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  1. - Top - End - #631
    Ogre in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: GitP PrC Contest Chat Thread IV

    Split HP pool is not scary to a caster. Not a well-played caster. A well-played caster has negation for anything, if he doesn't, he fails. That's how they get away with d4 hit die. Split casting, and costing spell slots to use would work.
    Other possibilites include:
    • Weakened Caster Level and DC while doing so
    • Death of one having complications for the others
    • The original caster having to concentrate to control them
    • The original caster having to make some other sacrifice to control them.
    • Not giving them new spell levels, but improved caster level


    That's not everything you could do, but that's a nice list to start with.

    In news regarding my own entry, mine should be mechanically finished, I'm still working on the fluff, which normally is the first thing for me. I've got some ideas though, and I'm letting them simmer. Peaches are nice, in particular I'd like to get some thoughts on the feat list. A few of them I think might be a little weak.
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  2. - Top - End - #632
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    Default Re: GitP PrC Contest Chat Thread IV

    For splitting into two, consider having them be under a kind of effect as if they had two negative levels, except not removeable, plus the split hp pool and shared casting pool.
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  3. - Top - End - #633
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    Default Re: GitP PrC Contest Chat Thread IV

    Ah, curses. I was hoping to put my homebrewing gloves back on and re-enter this time, but it looks like someone beat me to the "swarm of corvidae" theme. Now I feel like I'll be stepping on someone's toes.
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  4. - Top - End - #634
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    Default Re: GitP PrC Contest Chat Thread IV

    Well, I already make them split HP and spells once they split (even spells known are split between the two, though it only relevant when you unlock the permanent split, or at spontaneous casters.) and have them gain caster levels slower and effectively lower HD for the effects of spells.

    but the screw up of the action economy still makes it hard to balance properly, while his best spell is still a few levels behind a true caster, casting two 6th level spells is probably better then a single 8th level one.


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  5. - Top - End - #635
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    Default Re: GitP PrC Contest Chat Thread IV

    Several big changes. Reworked the wording of most of the abilities not outright changed. Changed Collateral Damage (again), before I renamed it Grand Slam. Also added (new) Collateral Damage and Roar. The saving throws for Stomp and Roar are based off of Constitution.

    Completely rewrote Mounted Warrior and As One; Mounted Warrior was too similar to (and even worse than) the Cavalier's Order of the Sword ability, and As One was just too much change in too little a time. The beast mount now gains proficiency in progressively heavier armor as he goes up in levels. Specified that the size increases from Behemoth and As One don't stack with the Brute ability. Wall Smasher now eventually ignores all hardness.

    PEACH.
    Last edited by Nihilarian; 2012-08-07 at 11:37 PM.

  6. - Top - End - #636
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    Default Re: GitP PrC Contest Chat Thread IV

    Is "sample encounter" required? Also, still looking for ideas for Necromantic Powers and undead abilities.
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  7. - Top - End - #637
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    Default Re: GitP PrC Contest Chat Thread IV

    Quote Originally Posted by Zelkon View Post
    Is "sample encounter" required? Also, still looking for ideas for Necromantic Powers and undead abilities.
    No, I leave it in there in case someone feels the need to flex their 'Fu on making a twinky signature character for it.

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  8. - Top - End - #638
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    Default Re: GitP PrC Contest Chat Thread IV

    Daft question, Errant, but do we have to make a 10 level PrC, or could we have shorter (or longer) ones if we wanted to?
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  9. - Top - End - #639
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    Default Re: GitP PrC Contest Chat Thread IV

    Looked up "necromancy spells" for inspiration. Was met with "witchcraft for the 21st century," "how to raise an undead," and the forgotten realms wiki.
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  10. - Top - End - #640
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    Default Re: GitP PrC Contest Chat Thread IV

    Quote Originally Posted by Sgt. Cookie View Post
    Daft question, Errant, but do we have to make a 10 level PrC, or could we have shorter (or longer) ones if we wanted to?
    Plenty of 5-level prestige classes are entered.
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  11. - Top - End - #641
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    Default Re: GitP PrC Contest Chat Thread IV

    Quote Originally Posted by Sgt. Cookie View Post
    Daft question, Errant, but do we have to make a 10 level PrC, or could we have shorter (or longer) ones if we wanted to?
    Quote Originally Posted by Temotei View Post
    Plenty of 5-level prestige classes are entered.
    Temotei got this one, yeah, just do what feels right. If you've got enough material to make a rock solid 5 level class, go for it. If it really feels like its longer, go for it. If you come up with a class that involves pets of the 12 signs of the Zodiac, well, make it a 12 level class and call it good. Use your judgment; just make the class so you're happy with it and it will reflect in your work.

