Page 1 of 12 1234567891011 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 30 of 353
  1. - Top - End - #1
    Ettin in the Playground
     
    Amphetryon's Avatar

    Join Date
    Dec 2006

    Default Iron Chef Optimization Challenge In The Playground XXIX

    Welcome, contestants, judges, and guests to Iron Chef XXIX. Here in Optimization Colosseum, contestants will endeavor to create an optimized and flavorful character using a specified D&D3.5 prestige class as a "Secret Ingredient".

    Contestants: You will need to present a write-up of your build at at least one of the following points: 5th level, 10th level, 15th, 20th, and a "sweet spot" that you feel is the high point of the build, as well as presenting a fully-fleshed out 20-level build in the table below. Feel free to present as many of these as you like, and please give a rundown of the build's abilities and playability at all of the levels you didn't show. The rules are as follows:

    Menu: For most challenges, the "special ingredient" will be drawn from Core plus Completes. There will, from time to time, be special challenges that showcase secret ingredients from other books--for example, the XPH.
    32 point-buy is the presumed creation method, but we have generally allowed other levels of point-buy.
    If you do use a different point-buy, please make your case for its necessity in your entry. Keep in mind that for using exceptionally large or small point-buys may warrant deductions in elegance and/or power.

    Kitchen: Competitors will be free to use any official 3.5 rulebook in constructing their builds. Dragon magazine is disallowed, and Unearthed Arcana is allowed; but see Elegance below. Web-exclusive 3.0 or 3.5 materials by WotC are expressly allowed, but take care to verify that an updated version did not appear in print elsewhere, as this may cause an Elegance deduction at the judges' discretion. Alternate rule systems from UA such as gestalt are not allowed, as they create a different playing field. Also, item familiars are forbidden because I hate 'em. This comes up often enough to bear mention in the rules: Dragon Compendium is allowed.

    Cooking Time: Contestants will have until 11:59PM GMT on Friday, February 4th, 2012 to create their builds and PM them to the Chairman, Amphetryon. Builds will then be posted simultaneously, to avoid copying. Judges will have until 11:59PM GMT on Friday, February 18th, 2012 to judge the builds and submit their scores. If no judges have scored by that point, only the scores of the first judge to submit will be counted. If you do not have access to the current challenge's Secret Ingredient, please do not volunteer to judge this round.

    Judging: Judging will be based on the following criteria, with each build rated from 1 (very poor) to 5 (exemplary) in each area: Originality, Power, Elegance, Use of Secret Ingredient.
    Power level is up to you. Cheese is acceptable, but should be kept to a sane level unless you're showcasing a new TO build you've discovered. In the words of one of my predecessors, a little cheddar can be nice, but avoid the mature Gruyere unless you're making a cheese fondue.
    Elegance could bear a little elaboration. It basically measures how skillfully you put your build together, and whether you sacrificed flavor for power. We're cooking here - if your dish doesn't taste good, it doesn't matter how well-presented it is. Use of flaws is an automatic loss of one point per flaw in this category. Other things that will cause lost points here are excessive multiclassing, and classes that don't fit the concept - using Cloistered Cleric in a front-line melee fighter, for example, will lose you points. Please note the following change: a legal source's relative obscurity should not be considered as penalizing Elegance, excepting the aforementioned issues with Unearthed Arcana. Using too many sources may be an Elegance deduction at the judges' discretion, but a book's relative obscurity may not.
    Presentation: Builds will be posted anonymously, in order to avoid the potential of bias towards a particular competitor. For this reason, please don't put your name in the build, as I'm likely to miss it when reviewing the entries!
    Due to concerns about standardizing entry format, I'd like everyone to try to use the following table for their entry.
    Spoiler
    Show
    NAME OF ENTRY
    {table=head]Level|Class|Base Attack Bonus|Fort Save|Ref Save|Will Save|Skills|Feats|Class Features

    1st|New Class Level|
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    2nd|New Class Level|
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    3rd|New Class Level|
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    4th|New Class Level|
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    5th|New Class Level|
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    6th|New Class Level|
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    7th|New Class Level|
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    8th|New Class Level|
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    9th|New Class Level|
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    10th|New Class Level|
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    11th|New Class Level|
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    12th|New Class Level|
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    13th|New Class Level|
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    14th|New Class Level|
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    15th|New Class Level|
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    16th|New Class Level|
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    17th|New Class Level|
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    18th|New Class Level|
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    19th|New Class Level|
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    20th|New Class Level|
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities[/table]

