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    Default The Sharpshooter (3.5 Base Class, FINALLY DONE, PEACH)

    The Sharpshooter


    Alignment: Any

    Hit Dice: d6

    Class Skills: The sharpshooter’s class skills (and the key ability for each skill) are Climb (Str), Concentration (Con), Craft (Int), Handle Animal (Cha), Heal (Wis), Hide (Dex), Jump (Str), Knowledge (dungeoneering) (Int), Knowledge (geography) (Int), Knowledge (nature) (Int), Listen (Wis), Move Silently (Dex), Profession (Wis), Ride (Dex), Search (Int), Spot (Wis), Survival (Wis), Swim (Str), and Use Rope (Dex).

    Skill Points: 6+Int per level, x4 at first level

    {table=head]Level|Fort|Ref|Will|Special

    1st|+0|+2|+0|Eyes of the Hunter

    2nd|+0|+3|+0|Claws of the Eagle, Poison Use

    3rd|+1|+3|+1|Shoot into the Fray

    4th|+1|+4|+1|Called Shot: Eyes, Uncanny Dodge

    5th|+1|+4|+1|Wild Instincts

    6th|+2|+5|+2|Called Shot: Arms, Manyshot

    7th|+2|+5|+2|Cautious Shooting

    8th|+2|+6|+2|Called Shot: Legs

    9th|+3|+6|+3|Long Shot, Improved Uncanny Dodge

    10th|+3|+7|+3|Called Shot: Throat, Penetrating Shot

    11th|+3|+7|+3|Greater Manyshot

    12th|+4|+8|+4|Called Shot: Heart

    13th|+4|+8|+4|Greater Wild Instincts

    14th|+4|+9|+4|Called Shot: Weak Spot

    15th|+5|+9|+5|Long-Ranged Accuracy

    16th|+5|+10|+5|Called Shot: Head

    17th|+5|+10|+5|Freedom of Movement

    18th|+6|+11|+6|Called Shot: Vitality

    19th|+6|+11|+6|Arrows of the Hunter

    20th|+6|+12|+6|Kill or Be Killed

    [/table]

    Weapon and Armor Proficiency: A sharpshooter is proficient with all ranged weapons, including all exotic ranged weapons. He is not proficient with any melee weapons or shields. He is proficient with light armor.

    Eyes of the Hunter (Ex): The sharpshooter does not fight like any other character in the game. The world through his eyes is a complete standstill. All creatures’ movements are slowed to a stop, and the sharpshooter is able to aim his shots with deadly precision. The sharpshooter does not have a Base Attack Bonus. He does not increase his Base Attack Bonus progression from any previous classes, and does not add his Base Attack Bonus from previous or future classes to his ranged attack rolls.

    Whenever the sharpshooter would make a ranged attack roll, he makes a Spot check instead. The DC is equal to the target's AC. Any bonuses to Spot checks apply, but bonuses to attack rolls (such as from the Weapon Focus feat or from a magic weapon) do not aid the Spot check. (A sharpshooter with both the Alertness feat and the Weapon Focus feat would get a +2 bonus to his Spot check to hit a creature with a ranged attack roll)

    If the sharpshooter’s Spot check exceeds his target’s AC by 7 or more, he is considered to have threatened a critical hit. (The weapon’s threat range does not affect this in any way) If he confirms his critical with another successful Spot check, the weapon deals critical damage.

    As this is still a skill check rather than an attack roll, the sharpshooter does not automatically miss on a natural 1, nor does he automatically hit on a natural 20.

    The sharpshooter is able to make iterative attacks. For every 5 class levels he has beyond the first, he receives an additional attack per round. His Spot checks take the normal iterative penalties (-5, -10, -15) for iterative attacks.
    The sharpshooter qualifies for feats that require a minimum Base Attack Bonus as if he had a Base Attack Bonus equal to his class level. He does not qualify for any prestige classes with a minimum Base Attack Bonus.

    If the sharpshooter attempts to hit a target farther away than his weapon allows, he takes penalties to his Spot check as normal (same penalties that would apply to his attack rolls)

    The sharpshooter receives no bonus from his eyes for melee attack rolls. A 20th level sharpshooter making an attack roll with a longsword would receive a bonus to hit equal to his Strength modifier+the weapon’s enhancement bonus, and nothing more.

    Claws of the Eagle: A sharpshooter is able to put his devastating accuracy to use. Starting at 2nd level, when the sharpshooter successfully strikes a target with a ranged attack, he adds his total ranks in the Spot skill to his damage rolls.

    Poison Use (Ex): A 2nd level sharpshooter does not risk poisoning himself when he applies poison or ravages to the tip of his ammunition. He still risks it when applying it to a melee weapon.

    Shoot into the Fray (Ex): A sharpshooter either hits or he misses. He never hits by accident. With the careful aim the sharpshooter uses, the only way his arrows miss is if his foe is simply too prepared.

    At 3rd level, the sharpshooter gains Precise Shot as a bonus feat. He need not meet the prerequisites. Additionally, he is treated as if he had the Point Blank Shot feat for the purposes of meeting all feat and prestige class prerequisites, though he does not gain the benefit of that feat.

    Called Shot (Ex): A sharpshooter isn't just an assassin. He can also use his deadly arrows to inflict targeted pain to his opponents and interfere with their abilities. As a swift action, a sharpshooter may take a -4 penalty to his next Spot check made to attack a target. He then declares where he is aiming, and if he hits, he deals his normal damage and adds the additional listed effect. A sharpshooter starts out at level 4 by being able to aim for the eyes, and gains an additional option target at 6th level, and every two levels later, stopping at 16th level. If a called shot misses, the use is wasted. (A called shot only applies to the first Spot check made each round, unless the sharpshooter has more than one swift action to spend)

    In order for any of the injuries to take effect, the creature in question must receive damage from the attack. If all the damage from the attack is prevented, the creature is not injured.

