World of Warcraft XIII: Even Aspects Get Nerfed

[subanark]

Well, got heroic Zon down finally. Very messy end, once again we screwed up the final black phase by getting extra bounces. 1/2 the raid died, and the boss died just after enrage. People had issues making other days of the week, so we just burned though the rest instead of going for Heroic Hagara. Guild leaders thinks that Blackhorn might be easier with all the nerfs.

[Karoht]

No. Hagara is much easier, speaking from experience.
Regular phase is a healing check with one tank using cooldowns. Stack for Ice Tombs and Burn them. Have people swap off for Ice Lances.
Lightning Phase is coordination. Two teams of two or three run around and link stuff. The rest sit in the middle. Protip-have pet classes keep their pets in the middle from the get go or they chain lightning into the group which is remarkably hard to heal.
Ice Phase is mostly personal coordination. My advice, mark off four starting points around the circle and assign people. This also helps for regular phase and Ice Lance Swapping. Here is my advice:
1-Your most mobile people with magic dispel effects. Paladins of all walks are perfect for this. No healer should be needed in this group.
2-DPS and a Healer (least mobile)
3-DPS and a Healer
4-DPS and a Healer (most mobile)
Keep people running in the innermost part of the circle, close to the edge of the watery entrenchment bubble. If anyone gets the debuff, they go into the circle and wait to be dispelled. Once they are dispelled, they wait for an ice wave to pass and go in. The ONLY time people deviate from this is if they are dodging the falling ice (which can and will knock you right into an ice wave for an insta-death) and are too far out from the inner part of the circle, they instead proceed to the outer edge and call for a dispel.
Keep moving at all times, kill pillars, burn boss as normal.

Pre-pot plus regular cooldowns on the pull. Bloodlust + Cooldowns + Pot at the end of Ice Phase 1 (all CD's should be up by then).

[subanark]

Only 2 groups linking stuff. Hrm... the strat we have tried to use is where everyone stands in a particular place to try and link it all at once (with a bit of movement to shift to those ones).

We tried this a while back trying to run into the middle for frost, but the healers just couldn't keep up. It looks like next week we will just go with running around the circle. We tried lightning a few times, but sometimes the lightning just didn't connect and the healers couldn't keep everyone up long enough. Pets chaining were a cause in addition to some times the lightning just not chaining were issues.

Our group is:
Tank - Druid (with that OP dps trinket)
Healer - Disc priest (has a shadow off spec)
Healer - Restro druid (has a moonkin offspec, but rarely uses it)
Healer - Holy Paladin (has a ret offspec, but isn't that well geared or practiced)
M. dps - Fury warrior (our off tank, but does the most damage due to getting more loot)
R. dps - Element shaman (me, I have a restro offspec)
R. dps - Affliction Warlock x1-2 (usually 2)
R dps - Fire Mage x2-3 (usually 2, one has considered reforging to arcane, one with legendary staff)

All of us except 1 mage (an alternate) has the Mirror of Broken Images.
As you can see we only have 1 melee dps, but we have all the spell caster buffs except +3% damage. An arcane mage would add that if needed. I could go healing, but my dps is pretty good on single targets. I usually heal blackthorn on normal due to lack of being able to multi-dot stuff up.

Currently we have fallen behind the alliance with 3 guilds getting 5/8. Aside from the trasnfer 8/8 horde guild, we are on top (another did manage to catch up to us briefly with 3/8). I am really concerned that Blackhorn might be another Beth for us due to lack of DKs being able to grip the sappers.

[Karoht]

Only 2 groups linking stuff. Hrm... the strat we have tried to use is where everyone stands in a particular place to try and link it all at once (with a bit of movement to shift to those ones).

It's easiest on your healers. We found that with everyone moving to various places it just caused more problems than it would in theory ever solve. Just pick your 4 fastest people (Blink/Dash/Ghost Wolf and such).

We tried this a while back trying to run into the middle for frost, but the healers just couldn't keep up.

We attempted it as well. Turns out that on 10 man you mathmatically can't keep up with the damage for more than 50-60 seconds. It's a viable 25 man strat though.

