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  1. - Top - End - #151
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    Default Re: League of Legends XXX: Must be Summoner Level 18 to View

    Quote Originally Posted by aethernox View Post
    Assuming your team manages to make it to the 40 minute mark while maintaining enough lane presence to reasonably deny your opponents any significant advantage in gold gained by their superior stats (which is unlikely; if I saw that the enemy team had practically nothing but gold/10 I would force objective fights all of the time), that team will have mildly more gold than the opposing team, but between one and two fifths of that is more or less ignorable (since it's on a support, a support jungler, or supporty or split-pushy solo top), plus your actual carries would be much better off with items that actually let them do their jobs.

    Gold per 10 is fairly useful, and it once was very strong, but trying to make a gimmick out of it doesn't really make any sense. AD carries and AP carries aren't allowed to build anything but damage or essentials. Supports and support junglers already buy gold/10, so that only leaves top lane. Champions who can win their lane without items are fine with gold per 10 but most of them would rather have actual stats.
    I see professional games go five or even ten minutes with no kills. By that time, you're already looking at something like 5-600 gold pr. champion.

    Think of every time anyone ever talks about a champion snowballing.

    Snowballing, very precisely, is this: Getting more gold for more items for more kills for more gold for more items. And so on.

    Lets do the math differently for a moment. It's 12000 gold. How many kills must the opposing team get in order to match that? That's a variable, I know, but it's still a lot of kills.

    And it comes at the price of 15 ap and a slightly slower early game.

    I'm still not saying this would work. As I initially asked - has it been tried? Because I'm certainly not going to dismiss the idea out of hand, based on opinion alone.

  2. - Top - End - #152
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    Default Re: League of Legends XXX: Must be Summoner Level 18 to View

    Quote Originally Posted by Acromos View Post
    That is patently obvious. Your early game will be weaker.

    However, 3 AP quints will give you 15 AP. 3 gold quints will give you 3 gold every 10 seconds, a gold item will give you an additional 5, and masteries give a further 2. In total, 60 gold pr. champion pr. minute. For a 40 minute game, the total would be 12000 gold.

    Now that is a significant amount of gold, which ever way you look at it.

    And I'm not saying this is a brilliant new way of playing. I'm saying I wonder if it would work.
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  3. - Top - End - #153
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    Default Re: League of Legends XXX: Must be Summoner Level 18 to View

    Quote Originally Posted by Fearan View Post
    Throw in Twisted fate for even more
    Ooh - and Ashe (tho that's only for herself).

  4. - Top - End - #154
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    Default Re: League of Legends XXX: Must be Summoner Level 18 to View

    Quote Originally Posted by Acromos View Post
    I see professional games go five or even ten minutes with no kills. By that time, you're already looking at something like 5-600 gold pr. champion.
    Much easier to bully someone out when he doesn't have those runes, so I'd assume lanes would be more one-sided.

    Snowballing is also about denying the gold to the opposition, not just becoming stronger yourself. When LeBlanc snowballs she kills mid lane, then goes bot lane and wins that too, and then top, and then gets dragon, then forces a baron fight when it's 5v4, etc.

    That said, I run gold/10 quints on Amumu for instance. They're mostly for quicker gold/10 items and more wards and nobody is going to interrupt my farming anyway.
    Last edited by Winthur; 2012-02-10 at 06:28 AM.
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  5. - Top - End - #155
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    Default Re: League of Legends XXX: Must be Summoner Level 18 to View

    Quote Originally Posted by Acromos View Post
    That is patently obvious. Your early game will be weaker.

    However, 3 AP quints will give you 15 AP. 3 gold quints will give you 3 gold every 10 seconds, a gold item will give you an additional 5, and masteries give a further 2. In total, 60 gold pr. champion pr. minute. For a 40 minute game, the total would be 12000 gold.

    Now that is a significant amount of gold, which ever way you look at it.

    And I'm not saying this is a brilliant new way of playing. I'm saying I wonder if it would work.
    Well, if one analyzes every lane for the potential effect of GP/10 vs Traditional runes:


    • Top lane would probably be fine, if you take a hero that is hard to bully out of lane (for example, Kennen). Although it would allow the enemy hero to try to push you out of lane, you should be probably okay, maybe a bit behind in farm if are denied/pushed to the tower. All in all you might see a gold advantage in the long run.
    • The jungler would have pretty serious problems if its not one of the 'power' junglers that can sustain themselves without runes. Again, by picking a self-sustaining jungler like Warwick or Lee Sin, you will be okay, albeit slower than the enemy jungler. If the enemy does not capitalize on your slower jungling by a lot (for example by stealing several camps, or just clearing much faster and ganking afterwards), GP/10 might yield a long-term advantage if you get yourself in the game.
    • The mid hero will face serious problems, I think - starting with 22 (possibly more) AP less at level 1, the other AP will have the advantage in almost any trade, sending you back more often, thus limiting your gold and your XP.
    • Bot lane will face grave problems - without the usual 15 bonus AD and armor, the enemy will have an easy time denying you XP and gold, actually gaining an advantage over you.