    Eyes: The first target a sharpshooter aims at is the easiest. If the sharpshooter hits, his target is blinded. Unlike the spell blindness, however, this is mundane blindness that comes from losing an eye, and so it is both partial and unhealable by magical means.

    For example, if a creature has two eyes, and the sharpshooter puts one out, the creature is 'half-blind'. (Attackers get a +2 bonus to hit it, and the creature suffers a 25% miss chance on all its attack rolls). Additionally, the targeted eye may no longer make gaze attacks or use eye rays. If a sharpshooter puts out every one of the creature's eyes, the creature suffers the full effects of blindness.

    Remove Blindness does not cure this condition. The only magical way to restore a creature's sight is with the regrowth or regenerate spells, or some variation (of the wish/miracle type)

    Arms: A creature who is struck in the arm takes a -2 penalty on all attack rolls made with that arm (natural or manufactured weapons). Additionally, a creature wielding a two-handed weapon while using that arm treats it as one-handed for all purposes, including resisting Disarm, bonus damage from Power Attack, and adding only 1x its Strength modifier to weapon damage rolls. A creature who is wielding a one-handed weapon in that hand instead treats it as a light weapon. A creature wielding a light weapon is unaffected. (For the purposes of this class feature, natural weapons are all considered one-handed before the arm is shot)

    A creature that is injured in every arm is unable to make full-attack actions, and may only make its standard attack routine every round until it receives magical healing equal to the damage dealt to one of its arms. (For example, if the sharpshooter dealt 13 damage to all of a creature's arms, once it received at least 13 points of magical healing (or fast healing) it would regain use of one arm)

    The above method of recovering use in an arm is applicable to all injuries sustained this way, not just if the creature lost all its arms.

    Legs: A creature who is struck in the leg is unable to make attacks with that leg (including rake attacks) and moves at half movement speed. If all a creature's legs are disabled, the creature's movement speed using those limbs (including land, swim, and burrow, but not including flight) are reduced to 0' until at least one leg has received full healing from a mundane or magical source. (See the example above)

    Throat: A creature that is struck in the throat begins to bleed uncontrollably. Every round the creature takes hit point damage equal to the sharpshooter's class level. (This damage is untyped and cannot be prevented, even by the regeneration ability). Additionally, the creature is unable to speak. All abilities that require sound, such as verbal components, bardic music, and sonic abilities are unable to be used by a creature who was struck in the throat.

    This injury persists until the original amount of damage from the attack is healed. Multiple applications of this injury do not stack.

    Heart: Because I had to make a Cupid reference. Sue me. A creature struck in the heart acts as if the sharpshooter had charmed it, and completely forgets the arrow sticking out of its chest. Instead of a caster level, the duration of this spell is simply until the injury is healed, or until the creature realizes there is an arrow sticking out of its chest (it cannot do so on its own, but if any other creature points it out to the charmed creature, the effect ends instantly)

    This is a mind-affecting, supernatural ability that follows all the rules of the charm condition.

    Weak Spot: Attacking a creature's weak spot allows the sharpshooter to ignore all its forms of damage reduction.

    Head: A creature that is shot in the head suffers a disruption to its actions. The creature is dazed for 1 round (no save). This does not work on creatures immune to critical hits.

    In order for the dazed effect to work, the creature must have taken at least 25 points of damage (after damage reduction and other damage prevention methods applied) with that single shot.

    Vitality: A creature that is shot in its vital organ (varies with the creature) must make a Fortitude save (DC 10+damage dealt) or die. A sharpshooter may only make a Vitality called shot once per encounter.

    Uncanny Dodge (Ex): As the barbarian class feature

    Wild Instincts: Starting at 5th level, the sharpshooter can react to any attack, magical or otherwise, without even thinking. He gains the evasion class feature, as the monk, though it only functions if he is in light or no armor and is not helpless.

    Manyshot (Ex): At 6th level, the sharpshooter gains the Manyshot feat as a bonus feat. He need not meet the prerequisites. He uses the Manyshot feat as if he had a Base Attack Bonus equal to his class level+his Base Attack Bonus from other classes.

    Cautious Shooting (Ex): A 7th level sharpshooter no longer provokes attacks of opportunity for making ranged attacks while threatened.

    Long Shot (Ex): A Sharpshooter has very good eyes. Starting at 9th level, he takes only a -1 penalty per range increment he fires, and he can fire up to 20 range increments.

    Improved Uncanny Dodge (Ex): As the barbarian class feature

    Penetrating Shot (Ex): A sharpshooter can, with difficulty, fire an arrow that can even pierce magical defenses, such as wind wall. As a full-round action, he may fire at such a defense, taking a -2 penalty to hit on his Spot check per CL of the spell. If he hits, he deals damage to the barrier as normal. If the barrier does not have hit points (such as a wind wall spell) its hit points are treated as 1/CL. If the sharpshooter drops a barrier's hit points to 0, it is destroyed.

    Greater Manyshot (Ex): An 11th level sharpshooter gains the Greater Manyshot feat as a bonus feat. He need not meet the prerequisites.

    Greater Wild Instincts (Ex): A 13th level sharpshooter is very aware of his surroundings. He gains the improved evasion ability of a monk, though it only functions if he is wearing light or no armor and is not helpless.

    Long-Ranged Accuracy (Ex): A 15th level sharpshooter doubles the range of any ranged weapon he is using before he starts taking penalties to his shots (for example, a 15th level sharpshooter using a shortbow could hit a target 120 feet away without taking a penalty on his Spot check)

    If the sharpshooter has the Far Shot feat, his total range is triple the weapon's listed range (a sharpshooter with Far Shot and Long-Ranged Accuracy could hit a target 180 feet away with no penalty when using a shortbow)

    Freedom of Movement (Ex): Starting at 17th level, a sharpshooter is able to evade and dodge against any form of mundane or magical attempt to restrict his movement, as if he were under a continuous freedom of movement effect. This is an extraordinary ability.

    Arrows of the Hunter (Ex): A 19th level sharpshooter develops a powerful technique that allows him to craft a deadly set of arrows.

