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2011-11-24, 12:11 PM (ISO 8601)
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Official Pathfinder broken spells
One of my Pathfinder DMs is allowing all, official Pathfinder spells but, of course, reserves the right to ban or fix them if they turn out to be broken. I know some spells, such as Glitterdust, were nerfed, so the list should be manageable. So, which official spells are broken? You can suggest a fix if you like.
Matthew Greet
My purpose in life is to play games.
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2011-11-24, 01:21 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Official Pathfinder broken spells
They did nerf various spells. Yet I think the new problem spells involve power creep than anything. Most brokenness can, like 3.5e, be solved by not trying to exploit rules loopholes.
One such spell, which I am guilty of using, is the first level cleric spell called grace. First Pathfinder nerfs tumble by making it harder to automatically succeed, then they make a level 1 spell that automatically succeeds without a roll. At full speed, in heavy armor. I think there are other such spells like this in the advanced player's guide and ultimate magic. Whether or not they're too much for your group, I cannot say. Some power creep is in line with Pathfinder's boost in general to everything which means it no longer fits the definition of power creep, but I think the later books take it a step further.Last edited by ericgrau; 2011-11-24 at 01:26 PM.
So you never have to interrupt a game to look up a rule again:
My 3.5e Rules Cheat Sheets: Normal, With Consolidated Skill System
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2011-11-24, 05:31 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Official Pathfinder broken spells
Grace is a second level cleric Spell (first level paladin) and it lasts until the end of your turn.
That hardly seems broken. Grace, unlike tumble, has a limit to the number of times per combat you can use it.
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2011-11-24, 07:45 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Official Pathfinder broken spells
Feat: Fire God's Blessing
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Orison: Spark
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Torch (Or other item(s) that can be subject to the spark spell multiple times.)
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Infinite healing!
A nifty trick for any half-orc cleric in that anytime they cast a spell with the [Fire] descriptor (i.e. spark) they may heal a target equal to half the caster's lvl. As spark is an orison capable of being cast an infinite number of times, all you need is something to burn (then put out if you're a good guy and don't want to get on Smokey's bad side) and now you never need to buy a wand of cure light wounds ever again.Avatar by Savannah
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2011-11-24, 08:58 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Dec 2010
Re: Official Pathfinder broken spells
Oppressive Boredom - a 2nd level spell that knocks you out of the combat for rounds/level on a successful save.
Prestige Bard, updated for Pathfinder.
Revamped Spell Resistance system, for use with Spell Points/Psionics.
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2011-11-24, 09:04 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Aug 2011
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2011-11-24, 09:07 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Dec 2010
Re: Official Pathfinder broken spells
Prestige Bard, updated for Pathfinder.
Revamped Spell Resistance system, for use with Spell Points/Psionics.
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2011-11-24, 09:50 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Official Pathfinder broken spells
I have to say Solid Fog is broken, but because it's over powered but the fact that it's way too weak for its level.
The day I find a game is the day that HL2 Episode 3 is released!
My Brandenburg Interactive AAR game for EUIV.
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2011-11-25, 05:33 AM (ISO 8601)
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2011-11-25, 05:36 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Official Pathfinder broken spells
I'd hazard that the feat being considered is actually Glorious Heat.
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2011-11-25, 10:04 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Official Pathfinder broken spells
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2011-11-25, 11:20 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Official Pathfinder broken spells
Oops, I need to fix that. There hasn't yet been a time when my mistake would have made the slightest difference though. Even at level 2, you will still never ever run out. A typical rogue tumbles maybe once or twice per combat, if at all. A battle cleric uses it about as often and a healbot the same or maybe 1 more. And I'm being generous: so far it's come up 0 or 1 times per fight as a healbot.
Last edited by ericgrau; 2011-11-25 at 11:25 AM.
So you never have to interrupt a game to look up a rule again:
My 3.5e Rules Cheat Sheets: Normal, With Consolidated Skill System
TOGC's 3.5e Spell/etc Cards: rpgnow / drivethru rpg
Utilities: Magic Item Shop Generator (Req. MS Excel), Balanced Low Magic Item System
Printable Cardstock Dungeon Tiles and other terrain stuff (100 MB)
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2011-11-25, 11:26 AM (ISO 8601)
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2011-11-25, 11:37 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Official Pathfinder broken spells
Just be sure cover your ears for the squee of joy if she does.
It would be much more balanced, though perhaps the other way, if it functioned as "the level of the spell" for the hit points regained.
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2011-11-25, 12:01 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Official Pathfinder broken spells
Well it's hardly broken as it is. It would heal 10hp at lvl20 in exchange for a standard action. Sure, the cleric can use it infinitely but I've always advocated that the cleric shouldn't run out of basic healing spells in the same way a wizard never runs out of basic damaging spells (hence orisons and cantrips no longer have expendable slots).
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2011-11-25, 12:08 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Official Pathfinder broken spells
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2011-11-25, 12:18 PM (ISO 8601)
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2011-11-25, 12:30 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Official Pathfinder broken spells
That's what dirt cheap wands of cure light wounds are for. And at low levels, you're supposed to actually care about mundane things. The main plot point for the beginning of one campaign I was in was disease. Even putting low level PCs aside, ending the world's problems for the low level masses via unlimited anything leads to the tippyverse. Whether actually available at level 1 or reasonably administered at will to thousands by each of the level 5 leaders.
So you never have to interrupt a game to look up a rule again:
My 3.5e Rules Cheat Sheets: Normal, With Consolidated Skill System
TOGC's 3.5e Spell/etc Cards: rpgnow / drivethru rpg
Utilities: Magic Item Shop Generator (Req. MS Excel), Balanced Low Magic Item System
Printable Cardstock Dungeon Tiles and other terrain stuff (100 MB)
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2011-11-25, 02:10 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Official Pathfinder broken spells
Any clerics with unlimited healing abilities willing to apply them to general population are offset by spellcasters with equally unlimited potential to deal damage. Besides, unless you're playing E6, all universes have the potential to be tippyverses even without unlimited abilities, they're not simply because all the adventurers are out for personal glory. I have never ever gone to the slums of any city to feed or cure the less fortunate, having unlimited amounts of healing wouldn't really change that, I've got monsters to kill and princesses to save after all.
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2011-11-25, 02:24 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Official Pathfinder broken spells
They're not because commoners outnumber even low level adventurers 1,000-10,000 to 1. Clerics in particular have plenty of selfless, gloryless members serving as NPCs in churches, letting others adventure. But beyond 1st-3rd level there simply aren't that many, and even level 1 clerics are under 5% of the population (I forget the exact number).
Even at-will damage is impractical to occur for more than a few rounds, as the subject struggles a bit more than a patient being healed. At-will healing happens for hours, thousands of rounds.
Just get a wand if you're adventuring, assuming low level slots and channeling doesn't already cover it.Last edited by ericgrau; 2011-11-25 at 02:29 PM.
So you never have to interrupt a game to look up a rule again:
My 3.5e Rules Cheat Sheets: Normal, With Consolidated Skill System
TOGC's 3.5e Spell/etc Cards: rpgnow / drivethru rpg
Utilities: Magic Item Shop Generator (Req. MS Excel), Balanced Low Magic Item System
Printable Cardstock Dungeon Tiles and other terrain stuff (100 MB)
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2011-11-25, 02:44 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Official Pathfinder broken spells
You're implying that out of those thousands that outnumber you, all get grievously wounded on a daily basis. Other than wars and plagues, nothing would really tax the collective spellcasters so much that they couldn't make hospitals, farmers, stonemasons etc. obsolete.
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2011-11-25, 02:55 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Official Pathfinder broken spells
At level 3, and much fewer at level 5, they could not make enough food or stone to make farming and construction obsolete.
A plague is precisely the plot point I described earlier, the crux of an entire adventure, and with the rarity of remove disease even with other common diseases you're better off getting someone to make a few heal checks than to find the only 5th level cleric per thousands of people. He has better things to do, more important people to cure, etc. The standard 150 gp fee is not unreasonable for the low supply, and those that can't pay are left out. People still get sick all the time or else have some other condition besides disease that needs fixing.Last edited by ericgrau; 2011-11-25 at 02:59 PM.
So you never have to interrupt a game to look up a rule again:
My 3.5e Rules Cheat Sheets: Normal, With Consolidated Skill System
TOGC's 3.5e Spell/etc Cards: rpgnow / drivethru rpg
Utilities: Magic Item Shop Generator (Req. MS Excel), Balanced Low Magic Item System
Printable Cardstock Dungeon Tiles and other terrain stuff (100 MB)
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2011-11-25, 03:33 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Official Pathfinder broken spells
I've already established that I'm not talking about low-level casters.
And yes natural disasters and plagues could overwhelm casters but there should really be people dedicated to monitoring the environment for such things and quench disease outbreaks before they spread out, or evacuate people before a tornado ravages a town. There is no absolutely no good reason why any such things should pose a problem apart from general "human" selfishness, unlimited resources merely ensure that the machine works smoothly.
But back to the original gist of the discussion, having unlimited healing capabilities doesn't automatically result in a tippyverse. The current clergy of the good gods should already be able to fully cover any actual healing that the people need, while not having to worry about their spell resources surely would increase their potential to heal, there simply is not enough opportunity to do so. This would only really shine in a war campaign where injuries are many and constant but even then it wouldn't make much of a difference mechanically.
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2011-11-25, 03:56 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Official Pathfinder broken spells
Simple solution to make sure it doesn't happen at low levels: bump up the caster level requirement on the feat to make its users that much more rare among NPCs or better yet give it a virtually but not actually unlimited number of uses per day, say 20-50.
Last edited by ericgrau; 2011-11-25 at 03:58 PM.
So you never have to interrupt a game to look up a rule again:
My 3.5e Rules Cheat Sheets: Normal, With Consolidated Skill System
TOGC's 3.5e Spell/etc Cards: rpgnow / drivethru rpg
Utilities: Magic Item Shop Generator (Req. MS Excel), Balanced Low Magic Item System
Printable Cardstock Dungeon Tiles and other terrain stuff (100 MB)
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2011-11-25, 04:19 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Official Pathfinder broken spells
Am I alone in thinking that Create Pit is really good for a second level spell?
Thanks to Lindorm for the Ziltoid avatar.
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2011-11-25, 04:34 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Official Pathfinder broken spells
2nd level reflex save-or-lose hitting 1-2 targets? And most things can't get out of it until it ends with climb DC 25. Ya that is too much for 2nd level. Especially right after they nerfed glitterdust which at least lets you fight blind.
Last edited by ericgrau; 2011-11-25 at 04:36 PM.
So you never have to interrupt a game to look up a rule again:
My 3.5e Rules Cheat Sheets: Normal, With Consolidated Skill System
TOGC's 3.5e Spell/etc Cards: rpgnow / drivethru rpg
Utilities: Magic Item Shop Generator (Req. MS Excel), Balanced Low Magic Item System
Printable Cardstock Dungeon Tiles and other terrain stuff (100 MB)
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2011-11-25, 04:48 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Official Pathfinder broken spells
Blessing of Fervor is an awesome party buff. Cleric Spell, I want to say 4th level but I think it might actually be 5th. My memory just sucks today.
You get to choose between 1 of 4 effects, every round.
-1 extra attack on a full round attack (doesn't stack with haste)
-+2 bonus to AC and Reflex, I think hit rolls as well.
-No penalty for getting up quickly
-Free metamagic (from a list of 4 feats) for First and Second Level spells.
It's party wide.
If you're into Divine Metamagic and are willing to give up a Channel or two a day, I hear tell that you can have this or other buffs up pretty much constantly. I've never touched DMM so I wouldn't know.Last edited by Karoht; 2011-11-25 at 04:51 PM.
~~Courage is not the lack of fear~~
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2011-11-25, 05:56 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Official Pathfinder broken spells
The day I find a game is the day that HL2 Episode 3 is released!
My Brandenburg Interactive AAR game for EUIV.
Here is the recruitment page
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2013-12-30, 05:10 AM (ISO 8601)
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2013-12-30, 06:36 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Official Pathfinder broken spells
Technically it's DC 20 to climb out. There's corners to brace against which lower the DC by 5.
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