Young Justice (Spoilers)

[Hopeless]

Given Green Beetle was only recently freed from the Reach's control whose to say they aren't in complete control over the Martian race?

Thats why a few weeks back I wondered if they had been wiped out since otherwise the Reach have a pretty powerful force to play with.

Metagene or no, nothing has been said about their influence over the Martians.

[HalfTangible]

Given Green Beetle was only recently freed from the Reach's control whose to say they aren't in complete control over the Martian race?

Thats why a few weeks back I wondered if they had been wiped out since otherwise the Reach have a pretty powerful force to play with.

Metagene or no, nothing has been said about their influence over the Martians.

The reach's invasion takes a century. Miss Martian and Manhunter were last there five years ago (tops) and had never heard of the Reach.

[Aotrs Commander]

Spoiler

Show

This is the best mental image.

It is, isn't it?



Wow, that was a spectacular episode.

Can't believe they faked me out again...! It's the blood, I think, the fact they actually used it (and that it was the penultimate episode of the season), it actually had going "are they really going there...?"



It is a travesty that this series is getting cancelled, it really is. I've been concurrently watching this last chunk of the season with my re-watching of Justice League/JLU and in some ways, I think this series is even better.

Would it be too much to hope they might finish the tale in comic format... Well, that said, given how DC (and Marvel) have been going lately, maybe that wouldn't be all that good of an idea...




Incidently, did everbody else know about the Flaming C? I just happened to be looking at the YJ wiki page and discovered about it... If you, like me, were not until now, apparently Conan O'Brian (who as a Brit I've heard of but never actually seen) met up with Bruce Timm for a segment. Apparently, someone (probably Bruce Timm himself I would imagine) thought the idea was so funny that it ended up getting animated, by which I mean edited into an actual YJ clip. (Properly edited in, that is, by the animation team, not just a cheap photoshop splice in.) It's hilarious because they play so completely straight. The show staff clearly spent some time and effort to put this together and I laud them for doing so.

[Mutant Sheep]

It is, isn't it?

Wow, that was a spectacular episode.

Can't believe they faked me out again...! It's the blood, I think, the fact they actually used it (and that it was the penultimate episode of the season), it actually had going "are they really going there...?"



It is a travesty that this series is getting cancelled, it really is. I've been concurrently watching this last chunk of the season with my re-watching of Justice League/JLU and in some ways, I think this series is even better.

Would it be too much to hope they might finish the tale in comic format... Well, that said, given how DC (and Marvel) have been going lately, maybe that wouldn't be all that good of an idea...

. I liked it alot. Considering how much talk there is, that is an accomplishment.

I've always loved Deathstroke, so yeah. I completely bought Slade blasting them dead. And then bam! i slightly question the holograms and recordings, but if Kaldur was the security guy, I guess he had time to set up. And had the holothing in his hand. Bwhaha, best plot.

Compared to the first season of Justice League? Definitely. Unlimited is dangerously close to my ideal show, but this has some very good tries to beat it. (Some of the exposition seems heavy handed to me, personally. But meh.)

Heh. Poor comic book Aqualad.

Incidently, did everbody else know about the Flaming C? I just happened to be looking at the YJ wiki page and discovered about it... If you, like me, were not until now, apparently Conan O'Brian (who as a Brit I've heard of but never actually seen) met up with Bruce Timm for a segment. Apparently, someone (probably Bruce Timm himself I would imagine) thought the idea was so funny that it ended up getting animated, by which I mean edited into an actual YJ clip. (Properly edited in, that is, by the animation team, not just a cheap photoshop splice in.) It's hilarious because they play so completely straight. The show staff clearly spent some time and effort to put this together and I laud them for doing so.

I do! "We are not happy" is still hilarious. The Flaming C had a twitter! And then it stopped updating! I do love that animation though. It's supposed to be Superboy looking at his idol. Instead....

[Mutant Sheep]

So was that last episode ever?

[Starbuck_II]

So was that last episode ever?

Sad but true, maybe we can start a kickstart to get a movie? It worked for Veronica Mars

The commericals say we will have another episoide next week: new young justice and green lantern. (TV guide channels says it lies)

[Flickerdart]

Why did Megan have to go to Rimbor herself instead of sending an email or something? The whole "oh we're too late/but it doesn't actually matter" thing seemed like a waste of time.

[HalfTangible]

*thing i don't recognize*

Spoiler ?

[KnightDisciple]

...And of course, after all of that, it's done. Cancelled. Ugh.

You lose life, Cartoon Network.

[The Bushranger]

Spoiler ?

It says "spoilers" right in the thread title...

[Mutant Sheep]

It says "spoilers" right in the thread title...