    This does not require a Craft check, but it does require enough gp to make a set of masterwork arrows, as well as 8 hours of uninterrupted work time. (This bonus can be applied to any ammunition. Arrows just sound better)

    A sharpshooter may only craft up to fifty of these arrows at one time. (One 8 hour sitting creates 50 arrows).

    These special arrows, when they connect with a target, render the target incapable of using any supernatural or spell-like abilities, or casting any spells, for one round. This does not interrupt any ongoing effects, nor does it interrupt supernatural qualities.

    These special arrows are destroyed after landing, whether they hit their target or not. They cannot be enchanted, made into magic ammunition, or have poison/ravages applied to them.

    Kill or Be Killed (Ex): A 20th level sharpshooter has a scent for danger. He is always aware of his surroundings, and is the first to draw his bow. The sharpshooter gains the benefits of a continuous foresight effect. This is an extraordinary ability.

    Additionally, if the sharpshooter slays a creature while at full hit points, he gains a morale bonus to his Spot checks made to hit a target and to his damage rolls equal to that creature's hit dice. This benefit lasts until the sharpshooter is no longer at full hit points or until the end of the encounter. This ability stacks with itself, but cannot increase any higher than the sharpshooter's total ranks in the Spot skill.
    Last edited by NeoSeraphi; 2012-01-15 at 10:50 AM.
    Sweet sorcerer avatar by Cuthalion

    Quote Originally Posted by LoL Forum
    Quote Originally Posted by DefenderCRU
    Even with six blood thirsters, I still wouldn't be dealing tons of damage...
    Quote Originally Posted by BellatorCQC
    That's because you don't have a Trinity Force.

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    Default Re: The Sharpshooter (3.5 Base Class, WIP, PEACH)

    Reserved for feats, ACFs prestiges and everything else
    Sweet sorcerer avatar by Cuthalion

    Quote Originally Posted by LoL Forum
    Quote Originally Posted by DefenderCRU
    Even with six blood thirsters, I still wouldn't be dealing tons of damage...
    Quote Originally Posted by BellatorCQC
    That's because you don't have a Trinity Force.

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    Default Re: The Sharpshooter (3.5 Base Class, WIP, PEACH)

    It's, um...bare. That's a lot of dead levels at the top, NeoSeraphi. There are enough bonus feats to Spot and several archery feats at least that could be granted to this guy automatically. And he really, really needs some form of capstone. I also recommend around level 10:

    Long Shot: A Sharpshooter has very good eyes. Starting at X level, he takes only a -1 penalty per range increment he fires, and he can fire up to 20 range increments.

    This either halves the penalty to make long shots or doubles the distance he can fire, depending on how you look at it.

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    Default Re: The Sharpshooter (3.5 Base Class, WIP, PEACH)

    Quote Originally Posted by Noctis Vigil View Post
    It's, um...bare. That's a lot of dead levels at the top, NeoSeraphi. There are enough bonus feats to Spot and several archery feats at least that could be granted to this guy automatically. And he really, really needs some form of capstone. I also recommend around level 10:

    Long Shot: A Sharpshooter has very good eyes. Starting at X level, he takes only a -1 penalty per range increment he fires, and he can fire up to 20 range increments.

    This either halves the penalty to make long shots or doubles the distance he can fire, depending on how you look at it.
    *points to the title* "WIP" = "Work in Progress"

    I posted it so that I could work on it over the next few days while getting some suggestions from the site.

    Capstone is definitely in the works as we speak.

    Thanks for the suggestion with Long Shot, adding it in now.
    Sweet sorcerer avatar by Cuthalion

    Quote Originally Posted by LoL Forum
    Quote Originally Posted by DefenderCRU
    Even with six blood thirsters, I still wouldn't be dealing tons of damage...
    Quote Originally Posted by BellatorCQC
    That's because you don't have a Trinity Force.

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    Default Re: The Sharpshooter (3.5 Base Class, WIP, PEACH)

    Once again, I fail at reading. *facedesk*

    As for other suggestions: multishot should be in their somewhere. All of them, the whole chain straight through the epic one. Let me load up my old archer class I wrote and see if I can't give you some abilities from there.

    OK, here's the level 10 ability I gave my class the Psi-Hunter (Ranger+Soulknife); it fits this class to a tee, and should only need a bit of tweaking if you like it:

    Piercing Shot: Starting at ninth level, a psi-hunter may take a full round action to fire a single arrow at an enemy with such power that it goes through them and travels an additional 10 feet or until it hits something. The force of the blow causes the enemy in front to take an extra 1d10 damage, 1d2 Constitution damage, or knock the enemy back 5 feet. This extra damage or knock back must be decided on before the attack roll is made. If an enemy is standing behind the pierced enemy, it takes damage as normal from the arrow.

    All enhancements to damage and other spells or effects (including Psychic Strike) placed on the weapon will still occur during a Piercing Shot. This attack may only be made with a mind bow. This skill provokes an attack of opportunity on the psi-hunter.


    And the upgraded version:

    Mighty Piercing Shot: At eighteenth level, a psi-hunter’s Piercing Shot becomes so powerful it can pierce two enemies. The first enemy pierced by the Mighty Piercing Shot takes 2d10 extra damage, 1d4 Constitution damage, or is knocked backwards 5 feet and is knocked off his feet by the sheer force of the arrow. The added damage or knock back must be decided before the attack is rolled. After piercing the first enemy the arrow will fly a further 20 feet or until it hits something.

    The second enemy hit is effected as a normal Piercing Shot (1d10 damage, 1d2 Constitution damage, or 5 foot knock back). The type of extra damage the two enemies take must be the same. For example, if Ryan the human psi-hunter shoots a Mighty Piercing Shot at a line of orcs and chooses to do Constitution damage, the first will take 1d4 Constitution damage and the second will take 1d2. After piercing a second enemy, the arrow will either go ten feet or until it hits something. If it hit’s a third enemy, it will do damage as normal for the psi-hunter’s arrow.

