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  1. - Top - End - #241
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    Default Re: LGBTAitp - Part Twelve

    Quote Originally Posted by Danne View Post
    @unsorta and raynedragon: I'm not particularly close to my cousin, is the thing. We never see each other outside of family events, and even that is growing less frequent because she moved to Florida and has a full time job that won't grant her much vacation time (seriously, they wouldn't let her come up for our grandfather's funeral ). I have no idea what her fiancé even looks like. Asking would require a phonecall, and I'm a terrified of telephones, and I'm not out to her (or anyone IRL) making it even more awkward. I don't think I could handle it.
    You could email her? Or just mail her, if need be. Just find some way to communicate her your position, and why you are making your arguments. If she still wants you to wear a dress, there isn't much you can do. If she is fine with you wearing whatever the heck you want, then your mother can't really tell her otherwise, unless she is paying for it.

    Do you both have a facebook account? That could help.
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  2. - Top - End - #242
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    Default Re: LGBTAitp - Part Twelve

    Well, I don't want to be "that guy," but it's a bit hard to control the stray thoughts that go through my mind. I'm not saying I don't trust him... he's really given me absolutely every reason to trust him (known him for over a year before going out). He's just got a lot more experience than me from both genders, and I guess it makes me a little intimidated, to be honest.
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    Default Re: LGBTAitp - Part Twelve

    Eh, people can't help what they think, but they can help what they do. It would hardly be fair to hold concerns against you. Just as long as (if they are unfounded) you keep them in perspective?

    Other than that... Sounds like standard new relationship jitters? A partner's experience can be intimidating, but it can also be an excellent and fun resource to take advantage of?

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    Default Re: LGBTAitp - Part Twelve

    Quote Originally Posted by Serpentine View Post
    edit @ ^: Sure, but was it so obsenely a cynical money-making scene back then, or was it more of a saint's holiday?
    Like I said, the holiday had been around for a long time before greeting cards began being mass-produced. The only way the holiday would have been related to making money would be the people buying supplies to make valentines, or perhaps purchasing them from your local handmade card shop. Some printers were making cards fairly early on, but it was still only to satisfy a demand. I'm not trying to deny that the holiday as it is today is more of a money-maker than anything, but the holiday has honest roots regardless.
    Last edited by Vaynor; 2011-02-13 at 04:37 AM.
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  5. - Top - End - #245
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    smile Re: LGBTAitp - Part Twelve

    In regard to the gender/sex debate: Is it accpetable that I use biological genderand mental/physiological psychological gender to differentinate? Seems a good wya to avoid confusion

    Possibly because the word sex is confusing enough when your native language lacks any meaning of it that is forum appropriate.

    Quote Originally Posted by Danne View Post
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    So, here's something I've been struggling with. I'm sure some of you remember the debacle with my cousin's wedding and Mum insisting I wear a dress. Nothing's changed in that regard -- the plan is still to find a fancy skirt/shirt combo that'll satisfy us both -- but it's taken me this long to be able to get passed being angry and upset in order to think about some of her ideas.

    My mom (who, as I've mentioned before, is great about LGBs but not so much with Ts) is of the opinion that a person crossdressing (let's skip over the fact that a transperson who is "crossdressing" is actually wearing the correct clothing, for the sake of simplicity) has to understand that their choice of dress makes other people uncomfortable. People are uncomfortable with the idea of a man in a dress, and though this is news to me apparently a lot of people are still wigged out by the idea of a woman in a tux. Since a wedding is about showering attention on the bridge (and the groom, but really, it's about the bride, or some I'm told) choosing to do something that draws attention to yourself (by making people uncomfortable) is selfish because it draws attention away from the bridge (and groom, him too), and that therefore even if a person is trans someone who is biologically male should be in a tux and someone who is biologically female should be in a dress (or, grudgingly, a fancy skirt).

    I can...sort of understand that perspective, with the idea that you're supposed to be all about the couple who's getting married. I do not understand why someone's choice of clothing makes people uncomfortable, because that seems silly to me, but that's a conversation for a different day. I do not understand the idea that I (or anyone) should do something that makes me Extremely Uncomfortable just to make other people happy. I do not like this idea. It rubs my proverbial fur the wrong way, makes me feel all gross and icky, and I do not understand it.

    So I do not know what to think, and was hoping other people would have an opinion.
    News to me as well, tuxedos and business suits were the most trendy outifts for a woman to wear over here a few years back. As proven by the fact that I know that.

    Sending an E-mail is probably the right thing to do but if you ask me then they're the ones being unreasonable. The idea's been here since 1966 after all, was controversial for less than five years too.
    Last edited by Mina Kobold; 2011-02-13 at 07:09 AM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by SiuiS View Post

    At first, it was the smiley faces and the mannerisms. Then, it was the infernal magpie. It struck a chord. A cutely fiendish, macabre chord.

