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    Default The Sorcerer (A NeoSeraphi Fix) 3.5, PEACH Finished!

    The Sorcerer

    The Reason for the Fix: The point of this fix is not to make the sorcerer more powerful, though obviously it did. The point of this fix is to give the sorcerer his due place.

    A sorcerer is supposed to be a caster-in-a-can. It's supposed to be noob-friendly, and more importantly, it's supposed to have the staying power than a cleric and a wizard lack. The original point of the sorcerer was to trade versatility for less book-keeping and more power.

    This did not happen. Therefore, I have given the sorcerer a fix, to do what he was originally intended to do: cast and blast, all day every day. I gave him a little extra versatility, but more importantly, I gave him class features.

    The sorcerer presented here is powerful, and he can last much longer than a wizard. This sorcerer could easily handle 8-10 CR-appropriate encounters per day, even if he was unloading a relevant spell every round. I also gave him slightly more versatility, with 10 extra spells known, plus 5 spells from the cleric spell list or a select choice of Domains.

    Alignment: Any

    Hit Dice: d4

    Class Skills: The sorcerer's class skills are Bluff, Concentration, Craft, Diplomacy, Forgery, Gather Information, Hide, Intimidate, Knowledge (Arcana), Move Silently, Profession, Spellcraft, and Use Magic Device.

    Skill Points: 4+Int per level, x4 at first level

    The Sorcerer
    {table=head]Level|Base Attack Bonus|Fort Save|Ref Save|Will Save|Special|0lvl|1st|2nd|3rd|4th|5th|6th|7th|8th|9th

    1st|
    +0
    |
    +0
    |
    +0
    |
    +2
    |Summon Familiar|5|3

    2nd|
    +1
    |
    +0
    |
    +0
    |
    +3
    |Magical Smile|6|4|-

    3rd|
    +1
    |
    +1
    |
    +1
    |
    +3
    |Chain Spell|7|5|-|-

    4th|
    +2
    |
    +1
    |
    +1
    |
    +4
    |Ancestral Spellcasting|8|6|3|-|-

    5th|
    +2
    |
    +1
    |
    +1
    |
    +4
    |Magical Reservoir|9|7|4|-|-|-

    6th|
    +3
    |
    +2
    |
    +2
    |
    +5
    |Explosive Immunity|Will|8|5|3|-|-|-

    7th|
    +3
    |
    +2
    |
    +2
    |
    +5
    |Arcane Resistance|Will|9|6|4|-|-|-|-

    8th|
    +4
    |
    +2
    |
    +2
    |
    +6
    |Ancestral Spellcasting, Reactive Spell|Will|Will|7|5|3|-|-|-|-|-

    9th|
    +4
    |
    +3
    |
    +3
    |
    +6
    |Arcane Vitality|Will|Will|8|6|4|-|-|-|-|-

    10th|
    +5
    |
    +3
    |
    +3
    |
    +7
    |Whirlwind Spell|Will|Will|9|7|5|3|-|-|-|-

    11th|
    +5
    |
    +3
    |
    +3
    |
    +7
    |Far Shot Spellcasting|Will|Will|Will|8|6|4|-|-|-|-

    12th|
    +6/+1
    |
    +4
    |
    +4
    |
    +8
    |Ancestral Spellcasting|Will|Will|Will|9|7|5|3|-|-|-

    13th|
    +6/+1
    |
    +4
    |
    +4
    |
    +8
    |Arcane Breath|Will|Will|Will|Will|8|6|4|-|-|-

    14th|
    +7/+2
    |
    +4
    |
    +4
    |
    +9
    |Spontaneous Counterspell|Will|Will|Will|Will|9|7|5|3|-|-

    15th|
    +7/+2
    |
    +5
    |
    +5
    |
    +9
    |Rapid Fire, Improved Arcane Breath|Will|Will|Will|Will|Will|8|6|4|-|-

    16th|
    +8/+3
    |
    +5
    |
    +5
    |
    +10
    |Ancestral Spellcasting|Will|Will|Will|Will|Will|9|7|5|3|-

    17th|
    +8/+3
    |
    +5
    |
    +5
    |
    +10
    |Greater Arcane Breath|Will|Will|Will|Will|Will|Will|8|6|4|-

    18th|
    +9/+4
    |
    +6
    |
    +6
    |
    +11
    ||Will|Will|Will|Will|Will|Will|9|7|5|3

    19th|
    +9/+4
    |
    +6
    |
    +6
    |
    +11
    |Superior Arcane Breath|Will|Will|Will|Will|Will|Will|Will|8|6|4

    20th|
    +10/+5
    |
    +6
    |
    +6
    |
    +12
    |Ancestral Spellcasting|Will|Will|Will|Will|Will|Will|Will|9| 7|5[/table]

    Class Features:

    The following are the class features of the sorcerer.