    Code
    Spoiler
    Show
    [b]NAME OF ENTRY[/b]
    {table=head][b]Level[/b]|[b]Class[/b]|[b]Base Attack Bonus[/b]|[b]Fort Save[/b]|[b]Ref Save[/b]|[b]Will Save[/b]|[b]Skills[/b]|[b]Feats[/b]|[b]Class Features[/b]

    1st|New Class Level|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    2nd|New Class Level|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    3rd|New Class Level|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    4th|New Class Level|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    5th|New Class Level|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    6th|New Class Level|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    7th|New Class Level|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    8th|New Class Level|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    9th|New Class Level|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    10th|New Class Level|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    11th|New Class Level|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    12th|New Class Level|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    13th|New Class Level|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    14th|New Class Level|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    15th|New Class Level|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    16th|New Class Level|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    17th|New Class Level|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    18th|New Class Level|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    19th|New Class Level|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    20th|New Class Level|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities[/table]

    For entries with spellcasting, use the following table for Spells per day and Spells Known. (Spells Known only if necessary, i.e. Sorcerer or Bard, but not Wizard or Warmage)
    Spoiler
    Show
    Spells per day/Spells Known
    {table=head]Level|0lvl|1st|2nd|3rd|4th|5th|6th|7th|8th|9th

    1st|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    2nd|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    3rd|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    4th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    5th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    6th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    7th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    8th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    9th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    10th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    11th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    12th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    13th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    14th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    15th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    16th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    17th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    18th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    19th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    20th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-[/table]

    Code
    Spoiler
    Show
    [b]Spells per day/Spells Known[/b]
    {table=head][b]Level[/b]|[b]0lvl[/b]|[b]1st[/b]|[b]2nd[/b]|[b]3rd[/b]|[b]4th[/b]|[b]5th[/b]|[b]6th[/b]|[b]7th[/b]|[b]8th[/b]|[b]9th[/b]

    1st|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    2nd|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    3rd|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    4th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    5th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    6th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    7th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    8th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    9th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    10th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    11th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    12th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    13th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    14th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    15th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    16th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    17th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    18th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    19th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    20th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-[/table]

    For other systems (Psionics, ToB, Incarnum, etc.) keep track of PP/maneuvers/essentia separately, preferably in a nice neat list.
    Speculation: Please don't post or speculate on possible builds until the "reveal," in order to avoid spoiling the surprise if a particular competitor is producing a build along those lines.

    Leadership is banned; we're producing a meal, not a seven-course banquet for a hundred diners. If your entry includes a prestige class or ACF that grants Leadership or a Leadership-like ability as a bonus feat, the feat should be ignored and is not eligible to be traded away for another feat of ACF through any means.

    So! Who wants to sign up as a contestant, and who wants to sign up as a judge? Looking for as many contestants and judges as feel like playing!

    This week's special ingredient is:
    Complete Divine's Consecrated Harrier! (Please note previous versions of Consecrated Harrier are not acceptable substitutes).
    We will award 1st through 3rd places, as well as a shout-out for honorable mention. The honorable mention prize is given to the most daring or unexpected build. Judges, contestants and guests alike are invited to vote for honorable mention via PM.

    Allez optimiser!

    Contestants

    Judges

    The Builds

    Past Competitions

    Iron Chef I: Entropomancer
    Iron Chef II: Psibond Agent
    Iron Chef III: Cancer Mage
    Iron Chef IV: Stonelord
    Iron Chef V: War Chanter
    Iron Chef VI: Master of Masks
    Iron Chef VII: Green Star Adept
    Iron Chef VIII: Pyrokineticist
    Iron Chef IX: Animal Lord
    Iron Chef X: Mythic Exemplar
    Iron Chef XI: Blade Bravo
    Iron Chef XII: War Mind
    Iron Chef XIII: Vigilante
    Iron Chef XIV: Seeker of the Song
    Iron Chef XV: Drunken Master
    Iron Chef XVI: Assassin
    Iron Chef XVII: Ardent Dilettante
    Iron Chef XVIII: Unseelie Dark Hunter
    Iron Chef XIX: Dread Pirate
    Iron Chef XX: Incandescent Champion
    Iron Chef XXI: Ghostwalker
    Iron Chef XXII: Dervish
    Iron Chef XXIII: Divine Crusader
    Iron Chef XXIV: Tactical Soldier
    Iron Chef XXV: Scion of Tem-Et-Nu
    Iron Chef XXVI: Shadowdancer
    Iron Chef XXVII: Mindbender
    Iron Chef XXVIII: Cryokineticist
    Last edited by Amphetryon; 2012-01-21 at 09:17 PM.
    Star Metallurgist of the Roy Fanclub