I was actually going to complain about it too, because usually there is a sentence of something before you go "plot point of episode". But meh. I tthink that the first day of an episode coming out, spoilers would be a kindness.

[Metahuman1]

Huh, weird, I would have though that we'd had a couple more eps to the series then this. There are still a bunch of loose ends left untied.

[Flickerdart]

It says "spoilers" right in the thread title...

Furthermore, why would one go to the thread discussing the show on the day a new episode of the show was released before one has seen that episode of the show? What else would be posted in that thread?

[Mutant Sheep]

Speaking of...

Spoiler

Show

Well, the ending was... Predictable. But awesome. Confirmation of Godfrey, a broshake between DARKSEID AND SAVAGE.... Woo!

[HalfTangible]

Furthermore, why would one go to the thread discussing the show on the day a new episode of the show was released before one has seen that episode of the show? What else would be posted in that thread?

I don't know when new episodes air. I just buy 'em on iTunes and watch em the week after.

I'll concede to the fact that the thread is labeled 'Spoilers' though. I am an idiot.

[KnightDisciple]

Speaking of...

Spoiler

Show

Well, the ending was... Predictable. But awesome. Confirmation of Godfrey, a broshake between DARKSEID AND SAVAGE.... Woo!

Spoiler

Show

Godfrey is an existing character from the New Gods mythos anyways, so it wasn't exactly a stretch.

Also.

Spoiler

Show

OMG WHY WALLY WHY NONONONONO
THIS SO MUCH THIS.

[Mutant Sheep]

Spoiler

Show

Godfrey is an existing character from the New Gods mythos anyways, so it wasn't exactly a stretch.

Also.

Spoiler

Show

OMG WHY WALLY WHY NONONONONO
THIS SO MUCH THIS.

Spoiler

Show

True, but Evil Charismatic Ginger wasn't the Justice League one. He was just someone who made fun of The League for underwear on the outside and Wonder Woman's... Apparel.

If the Speed Force existed on Earth 16, I'd say "Oh, he'll come in to save us from Brainior! Speed Force will save him!" But it doesn't, word of Weisman...

[KnightDisciple]

Spoiler

Show

True, but Evil Charismatic Ginger wasn't the Justice League one. He was just someone who made fun of The League for underwear on the outside and Wonder Woman's... Apparel.

If the Speed Force existed on Earth 16, I'd say "Oh, he'll come in to save us from Brainior! Speed Force will save him!" But it doesn't, word of Weisman...

Spoiler

Show

He's been around a while.

And...yeah, pretty much.

It's even more frustrating because the replacement show, Teen Titans Go, looks like it's a waste of space. It's not even proper Teen Titans!

And the GLTAS replacement is a show where Alfred looks like a street thug and runs around using a "pulse rifle"!

[Mutant Sheep]

Spoiler

Show

He's been around a while.

And...yeah, pretty much.

It's even more frustrating because the replacement show, Teen Titans Go, looks like it's a waste of space. It's not even proper Teen Titans!

And the GLTAS replacement is a show where Alfred looks like a street thug and runs around using a "pulse rifle"!

Spoiler

Show

I'm aware, that's why I said Confirmation and not "Wait why is the Tv dude with Darkseid".

Deaaaaaad forever! Impulse looked wrong in it, by the way. The parallels between the second episode of the first season were a bit forced, sometimes. All that "five years ago" things was too blatant and heavy handed.

Yeah. They turned it into a joke, literally.

[KnightDisciple]

Spoiler

Show

I'm aware, that's why I said Confirmation and not "Wait why is the Tv dude with Darkseid".

Deaaaaaad forever! Impulse looked wrong in it, by the way. The parallels between the second episode of the first season were a bit forced, sometimes. All that "five years ago" things was too blatant and heavy handed.

Yeah. They turned it into a joke, literally.

Spoiler

Show

I don't mind Bart taking up the costume. It's one of the things the Flash family does well. When this happens, you step up to the plate. You take up the mantle. And you keep fighting the fight. Because that's what being a hero is all about.
It's how you live, and...and... and how you die.
Wally told Bart he wanted him to take up the name and the suit.
One day, Barry will retire. One way or another. And Bart will take up the mantle.
And one day someone from the Flash Family will take up the mantle from Bart.

If you believe DC 1 Million, this will continue for thousands and thousands of years. I believe it's a line that is only matched by the generations of Superman descendants, at least in that possible world.

Only the Bat-clan has the same potential depth for someone to always take up the mantle. Keep up the fight.

You won't be forgotten, Wallace West.