    Weapon and Armor Proficiency: A sorcerer is proficient with all simple weapons. He is not proficient with any armor or shield.

    Spellcasting: A sorcerer is born with the innate gift of spellcasting, which he learns to control over his life. Because a sorcerer does not study magic, he is unable to grasp more than a tiny amount of the vast arcane power that the cosmos has to offer, but with that tiny amount, he is a master almost instantly.

    A sorcerer's ability to manipulate the world comes from his life energy and the force of his personality, and therefore is not drained by constant use. A sorcerer is able to cast an amazingly large number of spells per day, and as he masters higher level spells, his lower level ones take no toll on his body at all.

    When a sorcerer can cast a spell of a certain spell level at-will, as is displayed on the table, he is treated as having an infinite number of spell slots of that level to expend for spells and use for metamagic of lower level spells.

    For the purposes of other abilities that consume spell slots, such as the Arcane Strike feat, a sorcerer with at-will casting instead has a number of spell slots equal to the level of the spell+his Charisma modifier to use to power those abilities only, per level of the spell. (So a 20th level sorcerer with 20 Charisma would have 5 0 level spell slots, 6 1st level spell slots, 7 2nd level spell slots, etc)

    A sorcerer knows a small number of arcane spells, drawn from the sorcerer/wizard spell list, however, there is one exception. A sorcerer's mastery of magic comes from consuming the energy around him, mixing it with his own, and then leaking it back into the world after the spell dissipates. Therefore, sorcerers are unable to create permanent, lasting objects with their spells. A sorcerer may not learn or cast spells from the conjuration [creation] subschool, though they are still treated as being on his spell list for the purpose of scrolls and wands (using them, not creating them). The exception to this is spells that create effects which dissipate upon being thrown or tossed (such as lesser orb of fire or acid arrow). To learn or cast a spell, the sorcerer must have a base Charisma score of 10+spell level. This score must be the sorcerer's true, item-independent Charisma score. Inherent, enhancement, sacred, profane, and morale bonuses to a sorcerer's Charisma score do not count for determining his base Charisma score needed to learn or cast spells.

    A sorcerer's caster level is equal to her class level.

    The DC for saving throws of a sorcerer's spells (if they allow a saving throw) is 10+spell level+ Charisma modifier. Unlike wizards and clerics, a sorcerer does not receive bonus spells per day for a high Charisma score.

    A sorcerer casts spells spontaneously, as a PHB sorcerer. The sorcerer knows a number of spells equal to the PHB sorcerer, +2 extra spells per level, gained when he first gains access to the spell level. The sorcerer suffers arcane spell failure for attempting to cast a spell with somatic components in armor.

    A sorcerer's ability to affect the world around him is very limited. All of a sorcerer's spells that have a range of Medium or Long change to Close.

    On Sorcerers and Prestige Classes: The at-will casting mechanic of the sorcerer is considered a class feature. A sorcerer who takes a prestige class that advances his spellcasting level (such as the mystic theurge prestige class) does not gain at-will spellcasting for any spell levels that he did not already have at-will casting for from his sorcerer levels. Instead, his effective spell slots for those levels are treated as 9 and never change, unless he goes back to sorcerer.

    (Ex: A Sorcerer 8 can cast 1st level spells at-will. A sorcerer 7/swiftblade 1 can cast 9 1st level spells per day. A sorcerer 7/swiftblade 1/sorcerer 1 can cast 1st level spells at-will)

    Summon Familiar (Su): This class feature is identical to the PHB sorcerer feature.

    Magical Smile (Su): A sorcerer can use his magical power for more than just spells. Starting at 2nd level, a sorcerer may, as a swift action, consume a 1st or higher level spell slot. If he does so, he receives a circumstance bonus to all Charisma checks he makes for one minute equal to 3*the level of the spell sacrificed.

    Chain Spell (Ex): A sorcerer's strength comes in his ability to let loose and fire a large amount of power at once. Starting at 3rd level, as a full-round action, a sorcerer may cast two spells with a casting time of one standard action. These spells must both only affect one target, and they must be aimed at the same target. Chaining spells is incredibly difficult, and can only be done if the target is within 30 ft. A sorcerer who chains spells is unable to use his swift action for the round.

    Chain Spell does not allow you to extend the range of a touch spell.

