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  1. - Top - End - #571
    Titan in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: Togo's Planar Adventure set partly in Sigil (OOC)

    Before I post a reaction from Godot IC, I thought I'd check a few things:

    First, is Dragonsight picking up any discrepancies between what she's seeing and what she's sensing?

    Second, knowledge checks to make guesses about the nature of the ritual and identity of the Warlord:

    Know arcana: (1d20+22)[27]
    The Planes: (1d20+9)[27]
    History: (1d20+9)[19]
    Currently climbing out of a heckofa two weeks at work/RL. Now working to catch up. Thanks for your patience.

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  2. - Top - End - #572
    Ettin in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: Togo's Planar Adventure set partly in Sigil (OOC)

    Hey Togo, just checking you saw my post with all the Knowledge checks, above your last post - no worries if it takes a while to answer, I just wanted to make sure you didn't miss it due to the timing. I will also hold off on IC posting until Knowledge-check results come in.
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    Quote Originally Posted by The_Snark View Post
    I must not argue on the Internet.
    Internet argument is the mind-killer.
    It is the little death that brings total aggravation.
    I will face my annoyance.
    I will permit it to pass over me and through me.
    When it has gone past I will turn my inner eye to see its path.
    Where the irritation has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain.


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  3. - Top - End - #573
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: Togo's Planar Adventure set partly in Sigil (OOC)

    Sorry I haven't been posting. I was at work all weekend, and yesterday morning I came down with food poisoning ...will try to post today.
    Pointing out hypocrisy is not disrespect.


    RIP Tasha, April 1986 to November 25th, 2008. 22 years and 7 months of being the best kitty ever. You will be missed forever.

    RIP Finney Jr., June 1998 to March 18, 2011. Nearly 13 years of being the best goldfish ever. You, as with Tasha, will be missed forever.

  4. - Top - End - #574
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    Default Re: Togo's Planar Adventure set partly in Sigil (OOC)

    Umbriel
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    Likely to be important:
    Religion: 47 (on the prayer, and the warlord)


    You have never heard of this incantation before in your life. If it's a prayer, it should be calling upon the known attributes of the deity.

    The suit of armour doesn't give you any religious clues. You can't see the person wearing it.

    Arcana: 42 (opening a portal from Sigil, what does it generally take?

    Portal abound within Sigil, which is why it is called the City of Doors. Opening a portal requries a particular 'key' which can be anything - a snatch of a particular song, a colour, a small object. No other ritual is required.

    Magical portals connecting locations inside Sigil and outside Sigil are otherwise thought to be impossible. This is why Sigil is also known as 'The Cage'

    Planes: (same question as Arcana re Sigil, any clue what plane they're contacting? also possibly relevant to warlord)

    Not really enough information to go on.

    Local: 25 (identity of warlord?)
    Nobility & Royalty: 30 (ditto)


    You can't really see the face of the warlord, or any identifying marks.

    The term warlord would suggest an organisation or nation where the war leader was different from the overall leader.

    History: 31 (ditto, plus understanding the context of the prayer)

    Hm.. if there are historical references to either the prayer or the warlord, they aren't obvious.

    Several people have mentioned wars to you during the game, but there's no obvious way to tell if this is related.

    Architecture & Engineering: 19 (is the way they have the mirrors set up reflective of any particular place/faction's preferred architecture? also, how stable does the whole configuration look?)

    The two mirrors facing eachother will reflect eachother. The mirror on the cealing is suspended so as to be partly in Sigil, and partly on another plane. The hanging mirrors seem relatively stable. It's a bit of a lash-up job, but it's been organised by someone who knows what they're doing.


    Godot
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    No, no discrepencies. The room is dark, but but even a human could see things well enough to see what you can see.

    Arcana: 27

    Portal abound within Sigil, which is why it is called the City of Doors. Opening a portal requries a particular 'key' which can be anything - a snatch of a particular song, a colour, a small object. No other ritual is required.

    Magical portals connecting locations inside Sigil and outside Sigil are otherwise thought to be impossible. This is why Sigil is also known as 'The Cage'

    Planes: 27

    Not really enough information to go on. The bit about 'planes of thought' may simply be a reference to the outer planes, suggesting that he's calling someone not in the outer planes.

