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  1. - Top - End - #181
    Troll in the Playground
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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion IV: Roll Join Debate

    So, the way Holden has been talking about the Lunar overhaul, I'm thinking they may be able to crawl their way up out of "definitively last place" to "marginally last place" in my ladder of favorite Exalt types. Amidst several minor examples of fixing terrible charms, he posted this rough draft of a keyword that will apparently play a major role in Lunar charm design:
    Quote Originally Posted by Holden
    New Keyword
    Protean: The Lunar Exalted are blessed with their patron’s gift of change, and may call upon it to enhance their personal prowess. If a Lunar possesses a form in her Heart’s Blood library which resonates with a Charm with this Keyword, she may reflexively shapeshift into that form at no cost for the duration of the Charm, reflexively returning to the shape she previously held when the Charm’s duration expires; or she may pay a one-mote surcharge to remain in that form after the Charm’s duration expires. Shapeshifting in this fashion adds three dice to all actions enhanced or created by the Charm, or grants another benefit detailed in the text of the Charm. These do not count as dice added by a Charm.

    Resonant forms are forms which could conceivably enhance the performance of the Charm in question. For example, Jaws of the River Dragon might be enhanced by the shape of a gorilla, bear, anaconda or blood-ape (all shapes suitable for grappling), while Ferocious Biting Tooth might resonate with any overwhelmingly powerful shape—a yeddim, aurochs, or river dragon, perhaps. Storytellers are encouraged to be lenient when deciding what forms are appropriate (almost any powerful creature is appropriate for Impressions of Strength, for example, from a tyrant lizard to a ram).

    Shapes cease being valid resonant forms for the purpose of the Protean keyword after the Lunar has already assumed them once within a scene.
    /Crowned With Fury
    "Discuss"

  2. - Top - End - #182
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    WhiteWizardGirl

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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion IV: Roll Join Debate

    That's pretty awesome. Lunars are/were one of my favorite exalt types. I look forward to seeing where they go with that.
    BEEP.

  3. - Top - End - #183
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    GnomeWizardGuy

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    Protean keyword sounds very cool; I like it. *wonders if we'll see it showing up on some Martial Arts charms as a kind of Lunar-only aspect to them, much like the Prayer Strip keyword is for Sidereals*

    Also, wild speculation on Exalted Test of Spite:
    Spoiler
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    Given limited stunting and assuming characters have a way to get and stay in attack range of each other, everything is going to come down to mote pool size, efficiency of PDs, and charm-based mote-regen. Which means that an active ToS will quickly determine two things:

    --Whether high-movement kiting archers are Better Than Everything (assuming the normal spectrum of defenses, this probably comes down to The Freedom Stone and Gem of Perfect Balance to defeat clinch, knockdown, and blockade movement, and the archer's Per+Awareness versus the melee guy's Dex+Stealth to keep track of him and keep hitting him. Thrown with Space-Warping Needles may also be a viable tactic, negating most/all of the melee-guy's cover at the cost of motes spent recalling your needle and most of your comfortable kiting range.)

    --Which Exalt type has the best Reactor and/or Overdrive charms. Starting mote pool size is also helpful here, but regain is probably most important.

    Soak-based Abyssals, Infernals, and akuma will all fail _hard_ due to the ease with which the other types (particularly Solars, of course) can get access to Holy.

    Celestial Monkey Style will be the most commonly practiced Martial Art at greater-than-starting XP levels, for two reasons: one, when mastered, it's compatible with any armor and any attack made with Martial Arts (so: unarmed, Martial Arts weapons, and anything that's a Form Weapon for some other style you have), and two, it gets you a scene-length effective doubling of Parry DV. Ideally, combine with Chaos Targe to attempt to parry unblockables as if they weren't. Given the fact that DV optimization will necessarily be important in a limited-Willpower match, CMS+Chaos Targe becomes quite nice.

    For Eclipses, Moonshadows, and (if they can deal with their small mote pools and complete lack of mote-regain) Sidereals, Defense of Shining Joy + Hauberk of Bells gets Performance to DDV twice, PDV once, all Dex-based dice pools once, and ignores all penalties to DDV, at the price of a charm, a four-dot artifact, and an eight-mote attunement.

    Wood Dragon Style as far as the Form also seems like it might be nice for a soak-and-regen strategy, though I think those will go down hard to Grand Killsticks and anything with aggravated damage, so it won't actually end up being optimal.

