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  1. - Top - End - #691
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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion: There's a God for that! Except for Sorcery, of course

    Or, alternately, you could draw it up kind of as a hellforged wonder, then substitute appropriate behemoth powers.
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    My motto: Repensum Est Canicula.

    Quote Originally Posted by turkishproverb View Post
    I am not getting into a shootout with Golentan. Too many gun-arms.
    Leiningen will win, even if he must lose in the attempt.

    Credit to Astrella for the new party avatar.

  2. - Top - End - #692
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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion: There's a God for that! Except for Sorcery, of course

    So, I've been winging it a bit up to now, since it'd been a fairly secondary ability set for my characters up to now, but I'm finally making a fairly social character (mostly focusing on Excellencies, though. I'm not touching Sid social charms with a ten foot pole. Somebody needs to give Venus a punch in the face), I need someone to give me an explanation of how the social abilities and Attributes work. What is Manipulation? Somebody's ability at lying, versus Charisma being convincing with truths? Being able to find the right word versus Charisma being convincing by raw force of personality? And where the hell does Socialize fall?

  3. - Top - End - #693
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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion: There's a God for that! Except for Sorcery, of course

    Charisma is "Wow, that guy is cool. I'll listen to what he has to say." Manipulation is "Wow, that guy has a persuasive argument. I'll listen to what he has to say."

    Not exactly, but I hope you get the idea. It can be lying, but it is not so by default.
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    My motto: Repensum Est Canicula.

    Quote Originally Posted by turkishproverb View Post
    I am not getting into a shootout with Golentan. Too many gun-arms.
    Leiningen will win, even if he must lose in the attempt.

    Credit to Astrella for the new party avatar.

  4. - Top - End - #694
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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion: There's a God for that! Except for Sorcery, of course

    Quote Originally Posted by Drascin View Post
    And where the hell does Socialize fall?
    Golentan did a good job with Charisma/Manipulation, but as for Socialize, it's kind of like the social equivalent of "War". You don't make attacks with it, but you use it to coordinate. So, it's more your character's ability to see the Big Social Picture, administrate social gatherings, run political campaigns, and things like that.

    I think.

  5. - Top - End - #695
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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion: There's a God for that! Except for Sorcery, of course

    It's also what you roll when you're just shooting the breeze with NPCs and want them to like you.

    I think it's also the default "lying" ability.
    Last edited by Yuki Akuma; 2010-11-22 at 04:48 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by archaeo View Post
    Man, this is just one of those things you see and realize, "I live in a weird and banal future."

  6. - Top - End - #696
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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion: There's a God for that! Except for Sorcery, of course

    Quote Originally Posted by Xefas View Post
    Golentan did a good job with Charisma/Manipulation, but as for Socialize, it's kind of like the social equivalent of "War". You don't make attacks with it, but you use it to coordinate. So, it's more your character's ability to see the Big Social Picture, administrate social gatherings, run political campaigns, and things like that.

    I think.
    It's also used to make unexpected social attacks by reestablishing surprise.
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  7. - Top - End - #697
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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion: There's a God for that! Except for Sorcery, of course

    Quote Originally Posted by Yuki_Akuma View Post
    It's also what you roll when you're just shooting the breeze with NPCs and want them to like you.
    Really? I've only played one social character, and he had Crowned With Fury, so my casual shooting-the-breeze-to-make-random-NPCs-like-me was just "Like me! LIKE MEEE!!" as I shook my fist angrily at them.

  8. - Top - End - #698
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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion: There's a God for that! Except for Sorcery, of course

    Well, Charisma/Manipulation is pretty understandable. Socialize, however, seems to be rather all over the place it's lying, but also smalltalk, but also quick and surprising turns of phrase, but also... . Well, the social abilities as a whole seem to be rather over the place.

