Ice Hockey Fans in the Playground!!

[SensFan]

Correct. My bad. Full rules here:

http://sports.yahoo.com/nhl/blog/puc...urn=nhl-284177

I wonder how many of the 6 will be Leafs =P

I'm thinking they should use as many Leafs as possible in the All-Star game! They said they wanted lower scoring, right?

[Joran]

I'm thinking they should use as many Leafs as possible in the All-Star game! They said they wanted lower scoring, right?

NHL Fan All-Star Ballot is out.

I'm absolutely shocked that Alexander Semin is not on the ballot. The usual suspects of Backstrom, Ovechkin, and Green are there, but Semin has been the best Caps player so far outside of maybe Michal Neuvirth.

I'm somewhat surprised that Brodeur and Kovalchuk are on there, but am absolutely shocked that Marc-Andre Fleury is on there, considering he got benched in favor of Brent Johnson.

It's like they wrote the ballot at the beginning of the year and just grabbed all the famous players.

[shiram]

Carey Price could have taken Fleury's spot, and no love for Thomas Plekanec?
Bah humbug to you all-star game! I'll probably only watch the skills competition anyways.

[SensFan]

Should be noted that that's only the list for possibilities to fill half the starting slots. And frankly, they can't put Plekanec, or to a lesser extent Price, on there, because they know that they'd be voted in even if they got sent to AAA next week, because of the Montreal fan base.

[shiram]

Hehehe well i will not disagree on that. And Price has just been named the first star of last week as well.

[Joran]

So, remember when I referred to Colin Campbell's disciplinary process as "The Wheel of Justice" after it's consistent inconsistency?

Some of Colin Campbell's emails have appeared in a lawsuit. Colin Campbell also happens to be the father of Gregory Campbell, a player in the NHL.

The emails quoted have him whining about calls against his son to the director of officiating and calling Marc Savard "that little fake artist".

Yes... that Marc Savard that got absolutely blindsided by Matt Cooke and yet Cooke received no supplemental discipline.

At best, this is a huge conflict of interest. At worst, Colin Campbell is letting his personal biases influence his judgment. Hopefully this will get his butt fired.

http://sports.yahoo.com/nhl/blog/puc...urn=nhl-285531

[shiram]

Yup read that this morning, and its very unsettling. Hopefully some swift justice will be handed out soon.

[Walrus]

I hadn't heard about that until just now, but it makes me sad that my favourite sport's biggest league is run by a gang of incompetents who seem determined to make the NHL's growth as non-existant as possible.

Well, I mean, that was kind of apparent before, but still. Sad.

We also got some more "Sean Avery is slimy waste of several million dollars" action over the weekend (and the ensuing line brawl). So far I haven't heard about any disciplinary action coming out of it, though.

Has anybody voted for the All Star starting line-up? I was going to, but then it asked me to register and I lost interest.

I was going to vote for Steven Stamkos, Ryan Smyth, and Ales Hemsky for the forwards. Stamkos because I think he deserves it but might not have the fan-following down in Tampa to get him there, Smyth and Hemsky because I am a shameless homer (Smyth on the "once and Oiler, always an Oiler" train of logic). I pretty much glossed over the defencemen, then strongly considered putting in an ironic vote for Nikolai Khabibulin in the goaltender category. And on the bright side, if he actually ended up in the All Star game, we'd probably get to see the "most goals by a team in one period" record broken.

[SensFan]

Toronto's Forwards starting for one team, while Khabibulin starts for the other team. It would finally present scientists with the chance to test in practise what happens when a stoppable force meets a moveable wall!

I was also going to vote until they told me I had to register, and it probably would have been for the usual suspects: Ovechkin, Crosby, Luongo, etc. The way I see it, they're going to make it to the game anyways, so may as well let the actual informed decisions (I have almost no faith in fans' ability to select All Stars) get to pick from the players who aren't auto-includes.