    Quote Originally Posted by Zelkon View Post
    Looked up "necromancy spells" for inspiration. Was met with "witchcraft for the 21st century," "how to raise an undead," and the forgotten realms wiki.
    If you want some inspiration, the Playground has tons of resources outside of the SRD. Myself, if you check my sig, I've made a class called Ebon Initiate which is a necromancy-themed invoker with half a dozen or so prestige classes attached to it. Check the Homebrewer's sig for inspiration, think of books you've read, movies and TV you've watched. Just because it doesn't exist yet doesn't mean you can't make it. If there aren't spells that do what you want? Make them up. You need feats? Write em up. You're not limited to a class and its abilities; if you need to make creatures, feats and spells go for it.

    -X
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  12. - Top - End - #642
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    Default Re: GitP PrC Contest Chat Thread IV

    I know I've made feats a couple of times for my classes ^_^ Made two for my Nightsinger that I just bumped, actually.


    Quote Originally Posted by Chilingsworth View Post
    Wow! Not only was that awesome, I think I actually kinda understand Archeron now. If all the "intermediate" outer planes got that kind of treatment, I doubt there would be anywhere near as many critics of their utility.
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  13. - Top - End - #643
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    Default Re: GitP PrC Contest Chat Thread IV

    I made a feat for my entry in this contest... and meant to make more but got distracted by other things.
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  14. - Top - End - #644
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    Default Re: GitP PrC Contest Chat Thread IV

    Tell me ErrantX - I've got six days to come up with a PrC for this theme. Would a class that creates and customizes its own sapient item count?


    Quote Originally Posted by Chilingsworth View Post
    Wow! Not only was that awesome, I think I actually kinda understand Archeron now. If all the "intermediate" outer planes got that kind of treatment, I doubt there would be anywhere near as many critics of their utility.
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  15. - Top - End - #645
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    Default Re: GitP PrC Contest Chat Thread IV

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord_Gareth View Post
    Tell me ErrantX - I've got six days to come up with a PrC for this theme. Would a class that creates and customizes its own sapient item count?
    Using the word 'sapient' means it counts. Mission impossible, go make a winning entry or this forum will self-destruct and Tom Cruise will come to your house and scan you. Long time.

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  16. - Top - End - #646
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    Default Re: GitP PrC Contest Chat Thread IV

    Quote Originally Posted by ErrantX View Post
    Using the word 'sapient' means it counts. Mission impossible, go make a winning entry or this forum will self-destruct and Tom Cruise will come to your house and scan you. Long time.

    -X
    I would certainly like to win, especially after a couple of contests where I felt outright cheated of victory.

    Expect the Judices of the Pale Thorn soon.


    Quote Originally Posted by Chilingsworth View Post
    Wow! Not only was that awesome, I think I actually kinda understand Archeron now. If all the "intermediate" outer planes got that kind of treatment, I doubt there would be anywhere near as many critics of their utility.
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  17. - Top - End - #647
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    Default Re: GitP PrC Contest Chat Thread IV

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord_Gareth View Post
    I would certainly like to win, especially after a couple of contests where I felt outright cheated of victory.

    Expect the Judices of the Pale Thorn soon.
    Ooooo... Children of the Mausoleum related. Heck. Yes.

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  18. - Top - End - #648
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    Default Re: GitP PrC Contest Chat Thread IV

    Quote Originally Posted by ErrantX View Post
    Ooooo... Children of the Mausoleum related. Heck. Yes.

    -X
    I thought that might excite you.

    I'll get more work done on them soon. When they're done, can I beg you for a PEACH? I started a bit late, and with only six days to both work and edit, I'll need the help.


    Quote Originally Posted by Chilingsworth View Post
    Wow! Not only was that awesome, I think I actually kinda understand Archeron now. If all the "intermediate" outer planes got that kind of treatment, I doubt there would be anywhere near as many critics of their utility.
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  19. - Top - End - #649
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    Default Re: GitP PrC Contest Chat Thread IV

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord_Gareth View Post
    I thought that might excite you.