    Ancestral Spellcasting (Ex): Like a cleric draws power from his god, a sorcerer is able to draw power from the source of his magic, often traces of draconic, fiendish, or celestial blood somewhere in his lineage, though he can also draw power from other magical sources such as fey, undead, etc.

    At 4th level, and every 4 levels afterwards, a sorcerer may learn a single spell on the cleric spell list. This spell is in addition to his spells known, and may not be of a higher level spell than he is able to cast. A sorcerer may choose from the cleric list or from a list of up to five Domains that are related to his bloodline or alignment, at the DM's discretion (For example, a sorcerer who draws upon the power of fey might choose the Chaos, Charm, and Pleasure domains). A sorcerer may not cast divine spells if he does not match their alignment subtype (A chaotic neutral sorcerer may not cast [Good], [Evil], or [Law] spells, from the cleric spell list)

    A sorcerer is unable to learn conjuration (healing) spells that allow the creature to recover hit points with this ability, as well as any spells that channel positive or negative energy. Additionally, a sorcerer may never learn the miracle spell through this class feature.

    The spells the sorcerer gains are treated as arcane spells. If the spell has a divine focus, the sorcerer must use a holy symbol related to his bloodline as a divine focus. These holy symbols may be purchased or carved in the same way a cleric's holy symbol is acquired.

    Magical Reservoir (Ex): Even a less experienced sorcerer often finds himself able to unleash simple magic at will, with absolutely no drain on his body. At 5th level, a sorcerer may select a single Reserve feat (Complete Mage) that he qualifies for, and gain it as a bonus feat. Every time the sorcerer levels up, (after he chooses any new spells known and increases his caster level), the sorcerer has the option of changing his bonus reserve feat to another one that he qualifies for. If the sorcerer levels up and previously did not have this feat (because he did not qualify for any such feat at his previous level, but now he does), he may instead choose a feat that he qualifies for and gain the feat, then start trading it out as he levels up as normal.

    Explosive Immunity (Ex): A sorcerer does not fight like a wizard, he must walk into the fray in order to affect enemies with his most powerful spells and class features. So the sorcerer develops tactics that allows himself to be caught in the blast and walk away.

    Starting at 6th level, whenever a sorcerer casts a spell, he may choose to make himself immune to all effects of that spell, such as if he cast a fireball spell centered on a creature 10 feet away from him. The fire would explode and the sorcerer would be in an affected square, but would not take any damage.

    This ability is not mandatory. A sorcerer may still cast flight on himself, for example.

    Arcane Resistance (Su): Starting at 7th level, a sorcerer may, as an immediate action, consume a spell slot and grant himself an arcane bonus on all saving throws equal to the level of the spell slot he consumed until the beginning of his turn.

    An arcane bonus is a special kind of bonus. It stacks with all other bonuses to a character's saving throws, but it does not stack with any bonus provided by an arcane spell that is currently active (even if the bonus provided by that spell is untyped)

    For example, Arcane Resistance would stack with a +5 cloak of resistance, but not with the bonus to the sorcerer's Fortitude saves granted by the sorcerer's active transmutation spell.

    Reactive Spell (Su): A sorcerer controls the very air around him. Something as silly as initiative doesn't matter to him. Starting at 8th level, as an immediate action, a sorcerer may cast a single evocation spell on the sorcerer/wizard spell list that he knows, as long as that spell has a casting time of one standard action or less. (The sorcerer may not use this ability to cast a spell from the cleric spell list he has learned through Draconic Spellcasting)

    A sorcerer who uses Reactive Spell is slowed during his next round, with no saving throw allowed.

    Arcane Vitality (Su): Starting at 9th level, a sorcerer may consume an immediate action to shield himself from harm. By consuming a spell slot, the sorcerer gains DR X/- until the beginning of his next turn, where X is equal to 5* the level of the spell slot consumed.

    Whirlwind Spell (Su): A sorcerer can really let loose with his power, and take down everyone around him. Starting at 10th level, as a full-round action, a sorcerer is able to cast a spell that targets each enemy within 30 feet of him. He may only cast a spell that he is able to cast at-will in this way. If he so chooses, the sorcerer may instead cast an area-of-effect spell with the area centered on the creature (rather than targeting him)

    For example, a sorcerer has an orc 20 feet behind him, a giant 30 feet in front of him, a goblin 10 feet to his left, and a gnome 15 feet to his right.

    If he's 10th level, he could cast a 1st level spell that he knows at each one of them. (Magic missile at the goblin, lesser orb of electricity at the giant, charm person at the gnome and sleep at the orc)

    If he's 13th level, he could simply cast fireball centered on every one of them and catch all of them in each blast.

    A sorcerer who uses Whirlwind Spell is unable to use a swift action this round.