    Basically, the character I have in mind is a great actor and a great talker - he doesn't have raw magnetism, but he's persuasive through making very good points and backing them up with a prose that would make the Greek masters of the sophist school nod and clap in approval. So, I got Performance for the acting and the great monologues... but from the Core, it could also be Presence, since Presence is "the ability used for long-term persuading". And it could maybe need part Socialize because apparently socialize is also used to "realize and understand the feelings of others" (wouldn't that be Perception+Investigation anyway?) and it's absurd to expect a non-tailored discourse to affect anyone. So you can see how I'm a bit confused.
    Last edited by Drascin; 2010-11-22 at 05:39 PM.

  9. - Top - End - #699
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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion: There's a God for that! Except for Sorcery, of course

    You have enough starting ability dots and bonus points to take every social ability rather high.
    There's no wrong way to play. - S. John Ross

    Quote Originally Posted by archaeo View Post
    Man, this is just one of those things you see and realize, "I live in a weird and banal future."

  10. - Top - End - #700
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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion: There's a God for that! Except for Sorcery, of course

    Quick question: can a God-Blooded/Ghost-blooded/Half-caste/etc Exalt?
    He fears his fate too much, and his reward is small, who will not put it to the touch, to win or lose it all.
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  11. - Top - End - #701
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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion: There's a God for that! Except for Sorcery, of course

    Yes.

    Half-castes always Exalt as their parent's type.
    There's no wrong way to play. - S. John Ross

    Quote Originally Posted by archaeo View Post
    Man, this is just one of those things you see and realize, "I live in a weird and banal future."

  12. - Top - End - #702
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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion: There's a God for that! Except for Sorcery, of course

    Quote Originally Posted by Tavar View Post
    Quick question: can a God-Blooded/Ghost-blooded/Half-caste/etc Exalt?
    Yes, though it is said to "Burn" the impurities of your half-ness out of you when you Exalt, mostly as a balancing mechanic. It is "unheard of" (i.e. strongly suggested against but still technically agreeable with GM fiat) for a Half-Exalt to Exalt as something other than what their half-ness is.

  13. - Top - End - #703
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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion: There's a God for that! Except for Sorcery, of course

    Quote Originally Posted by Tavar View Post
    Quick question: can a God-Blooded/Ghost-blooded/Half-caste/etc Exalt?
    Yes, but they lose all GB abilities not covered by physical mutations. Exaltation is burning away the lesser essence patterns to make way for itself.
    Youth and strenght alvays lose to age and treachery.

  14. - Top - End - #704
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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion: There's a God for that! Except for Sorcery, of course

    Quote Originally Posted by Tavar View Post
    Quick question: can a God-Blooded/Ghost-blooded/Half-caste/etc Exalt?
    They can, and unless they are Half-Castes, there is no limitation on what kind of Celestial Exaltation they can receive. So, a Ghost-blooded doesn't need to Exalt as an Abyssal just because he has necrotic Essence.
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  15. - Top - End - #705
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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion: There's a God for that! Except for Sorcery, of course

    Quote Originally Posted by The Rose Dragon View Post
    They can, and unless they are Half-Castes, there is no limitation on what kind of Celestial Exaltation they can receive. So, a Ghost-blooded doesn't need to Exalt as an Abyssal just because he has necrotic Essence.
    Kind of like how I get the impression Gothy-mcSidereal came about.

    Canon example.
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    My motto: Repensum Est Canicula.

    Quote Originally Posted by turkishproverb View Post
    I am not getting into a shootout with Golentan. Too many gun-arms.
    Leiningen will win, even if he must lose in the attempt.

    Credit to Astrella for the new party avatar.

  16. - Top - End - #706
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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion: There's a God for that! Except for Sorcery, of course

    Quote Originally Posted by golentan View Post
    Kind of like how I get the impression Gothy-mcSidereal came about.

    Canon example.
    You know, he has a name.

    An name often mocked by turning it into "Black Eye Shadow", but still.
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  17. - Top - End - #707
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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion: There's a God for that! Except for Sorcery, of course

    Quote Originally Posted by The Rose Dragon View Post
    You know, he has a name.