Pets chaining were a cause in addition to some times the lightning just not chaining were issues.

Pets were a huge issue for us, once we figured that out Lightning phase was easy peasy. Just keep the pets off the lightning add when you kill him.

Currently we have fallen behind the alliance with 3 guilds getting 5/8. Aside from the trasnfer 8/8 horde guild, we are on top (another did manage to catch up to us briefly with 3/8). I am really concerned that Blackhorn might be another Beth for us due to lack of DKs being able to grip the sappers.

Our first Blackhorn kill featured no DK's. You'll be fine with the amount of range you have. Have fun dodging fire and soaking up swirlies.

Speaking of which, I managed to earn the Deck Defender achievement last night. Half our core didn't show up, so we pugged and cleared down, but to make it fun we did that achievement. Easy when you have 2 druids and a mage running around like chickens with their heads cut off jumping into every circle. Fun times.
Also, we managed to kill one of the dragons on the first pass before he dropped off his add. Add fell down past the ship, and about 15 seconds later was somehow hitting the tank through the floor, and then just appeared on the deck about 20 yards away from the tank. Luckily no evade bug with all that nonsense.

[Dublock]

Also, we managed to kill one of the dragons on the first pass before he dropped off his add. Add fell down past the ship, and about 15 seconds later was somehow hitting the tank through the floor, and then just appeared on the deck about 20 yards away from the tank. Luckily no evade bug with all that nonsense.

Props to your range although man, I can't imagine having to deal with an add with the evade bug while doing that fight lol.

I got the Beta yesterday! Had fun with the monk starter area.

Ok stupid question, in the beta is there a way to assign key bindings to the extra action bars? I always use...some bar addon which allows me to and its going to be a pain if I can use the key bindings I've used for years lol. Moved over my mage and when I was moving my spells to each key like it is in live it hit me and I thought "Oh yea no addons........crap"

[Karoht]

Addons are all disabled for beta, I haven't been able to keybind anything on my Cataclysm mouse either. They tend to turn off a lot of stuff like that during beta it was the same with cata beta.

[Expf]

Ok stupid question, in the beta is there a way to assign key bindings to the extra action bars? I always use...some bar addon which allows me to and its going to be a pain if I can use the key bindings I've used for years lol. Moved over my mage and when I was moving my spells to each key like it is in live it hit me and I thought "Oh yea no addons........crap"

Yes, it's in the "Key Bindings" like everything else. You have to scroll down to find the additional Action Bars, but it's there.

The default UI is really clunky but I made it work ... somewhat decently. The crashing is getting irritating though.

[Alarra]

Yeah, it was a bit of an adjustment for me when I started playing on the beta. Previously I didn't even have 2/3 of my spells on bars because they were all bound to my mouse.

[Karoht]

Big day.

First we had the Vodka VS Method: Heroic Dragon Soul 25 Race to Full Clear.

It was awesome. They did it without the debuff.
Vodka had a wipe on Zonozz which put them behind, but on every boss after that they were closing the gap.
However, it wasn't enough. Method had no wipes and beat them. Any guesses on how big the gap was?
2 minutes? No.
30 seconds? Nope.
10 seconds? Wrong.

3 seconds. Seriously, 3 seconds. That is how hard Vodka pushed from that wipe onward to try and close the gap.


Also, I came up with a video question for legendary, recorded it, and sent it to them.

Spoiler

Show

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sU2Fa...ature=youtu.be

[Dublock]

3 seconds.

Wow. I regret not watching it live, must have been something (although I've been busy).

A couple weeks and my guild has been...on a break but we are going to do a run today. Not NEARLY as far along as others in the thread, but I am happy so far, 8/8 week of the 10% nerf (almost had it the week before...) and so far 1/8 HM.

[Karoht]

It was truly astonishing to watch.
And the guys running it, and the sponsors, were all pretty happy with how it went down. No idea how much money they raised for charity.
Athene: "Feed dem keeds!"
His accent is awesome BTW.
We should be seeing more events like this in future. It was easy to set up, it was easy to access, and the participating guilds were great sports about it.