    Whirlwind Spell does not allow you to extend the range of a touch spell.

    Far Shot Spellcasting (Su): A number of times per day equal to his Charisma modifier (minimum 0), a sorcerer of 11th level or higher may extend the range of a spell he is casting from Close to Medium (this is regardless of the spell's description. Using this ability on slow and fireball would have the same effect and same changed range)

    This ability has no effect on a spell whose range is not Close (such as bestow curse)

    Arcane Breath (Su): Starting at 13th level, a sorcerer may build up his arcane power and expel it forth in a blast of power. The sorcerer gains a breath weapon in a 30 ft cone, usable every 1d4 rounds. If the breath weapon deals energy damage, that damage is equal to 2d8 per spell level of the highest spell level the sorcerer is able to cast at-will. (So a 13th level sorcerer who breathed fire could breathe for 6d8, a 15th level sorcerer who breathed fire could breathe for 8d8, etc). If the breath weapon has a different effect, the duration of the effect is 1 round per spell level of the highest spell level the sorcerer is able to cast at-will.

    Unlike a dragon's breath weapon, a sorcerer's Arcane Breath ability is a free action that can only be used on the sorcerer's turn. If the sorcerer modifies his Arcane Breath with the Maximize Breath feat, the time to breathe increases to one standard action.

    If the sorcerer is breathing energy damage, it allows a Reflex save for half damage (DC 10+1/2 sorcerer level+Charisma modifier). If the sorcerer is breathing using a different effect, the creature is allowed a Fortitude save to negate, at the same DC.

    At 13th level, the sorcerer is able to breathe fire, cold, electricity, and acid damage.

    At 15th level, the sorcerer gains the ability to breathe a cloud of slow, as the spell, and a cloud of gas that renders targets who fail their save paralyzed for the duration.

    At 17th level, the sorcerer gains the ability to breathe a cone of Strength damage (Amount is equal to the amount of d8s of energy damage he would deal, and this breath weapon has an instantaneous duration), or a cloud of negative levels (No save. It deals 2 negative levels that last for 1 hour and never result in actual level loss).

    At 19th level, the sorcerer gains the ability to breath a cloud of gas that functions as the solid fog spell, a cloud that grants all creatures affected invisibility, and an energy breath weapon that deals force damage.

    A sorcerer is immune to the effects of his own Arcane Breath ability.

    Spontaneous Counterspell (Su): A 14th level sorcerer does not need to ready an action to perform the Counterspell ability. As an immediate action, a sorcerer may identify a spell that's being cast (with the appropriate Spellcraft check, of course) and then may immediately spend a spell slot equal to or higher than the spell's level and counter the spell. Doing so requires line of sight and line of effect, and requires the sorcerer to make a caster level check (DC equal to 11+the casting character's caster level)

    If the sorcerer is countering a spell of a level that he is able to cast at-will, he uses one of his special daily spell slots for powering abilities and feats (see the Spellcasting class feature)

    Rapid Fire (Su): A 15th level sorcerer is a powerful beast of a caster. As a full-round action, a sorcerer may cast five spells with a casting time of one standard action or less. These spells must all target or be centered on the same 5' square, and that 5' square must be within 30 feet of the sorcerer.

    Rapid Fire is a deadly ability. For each spell that successfully hits (if an attack roll is required) and overcomes all who would have been affected's spell resistance (if any creatures have spell resistance, and the spell allows it), the next spell the sorcerer casts receives a +2 cumulative bonus to the DC of the saving throw, if any, as well as a +2 cumulative bonus to the sorcerer's caster level checks made to overcome spell resistance.

    If the sorcerer uses no spells that require attack rolls and no affected creature has spell resistance, the increase in his DCs are automatic.

    (For example, a 15th level sorcerer uses his Rapid Fire ability. There is only one creature he uses it on, an adult silver dragon. He casts five delayed blast fireballs with a 0 round delay. His first spell, he rolls a 9 on his caster level check to overcome the dragon's spell resistance of 22, so he succeeds. The second spell he casts has a DC of 19+Charisma modifier to resist, and he receives a +2 bonus on his caster level check to overcome the dragon's spell resistance. Assuming the dragon's SR is penetrated each time, the final delayed blast fireball has a DC of 25+Charisma modifier)

    A sorcerer may not use a swift action during the round that he uses his Rapid Fire ability. After using it, the sorcerer is dazed until the beginning of his next turn.

    Rapid Fire does not allow the sorcerer to extend the range of a touch spell.
    Last edited by NeoSeraphi; 2012-04-03 at 11:04 PM.

