway."

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    Default Re: [BitP:R] BleachitP: Reborn: OOC Thread 12

    Quote Originally Posted by Frozen_Feet View Post
    I was thinking more of functionality of the uniform. It seems clothes a spirit wears are part of their spirit to some extent - souls come out clothed when they lose their bodies. Similarly, I think when leaving Resurreccion Arrancars generate their clothes from their leftover reiatsu a bit like they do their swords.

    But the uniform wouldn't be a 'native' part of a person, and Resurreccion is a rather intense event to go through - it might be the uniform would only be the 'same' as far as appearance goes. I don't think it's guaranteed an intricate device like that would survive undamaged.
    If that's the case, my character has to stop and remove his belt, cloak, and probably a few other gadgets before engaging in Resurreccion. That, or say "oh well, it's all gone".

    It's selfish, but I'd much prefer the Wildshape route, wherein the gear is rendered non-functional for the duration of the transformation, but returns to normal functionality when he returns to his sealed form. We can handwave it with mutters of "micro-dimensional pockets", but one way or another, I'd really rather not have all his gear ruined every time he doesn't take a minute to dump it before releasing.
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    Default Re: [BitP:R] BleachitP: Reborn: OOC Thread 12

    Not all clothes are destroyed or assimilated in Resurreccion, mind you. Nnoitra and Ulquiorra clearly have partly the same clothes while changed. It's just a matter of devising a belt that will flawless suit his resurrected form.

    Of course, he could devise an unform that way, but it'd be much harder and possibly fit only him. He couldn't, for example, sell one and expect it to work without a hitch.
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    Default Re: [BitP:R] BleachitP: Reborn: OOC Thread 12

    Quote Originally Posted by Kuroimaken View Post
    Hmmm. All things considered, Canon Bleach has an example or two of clothes that change their shape a little bit, but it's not by much...
    Let's just agree that Kubo is really inconsistent on "spirit clothes" and that it's better to come up with an explanation of our own rather than trying to figure out how they're supposed to work in canon.
    Last edited by Prime32; 2010-10-01 at 03:48 PM.
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    Default Re: [BitP:R] BleachitP: Reborn: OOC Thread 12

    Quote Originally Posted by Frozen_Feet View Post
    Not all clothes are destroyed or assimilated in Resurreccion, mind you. Nnoitra and Ulquiorra clearly have partly the same clothes while changed. It's just a matter of devising a belt that will flawless suit his resurrected form.

    Of course, he could devise an unform that way, but it'd be much harder and possibly fit only him. He couldn't, for example, sell one and expect it to work without a hitch.
    I think we're almost talking past each other.

    I don't need my gadget belt or cloak or any other items I have/will have to function in his release. In my mind, the unique adaptability of such things is a sacrifice he chooses to make for the greater power of Resurreccion.

    All I'm asking is that we allow the handwave that it's not rendered useless junk, and instead just enters a sort of "stasis", again vis a vis Druid Wildshape.

    "It's magic" is a perfectly fine explanation to me, since we're talking an entire race of shapeshifters who each possess the ability to, at minimum, level city blocks with ease. Saying that his minor tools don't get screwed up when they disappear for a bit while he's fighting doesn't seem like a game-breaker.
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    Default Re: [BitP:R] BleachitP: Reborn: OOC Thread 12

    It seems to me that Ressurreccion is capable of addition but not of subtraction. Notice how pretty much no Arrancar ever loses an arm or a leg when in Ressurreccion, though most of them gain shiny new armor. Also, for the most part, all body parts they tend to gain could be added on top without necessarily damaging said clothes.

    I don't think it'd be a stretch to allow Vicente's Ressurreccion to transform OVER his clothes/cloak. Specially when you consider this...
    "It's magic" is a perfectly fine explanation to me, since we're talking an entire race of shapeshifters who each possess the ability to, at minimum, level city blocks with ease.
    I find it very hard to believe that something as inconvenient as having to put on new clothes whenever things get serious couldn't be worked with.
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    I met a girl with a really pensive look. I walk up to her, put a fifty cent coin in her hand, "For your thoughts. I know the going rate is supposed to be one, but I figure you play hardball."