[shiram]

Another great game last night, i admit i was nervous, the Flyers being an awesome team, with great players and the second best offence in the league, but the Habs came up on top, and they made the flyers look like a bunch of sulking bullies.
I despise the flyers thuggish style of play, and they really showed a lack of class last night, in the third period. The next game in Philly should see alot of sparks flying.
That being said, it would not have been the same game without Carey Price, tied for second in shutouts, tied for first in wins and his gaa and save% are nothing to sneer at either! The kid is cementing our team identity, and the skaters definately feel a sense of security playing in front of him.

Also it was great to see our special team pull out a great night, even with the absence of our star quaterback Markov.

[Joran]

Another great game last night, i admit i was nervous, the Flyers being an awesome team, with great players and the second best offence in the league, but the Habs came up on top, and they made the flyers look like a bunch of sulking bullies.
I despise the flyers thuggish style of play, and they really showed a lack of class last night, in the third period. The next game in Philly should see alot of sparks flying.
That being said, it would not have been the same game without Carey Price, tied for second in shutouts, tied for first in wins and his gaa and save% are nothing to sneer at either! The kid is cementing our team identity, and the skaters definately feel a sense of security playing in front of him.

Also it was great to see our special team pull out a great night, even with the absence of our star quaterback Markov.

Reading some quotes about the game, the Flyers are really pissed about P.K. Subban.

Mike Richards about P.K. Subban:

"He's a guy that's come in the League and hasn't earned respect. It's just frustrating to see a young guy like that come in here and so much as think that he's better than a lot of people. You have to earn respect in this League. It takes a lot. You can't just come in here as a rookie and play like that. It's not the way to get respect from other players around the League.

"Hopefully someone on their team addresses it, because, uh, I'm not saying I'm going to do it but something might happen to him of he continues to be that cocky."

Uh... Next game in Philly should be interesting.

[SensFan]

I didn't heard anything about that game; what did Subban (allegedly?) do to piss off the Flyers?

[shiram]

Mike Richards is a bane on hockey, and that he would say such thing is ridiculous.
He should look at what his own team does before spouting nonsense like that... the 2 dirty hits from Powe, they sent out Jody Shelley on the powerplay and Pronger keeps trying to steal the puck.

edit : for Sensfan as far as i know it was only talk, but he did stick up for Andrei Kostitsyn when he received 2 cross-checks from some Flyers player i cant recall right now. Gloves we're thrown put the zebras we're on it before anything happened.

[Joran]

I didn't heard anything about that game; what did Subban (allegedly?) do to piss off the Flyers?

From the Flyers' perspective:

Andrei Kostitsyn took a cheap stick shot to Mike Richards' kidney at one point in the third. When Richards turned around to do something about it, Kostitsyn ducked behind a linesman before P.K. Subban stepped in to protect him. Very typical.

For the Habs' perspective:

Many of those battles centered around P.K. Subban, who was chirping the Flyers practically all night. Subban also stepped in to challenge Flyers captain Mike Richards, who had a beef with Andrei Kostitsyn over a stick to the ribs.

Subban's chatter can be effective, but he still has to learn where to draw the line. His six minutes in penalties do not help the team with Andrei Markov on the shelf indefinitely. The Canadiens need Subban out there to carry the extra minutes in Markov's absence.

So, basically Mike Richards is angry at Subban for stepping in, chirping both on the ice and in the penalty box, and not backing it up by fighting.

[SensFan]

From the Flyers' perspective:


For the Habs' perspective:


So, basically Mike Richards is angry at Subban for stepping in, chirping both on the ice and in the penalty box, and not backing it up by fighting.

Eh. Quite frankly, I don't have a problem with any of that. The penalties are hurting the Habs, but I don't see what the heck the Flyers have anything to complain about.

[Joran]

Eh. Quite frankly, I don't have a problem with any of that. The penalties are hurting the Habs, but I don't see what the heck the Flyers have anything to complain about.