    The main problem is, GP/10 runes set you behind in the early game, and as I heard from almost every tournament caster: If you are ahead, you get further head.

    If the enemy does not pressure/punish you for your runes, you will probably be fine, but that would mean a VERY passive laning phase, on which one cannot count all the time. Some kits/builds allow for some GP/10 items or even runes, but the more aggressive roles (AP mid, AD carry) dont have this luxury.

    Edit: Stupid me - dont know from where I got Gold per 5...
    Last edited by Abakus; 2012-02-10 at 08:24 AM.

  6. - Top - End - #156
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    Default Re: League of Legends XXX: Must be Summoner Level 18 to View

    Quote Originally Posted by Acromos View Post
    I see professional games go five or even ten minutes with no kills. By that time, you're already looking at something like 5-600 gold pr. champion.

    Think of every time anyone ever talks about a champion snowballing.

    Snowballing, very precisely, is this: Getting more gold for more items for more kills for more gold for more items. And so on.

    Lets do the math differently for a moment. It's 12000 gold. How many kills must the opposing team get in order to match that? That's a variable, I know, but it's still a lot of kills.

    And it comes at the price of 15 ap and a slightly slower early game.

    I'm still not saying this would work. As I initially asked - has it been tried? Because I'm certainly not going to dismiss the idea out of hand, based on opinion alone.


    And yeah, mass GP10 has been a meta before GP10 was nerfed.
    Last edited by efdf; 2012-02-10 at 08:18 AM.

  7. - Top - End - #157
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    Default Re: League of Legends XXX: Must be Summoner Level 18 to View

    Quote Originally Posted by efdf View Post
    And yeah, mass GP10 has been a meta before GP10 was nerfed.
    Philostooooones. Or HoG on Rammus when it gave armor...

    On an unrelated note, I kind of miss Sunfire stacking. It was dumb and boring at the time, but funny in retrospect.
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  8. - Top - End - #158
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    Default Re: League of Legends XXX: Must be Summoner Level 18 to View

    Been playing a lot of games on Vlad recently. He's such a fun champ to play! And he's actually quite strong once you pick up a few items. and 15% damage on the ult... my god that's nice.

    Plus his general demeanour is pretty awesome

  9. - Top - End - #159
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    Default Re: League of Legends XXX: Must be Summoner Level 18 to View

    So i have talked to more people on mumble and heard a general consensuses that double elimination is the best compromise between a lengthy time consuming swiss and a fast potentially one sided single elimination so unless someone very strongly objects thats the plan. Also Djinn has confirmed that he will probably be unable for Saturday. Now we could move to Sunday if anyone absolutely demands we have him. But with all the different time zones involved someone is gonna wind up staying up late for this and i would hate to make someone lose sleep on a work night. Mario has offered cover djinns slot, and if he cant then i would like to have one more backup. The one rule of the backup commentator is they have to have a solid grasp of the game at a higher level than i do. Ill be the color to the color commentary so what im looking for most is someone to make sure the commentary is as correct as it is amusing.

    Also does anyone know if lolrecorder is still crashing the game. And could anyone help me figure out how to set up streaming on a free place so that people interested can check out the games.
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  10. - Top - End - #160
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    Default Re: League of Legends XXX: Must be Summoner Level 18 to View

    I demand Djinn!

    But on a more serious note, somewhere saturday evening I will most likely be leaving, since I have been invited to a Burlesque Freak-out party in amsterdam.
    Sunday however, would be much, much more convenient since I don't have anything scheduled, except a birthday I'm most likely not attending anyway.
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  11. - Top - End - #161
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    Default Re: League of Legends XXX: Must be Summoner Level 18 to View

    I would recommend Livestream, simply for its ease of setup and use. While it's usually considered a worse option compared to things like TwitchTV or BlipTV, you shouldn't run into problems considering the small handful of live viewers we'll probably get (from my experience, you only start running into troubles with it in the thousands of viewers).

    As for LoLRecorder, according to their website the latest version of the program fixes the crashing issues, so just use that.

  12. - Top - End - #162
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    Default Re: League of Legends XXX: Must be Summoner Level 18 to View

    As I said before, I don't mind helping with the commentating. I don't play ranked due to having found more idiots there than even in normal games, but I seem to hold up my end of the team when I play with Djinn and co.
    Quote Originally Posted by Deophaun View Post
    It doesn't so much as demean the celestial monkey's existence, so much as fulfill it. Without the ability to be summoned to set off traps, retrieve objects from dangerous situations, and all and all be a party's guinea pig, the Celestial Monkey would languish in obscurity in the MM and do nothing more legendary than eat celestial bananas.
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  13. - Top - End - #163
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    Default Re: League of Legends XXX: Must be Summoner Level 18 to View

    Just wondering, if I want to play with folks from the forums, which part of the mumble server should I be going to? Or should I try to organise something here first?

