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  1. - Top - End - #1
    Halfling in the Playground
     
    BlueKnightGuy

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    Default Best +0 Race/Template for Skirmisher?

    I'm building this Swift Hunter, and I can't decide what race or template to take, in order to be really effective. My Whole group is really optimized, so I would like to be competitive.

    To be honest my build is rather full and I don't know what will be really useful, whether a talent or +dex or spells.
    I've been suggested Illumian UurKrau (In order to cast on Dexterity and become SAD), but i think that races which gives me +Dex are Fairly better, expecially because of the bow thing.

    My Talents are:
    1st: Point Blank Shot
    Flaw 1: Weapon Focus (Longbow)
    Flaw 2: Dead Eye
    3rd: Travel Devotion
    Scout Bonus: Swift Hunter
    6th: Improved Skirmish
    9th: Sword of the arcane order
    12th: Greater Manyshot
    15th: Woodland Archer


    What should I choose and why?
    Can you also list me some good templates (+0) which gives me dexterity?
    Thanks :D

  2. - Top - End - #2
    Ettin in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: Best +0 Race/Template for Skirmisher?

    if you have the spare change, go with a whisper gnome and buy a permanent collar of umbral metamorphosis, giving you the dark template for free.

    your hide check will be out the wazoo, you will have darkvision, you have all the great stuff about being a gnome with the added bonus of 30 foot speed. bonus to dex and con, hit to strength and cha, which are probably not a focus for you anyway.

    and the dark template? hide in plain sight. you are now the best and most esteemed archer that nobody has ever seen because you are just that good at hiding
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  3. - Top - End - #3
    Titan in the Playground
     
    Keld Denar's Avatar

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    Default Re: Best +0 Race/Template for Skirmisher?

    Whisper Gnomie (Races of Stone) is probably your best bet. They are small (yay hide bonuses), but have 30' movement (yay skirmish). Other amiable choices include Goblin (again small, yet 30' move), Kobold (with web enhancement, natural weapons are AWESOME, plus Slight Build), Strongheart Halflings (bonus feat is bonus), and Human (we're better than you at everything. Yes, even that), with honorable mention to Wild Elf (+Str/Dex good, -Con bad) and Lesser Tiefling (same racial bonuses, half the angst).
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  4. - Top - End - #4
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    Default Re: Best +0 Race/Template for Skirmisher?

    I like Poison Dusk Lizardfolk (MMIII), even though they do have +1 LA.

    Tasloi aren't that strong, but the hide/move silently bonuses stand up to those of a whisper gnome, and the climb speed can come in handy.
    Last edited by Greenish; 2011-06-01 at 11:28 AM.
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    Default Re: Best +0 Race/Template for Skirmisher?

    Air Goblin (from the SRD) have a +4 dex, so that would be quite nice for a skirmisher, and are (yay) small sized.

    In the LA 0 Template department, though, there isn't a whole heck of a lot that does any real help for that. If Dragon material is allowed, Unseelie Fey gives +2 dex and cha, but you lose 2 con and str, so it might not be a great choice. Spring might be a good choice, as your party will love you for Vernal Touch.
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  6. - Top - End - #6
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    Default Re: Best +0 Race/Template for Skirmisher?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lisselys View Post
    I've been suggested Illumian UurKrau (In order to cast on Dexterity and become SAD), but i think that races which gives me +Dex are Fairly better, expecially because of the bow thing.
    Swift Hunter builds are always pretty feat-intensive, so you need every bonus feat you can get. I don't really see how Illumian UurKrau helps all that much. +1 on Dex-based checks isn't worth the opportunity cost of a bonus feat, nor do I see how that would directly improve "shoot things with lots of arrows". +1 caster level doesn't seem all that useful, either, particularly as a ranger your caster level is going to be ridiculously low with or without the +1. Most of your spells as an archery-based swift hunter are going to be swift action spells with a fixed duration (generally 1 round) where caster level isn't going to matter much. Edit: Hmm... Illumian UurKrau might be worth it, but Illumians don't get a Dex bonus. And as you may have already discovered, there are no decent LA +0 templates that increase Dex.

    So your best race is going to be something with a bonus feat:

    Human (PHB/SRD) - Bonus feat, extra skill points, and since most swift hunter builds feature a lopsided mix of base classes, not a lot of multiclass XP penalty headaches.

    Azurin (Magic of Incarnum) - There are a couple soulmelds that can help buff archery, notably Incarnate Avatar (chaos) and Sighting Gloves. The extra +1 attack or +2 damage bonus may put them slightly ahead of humans, since all those scout/ranger levels means you'll hardly miss the extra skill points, but you may run into favored class issues if you play with multiclass XP penalties.

    Strongheart Halfling (FRCS) - Bonus feat *and* Dex +2. However, the Str -2 and small size may ding your potential damage a couple points, and favored class isn't all that swift-hunterish. Still... pebbles make you deadly.

    Frostblood Half-Orc (Dragon Magic) - They get Endurance as a bonus feat, but if you get Endurance later, such as with 3 levels of Ranger, you can pick up any bonus feat you qualify for instead.

    Frostblood Orc (Dragon Magic) - Similar to the half-orc, they get the Endurance feat swap, and have Str +4, but pay for it with a Wis -2, which makes ranger spellcasting more difficult. Ask your DM if you can combine this with Water Orc from UA to get Con +2.