    Who made my awesome Dwarf Hexblade avatar, you ask? BRC did!
    Spoiler
    Show

  2. - Top - End - #2
    Troll in the Playground
     
    HalflingPirate

    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    In an Octopus's Garden

    Default Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge XXIX

    I can't say I've ever paid any attention to that one. I'm going to have to read up.
    Dex

    Spoiler
    Show
    Regarding my Necrotic Apprentice trick:
    Quote Originally Posted by Doc Roc View Post
    This is brilliant.
    Regarding my Non-Epic Hidecarved Dragon:
    Quote Originally Posted by Amphetryon View Post
    Nicely done. Probably too cheesy for many tables, but I'd be inclined to allow it at mine, just for chutzpah.

    Have a cookie.
    Spoiler
    Show
    Check out the Versatile Domain Generalist.

  3. - Top - End - #3
    Ettin in the Playground
     
    Thurbane's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Terra Australis
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge XXIX

    Consecrated Harrier huh? Interesting - I'll see if I can get an entry in this time...

  4. - Top - End - #4
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    Kobold

    Join Date
    Dec 2006

    Default Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge In The Playground XXIX

    Oh my, this one does have some meat to it, so many wonderful options.
    Spoiler
    Show


  5. - Top - End - #5
    Troll in the Playground
     
    HalflingPirate

    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    In an Octopus's Garden

    Default Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge In The Playground XXIX

    I've read it, and all I can say is, "huh."
    Dex

    Spoiler
    Show
    Regarding my Necrotic Apprentice trick:
    Quote Originally Posted by Doc Roc View Post
    This is brilliant.
    Regarding my Non-Epic Hidecarved Dragon:
    Quote Originally Posted by Amphetryon View Post
    Nicely done. Probably too cheesy for many tables, but I'd be inclined to allow it at mine, just for chutzpah.

    Have a cookie.
    Spoiler
    Show
    Check out the Versatile Domain Generalist.

  6. - Top - End - #6
    Troll in the Playground
     
    WolfInSheepsClothing

    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge In The Playground XXIX

    I was NOT expecting this one. Competing, even if it kills me.

    Interested in a PvP arena? Check out The Crowd Calls for Blood!
    This is what happens when they let me DM: Beyond the Horizon!

  7. - Top - End - #7
    Ettin in the Playground
     
    Amphetryon's Avatar

    Join Date
    Dec 2006

    Default Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge In The Playground XXIX

    Quote Originally Posted by The Gilded Duke View Post
    Oh my, this one does have some meat to it, so many wonderful options.
    And yet, almost nobody talks it up or highlights it in any builds, that I've ever found on the interwebs. I figure it's a reasonable change-of-pace/apology from Cryokineticist.
    Star Metallurgist of the Roy Fanclub

    Who made my awesome Dwarf Hexblade avatar, you ask? BRC did!
    Spoiler
    Show

  8. - Top - End - #8
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    Kobold

    Join Date
    Dec 2006

    Default Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge In The Playground XXIX

    Yeah at first glance it doesn't look like much, sorta ranger casting, code of conduct, some random abilities. I wouldn't say it is a great prestige class, but it is far far better then some, and there should be some ways to make it work out nicely.
    Spoiler
    Show


  9. - Top - End - #9
    Titan in the Playground
     
    BardGuy

    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    I wish I knew...
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge In The Playground XXIX

    Hmmm... well, there's one glaringly obvious entry, but the entry requirements are suitabally vague enough that just about anything not a 1/2 BAB class can probably get in on time. Heck, only needing 5 ranks means you can do cross-class by level 7 or 8. It's got a single feat requirement that comes as a class ability from at least one if not two base classes.

