Two Weapon Fighting

[Jesterface]

or 'Confusion over a simple matter'.

I remember there being something somewhere saying damage dealt by the off-hand weapon is reduced, however, I can't find it anywhere in the PHB, but looking at the stats for the half-dragon fighter, it's off-hand double-sword attack does less damage.

Can somebody clear this up for me? I know it's a simple rule, but I can't remember where I read this or if I had...

Cheers

~J

[Psyx]

Off-hand uses half str bonus instead of full bonus.

[Jesterface]

Ah, great, many thanks. I couldn't find the rules on that anywhere at all...

[Sir Swindle89]

I can only assume it would be in the cmobat section by that chart with all the to-hit panalties on it. (don't have a book here for page number)

[Sillycomic]

Actually, you would only use half your strength on your off hand attack if you are wielding a double weapon, or you were using a light weapon for your off hand attack.

In either of those cases, damage with that weapon uses only half strength.

However, you can use a one handed weapon as your off weapon attack, doing full strength damage, but you would take more penalties to hit (i think it would be -4/-4 if you had the Two Weapon Fighting Feat)

Most people use a double weapon, or a one handed weapon with a light weapon...in which case the off hand attack would only be at half strength damage.

Unless your GM lets you take the Pathfinder feat Double Slice. Then you get full Strength on both weapon attacks and you would also want to play Pathfinder cause it's awesome...

[Greenish]

Actually, you would only use half your strength on your off hand attack if you are wielding a double weapon, or you were using a light weapon for your off hand attack.

In either of those cases, damage with that weapon uses only half strength.

However, you can use a one handed weapon as your off weapon attack, doing full strength damage, but you would take more penalties to hit

That's not true. Off-hand weapons always add just half of your strength.

[Keld Denar]

Actually, you would only use half your strength on your off hand attack if you are wielding a double weapon, or you were using a light weapon for your off hand attack.

In either of those cases, damage with that weapon uses only half strength.

This part is correct, with the further clarification that if you use a double weapon, but only attack with one end of it, you actually get 1.5x str bonus since you are wielding it 2-handed. This is important if you only get a single attack (due to charging, AoOs, etc).

However, you can use a one handed weapon as your off weapon attack, doing full strength damage, but you would take more penalties to hit (i think it would be -4/-4 if you had the Two Weapon Fighting Feat)

This part is not correct. One-handed or light, offhand attacks almost always deal only 1/2 +Str damage. The only exception to this is a class feature of the Bloodclaw Master PrC. The only advantage a one-handed offhand has over a light offhand is the very slightly larger damage die, and more importantly that you get PA damage with a one-handed offhand weapon whereas you NEVER get PA damage on a light offhand unless its an Unarmed Strike.

Most people use a double weapon, or a one handed weapon with a light weapon...in which case the off hand attack would only be at half strength damage.

Or a matched pair of light weapons. This is useful if you have a feat like Imp Critical or Weapon Focus for your weapons. Not super relevant, but when you are TWFing, you often need every advantage you can fish up.

[Sillycomic]

I knew I was missing something. That is a shame. I might have actually thought about the -4/-4 if I got full strength on both attacks.

It's like they made two weapon fighting more difficult on purpose so people wouldn't use it.

[Keld Denar]

Well, I think the thing was that they didn't want anyone dealing more than 1.5x their +str bonus. If you use both hands on one weapon, you get 1.5x +str. If you use one hand on your mainhand weapon and one hand on your offhand weapon, you get 1x +str plus .5x +str = 1.5x +str.

The only problem with that is that they impose a -2 to hit for TWFing, require you to full attack (no movement, or at least no non-swift action movement), and make you pay twice as much to enchant your weapons as THF does.

[Greenish]

Well, I think the thing was that they didn't want anyone dealing more than 1.5x their +str bonus.

Then later some smart alec came up with Revenant Blade.

[Keld Denar]

Yea, and Shadow Blade (since only +Str is halved for offhands, they don't say anything about +Dex!).

Suppliments stepped outside of this paradigm because...its a dumb paradigm. Still, thats the rule they went with in the PHB, which has the flaw of being the first released content and thus the least benefitting from experience.