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  1. - Top - End - #811
    Ettin in the Playground
     
    Gez's Avatar

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    Default Re: Erfworld, The Thread.

    Quote Originally Posted by Justyn View Post
    Actually, no, it wasn't deleted: I moved it to a non-public subforum until Rob could review it and make the decision of deletion vs reinstatement himself
    Honestly, I think a better idea would have been to ban Rob from the forum so that he can concentrate on Getting Stuff Done(tm) instead of having to waste his time monitoring posts while his blood pressure increases to unhealthy levels.

    But that's just me.
    Quote Originally Posted by Midnight Roamer View Post
    I think he did the only morally acceptable thing by killing everyone.
    Hark! An avatar drawn by Kate Beaton!

  2. - Top - End - #812
    Ettin in the Playground
     
    OldWizardGuy

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    Default Re: Erfworld, The Thread.

    Quote Originally Posted by The Glyphstone View Post
    *dribbles bile out of the corner of his mouth*

    Hey, you're venturing into the lion's den of disgruntled ex-posters to clarify stuff, that's bravery in itself.
    Normally, I'd say it'd be a better idea to just open a topic (Or even a subforum) just for complaints or critiques, and handle it all there rather than letting it percolate through the rest of the site, but given the number of bans, this might be the only real option.

  3. - Top - End - #813
    Halfling in the Playground
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    Default Re: Erfworld, The Thread.

    Quote Originally Posted by Balder
    Moderation Notes

    There's a frequent poster on the forums who got a warning back in 2010, about derailing threads. A little while back, he was doing it again. So I gave him a 30 day ban, which recently expired.

    In a long PM he asked me for some clarifications, and this is what I wrote back. He gave me permission to post it.

    ================================================== ==============================================

    Okay, I appreciate your taking the time to cover that in depth. You're not someone I want to lose from the forums, because you do clearly care a lot and contribute a lot. But you also cause a lot of problems.

    Here's the gist of it. It's not about what you post, whether that's positive or negative [about Erfworld]. It's about whether what you post has a positive or a negative effect on the forum community.

    I'm not going to give you rules about what you can post. The only rule is "don't be a ****" and that's really only defined by how people are reacting to you. When a thread becomes all about contradicting what you're saying, then you're derailing it. Fair or not, that's the definition.

    [...]

    You [...] need to be more considerate of the feelings of other forum members and respectful in tone when you disagree with someone. Again, not a hard and fast rule. I don't make rules here; I just get rid of someone the second I'm sure they're more trouble than benefit. Deleting toxic posters does less damage than letting them stick around and turn off other people and drive them away from the community.

    You have been both a lot of trouble and also a lot of benefit on the boards. I don't want to lose you, but I need you to cause less trouble. This is a social problem, not a content-of-your-posts problem. That's all the guidance I can give you.

    On a side note, some of what I have written here might be worth re-posting. If I don't mention you by name, would you mind that?

    Thanks,
    Rob

    ================================================== ==============================================

    The part in italics may help you understand why I have been moderating with a chainsaw lately. It's a mistake to assume I care about fairness. Neither fairness nor the appearance of fairness is a goal here. This forum is for the shared enjoyment of the comic and your other interests and projects. Anything that harms that purpose doesn't belong here, and I don't have to put up with it.

    So threads and posters will keep being deleted. Yes, this annoys you. No, it's not doing more damage than giving the trolls free reign. People who contribute a lot to the Erfworld community have earned lot more slack in this, but don't set out to piss me off or cause an outbreak of mass butthurt. Don't make me think about whether you're more trouble to this place than benefit.

    Dealing with recent haters has wasted my time, cutting into my writing and productive time and making things that much worse. I am writing the comics that you will be reading in September and October, and they need my full attention to be worth reading.

    We'll be back on June 6 on a regular schedule that we will keep to for the rest of Book 2. There may or may not be any Book 0 updates before then. I'd suggest reading Girl Genius or Goblins or something. I like Wonderella and Basic Instructions, personally. Come back in a month.