    An name often mocked by turning it into "Black Eye Shadow", but still.
    I find it hard to take him seriously, is all. So I push even harder the other direction.
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    My motto: Repensum Est Canicula.

    Quote Originally Posted by turkishproverb View Post
    I am not getting into a shootout with Golentan. Too many gun-arms.
    Leiningen will win, even if he must lose in the attempt.

    Credit to Astrella for the new party avatar.

  18. - Top - End - #708
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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion: There's a God for that! Except for Sorcery, of course

    ...who are we talking about, and where is he? O.o


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    Quote Originally Posted by Revlid View Post
    And so it was that Zaeed, Aang, Winry, Ezio, Sadoko and Snow White all set out on their epic journey to destroy The Empire.

    God I love Exalted.


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  19. - Top - End - #709
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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion: There's a God for that! Except for Sorcery, of course

    Black Ice Shadow, the iconic Chosen of Endings.
    There's no wrong way to play. - S. John Ross

    Quote Originally Posted by archaeo View Post
    Man, this is just one of those things you see and realize, "I live in a weird and banal future."

  20. - Top - End - #710
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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion: There's a God for that! Except for Sorcery, of course

    Black Ice Shadow. He is all over the cover of the Sidereals book, and can often be seen along Abyssals.
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  21. - Top - End - #711
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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion: There's a God for that! Except for Sorcery, of course

    Also, he's a mildly creepy, but one of the few actual non-douchebag characters in the setting.

    The others being pre-emo Demetheous and most of his circle, Kes, Nightwarden, The Smith, That Lunar I Can't Remember The Name Of That Saves Lillun, Lillun herself, and a couple others.
    Quote Originally Posted by Deophaun View Post
    It doesn't so much as demean the celestial monkey's existence, so much as fulfill it. Without the ability to be summoned to set off traps, retrieve objects from dangerous situations, and all and all be a party's guinea pig, the Celestial Monkey would languish in obscurity in the MM and do nothing more legendary than eat celestial bananas.
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  22. - Top - End - #712
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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion: There's a God for that! Except for Sorcery, of course

    Lillun's not a douchebag, no.

    She is, however, a horrific, bipolar psycho.
    There's no wrong way to play. - S. John Ross

    Quote Originally Posted by archaeo View Post
    Man, this is just one of those things you see and realize, "I live in a weird and banal future."

  23. - Top - End - #713
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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion: There's a God for that! Except for Sorcery, of course

    Wait, are we talking about Lilith the Lunar, or Lillun the Phylactery Womb?

  24. - Top - End - #714
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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion: There's a God for that! Except for Sorcery, of course

    Exalted mad-libs time (I'm lacking a character concept, so I thought I'd turn it into a little game)!

    He is a [Exalt type] [Caste] [Profession] with [Psychological Trauma] and a [Noun] as a weapon who wants to [Phrasal Verb]. She is a [Non-Exalt Splat] [Profession] who [Verb] [Noun] and [Dark Past]. Together, they [Epic Deed]!
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  25. - Top - End - #715
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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion: There's a God for that! Except for Sorcery, of course

    Quote Originally Posted by Xefas View Post
    Wait, are we talking about Lilith the Lunar, or Lillun the Phylactery Womb?
    The Womb. The Lunar is question is Black Asp, who is also known for such feats as surviving the ire of Magnificent Jaguar and taking down Harmonious Jade like a joke.
    Quote Originally Posted by The Rose Dragon View Post
    Exalted mad-libs time (I'm lacking a character concept, so I thought I'd turn it into a little game)!

    He is a [Abyssal] [Day caste] [scavenger] with [shameless megalomania] and a [serpent-sting staff] as a weapon who wants to [kill those who ignored him]. She is a [Ghost-Blooded] [socialite] who [assassinates] [her father's agents] and [is the Green Lady's unwitting pawn]. Together, they [liberate Stygia from the Deathlords]!
    How's that for you?