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    Default Re: The Sorcerer (A NeoSeraphi Fix) 3.5, PEACH WIP

    wow, at will 6th level spells? heck at will 4th level spells by 15th... could make a crazy necromancer with that...
    Avatar by Szilard, thank you sir for the fine work!

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    Default Re: The Sorcerer (A NeoSeraphi Fix) 3.5, PEACH WIP

    So... by...?
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    Default Re: The Sorcerer (A NeoSeraphi Fix) 3.5, PEACH WIP

    Quote Originally Posted by bobthe6th View Post
    wow, at will 6th level spells? heck at will 4th level spells by 15th... could make a crazy necromancer with that...
    Wait 'till she finishes to post comments. That 'will' could be at-will, or it could be something else entirely.

    Still, yeah, if it's at-will that's kind of a fast progression of them. It's not ridiculous, since sorcerers generally have plenty of spells per day by higher levels anyway, but it's still just a little much- I'd probably shift that progression down a spell level, so you get at-will 5ths by 20 at most. Even at 20th level, your 6th level spells are very, very relevant, and being able to spam them at will is a huge deal.
    Last edited by Lateral; 2011-11-20 at 04:05 PM.

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    Default Re: The Sorcerer (A NeoSeraphi Fix) 3.5, PEACH WIP

    It doesn't even MATTER if it means at will or something else. 9 level 6 spells at level 18 is already bad enough.

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    Default Re: The Sorcerer (A NeoSeraphi Fix) 3.5, PEACH WIP

    Quote Originally Posted by Phosphate View Post
    It doesn't even MATTER if it means at will or something else. 9 level 6 spells at level 18 is already bad enough.
    The animate dead series is still limited by caster level, and I have removed the sorcerer's access to conjuration [creation] spells. The sorcerer does not receive at-will limited wish.

    Please, tell me what else I can do to limit this. Unlimited combat spells aren't the problem, obviously, they are the intent. It's how the sorcerer can abuse his downtime that's the problem.

    Edit: Lateral, I am actually one-hundred percent male.
    Last edited by NeoSeraphi; 2011-11-20 at 04:39 PM.

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    Default Re: The Sorcerer (A NeoSeraphi Fix) 3.5, PEACH WIP

    Seems like a pretty boring class since you're just getting this "class ability" feature over and over again. j/k


    I'd suggest not stating that the sorcerer casts "as a bard". You'd want to avoid this because a) a bard casts "as a sorcerer", and b) casting "as a bard" means you have no ASF for casting in light armor.

    At-will casting will burn you hard when combined with anything that provides an alternate use for your infinite spell slots, such as ultimate magus, arcane strike, runestaffs, raiment of the four, arcane toughness, and many others. On the other hand, the most obvious solution, that of ruling that at-will spell levels no longer involve slots, prevents you from using many good and valid options. I don't see an easy way out of that conundrum.

    The choice to drop bonus spells for a high Charisma is a sound one. It will make the sorcerer's high-level spells per day much less dependent on point-buy rules, wealth granted, and optimization level.
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    Default Re: The Sorcerer (A NeoSeraphi Fix) 3.5, PEACH WIP

    I'd suggest not stating that the sorcerer casts "as a bard". You'd want to avoid this because a) a bard casts "as a sorcerer", and b) casting "as a bard" means you have no ASF for casting in light armor.
    Great, jiriku. Rain on my parade, why don't you. x.x. Guess I'll just say "as the PHB sorcerer" then.

    At-will casting will burn you hard when combined with anything that provides an alternate use for your infinite spell slots, such as ultimate magus, arcane strike, runestaffs, raiment of the four, arcane toughness, and many others. On the other hand, the most obvious solution, that of ruling that at-will spell levels no longer involve slots, prevents you from using many good and valid options. I don't see an easy way out of that conundrum.
    For ultimate magus, I already specified at the top of the screen that this class was not intended to be allowed to prestige. Arcane Strike and Arcane Toughness are nice, but that's the point. Even if you have at-will uses of those abilities, they're still mostly flavorful and useful, but not as good as an actual spell.

    I guess I'll say that if you have at-will casting, you have "spell slots" equal to your Charisma modifier + the spell level for each spell level, thereby making it so that you can power those abilities without wasting your casting, but you can't overdo it.

    The choice to drop bonus spells for a high Charisma is a sound one. It will make the sorcerer's high-level spells per day much less dependent on point-buy rules, wealth granted, and optimization level.
    Thank you, though it was also intended to make the sorcerer's low-level casting slower, and to really reward the sorcerer for reaching the at-wills.