    An then I saw Keveak in the sorting hat and you are just the cutest thing when you want to be. My gosh look at that. It's squee-inducing.

  6. - Top - End - #246
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    Default Re: LGBTAitp - Part Twelve

    Ah... Isn't physiology a subset of biology? Do you mean psychological?

    Anyway, you can - although I'm not sure what you mean by "biological gender" unless you're just using it instead of sex - but I'm still gonna stick with my definition *shrug*

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    smile Re: LGBTAitp - Part Twelve

    Quote Originally Posted by Serpentine View Post
    Ah... Isn't physiology a subset of biology? Do you mean psychological?

    Anyway, you can - although I'm not sure what you mean by "biological gender" unless you're just using it instead of sex - but I'm still gonna stick with my definition *shrug*
    Oh yeah, oops.

    That I am, and that's what I would expect you to do. ^.^

    Now that everybody's got their definitions in order, let's get back to discussing the important stuff! Like Valentine's Day cards.
    Last edited by Mina Kobold; 2011-02-13 at 07:09 AM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by SiuiS View Post

    At first, it was the smiley faces and the mannerisms. Then, it was the infernal magpie. It struck a chord. A cutely fiendish, macabre chord.

    An then I saw Keveak in the sorting hat and you are just the cutest thing when you want to be. My gosh look at that. It's squee-inducing.

  8. - Top - End - #248
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    Default Re: LGBTAitp - Part Twelve

    Quote Originally Posted by Keveak View Post
    In regard to the gender/sex debate: Is it accpetable that I use biological genderand mental/physiological psychological gender to differentinate? Seems a good wya to avoid confusion
    Biological or physical gender would be appropriate to identify when you're using gender to mean the same as the biological/physical sex of a person.

    Rather than mental or psychological gender though, you might just want to say 'gender identity' or 'which gender they identify as' (though the first two would be correct).

    Remember though, that an unqualified gender could mean physical/biological sex, gender identity or grammatical gender, depending on who is saying it in what context.

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  9. - Top - End - #249
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    Default Re: LGBTAitp - Part Twelve

    @Danne: I think there's definitely a way for everyone to be happy here. The choice for wedding wear isn't tux or fancy gown anymore, there are plenty of formal-wear options these days. I think you should look for a formal trouser-suit, maybe in a gender-neutral (as society sees it) colour that makes it look "prettier" (women usually wear colours to a wedding) but isn't, like, frilly pink or something that's very girly to you. So maybe a nice understated blue trouser suit with a nice white shirt and no tie. If your mother still isn't happy, I say just go ahead and get in touch with the bride. Is your dislike of telephones greater than your dislike of wearing a dress/skirt for a whole day? If not, just go for it. Write down what you're going to say, and the number, on a sheet of paper. That way, you won't forget anything, especially if you have to leave a message. Tell the bride you don't like dresses, but you want to look nice for the wedding, and describe what trouser-based option you're thinking of wearing instead. Say you hope she doesn't mind you wearing that instead of a dress, and that you're looking forward to seeing her, or something else friendly.

    It's not such a weird thing to dislike dresses these days. I have a cisfemale friend, who is straight, and pretty, wears her hair long, and just really doesn't like dresses. I've seen her in a dress once. It was for Hallowe'en, and she was wearing her jeans underneath it. She wears neat black trousers and nice shirts to formal occasions (there's another option for you!).

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    Default Re: LGBTAitp - Part Twelve

    Am I the only one who uses 'gender' to mean 'grammatical category of a noun'?

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    Last edited by Asta Kask; 2011-02-13 at 07:23 AM.
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  11. - Top - End - #251
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    Default Re: LGBTAitp - Part Twelve

    That would be "gendered", I believe.

  12. - Top - End - #252
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    Default Re: LGBTAitp - Part Twelve

    Quote Originally Posted by Serpentine View Post
    That would be "gendered", I believe.
    I think you need to point who you were answering, luv.
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    Default Re: LGBTAitp - Part Twelve

    Quote Originally Posted by Danne View Post
    So, here's something I've been struggling with. I'm sure some of you remember the debacle with my cousin's wedding and Mum insisting I wear a dress.

    [...]

    So I do not know what to think, and was hoping other people would have an opinion.
    At most of the weddings I partecipated, it was actually implicitly forbidden to wear too fancy a dress/tux, because that would have detracted attention from the bride/groom. (I do not actually endorse this line of reasoning either.)

    I think that, unless you have a very, very conservative family, you wearing something other than a dress will most likely pass unobserved, rather than cause the wedding to be ruined forever.