[Jayngfet]

Spoiler

Show

I don't mind Bart taking up the costume. It's one of the things the Flash family does well. When this happens, you step up to the plate. You take up the mantle. And you keep fighting the fight. Because that's what being a hero is all about.
It's how you live, and...and... and how you die.
Wally told Bart he wanted him to take up the name and the suit.
One day, Barry will retire. One way or another. And Bart will take up the mantle.
And one day someone from the Flash Family will take up the mantle from Bart.

If you believe DC 1 Million, this will continue for thousands and thousands of years. I believe it's a line that is only matched by the generations of Superman descendants, at least in that possible world.

Only the Bat-clan has the same potential depth for someone to always take up the mantle. Keep up the fight.

You won't be forgotten, Wallace West.

It's not just DC one million. Constantly when we see the future there's often some future-flash. On one occasion I believe we see the mantle passing between them as well.

It's a thing only the Flash characters can do as well as they can. Bat and Lantern heroes can just be anybody really, and Super's never really explored the issue the way it could. With the Flash family, you kind of HAVE to step up to the plate. There's nobody else with the ability to do it, so the job falls to you.

[Metahuman1]

Spoiler

Show

Show of hands, who things the people doing the writing over at DC and Marvel could learn a whole hell of a lot from the people who wrote Young Justice?

Seriously, on major character death that wasn't a fake out, and it hurt more then all the deaths in Marvel Ultimateverse in the last half decade put together.

And the fake out's freaking dropped your jaw right up to the point were it being a fake out was reveled, and then you just jumped up and screamed "YES!"

[slayerx]

Huh, weird, I would have though that we'd had a couple more eps to the series then this. There are still a bunch of loose ends left untied.

Well you have to keep in mind that the writers had their hearts set on a season 3. Everything concerning darksied and the light was most likely gonna be settled then.

[Metahuman1]

Well you have to keep in mind that the writers had their hearts set on a season 3. Everything concerning darksied and the light was most likely gonna be settled then.

So, on that note, I've got the feathers, who's the the pitchforks, tar and torches?

Cause right now I wanna make with all of the above, en mass, on the executive staff at Cartoonnetwork, even if only to make them at least let the guys who worked on YJ and GLTAS start up on another network. Any other network.

[BRC]

Concerning the Finale

Spoiler

Show

Remember: Nobody stays dead in Comics besides Uncle Ben and the Waynes.

Wally would come back, the way he "Died" makes it basically inevitable. In the theoretical 3rd season you would have Artemis (Now "Tigress", I guess, except her name is still Artemis) occasionally hearing his voice and seeing him out of the corner of her eye. A couple episodes of her thinking she's just crazy, maybe a therapy session with Black Canary. Then there would be the episode where she, Impulse, and probably Nightwing and Kaldur break into whatever alternate universe place Wally got zapped to.

Then he returns, they either retire again, or he becomes Flash Proper. Or he takes back Kid Flash while Bart becomes Impulse again.

[t209]

Just wondering

Spoiler

Show

Was it the last episode? Kinda sad though, it's a sad finale. Wally dies and never thought the Robin and who's the others died before him.

[BRC]

Just wondering

Spoiler

Show

Was it the last episode? Kinda sad though, it's a sad finale. Wally dies and never thought the Robin and who's the others died before him.

Spoiler

Show

It wasn't written to be the last episode but it was. There is always a chance it comes back, crazier things have happened, but it seems like CN has made it's decision.

[Zevox]

Just watched the final episode (was working when it actually aired). Gotta say, a lot better paced than the season 1 finale, though it did still feel a bit rushed. I'm not much of a fan of the way they ultimately worked things out, though. Taking down Black Beetle quickly at the start then focusing on automated devices as the threat is just not as exciting as an actual villain fight for the final showdown. And the last one needing to be stopped at the expense of Wally's life felt kind of forced too - probably because that whole scenario was blatant techno-babble nonsense.

And of course, season 3 plot hook featuring Darkseid, as we all figured. Oh well, pity we'll never see that finished.

But yeah, the show had a good run, despite the hickups at the end of season 1 and start of season 2. Glad we at least got as much of it as we did.

[Aotrs Commander]

So... watched the finale. Cancellation is ever more tragic.

Spoiler

Show

Show of hands, who things the people doing the writing over at DC and Marvel could learn a whole hell of a lot from the people who wrote Young Justice?

Seriously, on major character death that wasn't a fake out, and it hurt more then all the deaths in Marvel Ultimateverse in the last half decade put together.

And the fake out's freaking dropped your jaw right up to the point were it being a fake out was reveled, and then you just jumped up and screamed "YES!"

I completely concur. The writing on YJ has been superlative, I think putting it right up there in my top four or five best cartoons period.