    Races without bonus feats:

    Wood Elf (MM/SRD) - The primary reason to go elf is to dip Cloistered Cleric and pick up the Elf domain (PB Shot as a bonus feat). Pick a deity with the Travel domain, such as Sehanine Moonbow or Fenmarel Mestarine, and you can pick up three feats that are essential to most archery builds: PB Shot, Travel Devotion, and Knowledge Devotion. Pick a War deity, such as Vandria Gilmadrith or Shevarash, and you can get Weapon Focus: Longbow instead of the Travel Devotion. While elves put Skittles to shame when it comes to subraces, Wood Elf is one of the best for archery: Str +2, Dex +2, Con -2, Int -2, and Favored Class: Ranger. If you don't need the Str bonus and would rather not take the Con penalty, Painted Elves (Sandstorm, Dex +2, Int -2) or Snow Elves (Frostburn, Dex +2, Cha -2) are also good picks.

    Lesser Drow (PGtF) - Excellent pick for a Crossbow-Sniper-based Swift Hunter, which extends your range for Skirmish damage out to 60'. Dex +2, and they start with EWP: hand crossbow. Add Hand Crossbow Focus (DotU) for a two-for-one deal: Rapid Reload and Weapon Focus for the hand crossbow. The Travel domain may also be available via Vhaeraun, but it looks like he has the Drow domain (Lightning Reflexes) instead of the Elf domain. He may also be dead (apparently killed by Eilistraee, who was later killed by one of Lolth's uber-porn-queens).

    Hengeyokoi Crane or Sparrow (Oriental Adventures) - In hybrid form, +2 Dex, -2 Wis, and a 20' fly speed. Although not mentioned in the OA Web Errata, the 3.5 OA update in Dragon #318 removed the LA +1 and changed their type to humanoid with the shapechanger subtype. This makes them the only race in the game with a fly speed at ECL 1 with no LA... which means at low levels if you give them a bow, they are pretty much "Behold I Am Become Death" to anything that can't get indoors or shoot back. Just a few caveats: you lose your Dex bonus outside of your hybrid form, the Wis penalty makes ranger spellcasting a little more difficult, and the favored class is Wu Jen.

    Air Goblin (SRD/UA) - As already mentioned, Dex +4 and 30' speed. Also a good pick if you want to go Dragonborn of Bahumat to pick up flight but still want a Dex bonus: the Dex -2, Con +2 from Dragonborn leaves your attribute mods as Str -2, Dex +2.

    Kobold (MM/RotD) - A stronger pick for a melee-based Swift Hunter (adding three natural attacks on top of iterative unarmed strikes), but also a good pick if you want flight via Dragonborn: attribute mods wind up as just Str -4. If you're advancing skirmish damage with Dragon Devotee 4/Unseen Seer 4, you can also squeeze another level of Sorcerer into the build with the Draconic Rite of Passage feat and get access to 4th level Sorcerer spells.

    Tiefling (PGtF or Savage Progression article): Two flavors here that can get rid of the LA +1: the Lesser Planetouched option from PGtF (p. 191) leaves the Dex +2, Int +2, Cha -2 attribute mods intact, but changes the type to humanoid with the extraplanar subtype. This version is ideal if you take Sword of the Arcane Order and want the Int bonus for your Wizard spells. The Savage Progression version is a little weaker, attribute mods are Dex +2, Cha -2, but still has the Outsider type, which has certain advantages (proficient with all martial weapons, immune to charm/hold person, alter self/polymorph shenanigans). You can get the Int +2 and the rest of your racial abilities by taking your racial template level sometime later, or just decide never to take it at all.

    Whisper Gnome (Races of Stone) - Other than the Dex bonus, I can't say I'm really a fan of Swift Hunter Whispers. If you're going to go small, I think the strongheart halfling or air goblin edges them out. The only advantage I can see would be if you're going the HiPS/sniper route, where the +4 racial bonus to Hide can help offset that -20 Hide penalty.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lisselys View Post
    Can you also list me some good templates (+0) which gives me dexterity?
    As previously mentioned, Unseelie Fey is the only one without any LA, but it's not widely regarded as a legitimate or balanced template. Half-Fey (LA +2) is a bit more reasonable: Dex +2, Con -2, Wis +2, Cha +4, fly speed = 2x land speed, and SLAs up the wazoo, including charm person at will. Also available as two racial template levels.

  7. - Top - End - #7
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    Keld Denar's Avatar

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    Default Re: Best +0 Race/Template for Skirmisher?

    Quote Originally Posted by Darrin View Post
    Swift Hunter builds are always pretty feat-intensive, so you need every bonus feat you can get. I don't really see how Illumian UurKrau helps all that much. +1 on Dex-based checks isn't worth the opportunity cost of a bonus feat, nor do I see how that would directly improve "shoot things with lots of arrows". +1 caster level doesn't seem all that useful, either, particularly as a ranger your caster level is going to be ridiculously low with or without the +1. Most of your spells as an archery-based swift hunter are going to be swift action spells with a fixed duration (generally 1 round) where caster level isn't going to matter much.
    You missed the Sigilword part of UurKrau. Alone, Uur and Krau kinda suck, as you pointed out. Together, however, they rekey your bonus spells from Wisdom (or Int for SotAO) to Dex. This makes you a bit more SAD and gives you more bonus spells assuming you are pumping Dex up as high as possible.

    Sigilwords are the true power of Illumians, the main reason to use that race nearly every time. Most of them suck, but a few (Aeshkrau, Uurkrau, NaenHoon) are really good, situationally.
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  8. - Top - End - #8
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: Best +0 Race/Template for Skirmisher?

    Maybe the Xeph from Expanded Psionics? They get a movement bonus like 3 times a day or something, plus a dex bonus. I like them.
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