    As an aside to everyone, I have changed the sorcerer's range of his spells to Close for all Medium and Long-ranged spells. I will be supplementing this ability with many close-combat class features, such as Chain Spell and Whirlwind Spell.

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    Default Re: The Sorcerer (A NeoSeraphi Fix) 3.5, PEACH WIP

    I have a hard time looking objectively for critique without knowing why, so... why did you think Sorcerer needed fixing? Note that I don't say that as "I don't think it did," just as a flat question.
    Last edited by Ilorin Lorati; 2011-11-20 at 06:12 PM.
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    Default Re: The Sorcerer (A NeoSeraphi Fix) 3.5, PEACH WIP

    Quote Originally Posted by NeoSeraphi View Post
    Edit: Lateral, I am actually one-hundred percent male.
    Gah, I knew that. Opposite-gender avatars confuse me.

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    Default Re: The Sorcerer (A NeoSeraphi Fix) 3.5, PEACH WIP

    Quote Originally Posted by Lateral View Post
    Gah, I knew that. Opposite-gender avatars confuse me.
    Pretty sure thats what the gender symbol is for under the avvy.

    Also.. Interesting. I think I will wait for the update to say more.

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    Default Re: The Sorcerer (A NeoSeraphi Fix) 3.5, PEACH WIP

    So...a sorcerer could learn CLW, and then cast it at will?

    Yes, I know wands of CLW are cheap, but there's still a big difference between cheap healing and free healing.

    Other than that, looks good.

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    Default Re: The Sorcerer (A NeoSeraphi Fix) 3.5, PEACH WIP

    I've thought about doing something along these lines before (that is the at will lower level spells), but honestly it always comes down to it's not realistic to do without overhauling the spell list and probably the mechanics of several spells as well. Without doing all that I'd recommend staying far far away from at will spells past say... 3rd level.
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    Default Re: The Sorcerer (A NeoSeraphi Fix) 3.5, PEACH WIP

    This looks pretty interesting thus far, though I don't really see the reasoning behind limiting PRCs. The use of the at-will casting for features is blocked already, and if you PRC out you lose the features of the class. Ironically, now that it actually has features, there is less incentive to PRC out, so I'm not sure why it needs to be prevented.

    Also, you make a couple statements which involve Fireballs targeting people. Are you implying the center of the area must be on that creature? There doesn't exist any mechanic in 3.5e to target an area spell in that way (they don't actually target anything, they just cover an area), so you might want to firm up your language a little bit.

    Chain Spell, specifically, is quite potent for its level, and a boon to low level Sorcs waiting for Arcane Fusion and Spellsurge.

    Also, if you're still wondering about Class features, Sorcs generally love anything involving metamagic, and this one would really love a way to give some spells Medium range once and a while (as it is, this thing would be a huge candidate for the Arcane Devotee dip if it could PRC).

    Oh! And it doesn't have any skills! Hide, Spot, Diplomacy and 4+ please?
    Last edited by DeAnno; 2011-11-20 at 08:06 PM.

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    Default Re: The Sorcerer (A NeoSeraphi Fix) 3.5, PEACH WIP

    Well, it's a solid class casting-wise, making it a definite Tier 2 with all that at-will casting (which isn't OMGTOTALLYOP like everyone seems to be crying about, unless combined with stuff like UltiMagus). Adding even moderate passive offenses and defenses to this kind of casting is a REALLY big deal, though, so this is definitely going to be stronger than the original sorcerer. I'm not sure if you intend that.

    In other news, a nice hotfix for the at-will problem with multiclassing could be that you actually make at-will casting a class feature, so people who want it will have to take X number of sorcerer levels for each spell level. It's not longer a fantabulous dip, but an important consideration.

    Also, I dislike the Dragons theme. I prefer my sorcerers to be openly-flavored. Faeries, Demons, or lyrium-blooded should all be available.

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    Default Re: The Sorcerer (A NeoSeraphi Fix) 3.5, PEACH WIP

    Quote Originally Posted by YouLostMe View Post
    In other news, a nice hotfix for the at-will problem with multiclassing could be that you actually make at-will casting a class feature, so people who want it will have to take X number of sorcerer levels for each spell level. It's not longer a fantabulous dip, but an important consideration.
    I actually like that a lot, because it elegantly solves the problem of how many spell slots you have for other purposes (however many are on the table).

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    Default Re: The Sorcerer (A NeoSeraphi Fix) 3.5, PEACH WIP

    Quote Originally Posted by Yitzi View Post
    So...a sorcerer could learn CLW, and then cast it at will?

    Yes, I know wands of CLW are cheap, but there's still a big difference between cheap healing and free healing.