Also, I saw the film The Lorax on the weekend. And now I want to make a machinima featuring my resto druid.

"My name is Karoht. I speak for the trees." Just need to figure out what direction I want to take it. Gaming or Environmentalism. Or both. We'll see.
"And unless someone cares a whole awful lot, it's never going to get better.
It's not."
Yeah, probably environmentalism.

[The Glyphstone]

Both? Make it seem about gaming, but in language and scenes that heavily imply environmentalism.

[Karoht]

Both? Make it seem about gaming, but in language and scenes that heavily imply environmentalism.

Or, third option. Do one for both.

My name is Karoht. I speak for newbies.
My name is Karoht. I speak for the trees.

And so forth.

[Elm11]

Well, I've just gotten back into WoW for the first time in 5 months. Still getting re-aquainted with transmog and other related stuffs, and I'm wondering: What's a good dps to be pulling on dummies nowadays? My ilvl is currently 370, and I'm pulling circa 20k.

[Karoht]

370 ilevel and you're getting 20K? Not bad. The potential is higher, and 370 ilevel can be a small part of the picture. I'd have to see armory to really know what you're wearing.
What class/spec?

Otherwise, you're doing okay. Keep up the good work.
I recommend www.Icy-Veins.com if you want some good tips. 1 page guides, easy to navigate, and it's not elitistjerks.com

Oh, yeah, livestream tonight.
www.livestream.com/karoht
I'm going to start it whenever we have a full group this time, rather than making people wait while we figure out our group. Should be starting around 2300 Calgary time. Videos of the stream will be available on the stream page just like last time.

[Dublock]

Last Saturday's raid for me was a success for sure. We went 3/8 HM including Slime and Ultra.

I feel bad cause I said in /g (we have about 5 people in raid in the guild including the GM) that I don't think we will down slime today due to heals being a bit low. A few pulls later (about 7 overall I think) we got it, insignia dropped and I lost the roll badly. Game taught me a lesson lol.

On Ultra, our 3rd pull was the killing blow. The first attempt we got down to 52% and someone commented on being hit who was not the tank and someone was talking about how the timing of the taunting was tricky and our main tank said "Oh we need two tanks for this fight?" lmao.

I got lightening rod, yay! Now my ilvl is 394 and still the lowest among the guild (who raids with us) lol, which got rid of my last 378 off hand, which we have yet to see dropped.

[Karoht]

Thats awesome.

Yeah last week we spent waaaay too much time on H Zonozz and H Hagara. I'm hoping that we don't suck today, it makes the stream much more interesting to watch.


Speaking of streaming and interesting, the guys who did that livestream raid race for charity? Well, now they are planning a marathon.
2 guys race from 1-87 with Pandaren Monks.

It's going to a great charity, project Sharecraft, who are trying to raise 1 million dollars to help starving children in africa. So far they raised 380 thousand from the race on the weekend (which is pretty darned good for a 1 hour charity event), and they're hoping to get the rest from this marathon.

For more info on this great event check out the article on www.mmo-champion.com

[Expf]

What's a good dps to be pulling on dummies nowadays? My ilvl is currently 370, and I'm pulling circa 20k.

Could be higher, maybe around 22k, but depends on how well-itemized your gear is (trinkets / weapons / etc).

As far as typical "normal" testubg dummy DPS goes, it's somewhere between 30k and 40k, and varies a lot depending if you have things like good trinkets, legendaries, and whatever (de)buffs you may or may not have. In a typical tank-and-spank raid I would see numbers from 35k and 45k, usually.

I usually don't judge DPS (or HPS) by the number, but rather compare the DPS with other people. Similarly geared people should do roughly the same DPS if they are performing the same role.

[Elm11]

This is on my Marksmanship Hunter. I'm decked out almost entirely in troll/HoT epics, since I've never been able to afford the time for raiding. Yesterday I sat down and fixed my hit rating so it was no long 4% over what it needed to be, and that saw an immediate increase in Deeps. I'm Barthilas Velian, if anybody cares to check armory.

[Karoht]

... since I've never been able to afford the time for raiding.