I think it's a lot of "Rookie, know your place" kind of talk. I find all the talk of "codes" and "unwritten rules" annoying; just play the game.

[shiram]

Game on as they say! Kostitsyn against Kostitsyn tomorrow, and Halpern and Gorges are said to be in the line-up for tomorrow too, so thats great news.

[SensFan]

Gotta love good ol' fashioned revenge games. I remember back in '07, the Sabres were complaining that Neil took a cheap shot at Drury, and so they had Andrews jump Alfie, which eventually led to the infamous Emery-Biron fight. The Sens had a rematch with the Sabres later that week, and the Ottawa Sun suggested that Ottawa should start McGrattan at LW, Neil at RW and Emery at C, and just jump the Sabres to start the game. Then Emery can spend the next 5 minutes getting his goalie gear on

[Chunklets]

We also got some more "Sean Avery is slimy waste of several million dollars" action over the weekend (and the ensuing line brawl). So far I haven't heard about any disciplinary action coming out of it, though.

Dubinsky, I think, got fined for punching Foster from the bench, but that was it for supplemental wrist-slapping after that one. There's a part of me (it's not the good part) that wishes that MacIntyre had come out of the penalty box, said "I'll take the 25 games," and explained matters to Avery (either that, or that Peckham had been able to get into the tunnel when Avery was being led away.

Anyway, the last few games for the Oil have been, well, educational (sample lesson: don't turn your back on Sean Avery, I'm looking at you Ladislav Smid). However, it wasn't like we didn't know this rebuild was going to feature some very long nights. On the bright(?) side, the Marty Gerber era in Edmonton has begun! Actually, it's probably going to be the Devan Dubnyk era, which would be fine.

And Price has just been named the first star of last week as well.

Deservedly so, too. To be honest, I didn't know if Price had it in him to recover from being a target for the ire of Montreal's fans, but he's done just that. Well done, young man!

[shiram]

Its funny reading the first posts in this thread, everyone doubted him, myslef included.

[Chunklets]

Its funny reading the first posts in this thread, everyone doubted him, myslef included.

Indeed. Here's me, from a month and a half ago:

The Habbies have always been my second team, but I'm not foreseeing great things for them this season. I worry about Carey Price's mental state... Hopefully they can prove me wrong!

However, at about the same time I also trotted out this bold prediction (I replay it here to prove that I am not, in fact, always wrong! ):

I think you're dead right on Gerber - I won't be surprised at all to see him in Edmonton at some point this season.

[Walrus]

Dubinsky, I think, got fined for punching Foster from the bench, but that was it for supplemental wrist-slapping after that one. There's a part of me (it's not the good part) that wishes that MacIntyre had come out of the penalty box, said "I'll take the 25 games," and explained matters to Avery (either that, or that Peckham had been able to get into the tunnel when Avery was being led away.

That incident was the kind of case that illustrates that the NHL's disciplinary actions are pretty impotent and that the shift away from tough-guy sluggers to "agitators" isn't one that's actually reducing violence in the game. Even as recently as the '90s, if somebody was out of line, they were going to have a run-in with a large, angry man with large, angry fists. Sure, you could still play dirty and act like a (expletive deleted), but you had to be ready to stand up to the other team's muscle, because he was coming after you. Or Wendel Clark was coming after you, which was probably worse for your long-term health.

Nowadays, with the nigh-useless instigator rule and other rules designed to curb fistic revenge, players like Sean Avery, Alexandre Burrows, and Matt Cooke never really have to worry about guys like Steve MacIntyre, because never in a million years will they ever agree to fight, and if Mac decides to make one of their skulls into a souvenir, he's getting a 2, 5, and 10, MINIMUM. I would honestly have loved to have seen Theo Peckham as an NHL defender fifteen or twenty years ago. The trail of mangled corpses along the boards and in the slot would be Pronger-esque.