    History: 19

    Not really enough to go on.



    Background information obtained earlier may still be relevent:

    http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showp...&postcount=275

  5. - Top - End - #575
    Ettin in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: Togo's Planar Adventure set partly in Sigil (OOC)

    Regarding Rhion's action:

    Taking 10 for Hide, +8 from size bonus: 33.

    Also, Rhion tries to read Kalinor's face and voice from where he perches, if possible. The main thing he looks for is if he sounds sincere in his devotion to this masked figure, or faking it to some end.

    Taking 10 on Sense Motive: 25.
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  6. - Top - End - #576
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    Default Re: Togo's Planar Adventure set partly in Sigil (OOC)

    Rolling Know: Religion and History cause it failed IC.

    Know: Religion-(1d20+20)[32]
    Know: History-(1d20+20)[40]
    ATTENTION ANYONE WHO I'M PLAYING WITH:
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  7. - Top - End - #577
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    Default Re: Togo's Planar Adventure set partly in Sigil (OOC)

    @Togo:
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    Okay, rephrasing: with the 47 on Knowledge (Religion), do I know of any deity who is commonly called by the titles in Kalinor's incantation? If not, Umbriel will just go with 'might be Ahsile', but I wanted to check before she says, 'Could be Ahsile but I'm not familiar with most of those titles for her'.

    If this needs a new check,
    Knowledge (Religion) (1d20+35)[49]
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    Quote Originally Posted by The_Snark View Post
    I must not argue on the Internet.
    Internet argument is the mind-killer.
    It is the little death that brings total aggravation.
    I will face my annoyance.
    I will permit it to pass over me and through me.
    When it has gone past I will turn my inner eye to see its path.
    Where the irritation has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain.


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  8. - Top - End - #578
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    Default Re: Togo's Planar Adventure set partly in Sigil (OOC)

    Quote Originally Posted by Toliudar View Post
    "Regardless, I say that we have to cut this short, and now."
    Regarding this part, do we really? I mean, it's not clear if Kalinor is planning to bring the warlord here or do something similarly irrevocable, or simply to contact him and get (de)briefing. In the second case, cutting him right now would cost us a great deal of information. Besides, the way Nephira gave us this felt more like it's something to observe rather than to prevent.

    What I'd suggest is taking our places and readying some actions in case it all starts to go south, and then simply listen.

    Also sorry if discussing this here would feel a little meta-ish (word?), but I dislike making long planning conversations IC. I'll take it to IC if you'd all want it that way though.
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  9. - Top - End - #579
    Ogre in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: Togo's Planar Adventure set partly in Sigil (OOC)

    Rhion
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    You're well hidden, as far as you know. :-)

    Sense motive - He's sincere in his devotion, but... it's a formula to him. It's more like, this is someone he knows well, and he feels that there should be some element of bowing and scraping going on, but he's basically comforable talking to this person.


    Simon
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    Religion - You have never heard of this incantation before in your life. If it's a prayer, it should be calling upon the known attributes of the deity.

    The suit of armour doesn't give you any religious clues. You can't see the person wearing it.

    History
    There's not really enough to go here. You don't recognise anything from the prayer(?) as matching something historical, although the 'realms of high thought' may just be a reference to the outer planes.
    It has come up in the past that Kalinor claimed to be from Chaldecott, and that there was some kind of war going on there recently. This warlord might be related somehow? The armour doesn't look like anything someone from Chalecott might wear, since they have a reputation as an fairly refined and effette bunch. Maybe things have changed since the war? The construction, if not the style, of the armour would match that region.



    Umbriel
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    You're not aware of any deities that would be called by those particular titles, although 'The Liar' is a distressingly common term for any number of evil or chaotic gods or outerplaner entities.
    You would have thought that Ahsile, being a deity of vanity as well as illusion, would not appreciate being called either a Liar or a Hellion. Ingenue of Illusions would fit, as would Liar sort of, except that again neither title is something she'd want to hear. It would be a bit like calling out to a deity of war as 'oh violent bully!'. Technically accurate perhaps, but...
    Then again, with her world being conquered, maybe she's less picky these days?
    Last edited by Togo; 2011-11-23 at 08:26 AM.

