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  1. - Top - End - #211
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    Default Re: GitP PrC Contest Chat Thread IV

    Re: The PrC Flavor/Mechanics Discussion

    I'm kind of in the middle of the whole thing. I think PrCs are a really useful tool for fitting either function, really. They're the best venue, IMO, for highly specialized flavor, as well as really unique mechanics that may not have the ubiquity to base a 20 level class on.

    My general PrC design philosophy is to make classes that have their own unique flavor, but don't necessarily "rely" on it. I want to make it mechanically interesting and "set-apart" enough that the mechanics could show up on a variety of character types. I think the Ikaruga is actually a pretty decent example of this. A mechanical idea I really wanted to flesh out, attached to some light flavor that isn't entirely necessary for the class's function.

    That's not to say I'm against flavor-heavy PrCs. The list Djinn quoted are some of my favorites from this contest's history (my own notwithstanding) and the voters really respond well to the excellent flavor they have. So... yeah. Call me Even Steven.

    Current Contest Entries:

    Prestige Class Contest: In the Shadows -The Ghost Wyrm

    Base Class Contest: Altar of Naught - The Nihilist

    Monster Competition: Beings of Legend - The Omni Template

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  2. - Top - End - #212
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    Default Re: GitP PrC Contest Chat Thread IV

    I'll weigh in on the other side of the discussion then.

    First, let me say that classes which marry fluff and crunch to make a distinctive and memorable whole are flipping awesome. When done well, it helps a character be memorable and fun as well.

    That said, I think of classes as packages of abilities, which can get them mixed up with feats. Let's take the example of cheesy martial arts films for an example to clarify. If your master teaches you the Five Point Palm Exploding Heart Technique, that's a feat. It's one discrete thing which not everyone with similar training to you has to be able to do. If your master teaches you the Mantis style instead of the Crane style, that's a different PrC because it makes you more focused on single, powerful strikes and ending combat quickly instead of avoiding and negating your opponent's attacks and winning through attrition. Mechanically, this means you gain sneak attack or some other bonus damage instead of evasion and dodge bonuses to AC and such. Different, thematically similar PrCs. (aside: I have no idea if that is a fair analysis of any Mantis style or any Crane style. It's a decent example though.)

    There is one downfall to classes having flavor and mechanics linked, which is exemplified by the Spirit Lion Totem barbarian alternate class feature. Pounce is really, really helpful for mobility of melee characters, and far and away the easiest way to get it is via a one level dip in barb. This means, provided one wants to build a melee character who relies on full attacks, the most effective character will have some barbarian in his background. Refluffing exists: you could have hidden ferocity despite your city upbringing, it could be a secret technique taught to you by aesthetics who occasionally flip out and kill people, etc. But mechanically, that dip in barb is very good and not everyone likes refluffing like I do.

    As I just shot myself in the foot by explaining, base classes are pretty flexible. Prestige Classes... I had an example earlier about different martial arts styles, which is kind of relevant here. But my deeper concern is choosing PrCs which have flavor for their mechanical merits due to a lack of other options to get such merits. Master of Many Forms is not guilty of this: it is a class about changing shape, and it makes you better at changing shape. For a list of the offenders, consider the X stat to Y thread. Want to be so tough that weapons don't hurt you? Deepwarden does it, but you have to be a dwarf with a specific kind of goal in life. Want to be so smart that you are hard to hit? Be a Blade Singer (elf), Eternal Blade (elf), Duelist (limits your combat style), factotoum (base class), or a couple of other also niche options. That's an ability that should just be a feat.

    I also don't like strict entry requirements precisely because they require you to intend your character to enter the class. That's just a matter of taste though.

    I appear to have weighed in on every discussion, rather than just one side of one of them. Such is life.

  3. - Top - End - #213
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    Default Re: GitP PrC Contest Chat Thread IV

    Added the final bits I needed and made slight tweaks to make the class more playable.

    Quote Originally Posted by Djinn_in_Tonic View Post
    *goes to look at your class*

    Wow. That's rather awesome. And yeah...a Raysailor of Sol Invictus seems like a rather interesting candidate to become a Twilight's Guide towards the end of his or her life. That would be an intriguing character...
    Definitely. "Oh, yeah, I've sailed these stars for ages, but now as death approaches, I figured I'd aid the poor souls that soon will welcome me in their midst."
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  4. - Top - End - #214
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    Default Re: GitP PrC Contest Chat Thread IV

    Quote Originally Posted by Djinn_in_Tonic View Post
    I'd personally be very interested in such a thing. I know that, for this contest, I prefer to work alone, but a chance to produce things in tandem for a contest would be quite interesting to me.
    I threatened to do it if people were interested, you expressed interest, and I saw a lull in contest activity. Thus I present the Pairs Contest for those here interested.