Anyway, the last few games for the Oil have been, well, educational (sample lesson: don't turn your back on Sean Avery, I'm looking at you Ladislav Smid). However, it wasn't like we didn't know this rebuild was going to feature some very long nights. On the bright(?) side, the Marty Gerber era in Edmonton has begun! Actually, it's probably going to be the Devan Dubnyk era, which would be fine.

The problem I'm having with the Oilers current play (aside from that it's terrible) is that the experienced players have been significantly worse than the kids, with a few exceptions. Tom Gilbert and Jim Vandermeer are leaking goals-against at an alarming rate, and even being paired with Ryan Whitney isn't making Gilbert better; it's just making Whitney worse. Hall and co. aren't going to be able to grow as players if every mistake they make goes into the back of the net because we only have four adequate defencemen.

I agree with you that it'll probably be Dubnyk that takes the reigns, which I'm also fine with. He's played well in his few appearances so far, and would have gotten the W in NJ if the rest of the team hadn't let him down. His save percentage is way up from last year, and with Marty Gerber backing him up there won't be any worries in goal. Now if only they could do something about all the worries in front of it...

[SensFan]

Darth Gerber, serving as a back-up for a Canadian team once again.

[shiram]

Anyone wants Scott Gomez? I dont...

[Joran]

That incident was the kind of case that illustrates that the NHL's disciplinary actions are pretty impotent and that the shift away from tough-guy sluggers to "agitators" isn't one that's actually reducing violence in the game. Even as recently as the '90s, if somebody was out of line, they were going to have a run-in with a large, angry man with large, angry fists. Sure, you could still play dirty and act like a (expletive deleted), but you had to be ready to stand up to the other team's muscle, because he was coming after you. Or Wendel Clark was coming after you, which was probably worse for your long-term health.

Matt Cooke did get his clock cleaned

Anyway, the reason why the big, hulking enforcers are no longer around is because the game has changed. Various rule changes, like enforced obstruction, removing the two line passes, and the salary cap all have made people who have no talent other than dropping gloves a luxury most teams can't afford.

The Caps have D.J. King, an enforcer, and he's a waste of a roster spot. Most of the times, he's a healthy scratch, but when he does play, he gets maybe 4-5 shifts, gets into a fight with the opposing team's enforcer, and then is stapled to the bench.

I think general team toughness is needed more than enforcers. The Caps have Matt Hendricks, Jon Erskine (who has a history of concussions so I'm nervous whenever he throws down), Matt Bradley, and Jason Chimera. They all have good skill, aren't liabilities on the ice, and are willing to fight to support and defend teammates.

The other deterrence is having a good powerplay. Don't foul our players, or it's very likely the puck will end up in the back of the net.

[Walrus]

Your point about enforcers fighting each other is kind of my point: if they enforcers only fight each other, they're job is pointless. Back in the '80s and '90s, the enforcer's job was to make sure nobody was taking liberties with his teammates. If anybody so much as looked at Gretzky wrong, Dave Semenko would punch them so hard they'd crap out their spine. But the thing with goons in the old days that separates them from the Macintyres and Boogaards of today is that the old goons could play. Sure, most of them didn't have 30 goal seasons like Bob Probert, but Dave Semenko's stats in any given year of his NHL career dwarf Boogaard and Macintyre's career totals.

The thing is, dirty plays haven't been curbed with the rule changes, they've just reduced the ability of the players on the ice to police each other. If I'm an NHLer, I'm FAR more afraid of the possibility of Steve Macintyre being allowed to punch me whether I agree to fight him or not than I am of being fined $2500.

[Chunklets]

Nowadays, with the nigh-useless instigator rule and other rules designed to curb fistic revenge, players like Sean Avery, Alexandre Burrows, and Matt Cooke never really have to worry about guys like Steve MacIntyre, because never in a million years will they ever agree to fight, and if Mac decides to make one of their skulls into a souvenir, he's getting a 2, 5, and 10, MINIMUM. I would honestly have loved to have seen Theo Peckham as an NHL defender fifteen or twenty years ago. The trail of mangled corpses along the boards and in the slot would be Pronger-esque.