LFR is compartimentalized for short and easy access. A full clear of both sections will typically take less than 90 minutes, a single section can take as short as 15 minutes depending on group.
Most groups in there now know what they are doing, clearing all 4 bosses in the section is pretty quick and easy now. Worth giving a try if you have even a spare 30 minutes. In fact I'll go ahead and say this. If you have time for 2 dungeons, you probably have time for 1 section of LFR.


Anyway, off to go get ready for raid and livestream.
www.livestream.com/karoht
starts in approx 4 hours from now.

[Elm11]

Ok, thanks for the heads-up. Unfortunately, with my current ilvl, I'm not eligible for LFR, but I will be with the addition of one or maybe two more items. Once I'm there, I'll probably run a couple.

[Hullabaloo]

LFR is compartimentalized for short and easy access. A full clear of both sections will typically take less than 90 minutes, a single section can take as short as 15 minutes depending on group.
Most groups in there now know what they are doing, clearing all 4 bosses in the section is pretty quick and easy now. Worth giving a try if you have even a spare 30 minutes. In fact I'll go ahead and say this. If you have time for 2 dungeons, you probably have time for 1 section of LFR.

I just started a month ago, and like the poster above, I think my ilevel will be short to move to the LFR when I cap (79 right now). I typically have 2-3 hours to play at night, but have been unable to find a guild on my server (alliance side) that raides those hours (typically 10 or 11 to 1 or 2 AM), so planned on the LFR to start.

But whats the best way to get the ilevel required to do those? PvP?

[Karoht]

I just started a month ago, and like the poster above, I think my ilevel will be short to move to the LFR when I cap (79 right now). I typically have 2-3 hours to play at night, but have been unable to find a guild on my server (alliance side) that raides those hours (typically 10 or 11 to 1 or 2 AM), so planned on the LFR to start.

But whats the best way to get the ilevel required to do those? PvP?

Dungeons and Justice Points. Dungeons will take you all the way to 378 gear, Justice Points will buy you 378 gear. It literally took me 2 days to get LFR access just clearing dungeons out. And you'll get valor points along the way as well, which will net you 397 gear.

PvP gear in PvE content tends to not be a good idea. It's not worthless, but it's definitely not what you want. And I'm pretty sure that honor farming will take you longer than progressing through some dungeons.



Also, thanks to anyone and everyone who tuned in this week to the live stream. Everyone played much better last night, and I think there was even less crude language. Still, video is up on my livestream page, just scroll down to the videos section.
www.livestream.com/karoht
I actually had a viewer question which I answered in game. WoW stalkers are funny like that.

[Hullabaloo]

Cool thanks. My iLvl has been about double my level from 70->79, so was worried. Ill keep progressing via the LFG.

Also my BSing is getting up to about 475, and from the looks of it, the gear quality is catching up to a useful level (currently using a shield a made), where as before I was just using sharping stones and less ward, while selling the rest.

[The Glyphstone]

Yeah, PvP gearing for iLvl pumping is almost always a bad idea. You can get away with one or two pieces, but item budget for Resilience means less PvE stats, so your iLvl doesn't accurately represent your potential capability. Plus,it irritates most PuGs, even the good ones,to have to 'carry' a PvPer. And good PuGs are hard to find on the best days.

[Karoht]

Monday I might go out of town to unwind after the convention this weekend.
(Calgary Comic Entertainment Expo, I'm running Operations for a 60,000 attendee event, I'm going to be a mess come monday)
But if I don't go out of town, I might do a big Livestream thingy all day monday or something.

Also, Zandalari Island looks awesome.


Suggested Fix to Symbiosis that I'm only slightly a fan of.
Druid that casts Symbiosis gets a buff based on their spec. It will relate to a spec ability. IE-If a Resto druid casts it, the buff for resto lowers the cooldown of Swiftmend. The class they cast it on gets an actual druid ability, based on the receiving spec.

I like getting other classes abilities and all, but I don't want people to feel like we're OP. And it makes less work for the Druid casting Symbiosis to figure out who they should cast it on. It's not the best fix, and I'd rather keep it the way it is, but if it needs to be nerfed, this is the method in which I hope it gets nerfed.

