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    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    Benejeseret's Avatar

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    Default Do Animals Get Unarmed Strike?

    Do animals and other monsters get the (unmentioned) unarmed strike attack due to BAB if only natural attacks (such as a single bite) are listed in their entries.

    Now it would still be unarmed and thus provoke AoO and be non-lethal...but they 'should' still have them available, yes?

    Would they be proficient with it?

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    Ogre in the Playground
     
    SolithKnightGuy

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    Default Re: Do Animals Get Unarmed Strike?

    The Unarmed Strike listing mentions that all characters can use it. In the glossary the term character and creature are deemed synonymous, so an animal could use an Unarmed Strike.

    Animals (or Animal Types) are listed in the Glossary sections of the Monster Manuals as being 'only' proficient with Natural Weapons.


    Therefore, an animal can use an Unarmed Strike, but is both non-proficient (-4 attack), can only deal nonlethal damage, do a pathetic amount of damage (1d2 for small animal) and will look stupid doing so.

    ~

    Fun Fact: As per the PHB, Monks aren't proficient with Unarmed Strikes either!

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    Default Re: Do Animals Get Unarmed Strike?

    Quote Originally Posted by HunterOfJello View Post
    Fun Fact: As per the PHB, Monks aren't proficient with Unarmed Strikes either!
    And for good reason. With out the -4 penalty to attack they'd be overpowering and dominate the game.
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    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    Benejeseret's Avatar

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    Default Re: Do Animals Get Unarmed Strike?

    Advance a large/huge animal (Druid Companion or as a DM)

    Pick up Improved Unarmed Strike and Improved Grapple.

    Even with a -4 proficiency to hit the touch attack to grapple should be no problem.

    But, then the natural attack(s) becomes a secondary attack for -5 to hit and only 1/2 Str damage I believe...

    Still, an Elephant taking a full attack on a party as normal...but then finishing up with 2 (BAB+8/+3) grapples to grab and then pin an opponent by sitting on them it just a great concept. With Earth's Embrace the Elephant sitting on them deals 1d6+10+1d12 lethal damage a turn and they are pinned against a +30 grapple check on top of any of the normal natural attacks (at -5 to hit and 1/2 str granted)

    Edited
    Last edited by Benejeseret; 2010-12-05 at 06:13 PM.

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    Greenish's Avatar

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    Default Re: Do Animals Get Unarmed Strike?

    Quote Originally Posted by Benejeseret View Post
    But, then the natural attack(s) becomes an off hand attack for -5 to hit and only Str damage I believe...
    No, the natural attacks are not offhand attacks. They're natural attacks, and if used in combination with a manufactured weapon (or unarmed strike), they're secondary natural attacks, which is what you meant.

    Secondary natural attacks have -5 penalty to attack roll and only add 1/2 Strength bonus to damage.
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    Default Re: Do Animals Get Unarmed Strike?

    Furthermore

    Why wouldn't ANY animal with the improved grab ability or the constrict ability NOT use those unarmed attacks to further grapple checks for damage once they have the grapple?

    I bet a lot of DM's forget this. I know I have as I am just realizing this.

    A Brown Bear that Improve Grab auto-grapples a character would get one additional unarmed BAB attack (not included in the natural attack 'Full Attack' listings) to use toward a grapple to either pin or crush (1d4+8) the victim.

    Constrictor Snake, Giant gets one bite attack and 2 unarmed attacks/grapple constrict attacks per turn this way. I normally would have only swapped the bite for the constrict.

    Am I reading this out of context would this be the way these animals are supposed to be used?

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    Default Re: Do Animals Get Unarmed Strike?

    Quote Originally Posted by Benejeseret View Post
    Am I reading this out of context would this be the way these animals are supposed to be used?
    BAB gets you more grapple attempts:
    Quote Originally Posted by SRD
    When you are grappling (regardless of who started the grapple), you can perform any of the following actions. Some of these actions take the place of an attack (rather than being a standard action or a move action). If your base attack bonus allows you multiple attacks, you can attempt one of these actions in place of each of your attacks, but at successively lower base attack bonuses.
    Seems pretty cut and dried to me.
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