    So very open-ended as to what qualifies... I look forward to seeing the variety of dishes served for this one.
    Quote Originally Posted by The Underlord View Post
    All hail great Shneekeythulhu! Ia Ia Shneeky fthagn
    Spoiler
    Show
    Quite possibly, the best rebuttal I have ever witnessed.
    Joker Bard - the DM's solution to the Batman Wizard.
    Takahashi no Onisan - The scariest Samurai alive
    Incarnum and YOU: a reference guide
    Soulmelds, by class and slot: Another Incarnum reference
    Multiclassing for Newbies: A reference guide for the rest of us

    My homebrew world in progress: Falcora

  10. - Top - End - #10
    Troll in the Playground
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Baltimore, MD
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge In The Playground XXIX

    One idea immediately springs to mind. I plan to compete.

  11. - Top - End - #11
    Titan in the Playground
     
    Greenish's Avatar

    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Finland

    Default Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge In The Playground XXIX

    Some Wis-synergy is obviously in order. I'll be watching with interest.

    Also, the picture is the stiffest pose I've seen for a while. That's pretty much the only thing I've noticed of the class until now.
    Quotes:
    Spoiler
    Show
    Quote Originally Posted by Claudius Maximus View Post
    Also fixed the money issue by sacrificing a goat.
    Quote Originally Posted by subject42 View Post
    This board needs a "you're technically right but I still want to crawl into the fetal position and cry" emoticon.
    Quote Originally Posted by Yukitsu View Post
    I define [optimization] as "the process by which one attains a build meeting all mechanical and characterization goals set out by the creator prior to its creation."
    Praise for avatar may be directed to Derjuin.

  12. - Top - End - #12
    Titan in the Playground
     
    BardGuy

    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    I wish I knew...
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge In The Playground XXIX

    Quote Originally Posted by Greenish View Post
    Some Wis-synergy is obviously in order. I'll be watching with interest.

    Also, the picture is the stiffest pose I've seen for a while. That's pretty much the only thing I've noticed of the class until now.
    Mmmm... not really. Wis 14 is all you really need to get all the spells out of this class. You can use most of the defensive/utility spells on the list and not worry much about DC's. About the only thing that really screams 'wisdom synergy' is the (wisdom mod + 1) times/day for the SLA's.
    Quote Originally Posted by The Underlord View Post
    All hail great Shneekeythulhu! Ia Ia Shneeky fthagn
    Spoiler
    Show
    Quite possibly, the best rebuttal I have ever witnessed.
    Joker Bard - the DM's solution to the Batman Wizard.
    Takahashi no Onisan - The scariest Samurai alive
    Incarnum and YOU: a reference guide
    Soulmelds, by class and slot: Another Incarnum reference
    Multiclassing for Newbies: A reference guide for the rest of us

    My homebrew world in progress: Falcora

  13. - Top - End - #13
    Titan in the Playground
     
    Rizban's Avatar

    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    Aldhaven
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge In The Playground XXIX

    I should mention that I hate this class...

    Still, I have an idea for it that I'm going to run with. I love the idea, but this class is really not what I would want to use it for. On the other hand, it can work with this class, and I doubt the classes with which it would work best will come up anytime soon.
    If I've helped you out, please check out some my homebrew and post in the threads. Thank you.
    Spoiler
    Show
    Fivefold Paths of Magic

    Rizban's E6 Compendium
    The Kreen of the Desert - Races, classes, feats, and more

    Full Homebrew List


    Aldhaven: Vicious Betrayals - May 27, 2010 to May 27, 2013.

    Quod tibi vis fieri, facias.

  14. - Top - End - #14
    Dwarf in the Playground
     
    Imp

    Join Date
    May 2009

    Default Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge In The Playground XXIX

    Quote Originally Posted by Rizban View Post
    I should mention that I hate this class...
    After Cryokineticist? Seems pretty great to me
    "No Anti-Magic field ever stopped a pouncing Barbarians Great Club"

    Spoilered Stuff!
    Spoiler
    Show


    Favourite Threads!



    Random
    Spoiler
    Show


    I appear to be a pixie. I knew I overflowed with natural charisma

    Nooo! I have fallen to being a mere halfling! Guess I'll....umm.....throw things....and bemoan my favored class.....