    All enhancements to damage and other spells or effects (including Psychic Strike) placed on the weapon will still occur during a Mighty Piercing Shot. This attack may only be made with a mind bow. This skill provokes an attack of opportunity on the psi-hunter.


    Originally, I had each version go through walls of varying types/thicknesses, but that was deemed too strong. I do suggest a cover-piercing ability for you, though; cover should be nothing to a Sharpshooter.

    Also, you mention that if a called shot misses, the use is wasted. Does it have uses per day? I don't see them listed if it does.

    Also, how do accuracy improving spells effect him? Do they give him bonuses to Spot checks? I do like using Spot as BAB; innovative and clever, that.

    Also, he should get a bonus on thrown weapons of some sort. Not sure what. Thrown weapons are sadly neglected and need more love. Actually, scratch that, once you finish this guy I'll put some effort into a thrown weapon specializing PrC for him (I love thrown weapons ).
    Last edited by Noctis Vigil; 2011-10-22 at 02:22 AM.

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    Default Re: The Sharpshooter (3.5 Base Class, WIP, PEACH)

    Quote Originally Posted by Noctis Vigil View Post
    Once again, I fail at reading. *facedesk*
    It's fine. You're not the first person to ignore one of my OPs, and you won't be the last.

    Piercing Shot:
    Okay, I'll tweak this and add it in momentarily

    Also, you mention that if a called shot misses, the use is wasted. Does it have uses per day? I don't see them listed if it does.
    No, but if you use it and miss, it doesn't let you apply the penalty and bonus to your second shot in a full-round attack.

    Also, how do accuracy improving spells effect him? Do they give him bonuses to Spot checks? I do like using Spot as BAB; innovative and clever, that.
    All bonuses to attack rolls apply to Spot checks made to attack a target. And thank you.
    Sweet sorcerer avatar by Cuthalion

    Quote Originally Posted by LoL Forum
    Quote Originally Posted by DefenderCRU
    Even with six blood thirsters, I still wouldn't be dealing tons of damage...
    Quote Originally Posted by BellatorCQC
    That's because you don't have a Trinity Force.

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    Default Re: The Sharpshooter (3.5 Base Class, WIP, PEACH)

    Not sure if it would fly, but maybe you should put a tiny bit of Ranger flair in this guy. Like Track or something. Makes sense to put on a hunter.

    Also, this guy needs some bonus damage to ranged weapons. Just flat out extra dice when he's shooting. Maybe increase the die size of his ranged weapons or something. Like a longbow would do 1d10 instead of 1d8 or something. Not sure exactly, just throwing stuff out for you to work with.

    Also, he needs to not provoke AoOs if he shoots while next to a foe. Not sure if there's a feat for that or not, but it just isn't something that he should do.

    Finally, he needs some sort of ranged attack dodging, perhaps a build in dodge/deflection bonus to ranged attacks. Oh, and Improved Evasion. He should be dodgier.

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    Default Re: The Sharpshooter (3.5 Base Class, WIP, PEACH)

    I've always liked my archers to be able to do more damage with one shot, like the order of the bow initiate.

    An example ability would be to take a full round action to move half your speed, fire with extra damage and move half your speed. This allows some nice hit and run tactics.
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    Default Re: The Sharpshooter (3.5 Base Class, WIP, PEACH)

    Quote Originally Posted by Wavelab View Post
    I've always liked my archers to be able to do more damage with one shot, like the order of the bow initiate.

    An example ability would be to take a full round action to move half your speed, fire with extra damage and move half your speed. This allows some nice hit and run tactics.
    Considering just how easy I made it to deal x3 damage with a longbow (critting based on your total attack bonus instead of just a flat percentage on a dice) I don't see how I could possibly make a single shot deal enough damage to be any better than making four easily criticaled attack rolls as a full round action (dealing a total of 12d8+12*your total modifier to your Spot checks for a Medium creature)

    Edit: Ah, I see, you meant hit and run tactics as in "single shot, then hide". Again, with the ease of delivering a critical hit (especially on your first shot of the round) I don't see the need to improve that damage any further.
    Last edited by NeoSeraphi; 2011-10-22 at 04:25 AM.
    Sweet sorcerer avatar by Cuthalion

    Quote Originally Posted by LoL Forum
    Quote Originally Posted by DefenderCRU
    Even with six blood thirsters, I still wouldn't be dealing tons of damage...
    Quote Originally Posted by BellatorCQC
    That's because you don't have a Trinity Force.

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    Default Re: The Sharpshooter (3.5 Base Class, WIP, PEACH)

    Quote Originally Posted by NeoSeraphi View Post
    Whenever the sharpshooter would make a ranged attack roll, he makes a Spot check instead. The DC is the target’s AC. The sharpshooter may choose to replace his Wisdom modifier to this check with his Dexterity modifier, though he may not use both. Any bonuses to either Spot checks or attack rolls apply. (A sharpshooter with both the Alertness feat and the Weapon Focus feat would get a +3 bonus to his Spot check to hit a creature with a ranged attack roll)

    If the sharpshooter’s Spot check exceeds his target’s AC by 7 or more, he is considered to have threatened a critical hit. (The weapon’s threat range does not affect this in any way) If he confirms his critical with another successful Spot check, the weapon deals critical damage.
    At level 1 you can easily have a bonus larger than +10 to the roll - you're significantly more accurate than the rest of the party. By level 20 it's easy to be always critting anything with every shot. Skill checks don't auto-fail on a 1, so you never miss. This doesn't work as an attack mechanism, particulary when you add in bonuses to attack rolls as well.