  26. - Top - End - #716
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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion: There's a God for that! Except for Sorcery, of course

    Quote Originally Posted by Xefas View Post
    Wait, are we talking about Lilith the Lunar, or Lillun the Phylactery Womb?
    I think Yuki's talking about Lilith, and Reynard is talking about Lillun.
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  27. - Top - End - #717
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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion: There's a God for that! Except for Sorcery, of course

    Quote Originally Posted by Ganurath View Post
    The Womb. The Lunar is question is Black Asp, who is also known for such feats as surviving the ire of Magnificent Jaguar and taking down Harmonious Jade like a joke.
    Oh, that's who's in that comic. I wondered that, with Lunars being the Exalt type I probably know the least about right now. Although, did she actually save Lillun? I always assumed she died like 10 seconds after that last frame. Not because I wanted that to happen, but because I figure whoever decided writing in a mutilated infant as an important character for a setting was a good idea probably gets their kicks like that.

    Also:
    He is a [Lunar] [Full Moon with a Zebra spirit shape] [public defender] with [color agnosia] and a [God Kicking Boot] as a weapon who wants to [enforce his own brand of black-and-white morality on Creation]. She is a [Djala] [panda shepherd] who [is thrown into a violent rage by] [bright colors] and [whose children were murdered by the Akuma of Hegra, who is incidentally a Yozi composed of a swirling storm of psychedelic colors]. Together, they [break the Loom of Fate, eliminating all color from Creation.]

  28. - Top - End - #718
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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion: There's a God for that! Except for Sorcery, of course

    So, creating a behemoth sword. Perfectly acceptable, since behemoths are the stuff from which narratives of war and battle are made. In the Wyld, you have a singularly potent weapon which could do things like call lightning down on your foes, or summon forth armies at your command, or simply slay anyone it strikes (and never miss). Easy.

    When dealing with the Creation-born, your sword needs to have actual powers, of course.


    The first key question is whether you are operating pre-errata, or post errata.

    Pre-errata is good for illusion and trickster types, as well as raw versatility.

    Post-errata is more structured, and opens up a few combat options.


    In any case, the behemoth's attacks have the properties of a 1 or 2 dot artifact weapon (with magical material bonuses), so that's a baseline for the raw combat stats.


    1 point: Assumption form. Earth for a 'normal' weapon, water or fire for extra shiny aspects to it. Dreams and Passion or Cerements and Bone can also serve.

    You now have 14 mutation points to distribute.


    Pre-Errata

    Optionally, 2 points gives Mad God Mien, so your weapon is Outside Fate, which can be useful if dealing with Sidereals. See Extinction of Desire for a strictly superior option.

    3 points: Transient Work of Flesh and Bone. When you raise your blade above your head on a battlefield, an army of wyld things crawls out of the ground to do your biddding.

    3 points: Teeth of the World. Brandish your blade in the direction of the foe, and a bolt of lightning strikes them down!

    1 point: Extinction of Desire. Your weapon never was and never will be anything but a perfect blade. Makes it indestructible (with soaks of +26/+26 beyond Stamina, and requiring magical materials to damage) and outside fate (cheaper than Mad God Mien, so go for this!). Useful if you expect opponents to try and destroy your sword rather than treat it as a weapon.

    6 points: Fearsome Mien. When your blade is unsheathed, it fills the hearts of all nearby with nigh disabling terror.

    3 points: Heart Stealing Kiss. Your blade drinks deeply of the courage of any it strikes, destroying their Valor (temporarily).

    3 points: Essence Disrobing Passion. By performing a terrifying kata, you cut away at the essence your opponents hope to use against you.

    1 point: Elemental Transformation. If you face a truly worthy opponent, you release the gems held in the sword's crosspiece, allowing the inner flame / water / lightning within full reign. Gain Essence + 3 more mutation points when transformed (requires a Speed 5 action to activate, though).