    Other than that, looks good.
    Quote Originally Posted by Draconic Spellcasting
    A sorcerer is unable to learn spells that channel positive or negative energy with this class feature. He is also unable to learn any conjuration [healing] spell that would cause the target to recover hit points over a small amount of time, such as lesser vigor.
    No. A sorcerer cannot do that.

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    Default Re: The Sorcerer (A NeoSeraphi Fix) 3.5, PEACH Finished!

    And done! The sorcerer fix is now open for business! So, come on, bring the hate.

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    Default Re: The Sorcerer (A NeoSeraphi Fix) 3.5, PEACH Finished!

    He lost all of his class ability abilities, now what will he do?!
    Last edited by Seerow; 2011-11-21 at 12:58 AM.
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    Default Re: The Sorcerer (A NeoSeraphi Fix) 3.5, PEACH Finished!

    Quote Originally Posted by Seerow View Post
    He lost all of his class ability abilities, now what will he do?! :P
    Fixed that for you

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    Default Re: The Sorcerer (A NeoSeraphi Fix) 3.5, PEACH Finished!

    Quote Originally Posted by NeoSeraphi View Post
    Fixed that for you
    I'm sorry I have no idea what you are talking about
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    Default Re: The Sorcerer (A NeoSeraphi Fix) 3.5, PEACH Finished!

    i can't wait to be this class and then just spam harm or maybe even Heal all day long.!!!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kenneth View Post
    i can't wait to be this class and then just spam harm or maybe even Heal all day long.!!!!
    It says in the Draconic Spellcasting section, very clearly:

    A sorcerer may not learn a spell that lets him channel positive or negative energy.

    This includes the cure and inflict line of spells, as well as heal and harm.

    Sorry to disappoint you.

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    Default Re: The Sorcerer (A NeoSeraphi Fix) 3.5, PEACH Finished!

    I think the only thing I'm worried about is the increased amount of record-keeping that sorcerers might have to do, and how spell slots oddly drop off from 9 + Partial Charisma to effectively X + Full Charisma.

    Reactive Spell seems a little strong, mostly because the Slow only means they can't take a move action. If an enemy's already in range for them to be tossing out evocations, then they probably don't need to move more than his usual 5-foot step. (After all, unlike with the others, there are no 5-foot restrictions here)

    Arcane Breath seems like a bit much when you're tossing out things for free every few turns, and I think there's a way to get it down further. A swift action might fit better, but I'm not sure how much of a benefit that would be when your sorcerer already has half a dozen ways to burn them.

    To be honest, I'm not completely sure how I feel about consuming your 5-foot step with your actions. It could work, but it just feels a little clunky. I just hope that you never allow Celerity, or else it gets to be a whole other beast.

    Past that, this does seem a whole lot stronger than the default Sorcerer. I'd need to do a lot of spell list considering before I'd be able to pinpoint exactly how much, though.
    Last edited by Ruduen; 2011-11-21 at 03:20 AM.
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    Default Re: The Sorcerer (A NeoSeraphi Fix) 3.5, PEACH Finished!

    Quote Originally Posted by Ruduen View Post
    Reactive Spell seems a little strong, mostly because the Slow only means they can't take a move action. If an enemy's already in range for them to be tossing out evocations, then they probably don't need to move more than his usual 5-foot step. (After all, unlike with the others, there are no 5-foot restrictions here)

    To be honest, I'm not completely sure how I feel about consuming your 5-foot step with your actions. It could work, but it just feels a little clunky. I just hope that you never allow Celerity, or else it gets to be a whole other beast.
    Reactive Spell is basically a weakened form of celerity (you can attack, but you can't escape) in exchange for not dazing you, but slowing you.

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    Default Re: The Sorcerer (A NeoSeraphi Fix) 3.5, PEACH Finished!

    Quote Originally Posted by NeoSeraphi View Post
    Reactive Spell is basically a weakened form of celerity (you can attack, but you can't escape) in exchange for not dazing you, but slowing you.
    Its similar to the Quick Recovery out of Celerity gambit, but without the Feat Tax or Will Save. Generally I like this, more detailed comments will come later.

    EDIT: more comments:

    Arcane Resistance (Su): Starting at 7th level, a sorcerer may, as an immediate action, consume a spell slot and grant himself an arcane bonus on all saving throws equal to the level of the spell slot he consumed.
    For how long? Also, the stacking mechanic is particularly kludgy imo.

    If the sorcerer modifies his Arcane Breath with the Maximize Breath feat, the time to breathe increases to one standard action.
    Do you mean any metabreath feat? I don't really see the point in singling out exactly one and penalizing it alone, especially when this class has plenty of better at will damage.