    She gave it back, "Keep it. Pretty sure a guy with your charm can find a way to have them for free anyway."

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    Default Re: [BitP:R] BleachitP: Reborn: OOC Thread 12

    Quote Originally Posted by Prime32
    Let's just agree that Kubo is really inconsistent on "spirit clothes" and that it's better to come up with an explanation of our own rather than trying to figure out how they're supposed to work in canon.
    All that we know for sure about Kubo's work is that clothes are also a parts of person's spirit. Anything outside that is already coming up with a new explanation. I just happen to like destruction & recontruction more than equipment melting to a foreign form, my reasoning I already told you.

    I didn't think of Vincente's belt, mainly because I thought it'd stay where it is even after transformation. But as far as "sacrifices" of some kind go, the belt dramatically shredding to pieces would be much more narratively appropriate in my mind. Vincente should have spares handy anyway.
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    Default Re: [BitP:R] BleachitP: Reborn: OOC Thread 12

    Quote Originally Posted by KnightDisciple View Post
    I think we're almost talking past each other.

    I don't need my gadget belt or cloak or any other items I have/will have to function in his release. In my mind, the unique adaptability of such things is a sacrifice he chooses to make for the greater power of Resurreccion.

    All I'm asking is that we allow the handwave that it's not rendered useless junk, and instead just enters a sort of "stasis", again vis a vis Druid Wildshape.

    "It's magic" is a perfectly fine explanation to me, since we're talking an entire race of shapeshifters who each possess the ability to, at minimum, level city blocks with ease. Saying that his minor tools don't get screwed up when they disappear for a bit while he's fighting doesn't seem like a game-breaker.
    Vincente's a planner. He should have a plan for this.
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    Default Re: [BitP:R] BleachitP: Reborn: OOC Thread 12

    Quote Originally Posted by Frozen_Feet View Post
    All that we know for sure about Kubo's work is that clothes are also a parts of person's spirit. Anything outside that is already coming up with a new explanation. I just happen to like destruction & recontruction more than equipment melting to a foreign form, my reasoning I already told you.
    Except for all those times spirits change clothes, including cases of stealing clothes from other spirits.

    And your clothes vanish or remain depending on how you die.
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    Default Re: [BitP:R] BleachitP: Reborn: OOC Thread 12

    Quote Originally Posted by Prime32 View Post
    Except for all those times spirits change clothes, including cases of stealing clothes from other spirits.

    And your clothes vanish or remain depending on how you die.
    We should ask Draken, or put it up to vote by central+draken.
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    Default Re: [BitP:R] BleachitP: Reborn: OOC Thread 12

    Quote Originally Posted by Frozen_Feet View Post
    All that we know for sure about Kubo's work is that clothes are also a parts of person's spirit. Anything outside that is already coming up with a new explanation. I just happen to like destruction & recontruction more than equipment melting to a foreign form, my reasoning I already told you.

    I didn't think of Vincente's belt, mainly because I thought it'd stay where it is even after transformation. But as far as "sacrifices" of some kind go, the belt dramatically shredding to pieces would be much more narratively appropriate in my mind. Vincente should have spares handy anyway.
    Right, and I prefer that it just "hides" for a bit. It's easier for me, the player to deal with, and makes just as much "metaphysical" sense as it getting shredded. It's a matter of minor convenience, not some major sacrifice. So the "narrative weight" is fairly minor, at best.

    And he can't bloody carry the spares with him, but he might well need the stuff in the belt if he's pulling off the field of battle after re-sealing his powers. Again, mainly a convenience thing for me, the player, as much as it is for Vicente, the character.

    Do note that his character sheet already explicitly says his equipment is "absorbed/stored". So I've kind of been running with this idea already, and no one has said a thing until now.