    3 points: Preemptive Declaration of Victory. Demonstrate the second kata of your weapon, and entire armies will melt away rather than dare face you.

    2 points: Armament of Flesh. If you feel that your weapon stats are not quite good enough. Take it more than once if you like...

    12 points: Curse of Definition. Anyone facing your sword simply cannot dodge its blows. As an alternative, make them incapable of parrying. If they stunt their defense or use a Charm, they still get a -2 External penalty. Probably too expensive.

    3 points: Defining the Parameters of Battle. Requires partial Errata access for the Defend Other action. Your sword instrinctively moves to deflect blows coming towards you, repelling the most potent strikes as if they were noting more than amateur attempts.

    2 points: Imposition of Law. As with Defining the Parameters of Battle, except now you can parry an unlimited number of extras.

    2 points: Gossamer Wing Flight. Or 6 points for better flight, allows your sword to move around on its own and attack people. This opens up many more options, but detracts from the theme.


    Post-errata

    Most of the options above are no longer valid. But we can use Defend Other without remorse, meaning that the sword is suddenly an extremely good defensive tool. Go figure.

    2 points: Endless Yawning Void. When drawn, your sword summons a storm of lightning bolts about it, shocking any who dare come close.

    2 points: Imposition of Law. Your sword now cannot fail to Defend Other (you) when dealing with extras.

    2 points: Knife Hand Dream. If your essence is high enough (3+), you do extra damage, and possibly even aggravated (5+).

    2 points: Opalescent Gossamer Raiment. If you're worried that 20/20 soak won't quite do for your sword. Add in Blade Turning Skin for another 1 point and get some aggravated soak too.

    2 points: Rarefied Air of Inevitable Victory. For another +1 to DV when your sword is defending you.

    2 points: Gossamer Winged Flight. Now much cheaper and more effective. Still against genre.

    1 point: Surpassing Excellence. Another 2 dice for Defend Other. Are you immune to blockable attacks yet?

    2 points: Glorious Hero Form (Dexterity). Because you really, really, need another die to block attacks with.

    2 points: Hundred Hand Style. If your GM requires a higher Rate on the sword so it can defend you. Worse than Armament of Flesh, in any case.

    2 points: Armament of Flesh. Enhance your attack, defense, and damage (or rate). Much more cost effective than Glorious Hero Form, and more versatile too. Slightly worse than Knife-Hand Dream if you're Essence 3+ and care about damage.

    4 points: Shuffling the Pieces. Those who die to your blade are bound to serve you afterwards, as fey beings flow from their corpses to replenish the ranks of your troops. Actually something that wasn't possible pre-errata!


    Mutations

    There are some mutations that work well either way.

    1+ points: Large, Huge, etc. Because if you're walking around with a really big sword, you may as well ensure that it is REALLY BIG! Also gives stamina and health levels, in case people start attacking it.

    6 points: Essence Attack / Dragon's Breath / Whatever. A way to toss lightning bolts at people if you're post errata, or want slightly different mechanics on your blast, or throw acid / tiny knives at foes pre-errata.


    Conclusion

    Pre-errata, you could do a truly insane amount of neat things, depending on the style you wanted for your weapon and combat techniques. Toss lightning bolts, summon armies or monsters, do massive damage on a hit while draining motes and / or virtues, parry unblockable attacks... And that's just my ideas.

    Post errata, you get a souped up 2 dot artefact weapon that can defend you exceedingly well (against blockable attacks only), and maybe a minor damaging aura or the ability to spawn minor fey servants when you kill someone.

    Neat, but very narrow and too focused on the numbers - the prospective stats you could get weapon-wise are liable to summon an unhappy GM, and that's almost all you can do.


    Yes, I'm disappointed in the errata - and that's not even why.
    Last edited by meschlum; 2010-11-23 at 12:22 AM.