    Quote Originally Posted by NeoSeraphi View Post
    Called Shot (Ex):
    It's not worth doing, because you can guarantee that your target is going to be dead. The head shot is also redundant as you are always critting anyway.



    edit - I missed that you don't add skill ranks to damage, which is much less rediculous.
    Last edited by elpollo; 2011-10-22 at 09:12 AM.
    Spelt with a silent "Phwoar"

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    Default Re: The Sharpshooter (3.5 Base Class, WIP, PEACH)

    Quote Originally Posted by elpollo View Post
    At level 1 you can easily have a bonus larger than +10 to the roll - you're significantly more accurate than the rest of the party. By level 20 it's easy to be always critting anything with every shot. Skill checks don't auto-fail on a 1, so you never miss. This doesn't work as an attack mechanism, particulary when you add in bonuses to attack rolls as well.
    I see no problem with that. Ranged attackers are supposed to be accurate. Considering they deal much less damage than melee and are unable to perform any special actions (bull rush, trip, etc), making and critting every shot doesn't bother me.


    It's not worth doing, because you can guarantee that your target is going to be dead. The head shot is also redundant as you are always critting anyway.
    Well that isn't true. A guaranteed critical doesn't always slay your target, especially since monster hit dice scales drastically higher than their CR. (And plenty of creatures are immune to critical hits)

    As for the head shot, its for the guaranteed critical, against monsters with particularly high ACs.

    I missed that you don't add skill ranks to damage, which is much less rediculous.[/i]
    Yes, that would have just been moronic. Adding your bonus to Spot is pretty high, but only if you spend a ridiculous amount of money optimizing it with magical items or gaining bonuses through spellcasting. If you don't, it's pretty much just your Wisdom modifier.
    Sweet sorcerer avatar by Cuthalion

    Quote Originally Posted by LoL Forum
    Quote Originally Posted by DefenderCRU
    Even with six blood thirsters, I still wouldn't be dealing tons of damage...
    Quote Originally Posted by BellatorCQC
    That's because you don't have a Trinity Force.

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    Default Re: The Sharpshooter (3.5 Base Class, WIP, PEACH)

    I'm gonna make a hypothetical here just to show you how over-balanced this class is.

    We have Sylvanna, the 1st level Elf Sharpshooter. She didn't roll too great for stats, but with racial adjustment managed to get 16 Dex. She takes alertness as her 1st level feat and ends up with a spot check modifier of +11. She wields a longbow.

    Her adventuring ally is Gorath, the 1st level Orc Fighter. He rolls amazingly for stats and, with racial adjustment, manages to get 22 Str. He takes weapon focus (longsword) as one of his starting feats and wields a masterwork longsword and ends up with +9 to his attack roll.

    They come upon a standard 1st level encounter of 6 goblins (AC 15). Gorath attacks the closest one and rolls a 16. Having outstanding strength, he manages to kill it with one sweep of his sword. Sylvanna takes a shot at the farthest one (60 ft away) and rolls 11 on her spot check. With the extra +11 that makes it a critical threat. She rolls a 12 next which makes it a x3 critical. She kills the goblin in one shot.

    They finish off the 6 grunts with Gorath suffering severe damage from being up in the fray and Sylvanna suffering zero damage. Suddenly, out comes their three bugbear leaders. Gorath having little intelligence or wisdom charges in and is pummeled to death. Sylvanna is still 80 feet away. She takes a shot at one and rolls a 13 (+11) for her spot, then rolls a 14 (+11) on her threat. She crits the first bugbear to death, dealing 18 damage. She then retreats 30 feet. The 2 remaining bugbears make a double move (not wanting to be tired or suffer the AC loss from running) and advance 60 feet. Sylvanna rolls a 17 and 13 and crits another one to death, then retreats 30 feet. The remaining bugbear soils himself, but continues to advance another 60 ft (now only 20 feet away). Sylvanna finally rolls terribly, a 7, but still manages to deal 5 damage. She then retreats 30 feet. The bugbear sees his opportunity and covers the remaining 50 feet with a charge and attack. Sylvanna is easily hit since she is wearing only light armor, but the bugbear deals only 6 damage and Sylvanna has 2 hp left. She retreats 5 feet and takes a shot, rolling a 12 and a 16, and crits the bugbear to death.

    Gorath, the amazingly above average fighter, is dead while Sylvanna, the average sharpshooter, gets 2100 XP and 2200 gp worth of treasure from an "impossible" encounter based on the CR of the enemies.


    The reason ranged fighters do less damage than melee fighters is because they are nowhere near the action. There is little chance of them getting damaged when they are so far away. Also, a huge gash from a sword will do much more damage than a little poke from an arrow. Ranged fighters can also take rapid shot and manyshot later on so that they can deal more damage per round.

    If you really want the attack to be based off of a spot check, then it should be opposed to the enemies hide check and not their AC. Magic weapons should not contribute to the spot "attack" roll and neither should weapon focus or any spells that increase attack. Also, threat range should still be based off of the weapon. So you would roll a critical threat just as often as other classes, instead of every other roll.

    Adding Dex to a spot check makes no sense to me. Dexterity represents how fluid and agile your movements are, not how well you can see.

    This class should only get d4 hp because, like wizards and sorcerers, sharpshooters should never experience melee combat and as such will never develop an ability to shrug off damage. *Note: Rangers get d8 hp because they can go either ranging or melee from their class abilities. They are also naturally attuned to wild (guerilla) combat, where enemies are frequently within melee attack range.

    The damage bonus at 2nd level should be removed. Ranged fighters are always assumed to have "devastating accuracy." As I have already pointed out, arrows don't do a lot of damage so the d8 damage from longbows is already assuming that you are hitting the enemies in the heart/lungs/face. Even with a heart or lung shot, the arrow is sealing its own wound. So as long as the arrow isn't removed, the enemy will be able to push through the pain and continue to fight without bleeding out. So does Claws of the Eagle allow a sharpshooter to shoot the enemy in vital spots even more vitally? Or is it a magical ability that imbues the arrows with extra damage?

    Even with all these changes, having an attack based on a spot check seems over-balanced to me.
    Last edited by Chaos_Laicosin; 2011-10-22 at 02:16 PM.