But as I've observed on other threads, I think the fact it's "children's television" might actually be something of a boon for enforcing the quality a bit. The writers don't have the dubious freedom of doing the really stupid things (like all the rampant character deaths, though dang, if YJ didn't make an effort of it and make it meaningful!) that they've been doing, because it has to be for "younger" audiences.

(Or perhaps more correctly, will be viewed by a broader and younger audience than the comics are, which are, let's face it, now much more of an "adult" market, on the basis they're a specialist product - and not hugely cheap at that, either!)

It might also be that a cartoon series is a larger money maker (or at least a larger investment) so you get either just flat-out better writers or closer control or something.

I dunno. It just seems like the best super-hero stories of recent years have not come from the comics that originated them, so I do wonder.



It was nice they'd wrapped most things up, though, if fairly sharpish. Was a bit hurried, but not so much it was bad (also, even a hurried end is better than no end).

I finished watched JLU a couple of days ago as well¹. I will take comfort in both series left on a "and then the adventure continues" note (and wry observation that there were certain paralellels in Knobbling Dohickeys to save the world in both!)

I will hope beyond hope that somehow, we get a new season at some point. (I mean sometimes cartoons have a more-than-year-break.) I know it's not likely - at all - but all things are possible...

(Maybe a spin-off down the line? I mean, Teen Titans is getting a spin-off - I'm not passing judgement on it until I see it on the basis that there is an unfortunate possibily I might find it hilarious - and Xiaolin Showdown is supposed to be getting a sequel series, so you never know...)



I think if I had one complaint about this series, it's that's nearly impossible to watch it outside of a dark room (I have to shut the curtains and turn the lights off) otherwise you can't see half of what is going on! (Though I think season one was worse for that.)



¹On the other hand, the latest Naruto DVD came through, and I'vbe just got season one of Avengers:EMH, so there's that.

[BRC]

So... watched the finale. Cancellation is ever more tragic.



I completely concur. The writing on YJ has been superlative, I think putting it right up there in my top four or five best cartoons period.



But as I've observed on other threads, I think the fact it's "children's television" might actually be something of a boon for enforcing the quality a bit. The writers don't have the dubious freedom of doing the really stupid things (like all the rampant character deaths, though dang, if YJ didn't make an effort of it and make it meaningful!) that they've been doing, because it has to be for "younger" audiences.

(Or perhaps more correctly, will be viewed by a broader and younger audience than the comics are, which are, let's face it, now much more of an "adult" market, on the basis they're a specialist product - and not hugely cheap at that, either!)

It might also be that a cartoon series is a larger money maker (or at least a larger investment) so you get either just flat-out better writers or closer control or something.

I dunno. It just seems like the best super-hero stories of recent years have not come from the comics that originated them, so I do wonder.

Well, I think part of it is that an animated and well-voice acted Cartoon is in many ways simply more enjoyable than a still comic depicting the same events. Don't get me wrong, I love comics, but it's an enjoyable experience.

Secondly, the Dramatic Arc is somewhat more flexible. I just got into reading print comics fairly recently (I've read comics for years, but usually either collected editions or webcomics), and it's struck me how limited the format is. Roughly once a month(Sometimes more) the writer gets about 24 pages to continue a story.

A quick look at some of my comics says that a standard comics page contains between 4-6 panels. Each Panel represents a singular Moment. A single Pose, or action, plus at most two pieces of dialogue. You can do more, but it seems pretty rare, especially with 1/6th of a page to work with.
So, that's around 144 moments in which to remind your readers what's going on, advance that story (plus any subplots).

Let's take, for example, This clip. It covers roughly 1 minutes of a Young Justice episode, or 1/20th of an episode.
A quick watchthrough, keeping track of things in my head, counted around 11 "Moments", usually marked by an important establishing shot, or a single exchange of dialog (Character A says something, Character B responds). Not to mention the Writer/Directors can add more meaning to that dialogue by altering how the voice actors read the lines. The presence of a pause, for example, or the despondent way Miss M remarked that Black Manta was going to kill her once Kaldur was cured.

So, at 6 panels a page (Which was the maximum I noticed, most were closer to 4, plus big splash pages, in which a single "moment" takes up two whole pages), you had 144 distinct "Moments" in a 24-page comic, in which words and images needed to battle for panel space. In that one minute clip, you have around 11 moments, for roughly 220 "Moments" in the entire episode, each of which is more versatile than a comic panel. Ideally, each Issue/episode should contain a full dramatic arc (one big dramatic arc can be made up of many smaller ones easily enough).


That said, I do think the writers of YJ are just very skilled, which makes sense. YJ is a bigger-budget production than any print comic I can think of.