    Quote Originally Posted by riccaru View Post
    Vincente's a planner. He should have a plan for this.
    Vicente's plan is, I suppose, going to be dependent on what Draken says.

    If we go with "clothes get absorbed", then nothing about his character sheet needs to change, as that is his default assumption.

    If Draken rules that they have to be "specially fitted" or they get shredded (somehow), then I will adjust his character sheet, and future posts, to reflect this.

    His "plan" will have been in place from the beginning. This isn't an issue of him lacking a plan. If there's any "issue", it's of a meta-level disconnect on concepts.
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    Default Re: [BitP:R] BleachitP: Reborn: OOC Thread 12

    Quote Originally Posted by Prime32 View Post
    Except for all those times spirits change clothes, including cases of stealing clothes from other spirits.

    And your clothes vanish or remain depending on how you die.
    The clothes not vanishing was noted to be abnormal, and that was because the hosts were technically still alive.

    I don't see how changing clothes constitutes an inconstistency, because Zanpakuto of both Shinigami and Arrancar are without doubt parts of their users' souls, but are still unquestionably separate (and can be separated) from their wielders to an extent.

    Considering Tousen could even take his friend's zanpakuto as its own before it vanished, the perceived inconsistency is more about imposing a rule on the work that has never been there.
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    Default Re: [BitP:R] BleachitP: Reborn: OOC Thread 12

    Quote Originally Posted by KnightDisciple View Post
    Right, and I prefer that it just "hides" for a bit. It's easier for me, the player to deal with, and makes just as much "metaphysical" sense as it getting shredded. It's a matter of minor convenience, not some major sacrifice. So the "narrative weight" is fairly minor, at best.

    And he can't bloody carry the spares with him, but he might well need the stuff in the belt if he's pulling off the field of battle after re-sealing his powers. Again, mainly a convenience thing for me, the player, as much as it is for Vicente, the character.

    Do note that his character sheet already explicitly says his equipment is "absorbed/stored". So I've kind of been running with this idea already, and no one has said a thing until now.

    Vicente's plan is, I suppose, going to be dependent on what Draken says.

    If we go with "clothes get absorbed", then nothing about his character sheet needs to change, as that is his default assumption.

    If Draken rules that they have to be "specially fitted" or they get shredded (somehow), then I will adjust his character sheet, and future posts, to reflect this.

    His "plan" will have been in place from the beginning. This isn't an issue of him lacking a plan. If there's any "issue", it's of a meta-level disconnect on concepts.
    You said earlier the cloak is going to help with his ressureccion when it's fully developed which means it would not be absorbed. Also, how would he wear the cloak with the large wings on is back?
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    Default Re: [BitP:R] BleachitP: Reborn: OOC Thread 12

    Quote Originally Posted by riccaru View Post
    Also, how would he wear the cloak with the large wings on is back?
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    Default Re: [BitP:R] BleachitP: Reborn: OOC Thread 12

    Quote Originally Posted by KnightDisciple View Post
    And he can't bloody carry the spares with him, but he might well need the stuff in the belt if he's pulling off the field of battle after re-sealing his powers...
    And that's exactly where I think the narrative weight is - because loss of his equipment could easily be a major plot point. I understand your desire for convenience, but I do think the inconcenience would be more interesting.

    In the end, this isn't a major issue. I'd suggest throwing dice over it, but waiting for Draken is fine, too.
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    Default Re: [BitP:R] BleachitP: Reborn: OOC Thread 12

    Quote Originally Posted by Prime32 View Post
    Beat me to it.

    Really, who cares? It's not like it affects power levels any, so it should be up to the player, because every character is a special snowflake.
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    Default Re: [BitP:R] BleachitP: Reborn: OOC Thread 12

    Quote Originally Posted by riccaru View Post
    You said earlier the cloak is going to help with his ressureccion when it's fully developed which means it would not be absorbed. Also, how would he wear the cloak with the large wings on is back?
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    Quote Originally Posted by KnightDisciple View Post
    He's still detectable by at least the Quinta Espada when at rest. If he starts to "crank it up a notch" in a fight, he becomes more and more detectable.