    BTW this post is locked. If it occurs to you that it might be a good idea to start a thread to discuss this post, then you may need to read it again from the top.
    So there ya go, his locked response to the topic.

  4. - Top - End - #814
    Pixie in the Playground
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    Default Re: Erfworld, The Thread.

    I haven't posted in so many years I can't even remember which email I registered with so I just made a new one.

    I'd been following Erfworld since it started on this site and even had one of those silly "Erfworld Idiot" avatars. But the way Rob's been crapping on his fan base, I've dropped it permanently and highly regret ever donating any money to him. You'd think he was EA/BioWare or something.

  5. - Top - End - #815
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    Gwyn chan 'r Gwyll's Avatar

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    Default Re: Erfworld, The Thread.

    Rob appears not to understand the difference between "hater" and "troll" on the one hand, and "disillusioned fan with legitimate criticisms" on the other.
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    What. Is. This. Madness.

  6. - Top - End - #816
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    Default Re: Erfworld, The Thread.

    Dealing with recent haters has wasted my time, cutting into my writing and productive time and making things that much worse. I am writing the comics that you will be reading in September and October, and they need my full attention to be worth reading.
    See? He agrees with me.
    Quote Originally Posted by Midnight Roamer View Post
    I think he did the only morally acceptable thing by killing everyone.
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  7. - Top - End - #817
    Pixie in the Playground
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    Default Re: Erfworld, The Thread.

    Quote Originally Posted by Rob
    free reign
    The interminable delays and decay of the plot pacing are one thing, but now I will never read his writing again

  8. - Top - End - #818
    Ettin in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: Erfworld, The Thread.

    Quote Originally Posted by Gez View Post
    See? He agrees with me.
    Funny up to the bit you posted, he's said that he's focusing all of his effort on the dream website and the motion comic. During the facebook fiasco I specifically pointed out that working on a buffer would have been a better use of his time. More importantly, if he has a buffer set up to go out 4 months of regular updates for the main comic as he implies in that quote... why is he incapable of posting text updates for the prequel? I mean if the buffer is out that far, that's more than enough of a buffer to get by with, so why not focus his attention now that he's that far ahead on the main comic towards the prequel novel, whose updates which were never supposed to go on hiatus in the first place?

    My personal thought: He's bluffing. He's saying what he thinks we want to hear at this point to get people off his back and buy him time. Alternatively, he IS working that far in advance... doing basic story boarding at this point. He doesn't actually have the next 4 months worth of updates written, but he's working on the outline of the story that will cover June 6th through September of October. This translates to mostly the same thing, except it's being deceptive rather than outright lying about what he's doing, which now that I think of it seems more likely.
    Last edited by Seerow; 2012-05-05 at 07:21 PM.
    If my text is blue, I'm being sarcastic.But you already knew that, right?


  9. - Top - End - #819
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    ClericGirl

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    Default Re: Erfworld, The Thread.

    Remember that him storyboarding isnt the same as a buffer, since the art is done by someone else.
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  10. - Top - End - #820
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    Seerow's Avatar

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    Default Re: Erfworld, The Thread.

    Quote Originally Posted by VariaVespasa View Post
    Remember that him storyboarding isnt the same as a buffer, since the art is done by someone else.
    This is true. However the point is if he actually has comics written to last all the way through October, then his half of the work for those 4 months of comics is essentially done. For his purposes it is a buffer, even if it doesn't act as a buffer for updates, because if they are fully written he can pass the script to Xin and let it go.

