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  1. - Top - End - #61
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    Default Re: [Base 3.5]The Tendersoul [Showable, Peaches]

    a first level Tendersoul knows all the spells on they're list.
    However, she must choose six orizons, and two first level spells. She has these spells as spontaneous casting from now on.
    Say, three days later. She decides she needs a different spell. At midday she goes to a sunny clearing/backyard/temple to the Goddess and prays, she can now reselect her eight spells, which replace her old selections as spontaneous casting.

    The Pureheart still can't die, mind you. They just return with fast healing 1 instead of 10 until they recover to 1+ hp, in which case they're normal 10 fast healing kicks in.
    but sure, changed hit die for the Pureheart to d8

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  2. - Top - End - #62
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    Default Re: [Base 3.5]The Tendersoul [Showable, Peaches]

    Question: how many spells per day do they get?

    Let's say we've got a Tendersoul with 20 Charisma (+5). They can cast each spell level 15 times? Or is it 15, 14, 13, 12, etc for 0, 1, 2, and 3 level spells?
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  3. - Top - End - #63
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    Default Re: [Base 3.5]The Tendersoul [Showable, Peaches]

    The later summon expert spells should work more like Summon Monster I-IX think... As in you should have an option to get a higher few higher level experts instead of more lower level ones. The exact mechanics don't have to be the same as that series, just... when a bridge is in danger of collapsing that 3rd level guy with a +12 to Knowledge [Architecture and Engineering] and Craft [Stone Mason/Bricklayer] who comes free with all the bricks and mortar he can lay in 4 days could be key. When you are 20th level and the dimensional boundaries have been ripped asunder in the area and you need to enact the counter-ritual precisely in the next 10 minutes, or a 20 mile radius sphere on 6 separate planes will vanish from existance? Those 9 guys who come loaded down with ritual components and +10 to Knowledge[Arcana], Knowledge[Religion], Knowledge[The Planes], Spellcraft may not even have a hope of pulling it off. Note that I was going to say that their 3 HD wouldn't be that good for surviving in the middle of a storm of elemental energy... but then I remembered what this class is all about thematically, and thought that theoretically they should totally be able to make that happen. Haven't run the actual mechanics though.
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  4. - Top - End - #64
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    Default Re: [Base 3.5]The Tendersoul [Showable, Peaches]

    Quote Originally Posted by SamBurke View Post
    Or is it 15, 14, 13, 12, etc for 0, 1, 2, and 3 level spells.
    ^-- This.



    Not sure what your talking about with summon expert.

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  5. - Top - End - #65
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    Default Re: [Base 3.5]The Tendersoul [Showable, Peaches]

    Higher level summoning should be able to get a few higher level experts, as an option to many lower level ones.
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  6. - Top - End - #66
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    Default Re: [Base 3.5]The Tendersoul [Showable, Peaches]

    Also, it appears that you have to wait until level five to get ORISONS at will. WUT?

    A few spells to add (sorry if any are already on the list):
    1st.
    Tenser's Disk. (This is pretty much only able to help. Supporting bridges,
    buildings, wrecked ships, and the like).
    Mage Armor/Shield/Etc. Protecting other people is good.

    2nd.
    See Invisibility.
    Detect Thoughts.
    False Life (Extra Temp. HP)
    Rope Trick (Hiding!)

    3rd.
    Magic Circle against Evil/Chaos.
    Nondetection.
    Displacement.
    Fly.

    4th.
    Minor/Major Creation

    7th.
    Refuge


    9th.
    Word of Recall

    Possibles:
    1st.
    Enlarge/Reduce Person.
    Illusion line -varies. 1,2,3, 5,6,7- (Other than phantasms, you could suggest all, as well. This would make it every level other than 9. And seriously, this is one of the most underpowered line of spells. Can it hurt?)

    3rd.
    Heroism
    Hold Person
    Deep Slumber

    4th.
    Wall of Ice

    I understand that you're trying to get rid of some of the power, but I don't think that these would mess it up all too much. The one I'm really begggggggging you to add is Tenser's Disk. I LOVE that spell, despite its apparent uselessness.