  15. - Top - End - #15
    Troll in the Playground
     
    Venger's Avatar

    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Texas
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge In The Playground XXIX

    Quote Originally Posted by ShneekeyTheLost View Post
    Mmmm... not really. Wis 14 is all you really need to get all the spells out of this class. You can use most of the defensive/utility spells on the list and not worry much about DC's. About the only thing that really screams 'wisdom synergy' is the (wisdom mod + 1) times/day for the SLA's.
    yeah, but the SLAs are sort of specific enough that I really don't think you'll be using them more than 3 times an in-game day

    I must give you credit, amphetryon, I am rather well versed with the completes and I've never even heard of this class before.

    it reads sort of like bloodhoud-lite. I think I can come up with at least 1 workable idea, maybe 2.

    in any event, count me in as a contestant instead of a judge this time, I can make this work
    fight my brute! it's a lot of fun
    Quote Originally Posted by Kelb_Panthera View Post
    How telling is it that people would rather discuss the taxonomy of tomatoes (which are delicious) than the truenamer class?
    Iron Chef Medals!
    Amazing Princess Mononoke avatar by Dispozition

  16. - Top - End - #16
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    Imp

    Join Date
    Sep 2011

    Default Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge In The Playground XXIX

    Just posting so the thread is prompted for me. I haven't decided whether to judge or compete but I will do one or the other. I typical dislike divine classes. They have way too much agenda for my tastes. And this class seems especially difficult in the originality department. I have already brain stormed about 15 different builds and they all seem terribly obvious to me. I might frantically try to enter them all and go the buckshot route. Or I might be utterly bored by it and decide to judge instead. I will give it a few days of pondering.


    P.S. Can we end the conversation on the mechanical inner-workings of the class? It kind of borderlines on the whole "don't discuss builds" rule for me.
    Last edited by Gotterdammerung; 2012-01-22 at 02:19 AM.

  17. - Top - End - #17
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    Imp

    Join Date
    Sep 2011

    Default Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge In The Playground XXIX

    The classes spell like abilities do not specify caster level. Can we get a rules clarification on the CL of these abilities.

    Detect chaos- states per lvl which leaves the question, character level or class lvl?

    Dispel magic- does not state CL or how to calculate.

    Crushing Despair- does not state CL or how to calculate.

    False Vision- does not state CL or how to calculate.


    Thank you in advance.

  18. - Top - End - #18
    Troll in the Playground
     
    Venger's Avatar

    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Texas
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge In The Playground XXIX

    Quote Originally Posted by Gotterdammerung View Post
    The classes spell like abilities do not specify caster level. Can we get a rules clarification on the CL of these abilities.

    Detect chaos- states per lvl which leaves the question, character level or class lvl?

    Dispel magic- does not state CL or how to calculate.

    Crushing Despair- does not state CL or how to calculate.

    False Vision- does not state CL or how to calculate.


    Thank you in advance.
    detect chaos states "as a cleric of equal level" meaning the harrier's class level

    as far as the others go, you are indeed correct, but it could probably be extrapolated that they follow the same formula
    fight my brute! it's a lot of fun
    Quote Originally Posted by Kelb_Panthera View Post
    How telling is it that people would rather discuss the taxonomy of tomatoes (which are delicious) than the truenamer class?
    Iron Chef Medals!
    Amazing Princess Mononoke avatar by Dispozition

  19. - Top - End - #19
    Ettin in the Playground
     
    Thurbane's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Terra Australis
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge In The Playground XXIX

    Quote Originally Posted by Venger View Post
    detect chaos states "as a cleric of equal level" meaning the harrier's class level

    as far as the others go, you are indeed correct, but it could probably be extrapolated that they follow the same formula
    Agreed - in the absence of any other data, I think the safest assumption is that caster level for the SLAs = Harrier level.