    If that really were the case, he'd be stupid to not be writing/releasing prequel novel updates to quell irate fans. Which is why my best guess is he's got a rough outline stretching out that far, and he's just starting to try to fill in the details for that period. Especially since this is the first time we've heard mention at all of him working on writing. Up til this point the delay explanation has been all about him working on the new site, him working on the motion comic, him handling orders, etc. It just seems really strange he could be so 100% focused on those things, mention nothing but that for over a month, then suddenly go "Oh yeah I've also been writing, and am currently 4 months ahead in terms of writing comics". Especially when the reason for no text updates has been lack of time to dedicate to writing.
    If my text is blue, I'm being sarcastic.But you already knew that, right?


  11. - Top - End - #821
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    Default Re: Erfworld, The Thread.

    Quote Originally Posted by Balder
    We'll be back on June 6 on a regular schedule that we will keep to for the rest of Book 2. There may or may not be any Book 0 updates before then.
    Seems to me he's trying to buy some time with the promise of a regular schedule starting from June 6 (this alone is unclear, IMO: wasn't the delay due to Xin's personal problems? this kind of things rarely got a predictable ending).
    At least, he now admits that the whole text update can end here, incomplete.
    Do I contradict myself?
    Very well then I contradict myself. I am large, I contain multitudes. (W.Whitman)


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    Great analysis KA. I second all things you said
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    If I have a player using Paladin in the future I will direct them to this. Good job.
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  12. - Top - End - #822
    Pixie in the Playground
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    Default Re: Erfworld, The Thread.

    Well I believed it was largely a stall tactic as well, said at the time that, intentional or not, if you give yourself a deadline to begin one thing as well as continue another in parallel, they tend to sync up with the deadline applying to both.

    Kickstarter finished 3/15
    Prequel updates 3/14 and 3/21
    News updates 3/15, 3/30 (couple of unrelated ones in between)
    Official return announced 4/1
    Since, nothing official other than the mod post (or at least nothing that hasn't been purged/deleted)
    Last Kickstarter post 4/16

    So 10 day gap between update, return announcement and then another 16 to next news event, believe everyone was getting a bit antsy which helped spur along the announcement and then it started to fester a bit with a two week silence. Then a few days later there was a fb post about "trying" to get an update or two out which triggered the boil-over into the recent ... unpleasantness.

    Justyn - thank you for that, well written post and taking ownership of it. Been a mod way back, thankless job at the best of times usually, and at this point I doubt you'll see much bile spewing as most have I think decided to minimize contact til June. I for one appreciate the attempt you made though.

  13. - Top - End - #823
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    Othniel Edden's Avatar

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    Default Re: Erfworld, The Thread.

    I just want more comic, in whatever form. Be it written or drawn. If I don't know when that is, I can't read the comic. I don't like playing a guessing game.

  14. - Top - End - #824
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    OldWizardGuy

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    Default Re: Erfworld, The Thread.

    I'm seriously debating gnabbing one of my local artist friends, doing a 6-8 page Erfworld spinoff, and emailing it to Rob for use as filler.

    Not sure if it would come across as presumptious, or if it'd be helpful. Could always try it anyhow, I s'pose.

  15. - Top - End - #825
    Eldritch Horror in the Playground Moderator
     
    The Glyphstone's Avatar

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    Default Re: Erfworld, The Thread.

    It's worth a try, but don't do any work for it until you get an okay, and probably don't expect that okay. Considering how sensitive Rob is being about any commentary on the updates or lack thereof, a not-so-implicit offer to do his job for him could go over very poorly.
    Quote Originally Posted by GungHo, on Battletech
    The Atlas is also goofy but it has that whole "Stay Puft Marshmallow Man" menacing smile thing going for it. The guy who drew that one up was obviously taken to the Nutcracker when he was a child... and he was screaming in terror the entire time.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Enterti, Cogidubnus
    Glyphstone, out of all the playground I think you scare me the most...
    Quote Originally Posted by Zombimode
    Glyphstone, you are an evil person :D

  16. - Top - End - #826
    Pixie in the Playground
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    Default Re: Erfworld, The Thread.

    Yeah, imagine a C&D would arrive pretty quickly.

