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Thread: Maus Guard

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    Titan in the Playground
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    Default Maus Guard

    This began as an impish, irreverent, and probably offensive joke...but now I'm thinking there might be some actual synergy. So I'm asking the playground:

    How well would it work to run a game of Mouse Guard set in the Maus universe? Are the game mechanics totally out of whack, or might it work with some minor modifications?
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    Default Re: Maus Guard

    My exact reaction.

    EDIT: To answer your question: If you're running the game, it'll work as well as you want it to. The MG system is open-ended enough to make it work.
    Last edited by TroubleBrewing; 2011-09-24 at 01:48 PM.
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    Default Re: Maus Guard



    (This is now a reaction thread.)

    Seriously, though, I don't know Maus very well, but Mouse Guard's mechanics are tied very tightly to its setting and very specific themes. It looks to me like the only thing the two series have in common is that they have mice. And, at the end of the day, Mouse Guard isn't just about being mice. It's about an organization that polices the wild lands between civilization, where the very land and weather itself is an enemy. It's a struggle between safety and heroism, as well as duty and self-interest. It's not really about racism and emotional trauma.

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    NecromancerGuy

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    Default Re: Maus Guard

    From what I know of the Mouse Guard system, it will function mechanically. Any system using Maus as its setting is going to suffer other problems, though, as previous posters have indicated graphically.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Trekkin View Post
    Any system using Maus as its setting is going to suffer other problems, though, as previous posters have indicated graphically.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Knaight View Post
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    Default Re: Maus Guard

    Yeah no. Mechanically, you might be able to do it (the system's simplistic enough to do all kinds of shenanigans) but there are so many better systems to run it in without trampling all over the core conceits of one or both...

    This are big coin-cidence though. I just picked up Mouse guard and am considering running it for my friends.
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    Default Re: Maus Guard

    I think the biggest problem you are going to run into with the system are Wises and Natures. Wises are "groups" of skills (one skill, actually) that represents a wide variety of related tasks, and is frequently used for MacGyvering something together using basic materials at hand. Crafting a boat from leaves and bark is one example. (Mouse Guard mice are actual mice, size and everything.) Natures are rolled to represent mouse instinct, and grant bonuses to activities that are distinctly very mousey. (They can also penalize activities that are distinctly non-mousey, depending on how strong the character's nature is.)

    Maus, as I understand it, is literally Nazi Germany with funny hats. Outside a few throwaway jokes or running gags, all the characters behave as humans.

    As such, you'll probably run into a conflict of ideals. While Mouse Guard works with its equipment-light system through allowing Wises to produce equipment, you probably don't want a character with "Gunwise" producing handguns in their basement. The Nature will need to be changed completely, although I don't see a problem with adding a "Human Nature" to represent the way the characters in the setting react to things.

    You may also run into a conflict of themes. Mouse Guard is basically gritty heroic fantasy with the question, "What would I lay on the line for my ideals?" Maus is survival during the Nazi regime. While it could produce an interesting one-shot or short campaign, I think that in the long run you'll begin to see a conflict characters who want to feel/act heroic and basic survival instincts. (Then again, I'm not even sure what you plan on running with a Maus RPG.)
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    Hmm, I had gotten the impression that Mouse Guard was more focused on adversity than heroics, what with all the talk I hear about characters failing at things and that being a feature of the game rather than a bug. But if it's got the heroic feel you guys are talking about, then yeah, it's more inappropriate then it would be anyway.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Urpriest View Post
    Hmm, I had gotten the impression that Mouse Guard was more focused on adversity than heroics, what with all the talk I hear about characters failing at things and that being a feature of the game rather than a bug. But if it's got the heroic feel you guys are talking about, then yeah, it's more inappropriate then it would be anyway.
    Well, as I see it it's all about being a BDH (Big Damn Hero) in an even bigger world. So yeah, you pull off legendary heroic exploits. And then you fail to pull off some legendary exploit and have to pick up the pieces. Or, with the Twist rule, you pull off a legendary exploit and then have to deal with some new, bigger problem (in the example given in the book: After days of combing the wilderness we found what happened to the grain peddler. Now what do we do about the giant snake that ate him?)
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    Quote Originally Posted by Urpriest View Post
    Hmm, I had gotten the impression that Mouse Guard was more focused on adversity than heroics, what with all the talk I hear about characters failing at things and that being a feature of the game rather than a bug. But if it's got the heroic feel you guys are talking about, then yeah, it's more inappropriate then it would be anyway.
    I think you misunderstood the reaction. [/understatement] The issue is not whether Mouse Guard is an appropriate system; the issue is that you're proposing an RPG where players are Jews during the Nazi Holocaust.
    "I had thought - I had been told - that a 'funny' thing is a thing of goodness. It isn't. Not ever is it funny to the person it happens to. Like that sheriff without his pants. The goodness is in the laughing. I grok it is a bravery... and a sharing... against pain and sorrow and defeat."

