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2011-03-04, 08:35 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: General Exalted Discussion II: No Longer Mortal
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2011-03-04, 10:23 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: General Exalted Discussion II: No Longer Mortal
Heck, you could pull it off in Visio or other flowcharting software.
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2011-03-04, 10:28 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: General Exalted Discussion II: No Longer Mortal
He fears his fate too much, and his reward is small, who will not put it to the touch, to win or lose it all.
-James Graham, 1st Marquess of Montrose
Satomi by Elagune
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2011-03-05, 12:48 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: General Exalted Discussion II: No Longer Mortal
When I design Charm trees, I use UMLet. It's free and easy to use. It's made for UML diagrams, but you can use it for practically anything where you connect boxes with arrows.
Last edited by Kyeudo; 2011-03-05 at 12:49 AM.
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Avatar by Kymme
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2011-03-05, 07:58 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: General Exalted Discussion II: No Longer Mortal
I have a few newbish questions for the community:
What exactly does aggravated damage do that lethal doesn't?
How do unnatural mental influence charms work at all? It seems like charms like Vanishing from the Mind's Eye are just terrible, because a guard can just spend 4 willpower and see you with no difficulty. Similarly, why do social charms ever work? Do opponents just spend willpower until one of them caves?
If one can't wear armor (because of Snake Style of something similar) how does one generally compensate?
Sorcery seems terrible. Are there any good fixes? (apart from getting more splatbooks)
Grand Goremauls seem incredibly overpowered. Is this just me?
And last but not least, how the hell does two-weapon fighting work? I can't seem to find any rules on it.
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2011-03-05, 08:07 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Jun 2009
Re: General Exalted Discussion II: No Longer Mortal
Bypass natural soak, heal slowly, and possibly scar even an Exalt
How do unnatural mental influence charms work at all? It seems like charms like Vanishing from the Mind's Eye are just terrible, because a guard can just spend 4 willpower and see you with no difficulty. Similarly, why do social charms ever work? Do opponents just spend willpower until one of them caves?
If one can't wear armor (because of Snake Style of something similar) how does one generally compensate?
Sorcery seems terrible. Are there any good fixes? (apart from getting more splatbooks)
Grand Goremauls seem incredibly overpowered. Is this just me?
And last but not least, how the hell does two-weapon fighting work? I can't seem to find any rules on it.
But, mostly, it's just to look nice.
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2011-03-05, 08:13 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Sep 2009
Re: General Exalted Discussion II: No Longer Mortal
Well, there are charms that help mitigate flurry penalties. Or get free reflexive attacks.
Also, general guidelines on NPC willpower expenditure=Borgstroms Suggestions On Social Combat
Edit: also, there are off hand penalties, and some other things that make attacking with both hands harder.Last edited by Tavar; 2011-03-05 at 08:14 PM.
He fears his fate too much, and his reward is small, who will not put it to the touch, to win or lose it all.
-James Graham, 1st Marquess of Montrose
Satomi by Elagune
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2011-03-05, 08:20 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: General Exalted Discussion II: No Longer Mortal
1. Aggravated damage is much harder to soak (only more advanced charms), and heals more slowly.
2. Depends on ST, from what I can tell. Intense social combat does tend to boil down to wearing down opponent's WP, and requires multiple social combat charms to eat it up (or just a prolonged "mundane" discussion, which can accomplish the same, if your dicepool is large enough). As to spending willpower to overcome non-social combat charms - it's quite tricky to get it right. Will an ordinary guard even have 4 WP (mook houserules)? Will he be willing to spend it all? What does this expenditure represent? etc. Social combat and unnatural mental influences tend to rely heavily on a particular ST's houserules to work smoothly.
3. Sorcery (especially terrestrial circle) is mostly about utility spells, and it's indeed quite limited, though you can just start researching your own spells (much like charms). The power lies in being able to summon demons and spirits to do your bidding (played extensively and smartly enough, it can effectively grant you a dozen or two of demonic henchmen and retinue with a plethora of powers at your disposal).
4. Dodge charms, Resistance charms, Dodge charms, Melee (parrying), and Dodge charms. In fact, relying on soak, unless you can get it into thirties at least, is likely to get you killed very quickly. And don't forget to invest in Dodge charms.
5. Grand Goremauls are massively powerful, but - as most of artifacts in this "price range" - they're just big sticks for hitting people. They will kill any mortal, but any worthy opponent worth his salt will be able to deal with it one way or another, and it will come down to charms, rather than the sheer power of your weapon.