    (It must be noted that I am somewhat defiant of social conventions.)
    Last edited by Anethiel; 2011-02-13 at 07:42 AM.
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    Default Re: LGBTAitp - Part Twelve

    Quote Originally Posted by Asta Kask View Post
    I think you need to point who you were answering, luv.
    You, regarding grammar.

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    Default Re: LGBTAitp - Part Twelve

    Quote Originally Posted by Serpentine View Post
    That would be "gendered", I believe.
    Gendered doesn't appear in most of the dictionaries I looked up, and in those that did, most listed the definitions as archaic or obsolete.

    Gender, on the other hand, does have the following definition (amongst others):
    Quote Originally Posted by WordWeb.info

    Noun: gender
    A grammatical category in inflected languages governing the agreement between nouns and pronouns and adjectives; in some languages it is quite arbitrary but in Indo-European languages it is usually based on sex or animateness

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    smile Re: LGBTAitp - Part Twelve

    Quote Originally Posted by Rawhide View Post
    Biological or physical gender would be appropriate to identify when you're using gender to mean the same as the biological/physical sex of a person.

    Rather than mental or psychological gender though, you might just want to say 'gender identity' or 'which gender they identify as' (though the first two would be correct).

    Remember though, that an unqualified gender could mean physical/biological sex, gender identity or grammatical gender, depending on who is saying it in what context.
    That's a good point, I think I will.

    I am aware, that is why I find it confusing not to specify. As I said, I am simply used to the Danish language's clear distinctions. ^.^'

    Though, that doesn't stop me from making tons of bad puns.
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    Quote Originally Posted by SiuiS View Post

    At first, it was the smiley faces and the mannerisms. Then, it was the infernal magpie. It struck a chord. A cutely fiendish, macabre chord.

    An then I saw Keveak in the sorting hat and you are just the cutest thing when you want to be. My gosh look at that. It's squee-inducing.

  17. - Top - End - #257
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    Default Re: LGBTAitp - Part Twelve

    Quote Originally Posted by Serpentine View Post
    You, regarding grammar.
    Quote Originally Posted by Rawhide View Post
    Gendered doesn't appear in most of the dictionaries I looked up, and in those that did, most listed the definitions as archaic or obsolete.

    Gender, on the other hand, does have the following definition (amongst others):
    My Webster's has 1. SEX. 2. any two or more classes of words (as nouns or pronouns) or of forms of words (as adjectives) that are usually partly based on sex and that determine agreement with other words of grammatical forms.

    Gendered does not appear.

    IIRC, the grammatical meaning was the only one until the 1920's when the word was used by someone-or-other to denote the cultural aspects of what was until then lumped together as sex. Since then, the 'secondary' meaning has taken over and is now the primary. So goes the world.
    Last edited by Asta Kask; 2011-02-13 at 08:31 AM.
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  18. - Top - End - #258
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    Default Re: LGBTAitp - Part Twelve

    I don't know if I mentioned that I had a little brother since October.

    It's gotten to the point where I flinch every time someone refers to me as a big brother.

    ...there's not really anything anyone can do about this, so... i'm gonna call this a rant.[/rant]
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    Default Re: LGBTAitp - Part Twelve

    Aren't you a big sister?
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    Default Re: LGBTAitp - Part Twelve

    That's her point.
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    Default Re: LGBTAitp - Part Twelve

    Oh, I thought it was because someone was stealing all the attention.
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    Default Re: LGBTAitp - Part Twelve

    Quote Originally Posted by Asta Kask View Post
    Oh, I thought it was because someone was stealing all the attention.
    Nah, I spend all my time in my room. I'm only an attention grabber online.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thanqol View Post
    It's like the feng shui version of an orbital death laser.

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    smile Re: LGBTAitp - Part Twelve

    Quote Originally Posted by Lix Lorn View Post
    Nah, I spend all my time in my room. I'm only an attention grabber online.
    Aww, I wanted to ask you how to be social and nice.

    Oh well, plan B it is. Anyone seen any textbooks on building robots to conquer the world lying around? -_0

    Back on topic, why not just tell people to call you something else?
    Last edited by Mina Kobold; 2011-02-13 at 10:31 AM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by SiuiS View Post

    At first, it was the smiley faces and the mannerisms. Then, it was the infernal magpie. It struck a chord. A cutely fiendish, macabre chord.

    An then I saw Keveak in the sorting hat and you are just the cutest thing when you want to be. My gosh look at that. It's squee-inducing.

  24. - Top - End - #264
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    Default Re: LGBTAitp - Part Twelve

    Because she doesn't want to out herself to everyone just yet? Call her what? "Big sibling"?