    And there was 'news' of a sort. Apparently whoever Maggie was to be declined so now not actually auditioning anyone specifically for that part... perhaps will be revisited. And based on the posts I've seen none have even gotten to Rob for evaluation as yet but all that has been only in response to a direct question about auditions on the board or facebook.

    Actually volunteered information for an official update... not so much of that

  17. - Top - End - #827
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    Default Re: Erfworld, The Thread.

    Well, it's not that uncommon for a webcomic to get fans to do filler comics so there will be something to put up when the author is busy for whatever reason...

    But somehow I can't picture Erfworld doing it. And part of the reason I can't, I think, is because at heart I don't think its author really wants to be doing a webcomic -- don't get me wrong, he wants to be doing a comic, but the website part isn't his reason for doing it, just the method he happens to use to publish. That's why all of these issues come up, because he has a huge list of other Erfworld-related things he'd rather be doing as opposed to regularly updating the main page. To him, the webcomic medium is just a way of getting his comic out there because other publication methods aren't viable -- like I've said for a while, Erfworld really feels like it's written with the final, published version in mind rather than with how it looks on the web.

    I mean, maybe I'm wrong, but even if I'm right, it's not like there's anything wrong with that. It also explains why there's this culture shock between fans who feel that the most important thing is to get something (anything) up on the frontpage regularly to hold your web audience, and his ultimate goals, which are more focused on getting the entire comic (and related media) out there eventually in a published form with the best quality he can. That's also why he's focused so hard on the animated version which, to him, is a big part of the point, even if most fans here probably care more about regular updates of some kind.

    (I'm taking what he says at face value and assuming he has been using this time to set up a buffer of scripts, because to me, it makes perfect sense -- he cares more about the long-term of the comic and doesn't really care about putting something up on the main page or keeping fans up to date the way a "typical" webcomic would. As far as he's concerned, as long as the entire comic gets completed to his quality standards and out there in the long run, he's succeeded..)
    Last edited by Aquillion; 2012-05-08 at 04:42 PM.

  18. - Top - End - #828
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    Default Re: Erfworld, The Thread.

    Quote Originally Posted by hightower2 View Post
    Yeah, imagine a C&D would arrive pretty quickly.

    And there was 'news' of a sort. Apparently whoever Maggie was to be declined so now not actually auditioning anyone specifically for that part... perhaps will be revisited. And based on the posts I've seen none have even gotten to Rob for evaluation as yet but all that has been only in response to a direct question about auditions on the board or facebook.

    Actually volunteered information for an official update... not so much of that
    As a forward, I'm not speaking as a mod here, just to make that clear: I highly doubt that any C&D orders will be given out by Rob, unless you start a website and start trying to sell your spinoff all on your own. The last time I talked to Rob about it, and in fact it's still written at the bottom of the website, that the Creative Commons Noncommercial Share Alike licence he started the comic was still what it was being published under.
    I seem to have the ability to misinterpret the most obvious of meanings and to completely miss the points of statements for no obvious reason. Just a warning.

  19. - Top - End - #829
    Pixie in the Playground
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    Default Re: Erfworld, The Thread.

    well, I suppose for 'non-canon' work you're right though i figured the license applied more to non-story related items like wallpapers and such. I read it as an attempt to actually continue a story thread 'officially' for some reason. long day, misread, carry on.

  20. - Top - End - #830
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    OldWizardGuy

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    Default Re: Erfworld, The Thread.

    Righty o, then, I'll get cracking on the writing. Artist is on board, and delving the erfworld archives to get a feel for the style.
    Last edited by Acanous; 2012-05-11 at 05:54 AM.

  21. - Top - End - #831
    Eldritch Horror in the Playground Moderator
     
    The Glyphstone's Avatar

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    Default Re: Erfworld, The Thread.