  10. - Top - End - #580
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    Default Re: Togo's Planar Adventure set partly in Sigil (OOC)

    Quote Originally Posted by Cespenar View Post
    Regarding this part, do we really? I mean, it's not clear if Kalinor is planning to bring the warlord here or do something similarly irrevocable, or simply to contact him and get (de)briefing. In the second case, cutting him right now would cost us a great deal of information. Besides, the way Nephira gave us this felt more like it's something to observe rather than to prevent.

    What I'd suggest is taking our places and readying some actions in case it all starts to go south, and then simply listen.

    Also sorry if discussing this here would feel a little meta-ish (word?), but I dislike making long planning conversations IC. I'll take it to IC if you'd all want it that way though.
    Godot is (of course) not suggesting killing anyone. But Kalinor has lied to them, and seems to have sent them to the Foundry on a wild goose chase, perhaps just to get them out of the temple. And you assume that Nephira's motives align completely with Kalinor's, and it seems clear that they do not. That suggests to me that cutting short the ritual would be A Good Thing. I will of course be open to a different consensus.

    Unfortunately, I have no way to talk with Rhion at the moment, from his current position, so can't say any of this IC.
    Currently climbing out of a heckofa two weeks at work/RL. Now working to catch up. Thanks for your patience.

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  11. - Top - End - #581
    Ettin in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: Togo's Planar Adventure set partly in Sigil (OOC)

    Quote Originally Posted by Toliudar View Post
    Godot is (of course) not suggesting killing anyone. But Kalinor has lied to them, and seems to have sent them to the Foundry on a wild goose chase, perhaps just to get them out of the temple. And you assume that Nephira's motives align completely with Kalinor's, and it seems clear that they do not. That suggests to me that cutting short the ritual would be A Good Thing. I will of course be open to a different consensus.
    There probably has been some miscommunication. I didn't say that Godot suggests killing anyone, nor do I assume that Nephira's motives align with Kalinor's. I'm also a little puzzled as to how you got there.

    I'm agreeing that cutting short the ritual would be a good thing, if that ritual is actually planning to bring that armored guy here. BUT, if Kalinor will simply talk and get his orders from this guy, why shouldn't we listen and gather some precious information?
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  12. - Top - End - #582
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    Default Re: Togo's Planar Adventure set partly in Sigil (OOC)

    Quote Originally Posted by Cespenar View Post
    There probably has been some miscommunication. I didn't say that Godot suggests killing anyone, nor do I assume that Nephira's motives align with Kalinor's. I'm also a little puzzled as to how you got there.

    I'm agreeing that cutting short the ritual would be a good thing, if that ritual is actually planning to bring that armored guy here. BUT, if Kalinor will simply talk and get his orders from this guy, why shouldn't we listen and gather some precious information?
    I thought that you were referencing killing from your comment:

    In the second case, cutting him right now would cost us a great deal of information.
    'Cutting' in this instance might have meant 'cutting him short', but might have also been more literal. Godot's a playwright: 'cutting' someone implies their removal. I'd disagree with your analysis of Nephira's probably motives.

    Besides, the way Nephira gave us this felt more like it's something to observe rather than to prevent.
    If all Nephira wanted us to do was watch, she could have simply told us about it afterward.

    Again, if consensus is 'watch and listen', then I'll follow that lead. Godot can keep murmuring to herself under her breath to maintain the morale boost, just in case.
    Currently climbing out of a heckofa two weeks at work/RL. Now working to catch up. Thanks for your patience.

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  13. - Top - End - #583
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    Default Re: Togo's Planar Adventure set partly in Sigil (OOC)

    Quote Originally Posted by Toliudar View Post
    I'd disagree with your analysis of Nephira's probably motives.



    If all Nephira wanted us to do was watch, she could have simply told us about it afterward.
    Actually, no: Nephira indicated to Umbriel that she's afraid of Kalinor, and believes he'll be able to find out if she's told anyone about his activities, which is why she's going for the "arrange for us to find out about it" approach rather than just telling us outright. Umbriel may be the only one who knows that right now, though. I'll try to get an IC post up later today, but Umbriel will be voting for "watch and listen for now".
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    Quote Originally Posted by The_Snark View Post
    I must not argue on the Internet.
    Internet argument is the mind-killer.
    It is the little death that brings total aggravation.
    I will face my annoyance.
    I will permit it to pass over me and through me.
    When it has gone past I will turn my inner eye to see its path.
    Where the irritation has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain.