  29. - Top - End - #719
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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion: There's a God for that! Except for Sorcery, of course

    Quote Originally Posted by meschlum View Post
    ...since behemoths are the stuff from which narratives of war and battle are made.
    Close, but not quite. Those would be Sword-shaping actions, including but not limited to Sword-shaping attacks. Sword-shaping weapons, including but not limited to behemoths, are the tools by which such narratives are brought to bear: the stylus, the plot outline, and the moment of inspiration outside the gas station.
    Quote Originally Posted by meschlum View Post
    In the Wyld, you have a singularly potent weapon which could do things like call lightning down on your foes, or summon forth armies at your command, or simply slay anyone it strikes (and never miss). Easy.
    That first one could actually be Ring-shaping, depending on whether the lightning is coming from the weapon or the environment.
    Quote Originally Posted by meschlum View Post
    Crunch.
    Umm... How many dots of what sort of artifact are you using? I'm not sure where you're getting these numbers.
    Quote Originally Posted by meschlum View Post
    Yes, I'm disappointed in the errata - and that's not even why.
    As a Fair Folk enthusiast who is utterly thrilled with the errata, I'm curious as to the cause for your frustration.

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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion: There's a God for that! Except for Sorcery, of course

    Quote Originally Posted by Ganurath View Post
    Close, but not quite. Those would be Sword-shaping actions, including but not limited to Sword-shaping attacks. Sword-shaping weapons, including but not limited to behemoths, are the tools by which such narratives are brought to bear: the stylus, the plot outline, and the moment of inspiration outside the gas station.
    Agreed. Still illustrates the possibility of using a sword as a behemoth.

    That first one could actually be Ring-shaping, depending on whether the lightning is coming from the weapon or the environment.
    If it's a feature of a behemoth, Ring isn't an option (variable gossamer cost pre-errata, not a mutation post-errata). If you're using Ring charms, you don't even *need* to rely on a Sword Grace / Behemoth. Transluscent Dream Sheathing Technology + Gossamer weapons = fun.

    Umm... How many dots of what sort of artifact are you using? I'm not sure where you're getting these numbers.
    The inital request was for a 4 dot behemoth. Which is 15 mutation points, plus the properties of a 1 or 2 dot artifact weapon with magical materials.

    I listed more than can be afforded with 14 points (an Assumption Form is required, after all), to allow for some customization and creativity.

    As a Fair Folk enthusiast who is utterly thrilled with the errata, I'm curious as to the cause for your frustration.

    I like a lot of the new charm options, and some of the clarifications are quite useful. But.


    • Mutation and Glamour Changes

      I appreciate the difference made between the two, and the introduction of inward / outward spells, which clarifies a lot. This is nice, and I'm happy. Losing a plethora of behemoth, oneiromancy, and oath options is very disappointing, however.

      Some things definitely had to go, but it feels like a bit too much has been pruned out. Such as Teeth of the World and Heart Stealing Kiss - monsters that command the elements or eat souls are extremely traditional tropes, and are no longer feasible.
    • Chancels

      A 1 dot chancel is a 1 dot artifact giving you 1800 square miles (3 waypoints, 30 mile diameter each) of entirely shapeable terrain. And it's portable. And you can respire in it.

      This completely destroys the point of the change to the rules for motes from stunts, and is vastly superior to a 1 dot freehold background (1 pennant, allowing its owner to spy on you. Or step into your chancel, engage arbitrary time, emerge with all motes and willpower at full). Not to mention the insane logistics options that it provides.

      Four Fair Folk. Two heroics (Silent Death and Noisy Doom), and two commoners (Porter and Carrier). Silent somehow gets to the Blessed Isle, or some other place deep within Creation. He has a chancel, containing Carrier (who belongs to Noisy) and an army. Noisy is in the furthest reaches of the Deep Wyld, with Porter (who belongs to Silent) and infinite armies.