    More on topic, anyone care to give some feedback for the Light of Lurking Shadows? Also, only about 2 weeks left for those who want to make changes, or have yet to submit their entries.

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  5. - Top - End - #215
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    Default Re: GitP PrC Contest Chat Thread IV

    Bump for great justice? It seems the Contest has fallen too many pages back, causing it to go unnoticed and unclosed as of yet.

    On a sidenote, I won't be able to post or vote in the coming three nights and days due to total absence (a matter which has occurred several times in the past weeks, but those times were usually only a day, two tops).
    Last edited by Morph Bark; 2011-09-30 at 09:01 AM.
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  6. - Top - End - #216
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    Default Re: GitP PrC Contest Chat Thread IV

    That was a contest I had fun working on and think it deserve a little more attention even if no new entry are coming. Maybe there's too many contest ongoing at the same time.

  7. - Top - End - #217
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    Default Re: GitP PrC Contest Chat Thread IV

    Did this die or something?

  8. - Top - End - #218
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    Default Re: GitP PrC Contest Chat Thread IV

    Quote Originally Posted by Phosphate View Post
    Did this die or something?
    Most likely Errant got busy IRL, which happens sometimes. It has been long enough that someone could just put up a voting thread... I assume someone has PM'd him already.

  9. - Top - End - #219
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    Morph Bark's Avatar

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    Default Re: GitP PrC Contest Chat Thread IV

    Quote Originally Posted by Glimbur View Post
    Most likely Errant got busy IRL, which happens sometimes. It has been long enough that someone could just put up a voting thread... I assume someone has PM'd him already.
    I've PM'd him last week and have not received a reply.

    I've put up voting threads before, but that was only with confirmation from the contest-holder that is was okay, so I'm reluctant to do so now. I won't object if anyone else puts on up though.
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  10. - Top - End - #220
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    Default Re: GitP PrC Contest Chat Thread IV

    I will try to do something with this tonight, I promise. I've been working 60+ hour weeks at my job so I don't have time for anything lately. If someone wants to put up a voting thread and be willing to manage that today, that would be fine with me as well. Very sorry guys!

    -X
    Chris Bennett
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  11. - Top - End - #221
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    Default Re: GitP PrC Contest Chat Thread IV

    Timing. xD

    Don't worry, ErrantX, I at least forgive you.
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  12. - Top - End - #222
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    Default Re: GitP PrC Contest Chat Thread IV

    Quote Originally Posted by ErrantX View Post
    I will try to do something with this tonight, I promise. I've been working 60+ hour weeks at my job so I don't have time for anything lately. If someone wants to put up a voting thread and be willing to manage that today, that would be fine with me as well. Very sorry guys!

    -X
    No worries. The contest is pretty cool and all, but getting money so you can eat and stuff should probably be a higher priority.

  13. - Top - End - #223
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    Default Re: GitP PrC Contest Chat Thread IV

    Drat. I tried to find older voting threads so I could put up one myself, but I can't find them. They're also not linked in any of the contest threads, only the announcement of the winner.
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  14. - Top - End - #224
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    Default Re: GitP PrC Contest Chat Thread IV


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    Default Re: GitP PrC Contest Chat Thread IV

    ...So... next contest?
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  16. - Top - End - #226
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    Default Re: GitP PrC Contest Chat Thread IV

    Thank you so much for bumping this thread, DMoD. I had lost my internet right in the week NineThePuma posted the link to an earlier voting thread and when I got it back I couldn't find the chat thread either and just decided to forget about it then.

    But seeing it back now, I have put up a voting thread! See here!
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  17. - Top - End - #227
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    Default Re: GitP PrC Contest Chat Thread IV

    Dang, forgot I hadn't done the fluff sections at the end. That's rather annoying.

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  18. - Top - End - #228
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    Default Re: GitP PrC Contest Chat Thread IV

    I myself specifically filled out those last few necessary parts a few days before the official end to avoid that. I think one of the other two disqualifiers intentionally withdrew, dunno about the last one.
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  19. - Top - End - #229
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    Default Re: GitP PrC Contest Chat Thread IV

    In my case, I'd thought I had already done them in the initial rush of completion, after which the only other thing unfinished was the features of light. Due to this and the lack of anyone mentioning they were black I completely overlooked needing to fill them in. Well, there's always next time.