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    Default Re: The Sharpshooter (3.5 Base Class, WIP, PEACH)

    Quote Originally Posted by Chaos_Laicosin View Post
    The reason ranged fighters do less damage than melee fighters is because they are nowhere near the action. There is little chance of them getting damaged when they are so far away. Also, a huge gash from a sword will do much more damage than a little poke from an arrow. Ranged fighters can also take rapid shot and manyshot later on so that they can deal more damage per round.
    Ranged fighters do not deal more damage with more arrows. A) Manyshot does not increase the number of arrows you can shoot per round. It increases the number of arrows you can shoot as a standard action. B) Shoot 4 arrows a round. Each deals a d8 with no bonus damage. The enemy has DR 5. You deal next to no damage with each arrow.


    If you really want the attack to be based off of a spot check, then it should be opposed to the enemies hide check and not their AC. Magic weapons should not contribute to the spot "attack" roll and neither should weapon focus or any spells that increase attack. Also, threat range should still be based off of the weapon. So you would roll a critical threat just as often as other classes, instead of every other roll.
    Hide check rather than AC? Sure, makes sense. And I'll remove the bonus to attack rolls from it. But no, threat range is not based off the weapon. If studying your enemy's weaknesses carefully did not allow you to deal more damage with your next attack roll, the assassin Death Attack class feature would not exist. The ability to take carefully aimed shots allows you to easily deliver critical hits. And I want this class to crit often.

    Adding Dex to a spot check makes no sense to me. Dexterity represents how fluid and agile your movements are, not how well you can see.
    Fair enough. I'll remove that.

    This class should only get d4 hp because, like wizards and sorcerers, sharpshooters should never experience melee combat and as such will never develop an ability to shrug off damage. *Note: Rangers get d8 hp because they can go either ranging or melee from their class abilities. They are also naturally attuned to wild (guerilla) combat, where enemies are frequently within melee attack range.
    Okay, d4 it is.

    The damage bonus at 2nd level should be removed. Ranged fighters are always assumed to have "devastating accuracy." As I have already pointed out, arrows don't do a lot of damage so the d8 damage from longbows is already assuming that you are hitting the enemies in the heart/lungs/face. Even with a heart or lung shot, the arrow is sealing its own wound. So as long as the arrow isn't removed, the enemy will be able to push through the pain and continue to fight without bleeding out. So does Claws of the Eagle allow a sharpshooter to shoot the enemy in vital spots even more vitally? Or is it a magical ability that imbues the arrows with extra damage?
    D8 arrows do not assume that you're hitting a creature's weak point. I designed the class on the balance point that a d8 arrow was simply you getting hit with the arrow.

    As I pointed out above, without the extra damage, you don't overcome damage reduction. At all. So no, I'm not taking it out.
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    Quote Originally Posted by LoL Forum
    Quote Originally Posted by DefenderCRU
    Even with six blood thirsters, I still wouldn't be dealing tons of damage...
    Quote Originally Posted by BellatorCQC
    That's because you don't have a Trinity Force.

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    Default Re: The Sharpshooter (3.5 Base Class, WIP, PEACH)

    Quote Originally Posted by NeoSeraphi View Post
    If studying your enemy's weaknesses carefully did not allow you to deal more damage with your next attack roll, the assassin Death Attack class feature would not exist. The ability to take carefully aimed shots allows you to easily deliver critical hits.
    Its just that being able to dead 3d8 damage almost half the time seems too powerful to me. Perhaps you could leave critical hits as they are (x3 on a natural 20) and instead have an extra ability to increase damage for regular shots.

    Something like: A sharpshooter is adept at finding weaknesses in an enemies fighting style as well as his armor. As a swift action, a sharpshooter may study a single enemy once per round (Concentration vs DC 10 + enemy's Dex modifier). If the check is successful, thereafter the sharpshooter deals 25% more damage with each successful attack against that enemy. The effects stack, such that 2 successful checks increase damage by 50%, 3 increase damage by 75% and so on. The effect counts against one specific enemy and lasts for up to one day.

    Or something of that sort so that you aren't constantly killing enemies before the melee fighters can get an attack off. You could also increase the number of enemies you could concentrate on at higher class levels and such.

    I thought it might be neat if a sharpshooter had a familiar. Similar to a druid's animal companion but giving bonuses like a spell caster's familiar. So you could have an owl to scout from the night skies for you and grant you (or increase your) low-light vision, or you could have an eagle and it could maybe increase your range increment by like 10 feet. I'd suggest avian familiars like owls, eagle, hawks, ravens, bats, etc.

    Also, I was thinking this class could have different combat styles like the ranger does. You could pick either bows or crossbows and get bonuses based on your choice. Bows could get more attacks per round while crossbows could get increased damage and precision. This would probably mess with your current setup, but I think its a neat idea to grapple with.

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    Default Re: The Sharpshooter (3.5 Base Class, WIP, PEACH)

    A problem I find with the hide check is how many creatures have a hide check above 10? Now how many have an AC above 10?

    That could be a potential problem.
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    Default Re: The Sharpshooter (3.5 Base Class, WIP, PEACH)

    I have 2 ,ajor issues against this class and a few smaller ones


    here the major

    d4 HD for me is waay to small for osmething that is supposed to be about combat I would give it a D8, or at least a d6.


    2ndly, it needs a level 20 capstone ability, as i fully beilve every none 6th+ spell casting class needs one. and this one should be super awesome! maybe some type of ultra shot that staggers the target?

    now for teh minor ones
    Claws of the Eagle. the bonus damage IMO should just be how many ranks you have, which I think is still respectable getting +23 at lvl 20 instead of people finding ways to cheese and get +100+ to their total spot check modifier.

    also instead fo a cahmr the heart attack should be like what Bard did to smaug and KILL SH*T dead!!! like POW! take that evil *insert evil whatever here*

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    Default Re: The Sharpshooter (3.5 Base Class, WIP, PEACH)

    Quote Originally Posted by Wavelab View Post
    A problem I find with the hide check is how many creatures have a hide check above 10? Now how many have an AC above 10?