    If allowed for non-Sidereals, Violet Bier of Sorrows will of course see frequent use as a one-charm dip (Yay, double Join Battle successes!), and Blade of the Battle Maiden may become a key component of Grand Killstick builds, as even the post-errata version is pretty darned strong. And scene-length, which is critical with limited regen.

    Terrestrials' free-use-of-reflexives is going to be extremely relevant in starting-level play, but become rapidly useless as XP ramps up. Except possibly for Terrestrial Akuma, if they're even allowed. *shudder*

    The Malfeas, Cecelyne, and SWLiHN Mythos Exultants will either be very useful or completely useless, depending on how high/low the stunt budget is set at.

    Due to Overdrive drip and free Holy, Glorious Solar <weapon> will be the standard for Solars. We may see the occasional Crimson Bow.

    The last point is nothing new, but given the importance of constant or scene-length abilities to boost pools without constant mote expenditure and charm activations, the Brutal Attack Merit + Demon Ink Tattoo + Green Iron Heart + Prosthetic of Clockwork Elegance combo is going to be really popular, considering that for 13BP and 13m committed it can get you:
    Base Melee attack pools on Str rather than Dex
    +6 Str
    +5 Stm
    +2 Dex
    +1 Melee, +1 Dodge, +1 Awareness/Resistance/Integrity/Stealth/Athletics/etc., or +2 Melee
    +3 specialty Melee (insert high-Rate weapon of choice here)

    ...all of which adds up to +10-11 dice to your attacks, +1-1.5 DDV, +3-3.5 PDV (or +6-7 if using Celestial Monkey Style), and (assuming Ox-Bodies equal to Stamina), +5-20 health levels, depending on whether you're a Sidereal or an Infernal/Lunar, not counting extra Dying levels. Also, none of the above counts towards dice caps.

    The downside, of course, is you lose instantly to forced-deattunement.

    Regardless, I look forward with interest to seeing the results.
    Last edited by Psyborg; 2011-04-27 at 05:05 PM.
    delete Teemo.

  4. - Top - End - #184
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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion IV: Roll Join Debate

    I'm liking the Protean. Feels like something they always should have had.
    Avatar by Elagune

  5. - Top - End - #185
    Troll in the Playground
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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion IV: Roll Join Debate

    It's like submodules for alchies.
    Past Avatars:
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    By Alterform


    Spoiler
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    Lore: 7.

    Factors: 2.

    Wealth: 5

    Magic: 4

    Espionage: 4

    Reputation: 3.

    Military: 2.

    Faith: 6.



  6. - Top - End - #186
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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion IV: Roll Join Debate

    Just to note, there is a ban list up in the TOS thread. Thanks for identifying some other things that need tweaked, though.
    He fears his fate too much, and his reward is small, who will not put it to the touch, to win or lose it all.
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  7. - Top - End - #187
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    If you allow Kimbery charms, I can technically get an arbitrarily high dodge DV.

    And I can layer 4000 doses of a poison on a weapon, so all I have to do is hit you once and you get at least a -2000 internal penalty.
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  8. - Top - End - #188
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    WolfInSheepsClothing

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lochar View Post
    If you allow Kimbery charms, I can technically get an arbitrarily high dodge DV.

    And I can layer 4000 doses of a poison on a weapon, so all I have to do is hit you once and you get at least a -2000 internal penalty.
    Then it's a good thing they aren't allowing Infernals.

    (Although I think that is because of lack-of-book issues instead of balance issues.)
    There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio,
    Than are dreamt of in your philosophy.
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  9. - Top - End - #189
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    Quote Originally Posted by a_humble_lich View Post
    Then it's a good thing they aren't allowing Infernals.
    Err, from what I saw, it was just a ban on akuma.

    EDIT: Nevermind, was just looking at the banlist itself.
    Last edited by TheCountAlucard; 2011-04-27 at 07:02 PM.

  10. - Top - End - #190
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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion IV: Roll Join Debate

    Note the allowed list, in the first spoiler box. Specifically:
    Due to resources available, only Solars, Dragonblooded, Lunars, Sidereal, Abyssals, Gods, Elementals, and Ghosts are currently allowed in the game.
    He fears his fate too much, and his reward is small, who will not put it to the touch, to win or lose it all.
    -James Graham, 1st Marquess of Montrose
    Satomi by Elagune

  11. - Top - End - #191
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    WolfInSheepsClothing

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    There is a ban on akuma, but in the character creation guidelines Infernals are conspicuously absent (along with Alchemicals, but my memory fails) from the allowed character types due to "lack of resources."