    EDIT: also, this homebrew seems applicable.
    Last edited by SamBurke; 2011-07-14 at 12:43 AM.
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  7. - Top - End - #67
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    Default Re: [Base 3.5]The Tendersoul [Showable, Peaches]

    Quote Originally Posted by DracoDei View Post
    Higher level summoning should be able to get a few higher level experts, as an option to many lower level ones.
    I'll check it out.
    Quote Originally Posted by SamBurke View Post
    Also, it appears that you have to wait until level five to get ORISONS at will. WUT?
    You know... I don't know of any class to get a whole spell level at will. So 0's at level five doesn't seem a stretch.
    3'rds at level 15 does, however. But not totally, due to restrictions.
    A few spells to add (sorry if any are already on the list):
    Tenser's Disk. (This is pretty much only able to help. Supporting bridges,
    buildings, wrecked ships, and the like).
    Mage Armor/Shield/Etc. Protecting other people is good.
    See Invisibility.
    Detect Thoughts.
    False Life (Extra Temp. HP)
    Rope Trick (Hiding!)
    Magic Circle against Evil/Chaos.
    Nondetection.
    Displacement.
    Fly.
    Minor/Major Creation
    Word of Recall
    Refuge

    Possibles:
    Enlarge/Reduce Person.
    Illusion line (Other than phantasms. And seriously, this is one of the most underpowered line of spells. Can it hurt?)
    Heroism
    Hold Person
    Deep Slumber
    Wall of Ice

    I understand that you're trying to get rid of some of the power, but I don't think that these would mess it up all too much. The one I'm really begggggggging you to add is Tenser's Disk. I LOVE that spell, despite its apparent uselessness.

    EDIT: also, this homebrew seems applicable.
    Add spell levels.

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  8. - Top - End - #68
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    Default Re: [Base 3.5]The Tendersoul [Showable, Peaches]

    Every Divine Class (save the absolutely crappy Paladin/Ranger Lists) gets all known 0 level spells at will. Every Arcane Class gets its known 0 Level spells at will. That's the point of an orison/cantrip.
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  9. - Top - End - #69
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    Default Re: [Base 3.5]The Tendersoul [Showable, Peaches]

    Quote Originally Posted by SamBurke View Post
    Every Divine Class (save the absolutely crappy Paladin/Ranger Lists) gets all known 0 level spells at will. Every Arcane Class gets its known 0 Level spells at will. That's the point of an orison/cantrip.
    I really do not believe that.
    Its not mentioned anywhere, and theres a reason 0's are listed in Spells known and Spells Per Day.

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  10. - Top - End - #70
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    Default Re: [Base 3.5]The Tendersoul [Showable, Peaches]

    In the pathfinder system, at least, all casters can cast lvl 0 spells at will. I dont think 3.5 DnD casters can though., So both lvl 0 at will and lvl0 spells per day are correct depending on the system.
    Last edited by Togath; 2011-07-14 at 12:41 AM.
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  11. - Top - End - #71
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    Default Re: [Base 3.5]The Tendersoul [Showable, Peaches]

    Quote Originally Posted by Togath View Post
    In the pathfinder system, at least, all casters can cast lvl 0 spells at will. I dont think 3.5 DnD casters can though.
    ... Then I just learned another reason why I like Pathfinder better. None the less, every things for 3.5, so I'll stick with it and take from Pathfinder when I can.

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  12. - Top - End - #72
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    Default Re: [Base 3.5]The Tendersoul [Showable, Peaches]

    Snap, wut? Wow. Sorry, there, Cipher. Pathfinder is indeed awesome. Level 0 spells that are not at will? OUCH. Can someone say nerfed spellcasters? (Kinda. Not.)
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  13. - Top - End - #73
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    Default Re: [Base 3.5]The Tendersoul [Showable, Peaches]