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  14. - Top - End - #584
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    Default Re: Togo's Planar Adventure set partly in Sigil (OOC)

    Derk
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    At what point did you cast true seeing? Or was your 'note to self an indication that you were casting it at that point? It only has a very short duration.

  15. - Top - End - #585
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    Default Re: Togo's Planar Adventure set partly in Sigil (OOC)

    Quote Originally Posted by Togo View Post
    Simon
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    Religion - You have never heard of this incantation before in your life. If it's a prayer, it should be calling upon the known attributes of the deity.

    The suit of armour doesn't give you any religious clues. You can't see the person wearing it.

    History
    There's not really enough to go here. You don't recognise anything from the prayer(?) as matching something historical, although the 'realms of high thought' may just be a reference to the outer planes.
    It has come up in the past that Kalinor claimed to be from Chaldecott, and that there was some kind of war going on there recently. This warlord might be related somehow? The armour doesn't look like anything someone from Chalecott might wear, since they have a reputation as an fairly refined and effette bunch. Maybe things have changed since the war? The construction, if not the style, of the armour would match that region.
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    Do my Lenses of Revelation give me anything on the armored dude? If he hails from an Evil-Aligned Outer Plane, he glows Red. If he's Undead, he glows Bone-White. Otherwise he glows Green.
    ATTENTION ANYONE WHO I'M PLAYING WITH:
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  16. - Top - End - #586
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    Default Re: Togo's Planar Adventure set partly in Sigil (OOC)

    Quote Originally Posted by Togo View Post
    Derk
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    At what point did you cast true seeing? Or was your 'note to self an indication that you were casting it at that point? It only has a very short duration.
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    I cast it together with the quickened shield, right after Godot suggests cutting Kalinor short. I know it only lasts 13 minutes, but it is one of my few self-buffs and I have slots to burn. I had rather prepare myself three times in vain than getting caught unprepared once.
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  17. - Top - End - #587
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    Default Re: Togo's Planar Adventure set partly in Sigil (OOC)

    Sthrer will do a Know Planes check to see if she's heard or any demon lords or similar with these titles.

    (1d20+9)[24]
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  18. - Top - End - #588
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    Beholder

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    Default Re: Togo's Planar Adventure set partly in Sigil (OOC)

    Xiulcoatl will also use his knowledge.

    Knowledge (Arcana): (1d20+15)[26]
    Knowledge (Religion): (1d20+15)[26]
    Knowledge (The Planes): (1d20+15)[35]
    Pointing out hypocrisy is not disrespect.


    RIP Tasha, April 1986 to November 25th, 2008. 22 years and 7 months of being the best kitty ever. You will be missed forever.

    RIP Finney Jr., June 1998 to March 18, 2011. Nearly 13 years of being the best goldfish ever. You, as with Tasha, will be missed forever.

  19. - Top - End - #589
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    Default Re: Togo's Planar Adventure set partly in Sigil (OOC)

    Pretty epic post there Togo, by the way. Plays out like an actual movie scene.
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  20. - Top - End - #590
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    Default Re: Togo's Planar Adventure set partly in Sigil (OOC)

    Simon
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    All the figures glow Green in your sight, including the image of the armoured warlord.


    Derk
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    That's fine, I just wanted to make sure I hadn't missed it earler.


    Sthrer
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    Planes: The titles aren't familiar, with the exception of 'the Liar' which could probably apply to most demon lords or devils you care to think of. Mirrors and image are quite specific terms. There are demons and devils who use illusions, and you've heard tales of 'mirror demons', but nothing really fits very well.

    The portal in the cealing is doubtless one of the gates that Sigil, 'city of doors' is famous for having so many of. As such, it could go literally anywhere. The fact they've stuck a mirror halfway though it is odd... unless they need the mirror to be on both sides at the same time?


    Xiulcoatl
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    Arcane
    They're using a scrying mirror. Scrying into or out of Sigil is supposed to be impossible. However, there is some kind of planar portal in the cealing. Maybe that helps?

