Fighter and paladin boost (includes new fighter feats) (3.5 Core, PEACH)

[gkathellar]

I must admit that I lost you.
Of the entire Weapon Focus tree, the one that grants +2 to all maneuvers is Melee Weapon Mastery - and this one was not on the list you mentioned... and it has Focus & Spec. as prereqs - making it 3 feats.
That's about equivalent to what you'll get from Enlarge Person, only without the extra reach.

Are you sure you're talking about the Weapon Focus feats tree?
I don't remember them granting new options.
Can you elaborate?

There's a whole section up there where he revises most of the feats in Core. They're still not good enough, mind, but RTFM.

[Yitzi]

They're still not good enough, mind.

Why not? What are they missing? (Other than the ability to kill an enemy in one round, which I specifically do not want.)

[nonsi]

There's a whole section up there where he revises most of the feats in Core. They're still not good enough, mind, but RTFM.

My bad. I never encountered fixes to the Weapon Focus feats that wasn't a stand-alone issue, so I wrongly assumed they weren't addressed.

Anyway, fixing the feats is not a class fix - if not for anything else, then for that fact that one cannot count on the right players' choices (if necessary, I can explain the difference between casters and noncasters on this one).

Feats & feat-combos should be the icing on the cake, not THE cake.

[Yitzi]

My bad. I never encountered fixes to the Weapon Focus feats that wasn't a stand-alone issue, so I wrongly assumed they weren't addressed.

Yeah, by themselves they're nice but nowhere near the complete fix.

Anyway, fixing the feats is not a class fix - if not for anything else, then for that fact that one cannot count on the right players' choices (if necessary, I can explain the difference between casters and noncasters on this one).

I think you'd better explain the difference between casters and noncasters on this one, as there is no class, except maybe the barbarian and monk, that can, with poor choices, compete with another class with good choices.

Feats & feat-combos should be the icing on the cake, not THE cake.

That is clearly not the concept behind the fighter. Someone who likes to be effective without feats shouldn't be playing a fighter. (Which is not to say that fighters are weak; the intent is that a fighter should be more than a match for any other "martial" class at the same level; of course, the other classes tend to be less vulnerable to rogues and casters.)

[Zale]

What does your fighter give the player that they can't get just by playing another class and picking up the shiny feats?

[NeoSeraphi]

What does your fighter give the player that they can't get just by playing another class and picking up the shiny feats?

The same thing the PHB fighter gave us: Tower Shield proficiency.

[Yitzi]

What does your fighter give the player that they can't get just by playing another class and picking up the shiny feats?

1. Weapon Specialization/Greater Weapon Focus/Specialization, which have been boosted a lot from their original version.
2. More feats. It's not as if there are a few "shiny feats" that are all you'll need. Different feats are better in different situations, so the more of the top-level feats you grab the more options you have from which to pick the best one for the circumstance. Essentially, the fighter gets horizontal power.

[Yitzi]

I realized that as written, Improved Deadly Aim favored crossbows over bows, so I've adjusted it to restore parity.