6. Dual wielding comes down to having a -2 offhand penalty (external) for attacks made with the other hand, and otherwise, it comes down to rate (effectively double rate for identical weapons, or you can attack with different weapons up to their rate). Occasionally wielding paired weapons allows you to attack even without that penalty, meaning you simply double the rate. You're unlikely to fully use the rate, since the more attacks you make, the less accurate they are, and the more exposed you become yourself (unless you build your character around flurries and have charms to make it workable rather than suicidal).
Edit: night caste'd :PLast edited by MickJay; 2011-03-05 at 08:22 PM.
LGBTitP
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2011-03-05, 08:28 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Sep 2009
Re: General Exalted Discussion II: No Longer Mortal
Even soak in the thirties isn't going to save you from minimum damage ping. And that damage will add up, especially if the person has some flurry charms. For example, Solar using a couple free reflexive attacks+Flurrying for max with penalty reducers. Pretty much every attack was reduced to minimum, but he still wore down about half of the Storm Spirit's health levels.
He fears his fate too much, and his reward is small, who will not put it to the touch, to win or lose it all.
-James Graham, 1st Marquess of Montrose
Satomi by Elagune
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2011-03-05, 08:44 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: General Exalted Discussion II: No Longer Mortal
Fair point - although high Hardness might help to negate much of that (it's still very unreliable, though, and an opponent's lucky roll can still kill you). Again, you need those flurry breaking charms (i.e., Dodge ).
Last edited by MickJay; 2011-03-05 at 09:22 PM.
LGBTitP
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2011-03-05, 08:45 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: General Exalted Discussion II: No Longer Mortal
Hardness is like damage reduction in DnD(at least, damage reduction that Players have access to); not high enough to matter, 9 times out of 10.
He fears his fate too much, and his reward is small, who will not put it to the touch, to win or lose it all.
-James Graham, 1st Marquess of Montrose
Satomi by Elagune
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2011-03-05, 09:00 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Sep 2007
Re: General Exalted Discussion II: No Longer Mortal
Lunars have a charm that sets their hardness to their non-armor Soak. Oddly enough, it branches off the armor creating Charm.
But with enough internal soak, a Lunar could use Hardness against just about anything.
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2011-03-05, 09:06 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Sep 2009
Re: General Exalted Discussion II: No Longer Mortal
Really? What's the charms name?
And, you're right, there are ways to get it high enough. Just not common, and not in the core book.He fears his fate too much, and his reward is small, who will not put it to the touch, to win or lose it all.
-James Graham, 1st Marquess of Montrose
Satomi by Elagune
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2011-03-05, 09:43 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Sep 2007
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2011-03-05, 10:28 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: General Exalted Discussion II: No Longer Mortal
All right, I get pretty much everything else, but I'm still having some trouble with this. How the hell does a guard, or even a group of Dragon-Blooded, know whether to spend the Willpower or not? I'm just not seeing it. It's not like someone sees you, weighs out the consequences of spending willpower or not, and then chooses. And what does spending Willpower even mean to normal people?
What do people think of a houserule that requires people to roll something like, maybe, (Appropriate Virtue (normally conviction) + Essence + modifiers for motivation/intimacy) with a difficulty of the amount of willpower they want to spend?
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2011-03-05, 10:30 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: General Exalted Discussion II: No Longer Mortal
Last edited by Tavar; 2011-03-05 at 10:30 PM.
He fears his fate too much, and his reward is small, who will not put it to the touch, to win or lose it all.
-James Graham, 1st Marquess of Montrose
Satomi by Elagune
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2011-03-05, 10:38 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Aug 2010
Re: General Exalted Discussion II: No Longer Mortal
I have read it, but I still don't understand the reasoning behind it. How does the guard know that exalt is setting up a deathtrap in the example? What are the negative impacts of spending willpower?
I also don't like the fact that, unless one's motivation is threatened, there is literally no chance of resisting the effect. And the fact that it's entirely based on motivation, requiring an ST to give every extra and their grandmother a motivation.
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2011-03-05, 10:48 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: General Exalted Discussion II: No Longer Mortal
Here's how it works. The Guard does see what's actually going on. But the UMI makes it so that consciously, he doesn't. Unconsciously, though, he might spends Willpower, if his subconscious felt in necessary.
Technically, there are none, but Willpower is a PC centric mechanic. Giving NPC's the same access to it is bad design, so the ST is supposed to intentionally limit their use of it.
That's the point of the system. Unless something is violating you're core beliefs, then it's easy to persuade you(assuming NPC's).
Also, every guard/extra should have a motivation. But, extra's generally have the same one; survive/enjoy life. Maybe 'follow X's orders' for extremely loyal people/fanatics. That's why they're extras. And almost every named NPC must have one, because motivations are so entwined with the rules.He fears his fate too much, and his reward is small, who will not put it to the touch, to win or lose it all.