    Religeon
    You don't recognise any of the titles used, or the ceromony. They don't sound much like anything a deity would want to be called.

    The Planes
    The phrase 'realms of high thought' is probably just a reference to being on the outer planes.
    The portal in the cealing is doubtless one of the gates that Sigil, 'city of doors' is famous for having so many of. As such, it could go literally anywhere. The fact they've stuck a mirror halfway though it is odd... unless they need the mirror to be on both sides at the same time?

  21. - Top - End - #591
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    Default Re: Togo's Planar Adventure set partly in Sigil (OOC)

    Togo
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    Thanks...and here I was hoping to get some awesome new info based on the True Seeing .

    And I would like to back up Cespenar's comment: that was a pretty awesome post to read.
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  22. - Top - End - #592
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    Default Re: Togo's Planar Adventure set partly in Sigil (OOC)

    Sorry that I have been dead to the world last few days ... I work retail, and with Black Friday ... even now I feel like my head was injected with a numbing agent.
    Pointing out hypocrisy is not disrespect.


    RIP Tasha, April 1986 to November 25th, 2008. 22 years and 7 months of being the best kitty ever. You will be missed forever.

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  23. - Top - End - #593
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    Default Re: Togo's Planar Adventure set partly in Sigil (OOC)

    Umbriel
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    Noone has any spellcasting powers that you can detect, including the warlord. Kalinor may have a few magical items on his person, but they're not active, or within line of sight. The large central mirror and the mirror in the cealing are magical divination devices in their own right.


    Godot
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    Sense motive - They're being honest with eachother. They may be avoiding areas of conversation where they know they disagree - the bit about the goddess not answering their prayers for example - but on the whole they're being frank with eachother, to the point of acknowledging eachother's criticisms. They certainly know eachother well.
    The warlord would be happy to lay down her life for the goddess. And everyone else's life too.


    Please note that Kalinor looks to be about to shut down the scrying mirror. If you want to intervene before he does so, you'd need to act now.
    Last edited by Togo; 2011-11-28 at 01:36 PM.

  24. - Top - End - #594
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    Default Re: Togo's Planar Adventure set partly in Sigil (OOC)

    Just to note, I'm here and watching, but Umbriel is satisfied with the way Godot is handling this at present, so is going to stand back and let the diplomat do her thing
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    Quote Originally Posted by The_Snark View Post
    I must not argue on the Internet.
    Internet argument is the mind-killer.
    It is the little death that brings total aggravation.
    I will face my annoyance.
    I will permit it to pass over me and through me.
    When it has gone past I will turn my inner eye to see its path.
    Where the irritation has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain.


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  25. - Top - End - #595
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    Default Re: Togo's Planar Adventure set partly in Sigil (OOC)

    I appreciate I've been posting a lot of material quite quickly, but this is largely because I'm ill, in bed with the 'flu, and thus have the time to write.

    If people are getting confused and need another summary, do let me know. Most of this should just be clarfiying existing information.

    If the plot to action ratio is getting too slanted, it should by now be fairly obvious where you can go to smite some bad guys.

  26. - Top - End - #596
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    Default Re: Togo's Planar Adventure set partly in Sigil (OOC)

    Togo, I just wanted to thank you again for crafting a game with a complex and nuanced narrative, and clear, engaging characters. We're all pretty freakin' lucky to be in this with you!
    Currently climbing out of a heckofa two weeks at work/RL. Now working to catch up. Thanks for your patience.

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  27. - Top - End - #597
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    Default Re: Togo's Planar Adventure set partly in Sigil (OOC)

    Quite. Togo, this is a most fantastic game. And I hope it continues to the very end.
    ATTENTION ANYONE WHO I'M PLAYING WITH:
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  28. - Top - End - #598
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    Default Re: Togo's Planar Adventure set partly in Sigil (OOC)

    Seconded Thirded, and also, Togo? I just reread the meeting with 'Elisha'. SO much more enlightening now - kudos, that was really neatly done

    Have a ?

