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    Orc in the Playground
     
    101jir's Avatar

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    Default Historic map of Caribbean ports? (1700-1750ish)

    I was planning on eventually running a fudge system game with sides being the Dutch, British, French, Spanish, and independant (pirates, privateers, political radicals). I would prefer a map that is color coded as to what side controlled what areas and a sufficient list of ports (preferably between 10ish and 20ish) and who controlled them. I would appreciate this very much!
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    Default Re: Historic map of Caribbean ports? (1700-1750ish)

    I know a fair bit of information about the colonial Caribbean... gleaned mostly from the classic Sid Meier computer game Pirates! (not the remake). So it might not be historically spot on, but it's already proven good enough for game purposes.

    However, the game dealt with the period 1560-1700, which is right before what you want. The reason given in the (superbly detailed) game manual was that, despite several of the most (in)famous pirates (e.g. Blackbeard) being active after 1700, the period before that was more interesting for the game designers. From about 1680, and certainly by 1700, professional navies were coming to dominate the seas. Privateers were less and less common, and while previously, one nation's pirate was often another's hero, now pirates were generally considered criminals by everyone. The 1600s were the era of buccaneers, privateers, Spanish treasure fleets, and infamous pirate havens like Tortuga and Port Royal.

    If you feel inclined to switch time periods, I'm sure I can dig out my Pirates! manual and map, and give you more information than you ever wanted. If not, I can still give you a rundown on the late 1600s, if you want to use that as a starting point for researching the early 1700s.
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    Default Re: Historic map of Caribbean ports? (1700-1750ish)

    I found some old maps of Port Royal:

    http://nautarch.tamu.edu/portroyal/archives/Map5.htm
    http://www.jamaicanfamilysearch.com/images/mapptryl.JPG

    And based on those there's even a fantasy style map by Paizo.
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    Default Re: Historic map of Caribbean ports? (1700-1750ish)

    Quote Originally Posted by Peregrine View Post
    I know a fair bit of information about the colonial Caribbean... gleaned mostly from the classic Sid Meier computer game Pirates! (not the remake). So it might not be historically spot on, but it's already proven good enough for game purposes.

    However, the game dealt with the period 1560-1700, which is right before what you want. The reason given in the (superbly detailed) game manual was that, despite several of the most (in)famous pirates (e.g. Blackbeard) being active after 1700, the period before that was more interesting for the game designers. From about 1680, and certainly by 1700, professional navies were coming to dominate the seas. Privateers were less and less common, and while previously, one nation's pirate was often another's hero, now pirates were generally considered criminals by everyone. The 1600s were the era of buccaneers, privateers, Spanish treasure fleets, and infamous pirate havens like Tortuga and Port Royal.

    If you feel inclined to switch time periods, I'm sure I can dig out my Pirates! manual and map, and give you more information than you ever wanted. If not, I can still give you a rundown on the late 1600s, if you want to use that as a starting point for researching the early 1700s.
    If it seems more advisable from a gaming perspective, sure, I would have no problem switching time periods. My initial reason was that if the players wanted to play a political radical, 1700s-1750s would be closer to the Revolution and simply radical ideas in general. Since balance is far more important, sure, I would definately prefer to go with whatever time frame is the most balanced.

    Quote Originally Posted by Yora View Post
    I found some old maps of Port Royal:

    http://nautarch.tamu.edu/portroyal/archives/Map5.htm
    http://www.jamaicanfamilysearch.com/images/mapptryl.JPG

    And based on those there's even a fantasy style map by Paizo.
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    This will certainly prove useful, although what I had in mind was more along the lines of where all the ports were located. I will definately implement that though, if I can get the game going, so THX.
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    Default Re: Historic map of Caribbean ports? (1700-1750ish)

    Okay, that's a very different question:

    The best locations to place a port is in an harbor, that is a location in which moored ships and the docks are protected from large waves and possibly even strong winds during a storm. Storms are a big enough problem on the open sea, but it's really not good if they bash against the docks for hours. Makes the ropes too long, and the ships will thrash around, make them to short and they will snap or break the wood when the storm is bad enough.
    For demonstration, another map of Port Royal.
    Out on a sandback isn't neccessarily the best location for a town (which proved to be fatal and led to it's complete destruction), but you have the coast of the "main-land" to the north and the west, the peninsula to the east, and a chain of reefs to the south. What you need is some barrier that stops the waves. It doesn't matter if the waves can spill over the barrier, for as long as the waves break and lose their energy. Behind that barrier waves first have to build up again and usually won't get any dangerous size by the time they reach the docked ships.
    Kingston to the north of Port Royal would have been a much more protected location for a town (the water is called "Kingston Harbour", but as I interprete the map the water is very shallow, so you probably couldn't get the bigger ships safely through the narrow passage. Because of that they put Port Royal right at the passage and the north-west side is actually very well protected from waves. And looking at the detailed maps, that's where they had the docks. The southeast side had no docks at all.
    Another good location for a port is some distance upriver. You have lots of such ports in northern europe, famously London and Hamburg, which are actually quite far away from the coast. The problem here is again that you have to get the ships up the river. The Thamse and the Elbe are large enough for even large ships, but when the river mouth narrows quickly, ships won't be able to get very far up where it becomes too shallow. An absolute perfect location is Oslo since it's located at the end of Oslo Fjord. The location is completely surrounded by mountains and because of the landscape the narrow water connection is actually extremely deep. But fjord landscapes are very rare, I think only in Norway, Canada, and probaly southern Chile.
    Last edited by Yora; 2011-03-21 at 04:12 PM.
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    Default Re: Historic map of Caribbean ports? (1700-1750ish)

    My folks have an 1830 map on the wall in the downstairs bathroom that features the island of Antigua. It shows cities and plantations.

    I'd be willing to try to get it out of its frame to scan it if that would be useful...

    Well, assuming they'll allow me

    Edit: wikipedia thing

    Assorted 1700 survey maps

    if you have $25 to spare

    Assorted jpeg maps, mostly small. Note that most cities in the Caribbean haven't moved, though a few, like Falmouth lost their importance

    Downloadable map from Port Royal 2
    Last edited by Mulletmanalive; 2011-03-21 at 06:48 PM.
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    Default Re: Historic map of Caribbean ports? (1700-1750ish)

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    Default Re: Historic map of Caribbean ports? (1700-1750ish)

    This map was made for Pirates of the Burning Sea. Can't imagine it'd be hard to use for a game

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    Default Re: Historic map of Caribbean ports? (1700-1750ish)

    Thanks everyone for your contributions. And Peregrene, I would very much appreciate those maps from Pirates! whenever you are ready.
    Long Sig (now with nonsense riddles).

    Augustus "Gus" Black

    THX to PallElandro for the unintentional suggestion of my new Avi. All hail PallElandro. OR ELSE!!!

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    Default Re: Historic map of Caribbean ports? (1700-1750ish)

    I'll send you a PM about getting these potentially large amounts of information to you.
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    GnomePirate

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    Default Re: Historic map of Caribbean ports? (1700-1750ish)

    Quote Originally Posted by Dsurion View Post
    This map was made for Pirates of the Burning Sea. Can't imagine it'd be hard to use for a game
    PotBS was what I was going to suggest.

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    Bugbear in the Playground
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    Default Re: Historic map of Caribbean ports? (1700-1750ish)

    Collection of historical maps of the Caribbean:

    http://alabamamaps.ua.edu/historical...caribbean.html

    They're not loading for me at the moment (but it may be my computer). Not exactly what you wanted but some of them may make a good in game map to give to your players.

    Pirates of the Burning Sea map appears to have some fantasy towns thrown in there.

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    Default Re: Historic map of Caribbean ports? (1700-1750ish)

    Quote Originally Posted by fusilier View Post
    Collection of historical maps of the Caribbean:

    http://alabamamaps.ua.edu/historical...caribbean.html

    They're not loading for me at the moment (but it may be my computer). Not exactly what you wanted but some of them may make a good in game map to give to your players.

    Pirates of the Burning Sea map appears to have some fantasy towns thrown in there.
    None of the ports are made up, unless some pirate ones are; it's just that there is a bunch of game related information on it as well.

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    Default Re: Historic map of Caribbean ports? (1700-1750ish)

    Quote Originally Posted by Cartigan View Post
    None of the ports are made up, unless some pirate ones are; it's just that there is a bunch of game related information on it as well.
    I didn't recognize any of the pirate towns along the Texas coast. For that matter "Charlesfort" (shown somewhere around Georgia or South Carolina), was a tiny french colony that lasted for less than a year during 1562-63. Whereas New Orleans wasn't founded until 1718, and to the best of my knowledge Pensacola was Spanish, and never controlled by the French (although briefly by the British between the French and Indian War, and the American Revolution).

    Anyway, that map doesn't seem to be an accurate map for any historical campaign, and certainly not for one set in the early 18th century.

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