    Quote Originally Posted by SamBurke View Post
    Snap, wut? Wow. Sorry, there, Cipher. Pathfinder is indeed awesome. Level 0 spells that are not at will? OUCH. Can someone say nerfed spellcasters? (Kinda. Not.)
    This is true, and yet surely spellcasters NEED a good nerfing (sounds rude when you say it like that...) on account of their general over-powered nature. Never-the-less, @will cantrips/orisons do make a lot of sense, with the one and only problem of cure/inflict minor being RIDICULOUSLY abusable as a result. Be careful what you port between 3.5 and pathfinder, for all their vast similarities, there are a few minor but vital differences which could screw over an entire campaign in relatively short order unless you flag them up.
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  14. - Top - End - #74
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    Default Re: [Base 3.5]The Tendersoul [Showable, Peaches]

    I thought PF made it so Cure Minor doesn't heal any hitpoints, it merely auto-stabilizes?
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  15. - Top - End - #75
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    Default Re: [Base 3.5]The Tendersoul [Showable, Peaches]

    I don't even remember it, but I rarely play pure clerics. As to that, it's a cantrip. At best, it means that you'll eventually be able to heal after all encounters.
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    Default Re: [Base 3.5]The Tendersoul [Showable, Peaches]

    Quote Originally Posted by SamBurke View Post
    ...l eventually be able to heal after all encounters.
    Some people consider that to be non-trivial, at least at lower levels.
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  17. - Top - End - #77
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    Default Re: [Base 3.5]The Tendersoul [Showable, Peaches]

    True, but still.
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    Default Re: [Base 3.5]The Tendersoul [Showable, Peaches]

    I like this class, reminds me of Je dit Viola. Very nice, still this is a class for a roleplayer, and powergame would fall so fast, that they break the ground when they hit.
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  19. - Top - End - #79
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    Default Re: [Base 3.5]The Tendersoul [Showable, Peaches]

    You're saying it's too weak for a powergamer, or too strong?
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    Default Re: [Base 3.5]The Tendersoul [Showable, Peaches]

    I'm saying about all the powergames I know, do evil things, or semi evil things, or as with the Paladin the class is made to fall, lots of powergamers if they can take paladin levels only for their use in blackguards.
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  21. - Top - End - #81
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    Default Re: [Base 3.5]The Tendersoul [Showable, Peaches]

    Well, that's their OOC fault. When my Paladins fall, it's because I want them to fall, or deliberately do something that might make them fall as a character issue.

    But agreed. This class has that added to make sure powergamers can't misuse.
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  22. - Top - End - #82
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    Default Re: [Base 3.5]The Tendersoul [Showable, Peaches]

    Quote Originally Posted by DracoDei View Post
    I thought PF made it so Cure Minor doesn't heal any hitpoints, it merely auto-stabilizes?
    It does, but if you merely port over the bits of PF you like, you miss these things out. It was merely a cautionary comment, nothing more.

    It's perfectly possible to powergame a LG character by the way, just means more RP effort on behalf of the player, and I find most of the serious powergamers I come across aren't too hot on their RP.

    Quote Originally Posted by SamBurke View Post
    When my Paladins fall, it's because I want them to fall, or deliberately do something that might make them fall...
    I never do this, if my paladin is going to fall, it's because my DM has set up a situation where I'm likely to do something horrendous in the name of righteousness and good. I've always preferred it that way, since to become a paladin you are not only 'chosen', but then have to undergo rigorous mental and physical training. This is not something done by whimsical or uncertain characters in my experience, let alone the fact that deliberately doing something which may make you fall is certainly not usual behaviour for a holy warrior who derives abilities from his adherance to a strict moral code...

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  23. - Top - End - #83
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    Default Re: [Base 3.5]The Tendersoul [Showable, Peaches]

    Quote Originally Posted by Veklim View Post

    I never do this, if my paladin is going to fall, it's because my DM has set up a situation where I'm likely to do something horrendous in the name of righteousness and good. I've always preferred it that way, since to become a paladin you are not only 'chosen', but then have to undergo rigorous mental and physical training. This is not something done by whimsical or uncertain characters in my experience, let alone the fact that deliberately doing something which may make you fall is certainly not usual behaviour for a holy warrior who derives abilities from his adherance to a strict moral code...
    Technically, only did this once, because of a special setup. (If any other players who know who Corin Thunderfist is are reading, stop now!).

    Corin didn't actually want to be a paladin, the death of his paladin brother Cor (due to Corin's own handiwork, long story) forced him to, because of family inheritance and tradition.
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