    Notes are in the spoilerblock for my own convenience, nobody else needs to read (but you can, if you want to have a better idea of what Umbriel's thinking, or join in spoilered theorizing )
    Spoiler
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    The basics: girl in the library claimed to be Elisha = Ahsile reflected. Ahsile fought Cyric as an illusion, and her reflection was trapped within the Well of Souls. The titles Kalinor was giving the goddess don't match Ahsile, but he made them up himself, so there's no reason for them to.

    Everything she says and does is intended to communicate, but she never gives a straight-out answer, so...

    I'm focusing mostly on the words and the books here. The body language may have a whole extra layer of meaning, but I'll leave that for later.

    Kalinor? I don't think he's tried to talk to me. Is he one of the people who's looking for an artefact of some kind?
    He's tried to talk to her a lot. Second part is a guiding question, not a statement; leading our thoughts to the artifact.

    She puts her book, Debunking the Mystrean Heresy, back on the shelf, and starts browsing for another.
    Mystra = goddess of magic. What's the Mystrean Heresy?

    Who are you people?
    Question that her followers want answered.

    She plucks Help in the Desert, a Collection of Traveller's Aids for the Wasteland Explorer from the shelf, but doesn't seem inclined to open it. She glances around expectantly.
    Links back to story of Zhentarim caravan in the desert, carrying the Well of Souls, everyone died with silver-mirror eyes?

    So... you're just helping Kalinor out? You're not after this thing for yourselves?
    Seeking information on behalf of her followers.

    She pulls out another book, IM to LT - Zuggtmoy's Pharmacological Grimoire, tilts her head to read whatever this has revealed on the shelf, and then puts it back.
    K is in that part of the alphabet: Korolis, god of slimes? Zuggtmoy is the Demon Queen of Fungi.

    Is that usual? I mean why give it away?
    Seeking information on behalf of her followers, again.

    I'm just a student. I don't have a powerful artefact. But if I did, I'd want to keep it.
    Is her motivation in seeking the artifact just wanting something shiny? And if she's 'just a student', what is she studying? That might qualify as a flat-out truth though, and hence would be a lie. So would 'I don't have a powerful artefact', of course... perhaps she has the artifact and just can't get away with it?

    Wasn't there a rumour of some kind of lady with some big ugly servants snooping around? Oh, and I haven't seen the blond girl with the wings, but I heard people talking about her.
    First is pointing us at Lycanthe, if we didn't know already. Second... flip the meanings. She HAS seen a blond girl with wings, but hasn't heard anything about her. Offering us a lead, or misdirection?

    Mark of a good being? Isn't it the mark of a being that's already got power, enough not to need more?
    This is probably a reference - to Cyric, arguing he doesn't need the mirror? Somebody else? Or just saying the mirror should go to someone who needs it, i.e. her?

    I'm just a little frustrated at the moment. Do you know how it is when you're stuck in the house with someone and you have to tiptoe around them all the time?
    Supports the hypothesis that she's stuck in Cyric's temple, or in the mirror itself? If in the mirror, who would she be stuck with?

    Still, it's nothing to me if you want to give it away. Not really my business. I don't know where that blond girl is, or who was talking about her. It's not something I keep track of. Not my... problem!
    This seems likely to be mostly lies, so invert the meaning to get the truth. She wants us to follow up on the winged blond girl.

    In triumph pulls out a newish heavy bound tome from the lowest shelf, A History of the Blood War, and puts it on the table behind her. The weight of the volume and the awkward angle causes her to wince, and she is massaging her wrist as she stands up.
    Blood War = eternal demon/devil conflict. Is she involved? Army of demons attacked Chaldecott, and we know she intervened there.
    And here I'll make an exception and discuss body language... pain, associated with demons? Rubbing her wrist = reference to a bracelet? Chains? A hand gripping her wrist (see the Grip below)?


    My problem is I need to something to show my master, I need him to stop ignoring me. I know what I need to do, I know how to do it, I just don't have the power.
    So, who is her master? Should we invert this, so she wants him to ignore her, to leave her alone? Last sentence may be ambiguous enough to not be reversed.

    Does that make me a bad person?
    This makes me feel rather nervous about her planar alignment

    She yanks another book off the shelf, Prisoner of Politics, and puts in on the table behind her.
    This is making me feel that imprisonment by Cyric / in the mirror is increasingly likely. Related to deific politics?