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    Quote Originally Posted by Premier View Post
    I think you misunderstood the reaction. [/understatement] The issue is not whether Mouse Guard is an appropriate system; the issue is that you're proposing an RPG where players are Jews during the Nazi Holocaust.
    Well, technically Mice-Jews during the Nazi-Cat Holocaust, but yeah. It's an odd point on the serious-silly spectrum, really.

    [edit]
    Thinking about it, that's not a million miles from the setup for An American Tail.
    Last edited by Tiki Snakes; 2011-09-25 at 11:20 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Urpriest View Post
    Hmm, I had gotten the impression that Mouse Guard was more focused on adversity than heroics,
    There is a difference?

    I mean, Mouse Guard is not the kind of wuxia/action heroic system where the characters fly in, destroy everything with their awesome skills and gumption, and get the girl at the end. It's more like the heroics in Conan, or Lord of the Rings, or even stuff like Odyssey. The characters run off to save the day. Along the way, they may fail their short-term goal or run into an obstacle they cannot overcome. It order to pass it and complete what they set out to do, they need to regroup and try again, or try tackling the obstacle from another angle, or look at another solution to the situation. Even when the characters "fail" they are usually far from dead, and generally still have the option to find some way out of their mess and continue on.

    If that's the kind of game you want, then I'd say go for it. However, my generally impression of Maus is that the theme is considerably different. I'd peg a system like Shadowrun or World of Darkness as more appropriate - the first because the characters need to stay hidden and want to avoid the established order, and the second due to the general opressive, you-will-never-know-everything theme of the game. Of course, both would need adjusting (Shadowrun moreso) to likely fit the game you have planned.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tiki Snakes View Post
    Thinking about it, that's not a million miles from the setup for An American Tail.
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    Hmm, I suddenly kinda want to play Mouse Guard set in the Secret of Nimh, potentially as one of the enhanced rats...
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    Quote Originally Posted by Premier View Post
    I think you misunderstood the reaction. [/understatement] The issue is not whether Mouse Guard is an appropriate system; the issue is that you're proposing an RPG where players are Jews during the Nazi Holocaust.
    Have you ever heard of Grey Ranks? The setup there is pretty much as grim.

    With Mouse Guard as a system it seems you'd be more likely to end up with Inglorious Basterds than Maus.

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    I have, and I consider it to be not an RPG but a tabletop form of misery tourism.

    Inglorious Basterds, yes, even (/especially) if it's arguably in bad taste. But I assume you've read Maus, so you ought to realise that it's a lot more than just "people with animal heads". If you turn it into Inglosious B., it's no longer "in the Maus universe".

    Perhaps the OP just phrased his thoughts slightly unfortunately, but the way it came across for me was that he specifically wanted Grey Ranks-style misery tourism.
    "I had thought - I had been told - that a 'funny' thing is a thing of goodness. It isn't. Not ever is it funny to the person it happens to. Like that sheriff without his pants. The goodness is in the laughing. I grok it is a bravery... and a sharing... against pain and sorrow and defeat."

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    Quote Originally Posted by Premier View Post
    I have, and I consider it to be not an RPG but a tabletop form of misery tourism.

    Inglorious Basterds, yes, even (/especially) if it's arguably in bad taste. But I assume you've read Maus, so you ought to realise that it's a lot more than just "people with animal heads". If you turn it into Inglosious B., it's no longer "in the Maus universe".

    Perhaps the OP just phrased his thoughts slightly unfortunately, but the way it came across for me was that he specifically wanted Grey Ranks-style misery tourism.
    Provided that I understand what you mean by misery tourism, yeah, that's more what I was going for. I had the impression that Mouse Guard was a game in which the primary theme was that you live in a universe in which pretty much everything is more powerful than you and you have to give up your pride to survive, rather than a world of Odyssean triumphs peppered with Achillesesque sulks. Under my misunderstanding of Mouse Guard it seemed like you could just replace the implacable predators and environment with implacable gentiles and environment and have a similar experience. But again, I misjudged their implacability.
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