    Edit: Oh Five-Score Fellowship, why do you hate me so!
    Last edited by a_humble_lich; 2011-04-27 at 07:06 PM.
    There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio,
    Than are dreamt of in your philosophy.
    --Will S.

  12. - Top - End - #192
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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion IV: Roll Join Debate

    Quote Originally Posted by Tavar View Post
    Note the allowed list, in the first spoiler box. Specifically:
    Quote Originally Posted by a_humble_lich View Post
    There is a ban on akuma, but in the character creation guidelines Infernals are conspicuously absent (along with Alchemicals, but my memory fails) from the allowed character types due to "lack of resources."
    Looks like I get to be the Sidereal today!

  13. - Top - End - #193
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    Considering I sent a PM saying the same thing at 8:01....

    Also, Celestial Monkey doubles your DV? Might have to expand the ban list a bit.
    He fears his fate too much, and his reward is small, who will not put it to the touch, to win or lose it all.
    -James Graham, 1st Marquess of Montrose
    Satomi by Elagune

  14. - Top - End - #194
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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion IV: Roll Join Debate

    Protean is just so very right.
    Quote Originally Posted by Thespianus View Post
    I fail to see how "No, that guy is too fat to be hurt by your fire" would make sense.

  15. - Top - End - #195
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    Quote Originally Posted by Psyborg View Post
    Terrestrials' free-use-of-reflexives is going to be extremely relevant in starting-level play, but become rapidly useless as XP ramps up. Except possibly for Terrestrial Akuma, if they're even allowed. *shudder*
    Even if Terrestrial akuma are allowed, how is the free reflexives rule relevant? It's not like they can use Infernal reflexive Charms as innate powers.
    I use black for sarcasm.


    Call me Rose, or The Rose Dragon. Rose Dragon is someone else entirely.

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  16. - Top - End - #196
    Troll in the Playground
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    Would a theoretical Fu-Sion-Ha spell that functions exactly like Unity of the Closed Fist but with only a maximum of two participants be Terrestrial or Celestial circle? (Assuming that the casting cost was maybe scaled to 20m if it was Terrestrial and 30m for Celestial.)
    Last edited by Xefas; 2011-04-27 at 09:52 PM.

  17. - Top - End - #197
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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion IV: Roll Join Debate

    Quote Originally Posted by Xefas View Post
    Would a theoretical Fu-Sion-Ha spell that functions exactly like Unity of the Closed Fist but with only a maximum of two participants be Terrestrial or Celestial circle? (Assuming that the casting cost was maybe scaled to 20m if it was Terrestrial and 30m for Celestial.)
    Neither, because Unity of the Closed Fist is pretty broken and doesn't need another easier-to-get version?[/hasnotseenyourspell]

    If you fix UotCF, then sure, but I don't know what that would look like.

    Also, Protean, hell yeah.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tavar
    Also, Celestial Monkey doubles your DV? Might have to expand the ban list a bit.
    Tavar, if you ban every single thing in Exalted that could possibly be broken, we're not actually going to play Exalted. Exalted is a pretty inherently broken system, and overuse of the banhammer will result in both the ToS being not fun, and it not being representative of Exalted. In my opinion, it'd be better if you just ban the things in the system that are broken beyond repair, and allow the other stuff in.
    Last edited by Mr.Bookworm; 2011-04-27 at 09:58 PM.
    Awesome Cyborg Doom Monkey avatar by Lord Fullbladder, Master of Goblins. Offer up your robo-bananas to him.

  18. - Top - End - #198
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr.Bookworm View Post
    In my opinion, it'd be better if you just ban the things in the system that are broken beyond repair, and allow the other stuff in.
    Yes, but if you ban Chapter 4 of the core rulebook, how are we gonna decide how combat is played out?
    I use black for sarcasm.


    Call me Rose, or The Rose Dragon. Rose Dragon is someone else entirely.

    If you need me for something, please PM me about it. I am having difficulty keeping track of all my obligations.

  19. - Top - End - #199
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    WhiteWizardGirl

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Rose Dragon View Post
    Yes, but if you ban Chapter 4 of the core rulebook, how are we gonna decide how combat is played out?
    Well played sir.
    BEEP.