    His goal would be a.)that even the Quinta can't detect him, and b.)the cloak completely masks his signature until he goes into Resureccion. Maybe make it tougher, too.

    Some form of defense against Serazel's Bala, or similar attacks, might be in order as well. Perhaps actual body armor...

    Edit: I should note that my intent would be for his progress on cloak designs to be incremental. So his next version will be slightly better. And so on. Probably 4-6 iterations before he's at his goal.
    As for the wings...*Shrugs* Were I going to do that (which I'm not), It'd just act like a narrow cape, and rest between the wings. Or end up like a long vest/sleeveless longcoat with slots for the wings to go out of.

    But it's never been my intent for the cloak to work once he releases. That's kind of broken. And not happening.
    BitPRR Characters: Entries Masaru, Chuck, Thomas, Turiel, and Masamune

  27. - Top - End - #327
    Ettin in the Playground
     
    Frozen_Feet's Avatar

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    Default Re: [BitP:R] BleachitP: Reborn: OOC Thread 12

    Hey, about other things...

    Now that Episode 3 is closing its end and most of the patrollers are already leaving for Seireitei, I'd like to know what people would like to do with the poker night and officers' party.

    Since we're in no rush, we can have the patrollers just hang in limbo for the moment, and hope the Ep.3 and the party finish off at the same time, after which we can timeskip Soul Soicety with few days. My own suggestion is one week.

    The other solution would be to move the party to an Episode, and timeskip Soul Society to follow Ep. 3 and Mortal World now. Seireitei could then carry on with Karite's Hollowfication plot and other things.

    I'm currently waiting for:

    Edge; you know why.
    riccaru; Akio in Ep. 3
    zerkai; Canguro in Hueco Muendo

    For those waiting for me, I'll try to come up with something for Sayuri, Nasumi and Hachirou, but currently I'm drawing blanks.
    "It's the fate of all things under the sky,
    to grow old and wither and die."


    Come and join Bleach: Turn Back the Pendulum freeform game!

    Thanks to Kasanip for my Nasumi avatar.

  28. - Top - End - #328
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    BlueKnightGuy

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    Default Re: [BitP:R] BleachitP: Reborn: OOC Thread 12

    Poker night: Let's just gloss over it. It seems to have kind of imploded for various reasons, so let's just say the Captains had fun, ate food, drank drinks, broke pretty much even in winnings, and went home. So timeskip is fine there.
    BitPRR Characters: Entries Masaru, Chuck, Thomas, Turiel, and Masamune

  29. - Top - End - #329
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    Default Re: [BitP:R] BleachitP: Reborn: OOC Thread 12

    Quote Originally Posted by KnightDisciple View Post
    ...No, I didn't. Here, I'll quote my post, which is on the top of this page.

    Relevant section bolded, relevant word within that section underlined.


    As for the wings...*Shrugs* Were I going to do that (which I'm not), It'd just act like a narrow cape, and rest between the wings. Or end up like a long vest/sleeveless longcoat with slots for the wings to go out of.

    But it's never been my intent for the cloak to work once he releases. That's kind of broken. And not happening.
    What do you mean by make it tougher than?
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  30. - Top - End - #330
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    Moon Wolf's Avatar

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    Default Re: [BitP:R] BleachitP: Reborn: OOC Thread 12

    Quote Originally Posted by KnightDisciple View Post
    Poker night: Let's just gloss over it. It seems to have kind of imploded for various reasons, so let's just say the Captains had fun, ate food, drank drinks, broke pretty much even in winnings, and went home. So timeskip is fine there.
    I support that idea. It's not really going anywhere. By the by, if any of you live in NYC, you missed me....I just got back from a 4-day trip there. Good times...

    But yeah, I think we should timeskip to the end of the poker night when they all head home. The VC party will continue, I guess.
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