And I hope they give Mages something cooler than Healing Touch. If we get Mirror Image I don't see why they can't get Treants or Boomshrooms (non-snare) or something.

[Leon]

But whats the best way to get the ilevel required to do those? PvP?

You can fudge it a lil bit with the PvP blues but don't go over board with it and try to replace those items with PvE gear as soon as you can.
As tedious as it can be endure the regular heroics as much as you can to build the JP up (and the valor is good as well) until you unlock the better ones (End Time, Well of Eternity and Hour of Twilight) and then keep grinding them out for the JP and superior drops.


I am pleased with my Shaman - manged to avoid using anything with +hit on it to reach hit cap (yay for Spirit to Hit Talent) Although i am not LFR ready yet due to mostly my Trinkets i think (a ilvl 308....) And a lvl 85 weapon would be nice as well.

Still need to get those last 6ilvls and then work on mage to have all 4 of my 85s in LFR and then just have to endure the thing 4 times a week to hope for drops

[Hullabaloo]

thanks guys, you answered a second question of mine, without asking it.

The honor(?forget the name) points that you get from random PvP can be used to buy gear, is that resilience gear only or questing (PvE) gear as well. Seems only PvP type gear from what you are saying.

As a tank (Dwarf Pally) I wouldnt want to give up any slots to resilience, as I think that would effect the raid more then on a DPS (or to a much less extent Healer).

From what you guys have said, the dungeons to get to and at 85 should get my iLvl to the proper LFR level? Is that the typical jump, or grind JP or 5 man heroics?

Thanks

[Karoht]

The honor(?forget the name) points that you get from random PvP can be used to buy gear, is that resilience gear only or questing (PvE) gear as well. Seems only PvP type gear from what you are saying.

PvP gets you PvP rewards, PvE gets you PvE rewards. Yes, you can convert Honor to Justice Points and vice versa, but the conversion ratio is at a loss so it is not as efficient.

As a tank (Dwarf Pally) I wouldnt want to give up any slots to resilience, as I think that would effect the raid more then on a DPS (or to a much less extent Healer).

Resilience on anyone in a PvE environement makes everyone bad. Tanks it is the worst for because PvP gear has next to no defensive stats, and it's impossible to get CTC (Chance To be Crit) capped with PvP gear, so some bosses can just one shot you. Healers tend to be behind because PvP gear doesn't focus on mana regen, and typically undervalues mastery, so the output isn't there either. DPS can sort of get away with PvP gear, but only to an extent.
I've carried all 3 in one dungeon at one point. That was probably the worst run of my life.

From what you guys have said, the dungeons to get to and at 85 should get my iLvl to the proper LFR level? Is that the typical jump, or grind JP or 5 man heroics?

Normal Dungeons from 80-85 will get you 333 gear. 85 Heroics range from 359-378 gear. You'll also gain more JP in heroics than normals.

But to more directly answer your question, yes, the progression chain is Hit 85 -> Normal dungeons -> Heroic dungeons -> LFR.


If you want a guide on any of the dungeons, I recommend two resources.
www.wowpedia.org -- some people like to read about bosses and process the info on their own. This in conjunction with the dungeon journal will do the trick.
www.tankspot.com -- Best video guides out there. Featues dungeon guids, raid guides, etc.

Let us know when you hit 85.

[Hullabaloo]

Thanks for the detailed response, Ive been checking out a bit of the stuff about raid bosses, and their little 'tricks'. Bit overwhelming, but I'm sure I can digest it soon enough.

Let us know when you hit 85.

Unfortunately, wont be for a bit still. I have about 2 weeks of vacation followed by 1 week of work travel, which is going to keep me out of game. Actually, let my sub lapse last night because of this, will resub when I will be at home for more then a 12 hour stretch (mid may).

Did not hit all my goals for my first month of play, but got close.
-Level 80 character with 2 professions at 500+. Close, he is about 5% from 79. Got 500 in mining, but only 425 in BS.
-Level 30 alt. Got this one twice, with an affliction warlock and resto shaman. Really like the shaman/healer game play, so he will probably be my main alt.