      Silent brings forth his army, then gives his chancel to Carrier. Noisy summons Carrier back, then puts Carrier into the chancel, and gives the chancel to Porter after loading an army into it. Silent summons Porter, pulls out the army, puts Porter into the Chancel and gives it to Carrier. Repeat.
    • Glamour Resistance

      A 500 year old Fair Folk specialized in illusions and mind breaking is completely ineffective against Exalts with Willpower 8+, Integrity 4+ and Essence 3+. Whereas a purely combat focussed Fair Folk can still pose a threat.

      The same 500 year old illusion expert Fair Folk is as good as a recently spawned hobgoblin with a random illusion Charm. Even if the hobgoblin has slightly less brains than a rock, and no clue as to how people think.

      The same hobgoblin can use his illusion to utterly confound any mortal (except those with Willpower 10 and Integrity 5), no matter how incompetent he may be.

      Even if intimacies and motivations contribute, there is still no difference between newly spawned figments of the Wyld and potent masters of deception. Besides the GM arbitrarily decreeing that the latter somehow know your Intimacies and Motivations better.

      Also, everyone should be wearing a cold iron ring in Creation. It grants massive, blanket immunity without any need to interact. Once upon a time (pre-errata), you had to put on the cold iron goggles to see through an illusion, or shield yourself with a cold iron shield to deflect a blow. Now? Wear a ring, and you won't even realize there's anything going on.
    • Oaths

      Are now nearly useless. For the price of one Charm (and some gossamer, which is now cheap thanks to the revised Feeding Charms), you have 6 mutation points which you can turn on or off as you like. This would require at least 4 commited motes (out of not many) as an Oath, and require you stick to its terms.

      I'll grant that an oath granting only Fair Folk Charms with the Mutation keyword is an option. But then, to get 6 points worth of mutations, you're better off with three 1-dot oaths (3 motes commited) than one bigger oath. Which makes the larger oaths... less than useful.
    • Specifics

      Mostly annoyances at this level, but still.

      Emotion Weaving Style was insane. Agreed. Now it's useless - resisting it costs 1 Willpower, so you only employ it when your target is already out of willpower. At which point you may as well convince him to follow you and have his will broken the old way. Plus, cold iron. Insert similar grumbles about Beguilement and Undetectable Lie (aka "spend 1 willpower to ignore my blatant lie, which by fluff you would have believed and rationalized").

      I don't understand the hatred for Imposition of Law. Once upon a time, it worked against Excellencies, requiring creativity or an obviously magical effect to be bypassed. Now? Poof. I'd also like to know whether IoL with a weapon grants unlimited Parry DV or not. Though IoL 'Curing the Great Contagion' would have made for an excellent bargaining tool...

      If a charm is lost to Spirit Flaying Meditation, is access to the follow up charms lost as well? The Birth revision explicitly states that pre-requisites do not apply. There is no errata for this (and I want it as an oath, to consume the Assumption Charms of those sworn to me, or as a spell, to anihilate the Essence of those who look at it). A trifle, but it does allow Fair Folk to learn Celestial Martial Arts and be Unshaped (since only the Root of the Perfected Lotus prevents resuming Unshaped form).

      Glorious Hero Form not stacking means that it is no longer possible for commoners to be better at an attribute than their masters. Despite ancient Fair Folk forming the most comely Entertainers they can imagine, none of them will ever demonstrate unearthly beauty. I understand that stacking 5 points of dexterity is frowned upon, but that just means that mutations will be employed instead, to the same effect (or better - see Large).

      Shape Forged Servant and Behemoth Forging Meditation only grant mutation points, despite fluff describing them as being behemoth like. Can they grant Fair Folk Charms with the Mutation keyword? What is the limit on the mutation points granted to a Shape Forged Servant (3 points per gossamer * 1000 gossamer = trouble)? Can Behemoth Forging Meditation be used repeatedly to grant more mutations? Does it work on Exalts? Do Behemoths created with the charm require an Assumption Charm to exist in Creation?

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