    So why can't you just fetch this thing? Is it guarded? Disguised? Hidden in heart of an honest merchant?
    Just guiding our thoughts, I think. 'Honest merchant' = reference to Kalinor? Does he have a further hidden agenda?

    My master? He doesn't like people knowing about him, I won't try and tell you his name. Vanity isn't really something he values.
    Hard to pick out how much of this is inverted and how much is straight, but if she will try to tell us his name, and she's (involuntarily, probably) working for Cyric, the next little bit may make more sense. Is she "Vanity"?

    He's not that bad. He's not like an evil lord of evil intent on conquering the world. And it's not like I'm being held in durance vile or anything. It's just that getting him to deal with me personally would be really good. I want him to notice I'm there.
    If it's Cyric, or some other evil power of evil, assuming the first three sentences are inverted makes a lot of sense. Last two... could be inverted (she needs him to stop paying attention so she can get away) or could be straight-ish (she needs the mirror to deal with someone).

    She pulls out a book entitled In the Grip - Meditations on Dilemmas and Paradoxes.
    This may be confirmation bias, but this reinforces to me that she's being held somewhere, and may also be a hint to invert her previous words.

    Of course the place is crowded, and he's always around. It would different if he were always away and it was just me, three servants and a houseguest.
    That reads like it should be inverted - advice to potential rescuers/helpers? Her, three servants and a houseguest - who are the servants and the houseguest?

    I could leave, of course. But where would I go?
    If inverted, she can't leave, as her followers think may be the case. If not inverted - perhaps this ties back to a dilemma or paradox keeping her where she is.

    I don't really need an answer to that. It's not something that would come up for a good while. Here I am babbling about things that are no use to you whatsoever in finding your artefact.

    She exchanges the book in her hands for a newish volume entitled Cyric's Domain - Views of a Post-Conquest World.
    These two combined? I'm getting concerned that Cyric has managed to coerce her into working for him; the conflict of interests may not come up for a 'good while', but the possibility is there. This book seems to mesh quite well with 'evil lord of evil intent on conquering the world', and the possible inversion in 'I won't try and tell you his name'.

    My name? Didn't I say it was Elisha? It's hardly a secret.
    And sigh, Elisha = Ahsile, and I'm kicking myself for missing this first when she said Elisha, and again when I reread the Ahsile story.

    And aren't you the only ones here? Apart from me, of course.
    Just indicating that she's not really there?

    Biting her lip, she pulls down another book, Shrine Architecture in Tropical Climes, and hugs it to her chest. As Xiulcoatl speaks she laughs, but then gives him a level look, with the hint of a smile.
    Tropical climes - the place they're invading? The Maldeport public baths? What's the weather like in Chaldecott and/or the Great Northern Forest? Or a hint to defenses inside the temple of Cyric?

    I'm not a captive, no. And would I really fit in your place, with all my baggage?
    Outright statement in the first sentence = should probably be inverted. What's all her 'baggage'? Past ties, connections/deals she regrets? Link back to Prisoner of Politics?

    What business? You have to look good to get ahead. Have you tried a green accessory of some kind? Like a jade pin or something?
    I feel we should obtain a jade pin before heading to the temple of Cyric Real jade.

    If I was actually a member of this place, I could just walk in through the front door.
    General hint for infiltrating places like the temple of Cyric? Or just bantering with Umbriel?

    You recognise illusions when you see them? How would you know?

    So, an illusion is something you can divine or dispel, and you can always spot them because you can divine or dispel them? That works.

    No particular ideas here.

    Did you ever wonder how the illusion feels about it all? Obviously they're not real. But shouldn't a sophisticated illusion include realistic displays of emotions? So what's a realistic emotion for an illusion that's about to be dispelled?
    Hmm. Let's quote the Ahsile story here.
    "Cyric tried a variety of ways of defeating her, including poisoning her with a hairbrush, enchanting her with a cursed flower, and trapping her reflection in an alien glass, girded about with twisted men. All these attempts failed except the mirror, which did catch her reflection, but it turned out, as do most stories about Ahsile, that she was an illusion all along, and had simply been keeping Cyric busy while mischief was being worked elsewhere."
    Is the one we're talking to the reflection of Ahsile, trapped within the mirror?