    That could be a potential problem.
    Yeah, I was just thinking about that, too. Perhaps it could go back to being a check vs DC, but the DC could be flat-footed AC + hide modifier. Or something of that sort.

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    Default Re: The Sharpshooter (3.5 Base Class, WIP, PEACH)

    Quote Originally Posted by Chaos_Laicosin View Post
    Its just that being able to dead 3d8 damage almost half the time seems too powerful to me. Perhaps you could leave critical hits as they are (x3 on a natural 20) and instead have an extra ability to increase damage for regular shots.
    3d8 damage nets around 12.6 damage, average. 12 damage. That's it. Add your ranks in Spot to that, multiplied by 3. So that's...3d8+3*(level+3). At 10th level, it averages to 51 damage. That's respectable.

    Realize that my intention is to bring ranged combat closer to the two-handed fighter. An archer may not take advantage of the valorous weapon enhancement, the Shock Trooper, Power Attack, or Leap Attack feats, may not deal double damage from the back of a mount, and may not add 1 1/2 his Strength modifier (amplified by Rage and Frenzy) to his damage rolls. There is absolutely no reason that an average of 12 damage per shot is unfair.

    A problem I find with the hide check is how many creatures have a hide check above 10? Now how many have an AC above 10?
    I agree. The DC is back to AC. Without the bonuses to attack rolls applying to the Spot checks anymore, it should be reasonable.

    d4 HD for me is waay to small for osmething that is supposed to be about combat I would give it a D8, or at least a d6.
    Alright, updated to d6

    2ndly, it needs a level 20 capstone ability, as i fully beilve every none 6th+ spell casting class needs one. and this one should be super awesome! maybe some type of ultra shot that staggers the target?
    The class is only half-finished. I am working on a capstone as we speak, don't worry.

    now for teh minor ones
    Claws of the Eagle. the bonus damage IMO should just be how many ranks you have, which I think is still respectable getting +23 at lvl 20 instead of people finding ways to cheese and get +100+ to their total spot check modifier.
    Good point. Changed.

    also instead fo a cahmr the heart attack should be like what Bard did to smaug and KILL SH*T dead!!! like POW! take that evil *insert evil whatever here*
    That was what the headshot is for. The heart shot is more for flavor than anything.

    Edit: Added Uncanny Dodge, Improved Uncanny Dodge, and the capstone Kill or Be Killed.
    Last edited by NeoSeraphi; 2011-10-22 at 10:14 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by LoL Forum
    Quote Originally Posted by DefenderCRU
    Even with six blood thirsters, I still wouldn't be dealing tons of damage...
    Quote Originally Posted by BellatorCQC
    That's because you don't have a Trinity Force.

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    Default Re: The Sharpshooter (3.5 Base Class, WIP, PEACH)

    Glad you changed it to at least D6. Even Cloistered Clerics get D6.

    @Chaos: Why are we balancing against the Fighter? The one class that most other combat classes are written to help us forget exists? This seems to be a common thing in most groups: the Fighter should be the peak of physical fighting. This is wrong. If you can't make a combat class that outstrips the Fighter in every way, ur doin it rong (that hurt to type). The only place Fighter ever shows up in my campaign is on mooks, and I make them 2-3 levels higher than the party facing them because yes, they will die that easily.

    Let's look at the example you gave. You assume optimal battle conditions for a Sharpshooter; lack of range or space to move in would have evened that fight up real fast (ie: most anywhere inside). Put that battle in a castle and you would have a problem. The Sharpshooter is a fairly situational warrior. There are a lots of problems they have to deal with that melee and casters never face that limit them (things like ammo and weather). Honestly, ranged combat is severely underpowered. To make it more realistic (history proves that better ranged combat wins wars), a drastic increase is needed in power. That's what I like about this class; it gives it that boost. Honestly, if it makes ranged a little stronger than melee, good! It needs it.

    Suggestion on a part of the capstone: give him a few "free" range increments. Like, maybe no penalty on the first two additional increments fired.

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    Default Re: The Sharpshooter (3.5 Base Class, WIP, PEACH)

    Quote Originally Posted by Noctis Vigil View Post
    Suggestion on a part of the capstone: give him a few "free" range increments. Like, maybe no penalty on the first two additional increments fired.
    I actually just finished the capstone. Please read it and tell me what you think. (Adding the no penalty on range increments at an earlier level)
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    Quote Originally Posted by LoL Forum
    Quote Originally Posted by DefenderCRU
    Even with six blood thirsters, I still wouldn't be dealing tons of damage...
    Quote Originally Posted by BellatorCQC
    That's because you don't have a Trinity Force.

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    Default Re: The Sharpshooter (3.5 Base Class, WIP, PEACH)

    The capstone:
    -Foresight isn't that much a problem, and I like the idea of the sharpshooter stopping the group and firing into the bushes.
    -The damage bonus may be more complicated. Let's say you fight two 30 HD creatures. You kill them both before the party makes contact. Then more creatures come. Same encounter, already a +60 boost to damage.

    I like this ability and that's a sure sign that it's overpowered.

    Edit: Maybe add a limit. For example equal to your total spot rank or your HD.
    Last edited by Wavelab; 2011-10-23 at 01:47 AM.
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    Default Re: The Sharpshooter (3.5 Base Class, WIP, PEACH)

    Quote Originally Posted by Wavelab View Post
    The capstone:
    -Foresight isn't that much a problem, and I like the idea of the sharpshooter stopping the group and firing into the bushes.
    -The damage bonus may be more complicated. Let's say you fight two 30 HD creatures. You kill them both before the party makes contact. Then more creatures come. Same encounter, already a +60 boost to damage.

    I like this ability and that's a sure sign that it's overpowered.