    You should still contact Rob to see if he'll even go for it as 'official' filler (my gut says no very loudly). If he says no, you can post it here for us to enjoy or something though.
    Quote Originally Posted by GungHo, on Battletech
    The Atlas is also goofy but it has that whole "Stay Puft Marshmallow Man" menacing smile thing going for it. The guy who drew that one up was obviously taken to the Nutcracker when he was a child... and he was screaming in terror the entire time.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Enterti, Cogidubnus
    Glyphstone, out of all the playground I think you scare me the most...
    Quote Originally Posted by Zombimode
    Glyphstone, you are an evil person :D

  22. - Top - End - #832
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    OldWizardGuy

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    Default Re: Erfworld, The Thread.

    once I get a rough copy of the script done I'll give him a holler. No point in bugging him if I don't have something for him to look at.

    So far, I have a basic plot, a character or four, and I know there will be a dance-fight.
    Of course, I don't expect it to be canon (Though it'd be kinda cool if it was) but I do expect it'll end up on the site. If he gives it a no to both, I'll post it here.

  23. - Top - End - #833
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    Default Re: Erfworld, The Thread.

    You could post it in the erf wiki or forums at least
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  24. - Top - End - #834
    Eldritch Horror in the Playground Moderator
     
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    Default Re: Erfworld, The Thread.

    Quote Originally Posted by Doran View Post
    You could post it in the erf wiki or forums at least
    Not if it then gets deleted. The main reason I can see Rob would turn down the request is the feeling that offers for fan filler = he's not updating fast enough, which is causing this whole crazy banstorm in the first place. Posting it on the wiki or forum (latter more than the former) would just see an equally speedy deletion.
    Quote Originally Posted by GungHo, on Battletech
    The Atlas is also goofy but it has that whole "Stay Puft Marshmallow Man" menacing smile thing going for it. The guy who drew that one up was obviously taken to the Nutcracker when he was a child... and he was screaming in terror the entire time.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Enterti, Cogidubnus
    Glyphstone, out of all the playground I think you scare me the most...
    Quote Originally Posted by Zombimode
    Glyphstone, you are an evil person :D

  25. - Top - End - #835
    Pixie in the Playground
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    Default Re: Erfworld, The Thread.

    {Scrubbed}
    Last edited by averagejoe; 2012-05-18 at 04:52 PM.

  26. - Top - End - #836
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    Default Re: Erfworld, The Thread.

    I understand the disappointment, but it's a pretty harsh way to put it down...
    Do I contradict myself?
    Very well then I contradict myself. I am large, I contain multitudes. (W.Whitman)


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  27. - Top - End - #837
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    Aquillion's Avatar

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    Default Re: Erfworld, The Thread.

    Honestly, I just recommend forgetting about Erfworld for a while, and "rediscovering" it sometime in the distant future when it's complete, then reading it then. I suspect you'll have more fun with it that way.

  28. - Top - End - #838
    Pixie in the Playground
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    Default Re: Erfworld, The Thread.

    Disappointed, yes. Harsh, perhaps. Wrong... think the jury is still out.

    Much like Aquillion I'm taking a bit of a break since the pattern of no-news is holding steady. I will return to the comic in June or whenever something changes. But if the best that gets committed to there is "once a week, sometime, maybe" then I will likely join Aquillion in an extended leave of absence.

    Luckily I'll have D3 to occupy my time for the next while anyway.

  29. - Top - End - #839
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    Default Re: Erfworld, The Thread.

    Perhaps we could also mention similar comics to tide us over until Erfworld resumes?

    I've been reading Tower of God recently, and it has some similarities (an ordinary-seeming outsider with supposedly world-shattering potential in a strange world whose rules are gradually revealed as the story progresses; like Erfworld, the world itself is as much a focus of the story as the supposedly main character.)

  30. - Top - End - #840

    Default Re: Erfworld, The Thread.

    {Scrubbed}
    Last edited by averagejoe; 2012-05-18 at 04:19 PM.

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