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    WhiteWizardGirl

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    Default Can Redcloak...(SoD SPOILERS!)

    Can he resurrect his family?
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    Chimera

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    Default Re: Can Redcloak...(SoD SPOILERS!)

    Quote Originally Posted by martianmister View Post
    Can he resurrect his family?
    If the soul wants to return.

    Edited for my own idiocy...
    Last edited by Caractacus; 2011-05-19 at 02:54 PM.
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    Kish's Avatar

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    Default Re: Can Redcloak...(SoD SPOILERS!)

    If he's 17th level. If the Dark One grants him True Resurrection. If all the members of his family, notably his brother, agree to come back. And, oh yeah...if Redcloak's master lets him.
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    "You are what you do. Choose again, and change." --Miles Vorkosigan

    "The really unforgivable acts are committed by calm men in beautiful green silk rooms, who deal death wholesale, by the shipload, without lust, or anger, or desire, or any redeeming emotion to excuse them but cold fear of some pretended future. But the crimes they hope to prevent in the future are imaginary. The ones they commit in the present--they are real." --Aral Vorkosigan

    Quote Originally Posted by The Giant View Post
    This, in a nutshell.
    Yes, exactly.

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    Default Re: Can Redcloak...(SoD SPOILERS!)

    Quote Originally Posted by martianmister View Post
    Can he resurrect his family?
    In theory he can as he is a high enough cleric to do it. The possibility he can/will do this?

    Right Eye: Yeah, I doubt he'll open up that can of worms.
    His other relations: He could if he's high enough level to perform a True Resurrection which Belkar hinted at he's high enough to do, though I'm not sure why he'd want to this late in the game.

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    Default Re: Can Redcloak...(SoD SPOILERS!)

    Yeah, what Kish said. Redcloak needs diamonds for the ressurection, and I very much doubt Xykon would let him spend 15k worth of diamonds to ressurect some 1 HD goblin mooks.
    Last edited by Morty; 2011-05-19 at 02:52 PM.
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    Chimera

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    Default Re: Can Redcloak...(SoD SPOILERS!)

    Even if Redcloak got together the diamonds necessary in a way that meant no loss to Xykon, the point above about permission bulks pretty large.

    The Brother issue and the Eye issue suggest that Xykon would throw a nasty fit - and with Xykon, you have NO idea what that might mean.

    I would LOVE Redcloak to get his family back - he certainly deserves it, but he'd pretty much have to do it behind Xykon's back I should think...and I wouldn't go there...
    Caractacus

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    BardGuy

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    Default Re: Can Redcloak...(SoD SPOILERS!)

    He definitely couldn't res his parents - they'd be too old by now.

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    Default Re: Can Redcloak...(SoD SPOILERS!)

    Quote Originally Posted by Fitzclowningham View Post
    He definitely couldn't res his parents - they'd be too old by now.
    What does that have to do with being able to res them? In D&D, you can resurrect anyone of any age.

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    RangerGuy

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    Default Re: Can Redcloak...(SoD SPOILERS!)

    Quote Originally Posted by Fitzclowningham View Post
    He definitely couldn't res his parents - they'd be too old by now.
    I think that brings up an interesting point... If someone dies, and then people try to resurrect this someone after some years... Would they age accordingly?

    If the answer is "yes", then Redcloak probably can't resurrect his family, as they'd be beyond their natural lifespan (don't forget the Crimson Mantle allows RC to live longer than his lifespan would allow, and Goblins are short-lived).
    Last edited by Roland Itiative; 2011-05-19 at 03:43 PM.

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    Chimera

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    Default Re: Can Redcloak...(SoD SPOILERS!)

    Quote Originally Posted by Roland Itiative View Post
    I think that brings up an interesting point... If someone dies, and then people try to resurrect this someone after some years... Would they age accordingly?

    If the answer is "yes", then Redcloak probably can't resurrect his family, as they'd be beyond their natural lifespan (don't forget the Crimson Mantle allows RC to live longer than his lifespan would allow, and Goblins are short-lived).
    Unless the rules have changed since I played (and that was a looong time ago, so they may have), they return at the age they died, but then continue ageing normally. When someone dies of old age, however, that's it. Hence, Roy's dad's comment about really dying after being resurrected a number of times...
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    WhiteWizardGirl

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    Default Re: Can Redcloak...(SoD SPOILERS!)