    The language of Rapid Fire is very odd. You're aware swift and immediate actions are the same thing right? To me it seems like you're trying to say his next turn's swift action is gone, but I'm not sure.

    In general, you have a lot of mechanics where you spend a swift action, a full-round action, and a five foot step. The mechanic seems a little goofy, but I'm not sure how to fix it exactly. One option would be something like this:

    Arcane Focus: Every Sorcerer has an Arcane Focus (like Psionic Focus) that they can expend to do awesome feats of magic. You can spend a swift action at any time to regain your Arcane Focus. At first level, a Sorcerer may expend his arcane focus to take 15 on a Spellcraft or Concentration check.

    Then you would make Chain Spell, Whirlwind Spell, and Rapid Fire require expending your Arcane Focus, and possibly use it for some other thematic things as well. If you wanted to limit Rapid Fire, you could say you are unable to regain your Arcane Focus until the end of your next turn.
    Last edited by DeAnno; 2011-11-21 at 05:56 AM.

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    Default Re: The Sorcerer (A NeoSeraphi Fix) 3.5, PEACH Finished!

    Quote Originally Posted by NeoSeraphi View Post
    No. A sorcerer cannot do that.
    Ah, I thought that that must be referring to something else. So in that case, which not-over-time healing spell is allowed? (Or if there isn't one, why does it specify recovering hit points over time rather than just recovering hit points period?)

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    Default Re: The Sorcerer (A NeoSeraphi Fix) 3.5, PEACH Finished!

    Quote Originally Posted by Yitzi View Post
    Ah, I thought that that must be referring to something else. So in that case, which not-over-time healing spell is allowed? (Or if there isn't one, why does it specify recovering hit points over time rather than just recovering hit points period?)
    Find a healing spell that isn't over time and does not channel positive energy.

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    Default Re: The Sorcerer (A NeoSeraphi Fix) 3.5, PEACH Finished!

    Quote Originally Posted by Yitzi View Post
    Ah, I thought that that must be referring to something else. So in that case, which not-over-time healing spell is allowed? (Or if there isn't one, why does it specify recovering hit points over time rather than just recovering hit points period?)
    If you're asking why I didn't just cut out conjuration [healing] spells altogether, that would remove access to the restoration line, remove blindness/deafness, remove paralysis, etc.

    The point of those limitations are to remove all spells that can recover hit points period.

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    Default Re: The Sorcerer (A NeoSeraphi Fix) 3.5, PEACH Finished!

    Quote Originally Posted by DeAnno View Post


    Do you mean any metabreath feat? I don't really see the point in singling out exactly one and penalizing it alone, especially when this class has plenty of better at will damage.
    The Maximize Breath feat itself extends the dragon's breath weapon time from a standard action to a full-round action. RAW, it would have changed the sorcerer's breath weapon to a full-round action as well, so I changed it in the class feature.

    The language of Rapid Fire is very odd. You're aware swift and immediate actions are the same thing right? To me it seems like you're trying to say his next turn's swift action is gone, but I'm not sure.
    Consuming this turn's swift action does not consume this turn's immediate action. Consuming your immediate action consumes your next turn's swift action. (So you can Quicken a spell during this turn, and between this turn and next turn, you could cast wings of cover, but you lose your next turn's swift action)

    At least, that's how I understood it. If I'm wrong, then I'll just drop the immediate action part.

    In general, you have a lot of mechanics where you spend a swift action, a full-round action, and a five foot step. The mechanic seems a little goofy, but I'm not sure how to fix it exactly. One option would be something like this:

    Arcane Focus: Every Sorcerer has an Arcane Focus (like Psionic Focus) that they can expend to do awesome feats of magic. You can spend a swift action at any time to regain your Arcane Focus. At first level, a Sorcerer may expend his arcane focus to take 15 on a Spellcraft or Concentration check.

    Then you would make Chain Spell, Whirlwind Spell, and Rapid Fire require expending your Arcane Focus, and possibly use it for some other thematic things as well. If you wanted to limit Rapid Fire, you could say you are unable to regain your Arcane Focus until the end of your next turn.
    The idea is to consume the sorcerer's defenses in order to attack. It would not be fair to allow a sorcerer to just spend a swift action in order to Chain Spells.

    I don't understand what you mean by "goofy". If you mean "it's different", then yes, it is, but so is at-will casting. If you mean "it's a bad idea", I don't think so. A sorcerer who has to spend every action of his turn concentrating and aiming can fire two to five spells at once. A full-round action isn't enough, he can still move and can still cast more spells with his swift action.
    Last edited by NeoSeraphi; 2011-11-21 at 01:21 PM.

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