  14. - Top - End - #164
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    Default Re: League of Legends XXX: Must be Summoner Level 18 to View

    Quote Originally Posted by Anonomuss View Post
    Just wondering, if I want to play with folks from the forums, which part of the mumble server should I be going to? Or should I try to organise something here first?
    I've played with them a few times and I still don't know. I just bum about in the room the has the most people until a game gets started that's looking for players.
    Quote Originally Posted by Deophaun View Post
    It doesn't so much as demean the celestial monkey's existence, so much as fulfill it. Without the ability to be summoned to set off traps, retrieve objects from dangerous situations, and all and all be a party's guinea pig, the Celestial Monkey would languish in obscurity in the MM and do nothing more legendary than eat celestial bananas.
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  15. - Top - End - #165
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    Default Re: League of Legends XXX: Must be Summoner Level 18 to View

    Quote Originally Posted by Eurus View Post
    On an unrelated note, I kind of miss Sunfire stacking. It was dumb and boring at the time, but funny in retrospect.
    It was quite funny to stack sunfires on eve or twitch and then invisi harass all day long.

  16. - Top - End - #166
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    Default Re: League of Legends XXX: Must be Summoner Level 18 to View

    Quote Originally Posted by Anonomuss View Post
    Just wondering, if I want to play with folks from the forums, which part of the mumble server should I be going to? Or should I try to organise something here first?
    Doesn't really matter. Just try to hunt people down.

    The channel names aren't really anything more than general guidelines (at best), so it's best to just find a concentration of people and/or hop from channel to channel and ask around.

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  17. - Top - End - #167
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    Default Re: League of Legends XXX: Must be Summoner Level 18 to View

    I haveth, just realizethed, that I-th, cannotith, play in the tournyeth.
    But yes, I have to drop out, sorry!
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  18. - Top - End - #168
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    Default Re: League of Legends XXX: Must be Summoner Level 18 to View

    *looks at the title*

    Butbutbut! Awwww.
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    Default Re: League of Legends XXX: Must be Summoner Level 18 to View

    Quote Originally Posted by Acromos View Post
    Watching tournaments, a fairly sure pattern emerges: The team that has the most gold wil win.

    There are exceptions, of course, but once one team has a significant advantage, they are rare.

    So the logic seems to be that the team that plays the best makes the most gold. But I'm wondering if the logic can be reversed on this one. As in, can the team that makes the most gold, play best?

    In other words, has any professional team ever tried going all in on gold/10, and how did it work out? And by all in I mean everyone takes gold quints, masteries and builds at least one gold/10 item.
    This strategy used to work when Gold/10 items like HoG stacked and heroes like Jarvan had tremendous base stats (Read: OP). It was also good on supports who were pretty gold starved at the time (and still are!). So for instance, Soraka can buy 2 HoGs, 2 Kage's, boots, slot for wards, and an oracles. That's a pretty epic build if you combine it with gold/10 quints and the greed mastery.

    A personal example: I was playing Amumu and I got counterjungled hard, fell behind, etc. I stacked 4 HoGs and managed to get a pretty decent build as a result. We also won that game in what was a rather epic comeback.

    Quote Originally Posted by Darth Mario View Post
    Sorry, you seem to have confused fun with pain and suffering.
    I loved DotA. Like, I loved that game so much. In my opinion, DotA is just as good of a competitive game as LoL. I think LoL is better for solo queue because most heroes can get a decent bit of farm and its more forgiving to mistakes like dying in lane (even though this still is pretty damn bad). But if I knew that I could regularly play DotA2 with 4 other guys more regularly than I play LoL, I play it.

    Believe me: 5v5 Inhouses when everyone is pretty much at an equal skill and no one is that serious is the greatest thing ever (its much better than our GITP Inhouses, where we have far to many tryhards who want to beat up on the "noobs")

    Quote Originally Posted by Dragonus45 View Post
    So i have talked to more people on mumble and heard a general consensuses that double elimination is the best compromise between a lengthy time consuming swiss and a fast potentially one sided single elimination so unless someone very strongly objects thats the plan. Also Djinn has confirmed that he will probably be unable for Saturday. Now we could move to Sunday if anyone absolutely demands we have him. But with all the different time zones involved someone is gonna wind up staying up late for this and i would hate to make someone lose sleep on a work night. Mario has offered cover djinns slot, and if he cant then i would like to have one more backup. The one rule of the backup commentator is they have to have a solid grasp of the game at a higher level than i do. Ill be the color to the color commentary so what im looking for most is someone to make sure the commentary is as correct as it is amusing.
    I can't play tonight. I can play Saturday Night. I can play Sunday night as well. I think, actually, I'd prefer it if I played Sunday night, but I know that people have work etc... I can literally stay up till 6AM to finish this thing on Saturday. And I can start at around 11AM (I will need a break to get food though ).