    I'll get more work done on them soon. When they're done, can I beg you for a PEACH? I started a bit late, and with only six days to both work and edit, I'll need the help.
    My pleasure. I'd be happy to.

    -X
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  20. - Top - End - #650
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    Default Re: GitP PrC Contest Chat Thread IV

    It's done!
    PEACH at this thread!
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  21. - Top - End - #651
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    Default Re: GitP PrC Contest Chat Thread IV

    Okay, so I might not actually get the time to write up the last of my crunch until just before the deadline, so if I could get any feedback on what is there already would be great... even just spell-checking and editing would be nice!
    I've got a few ideas for rounding out those boring 5th and 8th levels too.

    Just quickly, Lord Gareth - shrubbery jokes aside, I feel like Gardening and Horticulture should be profession skills, not craft

  22. - Top - End - #652
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    Default Re: GitP PrC Contest Chat Thread IV

    Alright, my in-laws are throwing me off the computer (I spent all of twenty minutes on it), but I have my ability names finished. Now for a time-honored Lord_Gareth tradition - based on only the names, guess what the abilities do.


    Quote Originally Posted by Chilingsworth View Post
    Wow! Not only was that awesome, I think I actually kinda understand Archeron now. If all the "intermediate" outer planes got that kind of treatment, I doubt there would be anywhere near as many critics of their utility.
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  23. - Top - End - #653
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    Default Re: GitP PrC Contest Chat Thread IV

    Pretty PEACH? I kinda don't this PrC to be a heaping mass of crap.
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  24. - Top - End - #654
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    Default Re: GitP PrC Contest Chat Thread IV

    I'm whipping out abilities as fast as I can type 'em. Be careful - they may still be hot from the friction burns.


    Quote Originally Posted by Chilingsworth View Post
    Wow! Not only was that awesome, I think I actually kinda understand Archeron now. If all the "intermediate" outer planes got that kind of treatment, I doubt there would be anywhere near as many critics of their utility.
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  25. - Top - End - #655
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    Default Re: GitP PrC Contest Chat Thread IV

    Does this close at midnight tonight or tomorrow?


    Quote Originally Posted by Chilingsworth View Post
    Wow! Not only was that awesome, I think I actually kinda understand Archeron now. If all the "intermediate" outer planes got that kind of treatment, I doubt there would be anywhere near as many critics of their utility.
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  26. - Top - End - #656
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    Default Re: GitP PrC Contest Chat Thread IV

    CRUNCH IS DOOOOOOOOOOONE!


    Quote Originally Posted by Chilingsworth View Post
    Wow! Not only was that awesome, I think I actually kinda understand Archeron now. If all the "intermediate" outer planes got that kind of treatment, I doubt there would be anywhere near as many critics of their utility.
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    Default Re: GitP PrC Contest Chat Thread IV

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord_Gareth View Post
    Does this close at midnight tonight or tomorrow?
    Worse. Two days from now.
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  28. - Top - End - #658
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    Default Re: GitP PrC Contest Chat Thread IV

    Well, I have finished the work on the Judices of the Pale Thorn, and would deeply appreciate any PEACHing or even just shorter reviews that I might get; emergency edits will need to be very swift indeed.


    Quote Originally Posted by Chilingsworth View Post
    Wow! Not only was that awesome, I think I actually kinda understand Archeron now. If all the "intermediate" outer planes got that kind of treatment, I doubt there would be anywhere near as many critics of their utility.
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  29. - Top - End - #659
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    Default Re: GitP PrC Contest Chat Thread IV

    Quote Originally Posted by Zelkon View Post
    Pretty PEACH? I kinda don't this PrC to be a heaping mass of crap.
    Let's do this.

    Fluff suggests that we are going to get a companion, cohort, whatever you want to call it, that is undead.

    Skill requirements mean you get in after level 7, which is unusual but fine. Feat requirements: I read it as any one of (Spell Focus (necromancy), Extra Turning, or Iron Will). If you wanted Spell Focus (Necromancy) and one of Extra Turning, or Iron Will then write it differently. You have misspelled Spellcasting, and you should bold the 'or' in the first sentence to make it stand out more clearly. Requiring specific spells known is probably ok, I find it inelegant but it fits what I think you want to do so go for it. Special requirement is whatever; it is probably unnecessary but not very hard either.

    Skill list looks like typical caster skills; it is anemic but I suspect this is purposeful. d4 hit die is typical for casters.

    1/2 bab and only good will is very wizard.