  20. - Top - End - #20
    Ettin in the Playground
     
    Amphetryon's Avatar

    Join Date
    Dec 2006

    Default Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge In The Playground XXIX

    Quote Originally Posted by Thurbane View Post
    Agreed - in the absence of any other data, I think the safest assumption is that caster level for the SLAs = Harrier level.
    That's how I'd read it as well.
    Star Metallurgist of the Roy Fanclub

    Who made my awesome Dwarf Hexblade avatar, you ask? BRC did!
    Spoiler
    Show

  21. - Top - End - #21
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    IdleMuse's Avatar

    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Lancaster, UK
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge In The Playground XXIX

    What's the consensus on Dragonlance setting material? Acceptable, or will result in horrible Elegance penalties?
    "Hex grids are the way forward! And slighty to the side..." - Studoku

  22. - Top - End - #22
    Troll in the Playground
     
    Venger's Avatar

    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Texas
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge In The Playground XXIX

    Quote Originally Posted by IdleMuse View Post
    What's the consensus on Dragonlance setting material? Acceptable, or will result in horrible Elegance penalties?
    people have used that stuff in earlier challenges, and amph has made a rule not to deduct elegance for obscurity of sources, so you're good (maybe scrub the post before the judges see, we don't want to know who's got what)
    fight my brute! it's a lot of fun
    Quote Originally Posted by Kelb_Panthera View Post
    How telling is it that people would rather discuss the taxonomy of tomatoes (which are delicious) than the truenamer class?
    Iron Chef Medals!
    Amazing Princess Mononoke avatar by Dispozition

  23. - Top - End - #23
    Dwarf in the Playground
     
    PaladinGuy

    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Minnesota
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge In The Playground XXIX

    Well, I would think it depends on the Dragonlance book you're talking about. The only book produced and published by Wizards is the Dragonlance Campaign Setting book.

    The rest of the stuff is third party with a "Wizards of the Coast Licensed Product" seal, and it is notorious for either being complete crap or borked to the point of making things like Incantrix and Planar Shepard look sane.

    Then again, Dragon Compendium is allowed... That's a bunch of third party content with essentially the same seal and problems...
    Last edited by Hunter Killer; 2012-01-22 at 11:49 AM.
    "What is Sanity? Madness put to good use. What is our waking life? A dream controlled."
    -George Santayana

    Spoiler
    Show



  24. - Top - End - #24
    Titan in the Playground
     
    BardGuy

    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    I wish I knew...
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge In The Playground XXIX

    Quote Originally Posted by Amphetryon View Post
    That's how I'd read it as well.
    Going to be difficult to make the Dispel Magic relevant, then, since you're going to be way behind the CL of anything you'd want to dispel. It'll be interesting to see how the contestants compensate for this.

    Crushing Despair and False Vision, fortunately, doesn't have anything really dependent on CL other than duration, which is minutes/level and hours/level respectively, and quite long enough to not worry about it.
    Quote Originally Posted by The Underlord View Post
    All hail great Shneekeythulhu! Ia Ia Shneeky fthagn
    Spoiler
    Show
    Quite possibly, the best rebuttal I have ever witnessed.
    Joker Bard - the DM's solution to the Batman Wizard.
    Takahashi no Onisan - The scariest Samurai alive
    Incarnum and YOU: a reference guide
    Soulmelds, by class and slot: Another Incarnum reference
    Multiclassing for Newbies: A reference guide for the rest of us

    My homebrew world in progress: Falcora

  25. - Top - End - #25
    Troll in the Playground
     
    WolfInSheepsClothing

    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge In The Playground XXIX

    Quote Originally Posted by IdleMuse View Post
    What's the consensus on Dragonlance setting material? Acceptable, or will result in horrible Elegance penalties?
    I think the Campaign Setting book was published by WotC and thus count as official, whereas the Dragonlance splats (like, I dunno, War of the Lance) are licensed products published by another company and are therefore a no-go.

    Edit: swordsage'd.
    Last edited by OMG PONIES; 2012-01-22 at 11:50 AM.

    Interested in a PvP arena? Check out The Crowd Calls for Blood!
    This is what happens when they let me DM: Beyond the Horizon!

  26. - Top - End - #26
    Ettin in the Playground
     
    Amphetryon's Avatar

    Join Date
    Dec 2006

    Default Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge In The Playground XXIX

    Quote Originally Posted by OMG PONIES View Post
    I think the Campaign Setting book was published by WotC and thus count as official, whereas the Dragonlance splats (like, I dunno, War of the Lance) are licensed products published by another company and are therefore a no-go.