    As to my team: I actually don't know. I think its best if we play Saturday just cuz... its consistent with our plan. :P

    As to commentary: Again, I could try my hand at commentary if needed.

    Also does anyone know if lolrecorder is still crashing the game. And could anyone help me figure out how to set up streaming on a free place so that people interested can check out the games.
    I think its fixed. Dunno.
    Last edited by toasty; 2012-02-10 at 12:20 PM.

  20. - Top - End - #170
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    Default Re: League of Legends XXX: Must be Summoner Level 18 to View

    Quote Originally Posted by Morph Bark View Post
    *looks at the title*

    Butbutbut! Awwww.
    Don't worry. If people were able to get into my 9th thread without paying me 6300 IP, then you can get in without being summoner level 18.
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  21. - Top - End - #171

    Default Re: League of Legends XXX: Must be Summoner Level 18 to View

    Wait, toasty is complaining about tryhards?

  22. - Top - End - #172
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    Default Re: League of Legends XXX: Must be Summoner Level 18 to View

    Hmm, apparently Cait + Blitz is a super kill lane. If blitz EVER lands a hook then cait can lay a trap while the enemy is popped into the air by powerfist, thus leading to something like 6 seconds of CC which is plenty of time for a kill.

    Combine with some jungler that has CC (jarven, WW, maoki) and you can get upwards of 8 or 10 seconds of pure CC which can kill just about anyone.


    I watched Guardman Bob duo queue with someone and every game was just 5+ kills in laning phase.
    Last edited by LordShotGun; 2012-02-10 at 01:12 PM.

  23. - Top - End - #173

    Default Re: League of Legends XXX: Must be Summoner Level 18 to View

    I imagine it is similar to Caitlyn/Taric.

    EDIT: Actually, if you're really snazzy, pull them onto a Caitlyn trap, then knock them up as it ends. Caitlyn then puts another trap under their feet.
    Last edited by llawafos; 2012-02-10 at 01:15 PM.

  24. - Top - End - #174
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    Default Re: League of Legends XXX: Must be Summoner Level 18 to View

    mhm, by the by, I can do the tourney games anytime, I just need to know in advanced

  25. - Top - End - #175
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    Default Re: League of Legends XXX: Must be Summoner Level 18 to View

    I guess ill just repeat this since it apperently got overlooked.

    Lord_khaine got a smurf on the NA server by the creative name of Lordkhaine.
    thnx to Starwoof for the fine avatar

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    Default Re: League of Legends XXX: Must be Summoner Level 18 to View

    Quote Originally Posted by llawafos View Post
    Wait, toasty is complaining about tryhards?
    Hardly. i'm complaining about what happens when tryhards play against causals. its not fun for anyone really.

  27. - Top - End - #177
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    Default Re: League of Legends XXX: Must be Summoner Level 18 to View

    AARRRRGGGG!!!!

    Having to start over from the deepest pits of elo hell, without any of my champions SUCK SO MUCH!!!!
    Last edited by lord_khaine; 2012-02-10 at 06:22 PM.
    thnx to Starwoof for the fine avatar

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    Default Re: League of Legends XXX: Must be Summoner Level 18 to View

    Quote Originally Posted by lord_khaine View Post
    AARRRRGGGG!!!!

    Having to start over from the deepest pits of elo hell, without any of my champions SUCK SO MUCH!!!!
    Whhhhhhyyyyyy???
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    Default Re: League of Legends XXX: Must be Summoner Level 18 to View

    Quote Originally Posted by toasty View Post
    Hardly. i'm complaining about what happens when tryhards play against causals. its not fun for anyone really.
    Y'know, I think this is something that heroes of newerth (I know, I KNOW, hush) did right. (even if it is a relatively new addition.) If you do badly in a normal game of HoN, yes, you can expect to be abused. That's because "normal" games are HoN's equivalent of ranked solo queue. However, you can get away from most of the ragers by playing casual mode instead, wherein virtually no one cares enough to rage, because it's casual mode, man. In League of Legends you can get raged at for feeding in a bot match.

    That said, I deleted Heroes of Newerth at the same time I deleted LoL.
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    Default Re: League of Legends XXX: Must be Summoner Level 18 to View

    Quote Originally Posted by lord_khaine View Post
    AARRRRGGGG!!!!

    Having to start over from the deepest pits of elo hell, without any of my champions SUCK SO MUCH!!!!
    I had similar feelings when I switched to the NA server.

    Apart from the 'elo hell' thing.

    Oh, and I didn't really care about runes, so only masteries were annoying.
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