    Edit: Maybe add a limit. For example equal to your total spot rank or your HD.
    Alright, a limit equal to your ranks in Spot is good enough I suppose.
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    Quote Originally Posted by LoL Forum
    Quote Originally Posted by DefenderCRU
    Even with six blood thirsters, I still wouldn't be dealing tons of damage...
    Quote Originally Posted by BellatorCQC
    That's because you don't have a Trinity Force.

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    Default Re: The Sharpshooter (3.5 Base Class, WIP, PEACH)

    A bonus equal to your spot is still pretty high.

    Having +23*4 damage isn't that bad.
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    Default Re: The Sharpshooter (3.5 Base Class, WIP, PEACH)

    Quote Originally Posted by Wavelab View Post
    A bonus equal to your spot is still pretty high.

    Having +23*4 damage isn't that bad.
    As opposed to 1d12+321? (40 Str, Supreme Power Attack, Leap Attack, and Shock Trooper, +5 valorous greataxe)

    I want an optimized sharpshooter to be dishing out damage like it's no one's business. And he still has to not get hit even once before the encounter ends. (And in order to maximize this, he has to be in one encounter with at least one 23 HD enemy that he kills without taking damage, then there has to be another 23 HD enemy that still doesn't damage him)

    Not only are the requirements steep, it also means he hasn't taken any levels in another class. Seriously. Base class capstones mean no dipping, no prestige classing, period by level 20. They should really reward the players for their commitment, in my opinion.
    Last edited by NeoSeraphi; 2011-10-23 at 02:06 AM.
    Sweet sorcerer avatar by Cuthalion

    Quote Originally Posted by LoL Forum
    Quote Originally Posted by DefenderCRU
    Even with six blood thirsters, I still wouldn't be dealing tons of damage...
    Quote Originally Posted by BellatorCQC
    That's because you don't have a Trinity Force.

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    Default Re: The Sharpshooter (3.5 Base Class, WIP, PEACH)

    It looks pretty good, but very very situational; I don't actually see myself ever using the bonus to Spot, personally. The Foresight is nice, though.

    This guy still needs a concealment remover/nullifier. Also, suggestion for called shot:

    Shot to the Soul: A Sharpshooter knows how to best disrupt casters to keep them from using abilities. Someone hit with this shot may not use any spells, spell-like abilities or supernatural abilities this round. This does not negate ongoing spell effects or dispel magic in any way, it merely keeps them from using any more for one round.

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    Default Re: The Sharpshooter (3.5 Base Class, WIP, PEACH)

    The chances of the 23 HD creatures getting in close range of you is very minimal(unless your party consists of only you). If they are rangers or spellcasters it's a different story.

    All in all it's a good ability but it can get overpowered quickly.
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    Default Re: The Sharpshooter (3.5 Base Class, WIP, PEACH)

    Quote Originally Posted by Noctis Vigil View Post
    It looks pretty good, but very very situational; I don't actually see myself ever using the bonus to Spot, personally. The Foresight is nice, though.
    Er...the bonus to Spot applies to your to-hit and critical confirmations, as per Eyes of the Hunter...

    This guy still needs a concealment remover/nullifier. Also, suggestion for called shot:
    I'm reticent to do that. Concealment is pretty much a fair way for a DM to counter a skilled archer. And there's no real mundane way to ignore it. If you can't see someone, you can't shoot them. It's really straightforward actually.



    Shot to the Soul: A Sharpshooter knows how to best disrupt casters to keep them from using abilities. Someone hit with this shot may not use any spells, spell-like abilities or supernatural abilities this round. This does not negate ongoing spell effects or dispel magic in any way, it merely keeps them from using any more for one round.
    Looks good. I'll figure out where to put it when I wake up.
    Sweet sorcerer avatar by Cuthalion

    Quote Originally Posted by LoL Forum
    Quote Originally Posted by DefenderCRU
    Even with six blood thirsters, I still wouldn't be dealing tons of damage...
    Quote Originally Posted by BellatorCQC
    That's because you don't have a Trinity Force.

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    Default Re: The Sharpshooter (3.5 Base Class, WIP, PEACH)

    Quote Originally Posted by Wavelab View Post
    The chances of the 23 HD creatures getting in close range of you is very minimal(unless your party consists of only you). If they are rangers or spellcasters it's a different story.

    All in all it's a good ability but it can get overpowered quickly.
    As the sharpshooter himself is living proof of, you don't need to be in close range to deal damage.

    Other archers, SLAs, etc. The ability to react is good, and the improved evasion even better, but the creature only needs to deal 1 hit point of damage to you to make everything go away.
    Sweet sorcerer avatar by Cuthalion

    Quote Originally Posted by LoL Forum
    Quote Originally Posted by DefenderCRU
    Even with six blood thirsters, I still wouldn't be dealing tons of damage...
    Quote Originally Posted by BellatorCQC
    That's because you don't have a Trinity Force.

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    Default Re: The Sharpshooter (3.5 Base Class, WIP, PEACH)

    Quote Originally Posted by NeoSeraphi View Post
    Er...the bonus to Spot applies to your to-hit and critical confirmations, as per Eyes of the Hunter...
    I'm aware of this. However, the odds of me dropping something large enough to give me a good boost without taking any damage, and then keep not taking damage for a good amount of time? Very slim indeed.

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    Default Re: The Sharpshooter (3.5 Base Class, WIP, PEACH)

    Quote Originally Posted by Noctis Vigil View Post
    I'm aware of this. However, the odds of me dropping something large enough to give me a good boost without taking any damage, and then keep not taking damage for a good amount of time? Very slim indeed.
    Yeah, I figured that was the problem. Still, if a sharpshooter has caster support, it's good for ambush scenarios. A sharpshooter who has greater invisibility becomes a serious problem for enemies if played correctly. Though that's true about any well-written class, I suppose.
    Sweet sorcerer avatar by Cuthalion

    Quote Originally Posted by LoL Forum
    Quote Originally Posted by DefenderCRU
    Even with six blood thirsters, I still wouldn't be dealing tons of damage...
    Quote Originally Posted by BellatorCQC
    That's because you don't have a Trinity Force.

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