    Edit: swordsage'd.
    This, with more VoG and less swordsage.
    Star Metallurgist of the Roy Fanclub

    Who made my awesome Dwarf Hexblade avatar, you ask? BRC did!
    Spoiler
    Show

  27. - Top - End - #27
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    flabort's Avatar

    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Canada
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge In The Playground XXIX

    Looked over the class now, see it pretty, well... uh.. would it be speculation to say my initial impression is that it turns a ranger into a paladin? With less-than-normal for a paladin? I would think not...

    I've got the start of my build, but am wondering whether to go straight <I know it would be speculation to say this, so I won't>, or to take another PrC first... I'm still grateful to Venger for giving me access to books that I couldn't before, and now I'm about to crack open <Saying the BOOKS would be speculation> to check out a feat I'm considering. I would now ask for advice, but that would also cause speculation.

    ... It's hard not to post stuff you want to share.
    Demilich avatar by Smuchmuch. Thank you VERY much!

    Extended Signature
    Awright, Supagoof, that's just awesome. Thanks!
    Spoiler
    Show


    Infernal avatar by Savana. Thanks!

    Nude version by SmuchMuch.

  28. - Top - End - #28
    Titan in the Playground
     
    Rizban's Avatar

    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    Aldhaven
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge In The Playground XXIX

    Well, I have my story finished and have all but 4 feats and 1 class level selected... I'm trying to decide between +1 existing class or a 1-level dip squeezed in somewhere...

    Correction, my build is finished, and I'm just trying to polish it for final submission. I have two other ideas I really want to consider as well...
    Last edited by Rizban; 2012-01-22 at 06:47 PM.
    If I've helped you out, please check out some my homebrew and post in the threads. Thank you.
    Spoiler
    Show
    Fivefold Paths of Magic

    Rizban's E6 Compendium
    The Kreen of the Desert - Races, classes, feats, and more

    Full Homebrew List


    Aldhaven: Vicious Betrayals - May 27, 2010 to May 27, 2013.

    Quod tibi vis fieri, facias.

  29. - Top - End - #29
    Barbarian in the Playground
    Join Date
    Feb 2010

    Default Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge In The Playground XXIX

    Quote Originally Posted by Gotterdammerung View Post
    The classes spell like abilities do not specify caster level. Can we get a rules clarification on the CL of these abilities.

    Detect chaos- states per lvl which leaves the question, character level or class lvl?

    Dispel magic- does not state CL or how to calculate.

    Crushing Despair- does not state CL or how to calculate.

    False Vision- does not state CL or how to calculate.


    Thank you in advance.
    Quote Originally Posted by SRD
    For creatures with spell-like abilities, a designated caster level defines how difficult it is to dispel their spell-like effects and to define any level-dependent variables (such as range and duration) the abilities might have. The creature’s caster level never affects which spell-like abilities the creature has; sometimes the given caster level is lower than the level a spellcasting character would need to cast the spell of the same name. If no caster level is specified, the caster level is equal to the creature’s Hit Dice
    If you don't want to suppose what the authors intended, there's a pretty easy way to handle it with established RAW.

    Time-wasting Question: Blessing of Scripture provides a "...sacred bonus on Bluff, Listen, Sense Motive, Spot, and Survival checks when in pursuit of their church-assigned targets." The next line says these bonuses apply to leaders of groups. That bolded part is odd. Does it read as <bonus on all those skill checks> as long as you can say you're in pursuit? Or a bonus against the leader only, except for Survival, which applies while in pursuit?

    I'm assuming the latter interpretation, as the former means that if you're hunting an organization, you would gain the benefits against anyone who you encountered on the way, but not the organization itself, since you already found them, unless it's the leader. Though the Sense Motive bonus may help you discover who has the leader -- "Oh hey, I can really read this guy! He must be calling the shots!"
    Last edited by Pechvarry; 2012-01-22 at 07:09 PM.

  30. - Top - End - #30
    Troll in the Playground
     
    Venger's Avatar

    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Texas
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge In The Playground XXIX

    this is actually shaping up to be more difficult than I thought.
    fight my brute! it's a lot of fun
    Quote Originally Posted by Kelb_Panthera View Post
    How telling is it that people would rather discuss the taxonomy of tomatoes (which are delicious) than the truenamer class?
    Iron Chef Medals!
    Amazing Princess Mononoke avatar by Dispozition

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •