Pokémon XII: Truth of the Ideal Thread

[Turalisj]

Wah!

I found a shiny Barboach in the Great Marsh! But it ran before one of the Safari Balls could stick! My first shiny in Gen IV, too!

I have a shiny Machop in HeartGold

I remember... Eight years ago? I was playing Crystal and ran into a shiny Butterfree.

[tgva8889]

Spoiler

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For the sake of discussion, though, the first five seconds of the game? The part where you quit the gang, steal the snag machine, and blow up the gang's hideout, the results of which set the mechanics and purpose for the entire rest of the game? That happens for pretty much no reason at all. Sure, you later hear about how mean the gang was. You also later hear how you were one of the tops in the gang, despite not knowing all that much about the gang. One day, you wake up, decide to blow up a building, and use a machine only for good. That's not polish. That's not focus. That's not developed. Maybe it was supposed to be rule of cool, but then the rest of the story fails to follow that rule.

You leave your home. You walk into the grass and an old man runs out to tell you it's dangerous out there and you need a Pokemon. I mean, the main character in Pokemon games is always pretty unpolished and undeveloped, to be honest. I don't know what you mean by "focus" in this context, so I am unable to comment on it.

You hear about Team Snagem later in the game, and you find out that they're, in some part, responsible for the problems of the entire game. I understand that the motivations of your main character are not particularly explored, but they're not much more explored in previous games in the series in my opinion. Starting with the "well I'm on the run because I blew up this hideout and stole their machine thingy" was an alright start to the game for me, as it was just as much of a start as "well, I'm in this world of things called Pokemon and I'm supposed to get one or something."

I don't think you ever "decide" to use the machine only for good. I think the girl that you rescue decides to force you to use it only for good. Honestly I wish that girl hadn't been in the game so I could (evilly) catch whatever other trainer's Pokemon I want.

For the record, I don't think the story in Pokemon Coliseum was better than any of the other games. It was about the same as the rest of Gen III was, in my opinion. But the game mechanics were really interesting, which is why I loved playing the game. Pokemon XD took the mechanics further, which is why I enjoy playing it so much. I think the story was done better in XD, but I also think it would have been hard for them to do that much worse.

I think XD's storyline was far better developed and polished than Coliseum's, though I respect your lack of desire to play it, as at this point it is an older game and Coliseum's storyline wasn't that good so a sequel probably isn't going to be better.

[OracleofWuffing]

You leave your home. You walk into the grass and an old man runs out to tell you it's dangerous out there and you need a Pokemon. I mean, the main character in Pokemon games is always pretty unpolished and undeveloped, to be honest. I don't know what you mean by "focus" in this context, so I am unable to comment on it.

That's only a fair summary of the beginning of Generation 1 maybe if you completely ignore the instruction manual. Generations 2 and 3 do not begin that way. That's not to say that they're written perfectly, but the comparison I'm making here is "This happened for no reason" compared to "This happened for a reason."

I think the girl that you rescue decides to force you to use it only for good.

And that's a whole 'nother rant altogether.

[tgva8889]

I agree that your character seems to do things for no reason at the beginning. But you get a reason to start doing things in the first 5 minutes of the game and you get pretty clear goals pretty quickly. I see your point, but I don't think it's a major problem overall.

The objective definitely was "make the MC look awesome" because they could do it on the Gamecube and couldn't in any previous Pokemon games. I don't remember what the news report says at the beginning of Coliseum, but there is one that explains some things. I honestly haven't played Coliseum in a while.

[tonberrian]

*mutter mutter stupid Pearl being particularly obtuse about the next thing to do*

Edit: What makes for a good HM slave in Pearl, other than Bibarel? Something for Defog.

[NineThePuma]

Defog is only needed in one or two places in the game. You can make do without it.

[tonberrian]

Defog is only needed in one or two places in the game. You can make do without it.

Yes, well, I need it now. I'm going to capture a Finneon, that looks perfect.

Edit: Though HMs are something that I think would be great to phase out. I'd be perfectly happy if beating Gym Leaders unlocked the out of battle moves without having to teach the appropriate moves to pokemon.

[OracleofWuffing]

Eh, sounds like you've already solved the problem, but Wingull/Pelipper I think were my secondary HM slaves back in Diamond.

E: Dear Pokemon-GL: An hour would not have passed since I started playing if, perhaps, you didn't send twenty pokemon my way that all want to test their courage. Also, Why you no send me any females to test their courages?

[DiscipleofBob]

*mutter mutter stupid Pearl being particularly obtuse about the next thing to do*

Edit: What makes for a good HM slave in Pearl, other than Bibarel? Something for Defog.

Yeah, trying to go through the fog places without Defog is a real pain though. At least in the dark caves the battles weren't changed, but the fog is a horrible weather condition that makes pretty much everything miss.

Chatot or Starly are good choices for Defog. Gives the former something to do at least.

[tgva8889]

Pretty much any Flying-type makes a decent HM Slave for Fly and Defog in D/P/P. And to those who say Defog is unnecessary, clearly you haven't fought in fog enough to know that it's the worst weather condition ever devised and Game Freak was stupid for thinking it was at all interesting.

Also, I like HM moves.

[Mando Knight]

Pretty much any Flying-type makes a decent HM Slave for Fly and Defog in D/P/P. And to those who say Defog is unnecessary, clearly you haven't fought in fog enough to know that it's the worst weather condition ever devised and Game Freak was stupid for thinking it was at all interesting.

Or they spam Aerial Ace and the like anyway, so the accuracy drop doesn't touch them.

[tgva8889]

I suppose. Using a single Pokemon in an entire area of the game doesn't sound exciting to me, though.

[OracleofWuffing]

Given how Double Team remains unbanned and how they keep introducing new ways to get more evasion, I actually would not be surprised if their playing team had a compulsive insatiable desire to use such attacks.

[The Dark Fiddler]

I learned about this over on Bethsoft forums, I was stunned, as they've never made a direct sequel to a pokemon game before.

Gold and Silver don't count?

[tonberrian]

Yay, female Riolu! Now I can breed up a decent Lucario for Cynthia!

Also Garchomp. Because Garchomp vs. Garchomp is awesome.

[Turalisj]

Gold and Silver don't count?

Nope! Obviously not!

[Starwulf]

Nope! Obviously not!

Heartgold and Soulsilver are remakes with a few alterations and additions, not direct sequels. The new games are direct sequels(obviously, since it wouldn't make a lick of sense to remake them).

[The Dark Fiddler]

Heartgold and Soulsilver are remakes with a few alterations and additions, not direct sequels. The new games are direct sequels(obviously, since it wouldn't make a lick of sense to remake them).

Who said anything about HG and SS, though?

Gold and Silver more or less directly continue the Team Rocket plot. Sure, there's a time skip, but I really wouldn't call Black and White 2 the first Pokemon sequels. (Ignoring all the stuff like XD and TCG 2, since I'm assuming we're talking main-series.)

Also, technically speaking, we don't know for certain they're sequels. I've seen a lot of (mistaken, if you ask me) people swear up and down that this is just Gray and Grey.

[tgva8889]

Depends highly on how they do the "sequel." Gold/Silver are not considered sequels because they are considered their own series. They take place in their own region (Johto), rather than the region of the original game just later on, even though you can technically go there. Absolutely nothing happens in G/S Kanto, it's really just tacked on as post-game content.

Considering the R/B Team Rocket plot ended, G/S isn't really as much a continuation as a totally new Team Rocket trying to revitalize the old one. People in G/S I think even say stuff relating to the believed death of Team Rocket and the fact that they haven't done anything in the time between R/B and G/S.

The current assumption is that Black/White will take place entirely in Unova. It will be the first time that we have two subsequent games entirely set in the same region; I think this is the definition of "sequel" that is being used. Also the fact that it has a "2" in the title, clearly indicating it is a more direct continuation of whatever happened in Black/White, rather than the sort of kind of not really continuation that Gold/Silver was.

It is amusing that other games do this in the opposite way, using new numbers to indicate that we're moving to an entirely different world completely and not using numbers to indicate we're staying with stuff we already know. Assassin's Creed, for example.

[boj0]

Given how Double Team remains unbanned and how they keep introducing new ways to get more evasion, I actually would not be surprised if their playing team had a compulsive insatiable desire to use such attacks.

Double Team remains banned in most competitive circles

[OracleofWuffing]

Yes, it remains banned in most competitive circles, and for good reason. Game Freaks, however, do not ban Double Team. They only ban moves that can be glitched or overpowered moves like Dark Void. Seriously. This is a long-standing disconnect between "Power players" and "Official Play" that sometimes gets entertaining to study.

[tonberrian]

So before I start doing serious Honey Tree action, I just want to confirm something. If I have a pokemon encounter on one tree, immediately slathering honey on that tree has a 90% chance to pick another pokemon from the same list. If I want to increase the odds of it choosing from another list, I should go slather another tree first, right? Because that removes the first check to make sure the pokemon is from the same list?

[Aotrs Commander]

Can't win with Platinum, can I? The one I bought off Amazon? Seller is a dud (late (cliamed) dispatch, no arrival after nearly three weeks, no response to emails), so I'm getting a refund.

Bought for for full price this time (Amazon again, since at least I can garentee if I have any more problems), since it's getting hard to get a copy...

[tonberrian]

Can't win with Platinum, can I? The one I bought off Amazon? Seller is a dud (late (cliamed) dispatch, no arrival after nearly three weeks, no response to emails), so I'm getting a refund.

Bought for for full price this time (Amazon again, since at least I can garentee if I have any more problems), since it's getting hard to get a copy...

That sucks. Where are you that Platinum is so difficult to find?

It's weird because I was just thinking about picking Platinum up today.

[Aotrs Commander]

That sucks. Where are you that Platinum is so difficult to find?

It's weird because I was just thinking about picking Platinum up today.

England, apparently...!

[tonberrian]

Woo shiny Kadabra caught!

[Aotrs Commander]

Woo shiny Kadabra caught!

Nice.

I think the only shiny I've see (and actually managed to catch) in all-but-platinum games of Gen III to V was a Snover in Diamond.

[tonberrian]

Nice.

I think the only shiny I've see (and actually managed to catch) in all-but-platinum games of Gen III to V was a Snover in Diamond.

It was especially nice since the last shiny I saw in this game, a Barboach, escaped like 5 Safari balls.

I was really lucky with the Kadabra, too, because it definitely still knew Teleport.

Stupid teleporting Abras.

And yes, those have been the only shinies I've seen since Gen II. And I've played a lot of Sapphire.

Edit: On an unrelated note, you know you're slow when the Gravelers outrun you.

[Qwertystop]

Really? Has everyone but me seen a random shiny?

[NineThePuma]

I'd say no, but I ran into a random shiny ursarang. I was in an argument with my girlfriend about how I spend too much time playing video games instead of focusing on our relationship.

Then I was like "Holy ****, shiny ursarang" and she was like "AMG, SHINY, CATCH IT!" and it was good.