    well I have to get back to reading. The titles don't tell you what you need to know, it's not just the first word that's important. You have to read the actual (oof) book.
    This was probably just a hint to pay proper attention to what she was doing/saying, which Umbriel at least completely overlooked at the time

    It needs to be real jade. Don't forget?
    Jade. Got it


    Also, Togo, there are a couple of checks I'd like to roll:
    Spoiler
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    Spellcraft and Knowledge (Arcana) to remember spells for which jade is a required spell component.
    Spellcraft: (1d20+32)[36]
    Arcana: (1d20+35)[41]

    Religion, for everything I can remember on the goddess Ahsile.
    (1d20+35)[55]

    Religion, on the Mystrean Heresy.
    (1d20+35)[50]
    PCs:
    Spoiler
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    Word:
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    Quote Originally Posted by The_Snark View Post
    I must not argue on the Internet.
    Internet argument is the mind-killer.
    It is the little death that brings total aggravation.
    I will face my annoyance.
    I will permit it to pass over me and through me.
    When it has gone past I will turn my inner eye to see its path.
    Where the irritation has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain.


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  29. - Top - End - #599
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    Default Re: Togo's Planar Adventure set partly in Sigil (OOC)

    Wow, that's quite the theorizing you've got there. Although I'd think that mentions of paradox might refer to 'mirror logic', like in Alice Through The Looking Glass.
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  30. - Top - End - #600
    Ettin in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: Togo's Planar Adventure set partly in Sigil (OOC)

    Quote Originally Posted by GuesssWho View Post
    Wow, that's quite the theorizing you've got there. Although I'd think that mentions of paradox might refer to 'mirror logic', like in Alice Through The Looking Glass.
    Seems quite likely. Almost everything I've written in the spoilerblock is wild speculation, I was just noting down ideas for interpretation as they came up (i.e., just because it doesn't have a question-mark after it, that doesn't mean I'm at all sure of it).

    I think at the moment my current theory is
    Spoiler
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    Elisha is the reflection of Ahsile who was trapped in the glass by Cyric. She has some ability to interact with the real world via mirrors, hence why she could help the Duchess, and she can project illusions. Cyric still has the mirror; Elisha wants her followers to get hold of it instead, presumably because they'll use it as she tells them. What exactly are her motives? That seems like the million dollar question...

    Summary of mirror's history:
    -Originally came from the Monkey's Spiral? (Korolis and Demogorgon teamed up to take and hold the Spiral, and at some point Korolis got hold of the mirror.)
    -Korolis used the mirror as a weapon to trap souls. Around the time of his fall, he lost it in a fight with Khodan-Ra, god of lightning and battles. Korolis was quite thoroughly killed and his corpse interred in the Tomb of Korolis, on a wandering star. The Children of Korolis are still around though.
    -The mirror next showed up with the elves of the Great Northern Forest. They used it to open a gate to the elemental Plane of Earth, fleeing a prophecy of doom, and left the mirror with one of their trusted allies, a human elementalist.
    -A Daughter of Korolis attacked the elementalist(s) and made off with the mirror (possibly after he tried to use it to resurrect a child, with unfortunate consequences, but that might be propaganda).
    -Her ship was sunk in a storm on the Sea of Stars, and the mirror taken by the sahuagin.
    -An adventuring party attacked the court of the sahuagin, took the mirror, and sold it in the nearby country of Chaldecott.
    ---------------gap to be filled in here
    -Somehow the Zhentarim got hold of the mirror, and brought it to Cyric (possibly just one of their early exercises in extraplanar expansion?)
    -Cyric used the mirror to try to trap the goddess Ahsile, but while it successfully caught her reflection, it turned out to be only an illusion of Ahsile, the goddess' real aims were elsewhere.
    PCs:
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    Word:
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    Quote Originally Posted by The_Snark View Post
    I must not argue on the Internet.
    Internet argument is the mind-killer.
    It is the little death that brings total aggravation.
    I will face my annoyance.
    I will permit it to pass over me and through me.
    When it has gone past I will turn my inner eye to see its path.
    Where the irritation has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain.


    Avatar by Castaras. Thanks!

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