  20. - Top - End - #200
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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion IV: Roll Join Debate

    But if Unity of the Closed Fist gets changed, how will the Yozi use all of those five kilomote charms they have?

    Spoiler
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    Charizard
    Cost: 5,000m 1wp; Mins: Essence 10; Type: Reflexive
    Keywords: Combo-OK, Charizard
    Duration: Instant
    Prerequisite Charms: [Malfeas] Cosmic Principle
    PHP Code:
    ."-,.__
                     `.     `.  ,
                  .--'  .._,'"
    -' `.
                 .    .'         
    `'
                 
    `.   /          ,'
                   `  '
    --.   ,-"'
                    `"
    `   |  \
                       -. \, |
                        
    `--Y.'      ___.
                             \     L._, \
                   _.,        `.   <  <\                _
                 ,' '           `, `.   | \            ( `
              ../, `.            `  |    .\`.           \ \_
             ,' 
    ,..  .           _.,'    ||\l            )  '".
            , ,'   \           ,'.-.`-._,'  |           .  _._`.
          ,' /      \ \        `' ' `--/   | \          / /   ..\
        .'  /        \ .         |\__ - _ ,'` `        / /     `.`.
        |  '          ..         `-...-"  
    |  `-'      / /        . `.
        | /           |
    L__           |    |          / /          ``.
       , /            .   .          |    |         / /             `
     `
      / /          ,. ,`
    ._ `-_       |    |  _   ,-' /               ` \
     / .           \"`_/. `-_ \_,.  ,'    
    +-' `-'  _,        ..,-.    \`.
      '         .-f    ,'   
    `    '.       \__.---'     _   .'   '     \ \
    ' /          `.'    l     .' /          \..      ,_|/   `.  ,'`     L`
    |
    '      _.-""` `.    \ _,'  `            \ `.___`.'"`-.  , |   |    | \
    ||    ,
    '      `. `.   '       _,...._        `  |    `/ '  |   '     .|
    ||  ,
    '          `. ;.,.---' ,'       `.   `.. `-'  .-' /_ .'    ;_   ||
    || 
    '              V      / /           `   | `   ,'   ,' '.    !  `. ||
    ||/            _,-------7 '              . |  
    `-'    l         /    `||
     |          ,' 
    .-   ,' ||               | .-.        `.      .'     ||
     `
    '        ,'    `".'    |               |    `.        '. -.'       `'
              /      ,'      |               |,'    \-.._,.'/'
              .     /        .               .       \    .''
            .`.    |         `.             /         :_,'.'
              \ `...\   _     ,'-.        .'         /_.-'
               `-.__ `,  `'   .  _.>----''.  _  __  /
                    .'        /"'          |  "'   '_
                   /_|.-'
    \ ,".             '.'`__'-( \
                     / ,"'"\,'               
    `/  `-.|
    At Essence 11+, it is also Charizard.

  21. - Top - End - #201
    Barbarian in the Playground
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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion IV: Roll Join Debate

    You already know how to get Giga-motes.

    For a functional fire breathing lizard, 5-dot behemoths are your friend.

    Fire Breath is a 4-dot attuned artifact weapon analog.

    Soak in the 50/50 range (and aggravated soak around 25).

    Flight, massive size, half a dozen flavors of unkillability...

    Was there ever any doubt?


    Of course, we can make this interesting and skip the obvious route.

    Would a Tyrant Lizard with ~200 mutation points suffice as a starting point? One that channels essence, is fully sentient, and (as a special one time only bonus) eats souls? Shape Forged Servant and the varied Grace Forging Charms.

    Does it need to look like its master? Evoke it while under the effect of Assumption of the Person's Heart, and it'll look like whoever you're disguised as.

    Do you need a few hundred of its spawn to have a party with the nice people bringing the torches and pitchforks? Bestial Transformation will turn any number of them into mini versions of the Big Guy - and even if they are much weaker, the rest of the mob (and they) will be utterly convinced that they are, in fact, the horrible monsters they appear to be.

    Oh, wait. Happy thoughts, happy thoughts.

    Emotion Weaving Style will rewrite the Motivation of all mortals nearby so tat their one purpose in life is to feed themselves to dance around and throw flowers at the beast. Translucent Dream Sheathing Technology ensures that it can, and will, fit inside any properly made ball - and be utterly loyal to the one who captures it that way (best not make it sentient, in this case).

