So, how bad of an idea is this....

[druid91]

I'm running a game of starwars saga

I've agreed to let a second level scoundrel have a stripped down capital ship that he may upgrade over the course of the campaign.

By stripped down I mean no weapons. At all.

He will be able to slowly purchase weapons for it, over the course of the campaign.

Note: I'd like to take the time to clarify, he is not getting it for free, in fact he is spending most of his money on it. This is assuming he wins at gambling. otherwise he won't have enough money.

[Comet]

Sounds great to me.

[gbprime]

Hey, owning your own ship can be a real headache, especially one that expensive to crew and operate. Add to it the fact that this may be an old, "demilitarized" battlewagon, and you're looking at a logistical nightmare. The owner is going to have to keep busy finding ways to pay for it all, and that might mean a lot of plot-related favors and errands.

Play that up, and the player may wish he never got his hands on the thing.

[Kylarra]

Beyond the logistics of just crewing and maintaining it, a stripped down capital ship with no weapons is just asking to be taken from you by anyone with sufficient money to outfit it.

[Tokuhara]

You do not have a bad idea. I had a bad idea:

I am playing a Jawa Bounty Hunter who carries a flechette rifle

[druid91]

You do not have a bad idea. I had a bad idea:

I am playing a Jawa Bounty Hunter who carries a flechette rifle

Why is this a bad Idea?

[Velaryon]

Hey, owning your own ship can be a real headache, especially one that expensive to crew and operate. Add to it the fact that this may be an old, "demilitarized" battlewagon, and you're looking at a logistical nightmare. The owner is going to have to keep busy finding ways to pay for it all, and that might mean a lot of plot-related favors and errands.

Play that up, and the player may wish he never got his hands on the thing.

I think it's very important to play up the logistics of maintaining a capital ship under private ownership. If you don't do this, then essentially what you have done is given the player a freighter with unlimited storage capacity and the capacity to be upgraded as a significant threat in space combat as soon as the party comes into money for the first time (and don't they always?)

Aside from the vast numbers of crew and droids required to run a capital ship, there are also lots of other matters to consider:

-Constant maintenance expenses. Got to replace all the light bulbs, keep the computers working, the doors opening and closing right, the hull in good repair, etc.
-Food and other supplies for your crew, enough to keep them from seeking employment elsewhere.
-Security measures so the ship isn't boarded or stolen by pirates the first time you go anywhere.
-Shuttles for going planetside since most capital ships cannot land, and even those that can need an awfully big place to dock.
-Maybe a squad of fighters to field against enemy fighters in case of an attack. In this case, you need pilots for the fighters as well.


If you as GM make these restrictions so harsh that it overwhelms the story and consumes the character's attention, then you might as well not do it at all. But on the other hand, if you ignore all these things then all sense of realism is lost and the player is handed a very powerful and useful tool at almost no cost.

[Gamer Girl]

It depends on your game.


1.Problem one-the ship becomes the plot. The whole game revolves around the ship. He has to get it fuel and crew and weapons. You might get two nice adventures out of getting ship supplies, but the 16th adventure to do so will get repetitive.

2.Problem two-the ship flies over the plots. Depending on your plots, the ship can be way too powerful. They need to get to the 3rd moon of the Dok system..no problem they have a ship. They need to get into the bad guys base...no problem, just blast it from orbit.

3.Problem three-the ship becomes a loadstone. The character has to guard the ship 24/7. Everyone and everything tries to take the ship from him. He can't even go on an adventure without worrying about the ship.

4.Problem four-the ship causes the plot to derail. The ship takes some damage, and suddenly the character wants to zip off to the nearest safe place and fix it...derailing the plot. This is worse when it's just a random encounter type damage.

5.Problem five-the ship becomes a carryall. They load up the ship with tons and tons of stuff, so that no matter where they are they have tons of stuff with them.

[true_shinken]

While this looks like a good idea for me, I'd be careful not to make the campaign gravitate around that.
Or, if you group is OK with it, build the whole campaign around it.

[druid91]

I think it's very important to play up the logistics of maintaining a capital ship under private ownership. If you don't do this, then essentially what you have done is given the player a freighter with unlimited storage capacity and the capacity to be upgraded as a significant threat in space combat as soon as the party comes into money for the first time (and don't they always?)

Aside from the vast numbers of crew and droids required to run a capital ship, there are also lots of other matters to consider:

-Constant maintenance expenses. Got to replace all the light bulbs, keep the computers working, the doors opening and closing right, the hull in good repair, etc.
-Food and other supplies for your crew, enough to keep them from seeking employment elsewhere.
-Security measures so the ship isn't boarded or stolen by pirates the first time you go anywhere.
-Shuttles for going planetside since most capital ships cannot land, and even those that can need an awfully big place to dock.
-Maybe a squad of fighters to field against enemy fighters in case of an attack. In this case, you need pilots for the fighters as well.


If you as GM make these restrictions so harsh that it overwhelms the story and consumes the character's attention, then you might as well not do it at all. But on the other hand, if you ignore all these things then all sense of realism is lost and the player is handed a very powerful and useful tool at almost no cost.

So what would you suggest, An Idea I had was to take a flat percentage of his portion of the money and use that for basic upkeep.

For crew he was planning on going with droids. Basically his end goal is to have a droid army, and use the ship as a home base of sorts.