    6/10 casting with 2 bonus CL is painful.

    The order of what you describe for Undead Ally is kind of strange. I would start with its basic stats: where attributes come from, how many hit dice, special abilities, etc. Then make a paragraph on how you interact with it.

    Are Necromantic Powers at-will or uses/day? Do spontaneous casters decide day by day to suppress normal spells and instead use powers, or do they have powers in addition to their spells?

    Raise Undead is cheaper than standard necromancy, but also not very strong minions. Could have synergy with Destruction Retribution or whatever that Corpsecrafter feat is that causes neg energy explosions, otherwise chaff.

    Draining touch: does this heal me or give me temp hp? It becomes a nasty debuff at higher levels, but that happens at level 19 or 20, at which point I question the wisdom of a caster who is touching things. Spectral Hand exists, but even so high levels are wonky.

    Gaining a d12 hit die is rather strange... also your party might intentionally cast Sleep on people before combat to use this on them. You might want to add some sort of mind control on the enemies who are revived by this at 5th level, otherwise it's a bad idea.

    Defile Ground looks strong. Really strong. Especially since you can prepare a battlefield with it, what with the hours/level duration and all. I might make it rounds/level, which still leaves it scary but costs an action in combat.

    Cemetery is, again, long lasting which makes it stronger. Metamagic reduction is only helpful to spont casters, since prepared casters have to metamagic the night before. I see why you turn all dead into human commoners, but it's strange to imagine a dragon rising as... a human zombie. The 7th level version is really strong...

    Soul Theft is very strong. Look at Planar Binding. Look at this class feature. Cry. In addition, a save-or-die as an 8th level that doesn't get benefits from Spell Focus (Necro) or other misc stuff is probably fine even with permadeath. Kind of lame to face as a PC, but you should expect straight up murder at this level.

    Undead Sacrifice is a lot of things smushed together. Nausea for hours is a death sentence, exploding undead are good fun, and raising undead from explosions is pretty strong. You might make the type of undead strictly based on the HD of the victim, with control determined by your CL. As it stands, you could penalize your CL (negative levels are an easy way) and make vampires out of commoners.

    Disrupt Necrotic Energy is... underwhelming.

    Befriend Undeath could be lower level.

    Slay is like Finger of Death, but longer ranged, raises them as undead, and requires at least one level of this PrC to get access to. Underpowered.

    Ah, Necromantic Flexibility sort of answers the question I asked about spells known v powers. Add "that you can cast" to the end of your sentence about spont casters, otherwise you'll get a joker with that feat that lets you spend two slots of level N to get a spell of N+1 casting spells before they are supposed to.

    Bolster Undead is a waste of an action in combat. Maybe make it last [casting mod] rounds instead of one. How many times per day is this supposed to be usable?

    Improved Creation is an ok buff.

    Channel Spell is nice. Normal pet-class stuff, but necromancy has some nasty touch spells.

    Life to Undeath is like your Slay power without any of the good bits: you strip the nice stats, special abilities, natural armor... I would rather kill the critter some other way and raise it normally. This is a waste of a corpse. Maybe take out all those caveats about what it does not inherit, but make it take ten minutes to rise so it's not as good in one combat.

    Master of Necromancy is no big deal. It helps a little with the loss of 9th level spells.

    Sentient Ally is like Leadership, but you have 10 class levels to play with when a normal leader at level 17 has 15 levels. Maybe tie its number of class levels to your character level. Of course, Leadership is pretty powerful so comparing stuff to it is questionable.

    Fluff is fluff.

    All in all, the main draw of the class is the powers, not the companion. That might cost some style points (not that there are style points). The powers are not really worth trading spell levels for, but they are strong enough that the class is not underpowered in what I assume to be normal play. I pointed out a few things which are possibly too good, mostly Soul Theft. The flavor is consistent, but a little broad. I would have liked a tighter focus on making one really good undead.

  30. - Top - End - #660
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    Default Re: GitP PrC Contest Chat Thread IV

    Right, so Body of Chaos has undergone a[lies]minor[/lies]update. Anyway, it should now be complete baring any peaching, need to clarify thing, and adjustments needed for balance. As such peaching would be appreciated. My main concern is if familiar advancement might not be too much (and I am considering removing it as such). Well, that and wording, which I feel could be vastly improved in many parts even if I'm not quite sure how best to do that myself. Anyway, looks likely to be an interesting contest.

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