Absolutely. In fact, the instigator rule as it is enforced now is arguably an incitement for dirty play: "hey, if I give this guya bit of lumber behind the play, one of his team-mates might start something and we'll get a man advantage!" I agree on Peckham as well - I think the NHL penny may have dropped with him, as he's been very effective lately.

The other deterrence is having a good powerplay. Don't foul our players, or it's very likely the puck will end up in the back of the net.

Also a very good point. Even leaving aside the issue of thuggery, having a good powerplay forces the opposing defense to play a bit soft at even strength.

I agree with you that it'll probably be Dubnyk that takes the reigns, which I'm also fine with. He's played well in his few appearances so far, and would have gotten the W in NJ if the rest of the team hadn't let him down. His save percentage is way up from last year, and with Marty Gerber backing him up there won't be any worries in goal. Now if only they could do something about all the worries in front of it...

I wonder if the change in goaltending will have a positive effect on the defense as well. Khabi was dreadful the last few games before he got hurt, and I really think that contributed to the panicky defense in front of him. I thought that the D looked somewhat better on Sunday - the simple plays were being made, and most of the time there was general of calm about the whole thing. We'll see, starting tonight, if that continues. The big question is what they'll do whan Khabibulin is better; he's arguably the third-best goalie in the Oilers system right now.

Darth Gerber, serving as a back-up for a Canadian team once again.

I do hope he brought his mask with him...

Anyone wants Scott Gomez? I dont...

No, no, that's fine, thank you for the kind offer! Seriously, though, any idea what's wrong with him this year?

But the thing with goons in the old days that separates them from the Macintyres and Boogaards of today is that the old goons could play. Sure, most of them didn't have 30 goal seasons like Bob Probert, but Dave Semenko's stats in any given year of his NHL career dwarf Boogaard and Macintyre's career totals.

True, although to be honest quite a lot of Semenko's offensive production came when he was actually playing on Gretzky's wing. Heck, Glen Sather used to run Gretzky out between Semenko and Dave Lumley, and it didn't slow the kid down.

[An Enemy Spy]

The Canadiens. I alwyas thought it was spelled Canadians. Is this a regional thing? Also, shouldn't the Leafs be the Leaves?

[SensFan]

The Canadiens. I alwyas thought it was spelled Canadians. Is this a regional thing? Also, shouldn't the Leafs be the Leaves?

Canadiens is the french spelling. Leafs is...yeah, I think making jokes about the Leafs is too easy at this point

Also, that isn't the Darth Gerber mask; THIS is.

[Chunklets]

Also, that isn't the Darth Gerber mask; THIS is.

Yes, the all-black mask was the inspiration for the nickname, but he did have the "vader-painted" mask and used it a few times with the Sens. Actually, from what I've seen so far of him here and and in Oklahoma city, he seems to be going with an all-white mask this time around.

The Canadiens. I alwyas thought it was spelled Canadians. Is this a regional thing? Also, shouldn't the Leafs be the Leaves?

What SensFan said about "Canadiens" - I think one of their early official names was "Le Club de Hockey Candien de Montreal."

As for the unusual pluralization of "Leaf" to "Leafs," I've extracted from their Wikipedia page the following plausible explanation:

"After taking control on Valentine's Day 1927, Smythe immediately renamed the team the Maple Leafs (the Toronto Maple Leafs baseball team had won the International League championship a few months earlier and had been using that name for 30 years). The Maple Leafs say that the name was chosen in honour of the Maple Leaf Regiment from World War I. As the regiment is a proper noun, its plural is formed by adding a simple 's' creating Maple Leafs (not *Maple Leaves)."