    So, he can resurrect them without any problem about rules, right?
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    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    Chimera

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    Default Re: Can Redcloak...(SoD SPOILERS!)

    I *think* that that's the case, yes. But as I am waaay out of date, I am open to those who can show me to be wrong...
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    Default Re: Can Redcloak...(SoD SPOILERS!)

    Quote Originally Posted by martianmister View Post
    So, he can resurrect them without any problem about rules, right?
    Rephrase "about rules."
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    "You are what you do. Choose again, and change." --Miles Vorkosigan

    "The really unforgivable acts are committed by calm men in beautiful green silk rooms, who deal death wholesale, by the shipload, without lust, or anger, or desire, or any redeeming emotion to excuse them but cold fear of some pretended future. But the crimes they hope to prevent in the future are imaginary. The ones they commit in the present--they are real." --Aral Vorkosigan

    Quote Originally Posted by The Giant View Post
    This, in a nutshell.
    Yes, exactly.

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    AKA_Bait's Avatar

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    Default Re: Can Redcloak...(SoD SPOILERS!)

    Quote Originally Posted by martianmister View Post
    So, he can resurrect them without any problem about rules, right?
    In 3.5, which is the OotSverse rules-wise, mostly, yes.

    But, as said, the whole Xykon thing is the major issue. Also, consider too that Redcloak might not want to face his remaining family after what he did to Right Eye.
    Last edited by AKA_Bait; 2011-05-19 at 04:42 PM.
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    IronWilliam's Avatar

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    Default Re: Can Redcloak...(SoD SPOILERS!)

    I think he could, but in SoD he chose not to raise right-eye, and 15k worth of diamonds could be hard to find even if xycon would let him.
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    Barbarian in the Playground
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    Default Re: Can Redcloak...(SoD SPOILERS!)

    By the rules, he can raise them. But would they return
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    just to be cannon fodder for Xykon again? Heck, would Right-Eye trust his backstabbing older brother after being set up like that?

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    PirateGuy

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    Default Re: Can Redcloak...(SoD SPOILERS!)

    Xykon would probably kill and zombify them the second they re-appeared.
    Last edited by CletusMusashi; 2011-05-19 at 06:20 PM.

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    BlueKnightGuy

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    Default Re: Can Redcloak...(SoD SPOILERS!)

    Xykon would not give up 15k worth of diamonds to raise any number of goblins, save for Right eye as he's not an average goblin, just because of the cost.

    He'd also not give up the cash to raise Right eye, as he's not loyal, and also near natural dead at time of disintigration, so it wouldn;t be worth it.

    and Redcloak couldn't do it without Xykons permision, as he's too much of a spineless coward

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    Default Re: Can Redcloak...(SoD SPOILERS!)

    Quote Originally Posted by AKA_Bait View Post
    But, as said, the whole Xykon thing is the major issue. Also, consider too that Redcloak might not want to face his remaining family after what he did to Right Eye.
    Right. If he raised the rest of his family, he’d have to grow the balls to lie to them about why Right-eye didn’t get raised.

    Quote Originally Posted by Swordpriest View Post
    By the rules, he can raise them. But would they return
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    just to be cannon fodder for Xykon again?
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    It’s likely Right-eye would be the only one aware that they’d be returning as little more than canon fodder. The rest of his family died long before Redcloak ever met Xykon, and the dead generally don’t watch the living (Eugene and Roy being notable exceptions).


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    Heck, would Right-Eye trust his backstabbing older brother after being set up like that?
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    Xykon certainly doesn’t think he would.
    Last edited by Shhalahr Windrider; 2011-05-19 at 11:04 PM.
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    BlackDragon

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    Default Re: Can Redcloak...(SoD SPOILERS!)

    all the other points are valid, but the diamonds required would not be a factor. team evil is high enough level that mere fiscal wealth is of little consequence. they have a city and all its coffers, and that's just what they recently captured, and does not even contemplate what they already had stashed away. redcloak probably has a large stash of suitable diamonds in his own reserve, just for use should he want/need to perform any resurrections.

    the real issues are: 1) would they want to come back? and 2) what would xykon do? my guess is 1) no, because 2) if they came back, xykon would turn them into undead for fun.
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    RedKnightGirl

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    Default Re: Can Redcloak...(SoD SPOILERS!)

    If Redcloak resurrected his mother, sister, older brother, etc., the first question they would ask him would be, "Where's your younger brother?"