    Principle of Worlds means that each time a fight starts, strange beasts appear and begin to call out attack names. You haven't lived until you've seen a small tentacle demon call out "Panther, I choose you! Use Glorious Thunderbolt!" when your iconic Solar Circle goes against the Mask of Winters, to have a mini-Luna respond on the other side: "Maskie! Show them how you've leveled up! Use Pointless Intricate Plot!"

  22. - Top - End - #202
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    Ahem. I may just have beaten you to the punch there.
    Quote Originally Posted by The-Mage-King;
    Hydrogen Dioxide! It kills more people than ANYTHING ELSE! Billions are CHRONICALLY ADDICTED to it!

    INCLUDING BABIES! THINK OF THE BABIES!
    Currently not doing any Let's Plays or AARs or anything, on account of being a lazy git. I'll get around to it eventually. Really.

    Avatar by A-Rainy-Knight

  23. - Top - End - #203
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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion IV: Roll Join Debate

    And I stole the concept, ran with it, have a word document full of artifacts and notes on setting, and am eventually running a game on it.
    ...
    With 240% more DBs!
    Recent Homebrew: The Socialite | The Crystalline: Memory Altering Construct Race | Sanguine Hand, a ToB Discipline of blood and cruelty
    Homebrew Signature | NEW Homebrew Collection
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thanqol View Post
    It's like the feng shui version of an orbital death laser.

  24. - Top - End - #204
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    Where are my royalties, then?

    I DEMAND MY AMBROSIA, DAMNIT!

    EDIT: At least a link to all this would be nice.
    Last edited by Cyborg Mage; 2011-04-28 at 08:05 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by The-Mage-King;
    Hydrogen Dioxide! It kills more people than ANYTHING ELSE! Billions are CHRONICALLY ADDICTED to it!

    INCLUDING BABIES! THINK OF THE BABIES!
    Currently not doing any Let's Plays or AARs or anything, on account of being a lazy git. I'll get around to it eventually. Really.

    Avatar by A-Rainy-Knight

  25. - Top - End - #205
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    I haven't posted it yet, but I can send you the word document if you want?
    (starts organising a dot of Cult for you)
    Recent Homebrew: The Socialite | The Crystalline: Memory Altering Construct Race | Sanguine Hand, a ToB Discipline of blood and cruelty
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thanqol View Post
    It's like the feng shui version of an orbital death laser.

  26. - Top - End - #206
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    Nah, I'll wait. Don't have Word on this laptop. If you can convert it to PDF or something, that would work.
    Quote Originally Posted by The-Mage-King;
    Hydrogen Dioxide! It kills more people than ANYTHING ELSE! Billions are CHRONICALLY ADDICTED to it!

    INCLUDING BABIES! THINK OF THE BABIES!
    Currently not doing any Let's Plays or AARs or anything, on account of being a lazy git. I'll get around to it eventually. Really.

    Avatar by A-Rainy-Knight

  27. - Top - End - #207
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    I'm not completely sure how, but I could just copy it into a PM for you.
    Recent Homebrew: The Socialite | The Crystalline: Memory Altering Construct Race | Sanguine Hand, a ToB Discipline of blood and cruelty
    Homebrew Signature | NEW Homebrew Collection
    Thanks to all my avatar artists, especially to Paisley for my avatar of Vivian, cowardly cryophoenix.
    Quote Originally Posted by Thanqol View Post
    It's like the feng shui version of an orbital death laser.

  28. - Top - End - #208
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    It should be an option in the Print menu.
    Quote Originally Posted by The-Mage-King;
    Hydrogen Dioxide! It kills more people than ANYTHING ELSE! Billions are CHRONICALLY ADDICTED to it!

    INCLUDING BABIES! THINK OF THE BABIES!
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  29. - Top - End - #209
    Titan in the Playground
     
    Lix Lorn's Avatar

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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion IV: Roll Join Debate

    I guess, but it'd be easier just to put it in a PM. DXD
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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion IV: Roll Join Debate

    Quote Originally Posted by Lochar View Post
    And I can layer 4000 doses of a poison on a weapon, so all I have to do is hit you once and you get at least a -2000 internal penalty.
    I don't recall the Charm in question, but does it specifically stack poison penalties? The usual way that getting hit by poison works is that they happen one after the other, not all at once.
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