-James Graham, 1st Marquess of Montrose
Satomi by Elagune
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2011-03-05, 10:49 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Sep 2007
Re: General Exalted Discussion II: No Longer Mortal
Everyone has a Motivation. Unless it's important or otherwise game challenging, it usually is some variation on "Ensure the survival and well being of myself and my family"
Therefore that 4 willpower expenditure? Metagame, what are the odds of the Exalt killing the mortal, versus the odds of losing out on their job?
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2011-03-05, 10:52 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: General Exalted Discussion II: No Longer Mortal
I like it, because it forces you to use mental invisibility charms to do something besides surprise attack a guy. Even if it's as simple as hiding from his buddies, because they don't care enough about him to spend the wp, he's just an Intimacy.
Also note that threatening their high virtues is ~4wp by that system. If you're about to shank his kid, an extra with Compassion 3+ can (can, not will) get his great, heroic moment, pull every last bit of willpower he has, become consciously aware of your existence and try to stop you. And then die because he's an extra facing an Exalted, but at least he tried.Last edited by Guancyto; 2011-03-05 at 10:55 PM.
Rider avatar by Elder Tsofu
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2011-03-05, 11:01 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: General Exalted Discussion II: No Longer Mortal
With that specific charm, the "invisibility" effect works by you literally convincing the people around you that they don't see you. Spending the Willpower allows you to ignore every rational instinct that tells you that nothing is there.
What are the negative impacts of spending willpower?
I also don't like the fact that, unless one's motivation is threatened, there is literally no chance of resisting the effect. And the fact that it's entirely based on motivation, requiring an ST to give every extra and their grandmother a motivation.
And Motivations are simple things for anything below heroic mortal level. You can assume that something along the lines of "enjoy my life" is the Motivation of everyone that's not noteworthy.Awesome Cyborg Doom Monkey avatar by Lord Fullbladder, Master of Goblins. Offer up your robo-bananas to him.
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2011-03-05, 11:01 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: General Exalted Discussion II: No Longer Mortal
If an Extra and the Exalted is a Day caste about to shank his kid, I'm sensing a Solar Exaltation about to happen. :P
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2011-03-05, 11:08 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: General Exalted Discussion II: No Longer Mortal
You wouldn't be an extra if you have the potential to Exalt, but yeah.
Also, that reminds me of something. Are there any concrete rules on what happens in the moments after someone Exalts? Unless I'm completely misremembering, the Exalt gets a big surge of power when they first Exalt as the Exaltation releases a huge amount of energy through them. Are there rules for this anywhere, or even a developer post somewhere? Exalted generally tries (succeeding is another issue) to make everything in the backstory playable (which is why I hate the Three Spheres Cataclysm with a burning passion, but again, another issue).
I could be having a brainfart on this, though.Awesome Cyborg Doom Monkey avatar by Lord Fullbladder, Master of Goblins. Offer up your robo-bananas to him.
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2011-03-05, 11:32 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: General Exalted Discussion II: No Longer Mortal
The only concrete thing I can remember is that Exalting heals all the wounds you currently have.
The name is "tonberrian", even when it begins a sentence. It's magic, I ain't gotta 'splain why.
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2011-03-06, 12:15 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: General Exalted Discussion II: No Longer Mortal
Well, arguably, an NPC stops being an extra when they start up with the heroics thing.
Heh, Lunar social experiment idea: A Lunar, hearing of the return of the Solars, attempts to maximize the chances of Solars exalting in his pet kingdom by doing everything he can to drive each and every one of the mortals in his kingdom to their limits - and beyond - while trying not to kill them outright.
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2011-03-06, 02:17 AM (ISO 8601)
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2011-03-06, 03:07 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: General Exalted Discussion II: No Longer Mortal
I've always taken the idea that, for that one glorious scene, a new Celestial Exalt is a hell of a lot more powerful than a starting one (more essence, charms, etc). The righteous power surge fades down after that scene, meaning they have to work back up to that wondrous level if they want to a taste of that sheer power again.
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2011-03-06, 05:56 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: General Exalted Discussion II: No Longer Mortal
What exactly is the Overdrive system? Where I can read about it?
English isn't my native. Sorry for all misunderstandings.
Warning: This user is a powerplayer and a TYPE-Lunatic
Familiar summons YOU avatar by happyturtle
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2011-03-06, 06:01 AM (ISO 8601)
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2011-03-06, 06:39 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: General Exalted Discussion II: No Longer Mortal