    No, this is a problem with no easy solution.
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    smile Re: LGBTAitp - Part Twelve

    Quote Originally Posted by Asta Kask View Post
    Because she doesn't want to out herself to everyone just yet? Call her what? "Big sibling"?

    No, this is a problem with no easy solution.
    That's what I get for making assumptions. ^_^'

    I don't usually support lying but why not say you're not quite over the shock of getting a sibling, Lix?

    Lot's of people seem to be uncomfortable with being called sibling/parent/uncle/aunt/other for a while after they become so.

    EDIT: Also considering joining the Harem, looks like fun. ^_^
    Last edited by Mina Kobold; 2011-02-13 at 10:48 AM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by SiuiS View Post

    At first, it was the smiley faces and the mannerisms. Then, it was the infernal magpie. It struck a chord. A cutely fiendish, macabre chord.

    An then I saw Keveak in the sorting hat and you are just the cutest thing when you want to be. My gosh look at that. It's squee-inducing.

  26. - Top - End - #266
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    Default Re: LGBTAitp - Part Twelve

    Quote Originally Posted by Keveak View Post
    Aww, I wanted to ask you how to be social and nice.

    Oh well, plan B it is. Anyone seen any textbooks on building robots to conquer the world lying around? -_0

    Back on topic, why not just tell people to call you something else?
    Quote Originally Posted by Asta Kask View Post
    Because she doesn't want to out herself to everyone just yet? Call her what? "Big sibling"?

    No, this is a problem with no easy solution.
    Quote Originally Posted by Keveak View Post
    That's what I get for making assumptions. ^_^'

    I don't usually support lying but why not say you're not quite over the shock of getting a sibling, Lix?

    Lot's of people seem to be uncomfortable with being called sibling/parent/uncle/aunt/other for a while after they become so.

    EDIT: Also considering joining the Harem, looks like fun. ^_^
    I don't mind so much if it's in public, cause they can't really say anything else without outing me. It's just when we're at home, I'd really prefer it.

    My mum knows it bugs me, though I don't think she knows how much. She said she doesn't want to confuse him or something. I think it more likely she doesn't want to think about it...

    @Keveak: Yaaaaay!
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thanqol View Post
    It's like the feng shui version of an orbital death laser.

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    Default Re: LGBTAitp - Part Twelve

    Quote Originally Posted by Lix Lorn View Post
    My mum knows it bugs me, though I don't think she knows how much. She said she doesn't want to confuse him or something. I think it more likely she doesn't want to think about it...
    *blink* How old is this child? Because when you said you're a new big sister since October, I assume the child was born then, which would make him, what, four or five months old now? In which case, since my impression is you're hoping to get SRS (yes?) by the time he's old enough to understand what a big brother/sister is, "big brother" could no longer apply in a literal sense.

    Anyway, kids are smart. Sounds like she's just in denial. Any idea on how to work on that?

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    Default Re: LGBTAitp - Part Twelve

    Quote Originally Posted by Danne View Post
    *blink* How old is this child? Because when you said you're a new big sister since October, I assume the child was born then, which would make him, what, four or five months old now? In which case, since my impression is you're hoping to get SRS (yes?) by the time he's old enough to understand what a big brother/sister is, "big brother" could no longer apply in a literal sense.

    Anyway, kids are smart. Sounds like she's just in denial. Any idea on how to work on that?
    Correct on all counts. And no, not really. :(
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thanqol View Post
    It's like the feng shui version of an orbital death laser.

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    Connecticut

    Default Re: LGBTAitp - Part Twelve

    Well, I'm hardly one to offer advice about relationships, but I find that writing down what I want to say beforehand, sitting the person down in during a calm moment, and having a conversation (that's important, it has to be two ways) can be a big help when someone is doing something that bothers me. Use "I-statements." They're lame but they work.

  30. - Top - End - #270
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    KenderWizard's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    Dublin, Ireland
    Gender
    Female

    Default Re: LGBTAitp - Part Twelve

    Quote Originally Posted by Lix Lorn View Post
    I don't know if I mentioned that I had a little brother since October.

    It's gotten to the point where I flinch every time someone refers to me as a big brother.

    ...there's not really anything anyone can do about this, so... i'm gonna call this a rant.[/rant]
    Wow, I had a head-hurting moment there. I just think of you as a girl!

    The biggest problem seems to be your mom calling you a big brother to the baby. Maybe you should substitute a nickname? A baby-talk version of your real name or something. Call yourself that to the baby all the time and hope it catches on with him (when he starts talking) and your mom!

    Cheerfairy, Kenderwoman and Geologist by Succubus, Feminist Geomancer by Astrella, Kender Wizard by me

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