    Redcloak does not want to answer that question, so he won't ever resurrect them, all other concerns aside.
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    Ettin in the Playground
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    Default Re: Can Redcloak...(SoD SPOILERS!)

    Quote Originally Posted by SPoD View Post
    If Redcloak resurrected his mother, sister, older brother, etc., the first question they would ask him would be, "Where's your younger brother?"

    Redcloak does not want to answer that question, so he won't ever resurrect them, all other concerns aside.
    "He wouldn't come" would be the easiest response, but more importantly IMO is the fact that Redcloak couldn't protect them right now; its not till Xykon is dead and the goblins are a free people that it would even start seeming probable.

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    Default Re: Can Redcloak...(SoD SPOILERS!)

    Even if Redcloak out"lives" Xykon, the only person I can see him trying to resurrect is his Sister, since a) she was young (possibly even younger than Right-Eye), b) she didn't get to die fighting or anything (unlike Redcloak's Uncle, Eldest Brother, and Right-Eye's family), and c) he views her death as something that could have been prevented were it not for Right-Eye's actions.
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    BlackDragon

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    Default Re: Can Redcloak...(SoD SPOILERS!)

    I like the way everybody (other than Kish) is assuming Redcloak is high enough level to cast True Resurrection--because he'd have to be to be able to resurrect people who died more than 30 years before the online strip started! The only member of his family who he *could* raise, assuming he's only high enough level for a standard Resurrection, is Right-Eye--and we all know darned well why THAT won't happen.

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    Default Re: Can Redcloak...(SoD SPOILERS!)

    Quote Originally Posted by factotum View Post
    I like the way everybody (other than Kish) is assuming Redcloak is high enough level to cast True Resurrection
    Or maybe we're just assuming he can just in this purely hypothetical situation for the sake of discussion. Besides, it's not like he can't eventually reach 17th-level.
    THE SCRYING SENSOR AT THE END OF STRIP #698 WAS ZZ'DTRI'S (SOURCE)

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    Quote Originally Posted by martianmister View Post
    Mongolian hordes. Lots of lots of mongolian hordes. With a mongolian warrior chief. They will conquer Gobbotopia and rename it as Mongolitopia. Because that makes so much sense.

    Also ponies.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gift Jeraff View Post
    elan: dad plz dont kill roy
    tarquin: ok
    Damn it! Now I have to rewrite the script for #917.
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    Barbarian in the Playground
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    Default Re: Can Redcloak...(SoD SPOILERS!)

    Redcloack´s relationship with his own past is contradictory... for one hand, all his actions and goals are motivated for it; on the other hand, He is afraid to confront his past mistakes and sins (like killing his own brother to protect Xykon for the sake of the Plan), so He really hides of it. I doubt he is prepared to face his long dead family and give them explanations about his doings.
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    Default Re: Can Redcloak...(SoD SPOILERS!)

    Quote Originally Posted by factotum View Post
    I like the way everybody (other than Kish) is assuming Redcloak is high enough level to cast True Resurrection--because he'd have to be to be able to resurrect people who died more than 30 years before the online strip started! The only member of his family who he *could* raise, assuming he's only high enough level for a standard Resurrection, is Right-Eye--and we all know darned well why THAT won't happen.
    Redcloak is at least level 15. True Res isn't that far away.

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    Default Re: Can Redcloak...(SoD SPOILERS!)

    Quote Originally Posted by HappyBlanket View Post
    Redcloak is at least level 15. True Res isn't that far away.
    Also: He has been level 15 for a long, long time. So he cannot be far away if he cannot do it it already.
    Apart from that: Scrolls! So Redcloak is two or so levels too low to cast a specific spell? Well, casting the spell from a scroll is not that hard, especially if he has time to prepare (by boosting his wis + make sure he can take the possible repercussions of a backlash).

    Now, you could assume it's hard to get level 9 scrolls but "stuff" seems to be available in general in the OotS-world. So I'd be surprised if you could not get Level 9 scrolls in some magic shop, in the Quick-E-Mart, or from ebay.

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    WhiteWizardGirl

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    Default Re: Can Redcloak...(SoD SPOILERS!)

    Also remember, his other family members could be more supportive about Dark One's plan.
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    Default Re: Can Redcloak...(SoD SPOILERS!)

    Quote Originally Posted by Tvtyrant View Post
    "He wouldn't come" would be the easiest response,
    ...And one not even the densest family members would accept.

    No, I'm with SPoD on this one.
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