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    Default Re: GitP PrC Contest Chat Thread IV

    I'm sure you'll manage to come up with something awesome.

    That being said though, we probably need to start thinking of potential themes. Perhaps "powering up", where it is based on abilities like rage, frenzy, ki frenzy, lycanthrope forms, etc. Basically a state that you stay in for limited time, but which makes you stronger.
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    Default Re: GitP PrC Contest Chat Thread IV

    Quote Originally Posted by Morph Bark View Post
    I'm sure you'll manage to come up with something awesome.

    That being said though, we probably need to start thinking of potential themes. Perhaps "powering up", where it is based on abilities like rage, frenzy, ki frenzy, lycanthrope forms, etc. Basically a state that you stay in for limited time, but which makes you stronger.
    I personally prefer Cursed as a theme- either a curse that you can tap into for power, breaking curses that others make, and so on, could be interesting.
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  22. - Top - End - #232
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    Default Re: GitP PrC Contest Chat Thread IV

    In case I forget, can someone perhaps email me once the deadline on the voting thread has passed? I might miss it as I will need to deal with my grandmother getting hospitalized suddenly and want to help her out, or my mom who will likely spend most days there.

    Additionally, I may not be on as much, but with me I never know in such situations.
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  23. - Top - End - #233
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    Default Re: GitP PrC Contest Chat Thread IV

    I apologize for my absence here. Between my employment situation increasing my hours from 45 to 55-60 due to tax season starting for me at my job, plus family health issues I've been very far from these halls, and I totally dropped the ball here. I suck, and I'm sorry. That being said, I'd still like to run the contests, but with my schedule (or lack thereof), its become more or less impossible.

    If someone is willing to take over the contests or at the very least willing to co-run this with me when I have spare time, that'd be appreciated. I look to Morph Bark as he's really been awesome, but if someone else wants to step up and volunteer to at least help me run this through the holidays into next year, that would be incredible. PM me and we'll discuss..

    -X
    Chris Bennett
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  24. - Top - End - #234
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    Default Re: GitP PrC Contest Chat Thread IV

    Quote Originally Posted by ErrantX View Post
    I suck, and I'm sorry.
    BLATANT LIES.



    Life has you by the metaphorical throat. There is absolutely nothing wrong with that. We can understand that there's a problem, and the contest will do its best to persevere. I think I can safely speak for all of us when I say that these contests are looked forward to.

  25. - Top - End - #235
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    Default Re: GitP PrC Contest Chat Thread IV

    Couldn't think of a better place to post this, so... Djinn, are you ever planning on finishing those Seiškona of the Iron Bands vestiges?
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  26. - Top - End - #236
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    Default Re: GitP PrC Contest Chat Thread IV

    New contest: Time.

    Go.

    I'll do my best to be more active, but I'm gonna rely on Morph Bark to help me field questions and such. I'll second his judgment.

    -X
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  27. - Top - End - #237
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    Default Re: GitP PrC Contest Chat Thread IV

    I am made sad that we cannot post old content as part of the competition; I have a really sexy "editing the past" PrC posted on these boards, somewhere...

  28. - Top - End - #238
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    Default Re: GitP PrC Contest Chat Thread IV

    Quote Originally Posted by Amechra View Post
    I am made sad that we cannot post old content as part of the competition; I have a really sexy "editing the past" PrC posted on these boards, somewhere...
    No, you can actually post it, I think... there was the question of that sometime ago. You just can't have had it in the contest before; if you already made it, it's fair game.
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  29. - Top - End - #239
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    Default Re: GitP PrC Contest Chat Thread IV

    Quote Originally Posted by DMofDarkness View Post
    No, you can actually post it, I think... there was the question of that sometime ago. You just can't have had it in the contest before; if you already made it, it's fair game.
    This is incorrect. See rule 6.

    Quote Originally Posted by ErrantX View Post
    6) Entries must be your own work, and must not be copied for other places. Only new work may submitted; no previously posted work will be accepted. Such entries will be disqualified. Such entries will be disqualified.
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    Default Re: GitP PrC Contest Chat Thread IV

    Quote Originally Posted by Owrtho View Post
    This is incorrect. See rule 6.
    As I recall, the argument was that 'previously posted' implied previously posted in the contest. I may be misremembering, though.
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