Shuttles and fighters seem like the sort of thing he'd have to buy extra. Maybe a small discount for buying in bulk. Fortunately one of the other players wants and A-wing, so they won't be completely fighter-less.

A jedi in an A-wing is a dangerous thing.

It depends on your game.


1.Problem one-the ship becomes the plot. The whole game revolves around the ship. He has to get it fuel and crew and weapons. You might get two nice adventures out of getting ship supplies, but the 16th adventure to do so will get repetitive.

2.Problem two-the ship flies over the plots. Depending on your plots, the ship can be way too powerful. They need to get to the 3rd moon of the Dok system..no problem they have a ship. They need to get into the bad guys base...no problem, just blast it from orbit.

3.Problem three-the ship becomes a loadstone. The character has to guard the ship 24/7. Everyone and everything tries to take the ship from him. He can't even go on an adventure without worrying about the ship.

4.Problem four-the ship causes the plot to derail. The ship takes some damage, and suddenly the character wants to zip off to the nearest safe place and fix it...derailing the plot. This is worse when it's just a random encounter type damage.

5.Problem five-the ship becomes a carryall. They load up the ship with tons and tons of stuff, so that no matter where they are they have tons of stuff with them.

1: This will mostly be handled off-screen.

2: It will take a while before "blast the base from orbit" becomes an option. And when it does? Bases can shoot back.

3: This won't be much of a problem. I don't plan on doing this.

4:For him? the nearest safe place is probably just out of weapons range. And if the ship is taking damage, I plan on having the PC's be in a bad situation, where going off to lick your wounds and plot is a very good Idea.

5: And this is a problem how? They still need to buy stuff, having a lot of space to store it doesn't seem that bad to me.

[gbprime]

So what would you suggest, An Idea I had was to take a flat percentage of his portion of the money and use that for basic upkeep.

Oh it'll be more than a flat percentage. Remember, if a tramp freighter takes 10,000 credits to overhaul, then a junker of a cruiser is gonna take 150,000 ... if you're lucky. And remember that when this thing was in service, it took 100 techs and engineers plus a few hundred droids just to keep it operational. Well you're nearly 100 engineers shy of that and each droid costs you 5,000 credits to buy...

And the thing is old. You know how much extra maintenance old cars need...

[druid91]

The percentage was for things to keep it running.

And yes I anticipate that this is going to be his main bit of money.

For specifics he wants a lucrehulk. Mainly so he can land the central sphere on the planet.

[Dr.Epic]

I don't see anything wrong with it.

[hamishspence]

The Errant Venture is a good example of this at the most extreme level.

That ship (most weapons stripped off since civilians aren't allowed to own ships that are that well armed) is an Imperial Star Destroyer.

I'm guessing that's a bit bigger than the capital ship you have in mind though.

[Zuljita]

This is obviously a player dependent issue, but ive known players who would use the fact that they own the ship as a way to push other players around. If its not an issue in your game then great! if it could be, consider contriving a scenario where more than one person owns a portion of the ship. Easy options are that it was inherited from a mutual acquaintance who split it, or that someone else was fronting some of his seed money when he won it in a card game.

[PairO'Dice Lost]

As hamishspence said, the adventures of the Errant Venture provide a good example of what a private owner of a capital ship has to go through. It'll probably end up playing a major part in the campaign whether the player wants it to or not, so be ready for that.

[druid91]

This is obviously a player dependent issue, but ive known players who would use the fact that they own the ship as a way to push other players around. If its not an issue in your game then great! if it could be, consider contriving a scenario where more than one person owns a portion of the ship. Easy options are that it was inherited from a mutual acquaintance who split it, or that someone else was fronting some of his seed money when he won it in a card game.

How could he push them around? So far it looks like each of the players will have their own ship, if you mean by "my ship I choose where it goes". Admittedly I haven't heard back from one, but still.

Of course none of the others want a lucrehulk... but still each seems to have a way of getting around.

For those who don't know what a lucrehulk is...

Spoiler

Show

[gbprime]

So far it looks like each of the players will have their own ship

Okay, then here's a question... if everyone has their own ship, what do the players ever do TOGETHER?

Recall that in this genre, any time the PC's are on separate ships, they split up.

[Zuljita]

you mean by "my ship I choose where it goes". Admittedly I haven't heard back from one, but still.

Thats kind of what i meant. or "get off my ship because you did something i dont like"
in the circumstance of everyone having their own ship, I agree with the above question about group cohesion then, if everyone can just fly off in their own vehicles, whats to keep em together? Being invested in the ship would keep everyone close even if they have their own transportation.

These are potential issues depending on your players and what they do with what you give them. If you know your group well enough to be confident this isnt a problem, then no worries!

[druid91]

Considering so far the other ship is a fighter, It's more comfortable to stick with the capital ship. And staying together will probably be a good idea considering they will most likely end up on the same guys payroll.


EDIT: that and one's new to this and will probably take any suggestions I give her.

[gbprime]

EDIT: that and one's new to this and will probably take any suggestions I give her.

Especially if you hold up 2 fingers and wave your hand when you say it.

[druid91]

Especially if you hold up 2 fingers and wave your hand when you say it.

What? I don't get it...

[PairO'Dice Lost]

What? I don't get it...

*waves hand*

You don't need to get it.

[druid91]

*facepalm*

I feel like a dunce now.

[PairO'Dice Lost]

*waves hand*

You don't need to feel like a dunce.

[druid91]

As a great manalien once said "Mind tricks don't work on me... Only money."