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    Jan 2008

    Default Warhammer 40K Tabletop XV: "More People Should Be Punched In The Head."

    40k-in-the-Playground presents...
    Cheesegear's Newbie Guide on How to pick Warhammer 40K army
    by Cheesegear and GitP contributors

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    Disclaimer: This is not a guide to say which armies are 'better' than other armies. Except in hyperbole. The 'stars' notation is for what Newbies should play. By no means does this mean that you shouldn't play Chaos Daemons. It means that if you're a new player and don't fully understand the rules to the game, it might be hard to make Daemons work.

    Any unit that gets specifically mentioned is a stand-out unit, or will represent a 'must-have' unit that the army has.

    General Advice for all armies;
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    • Where possible, you should always talk to a GW Staff Member. No, you don't have to actually listen to or do anything they say. But, you should at least talk to them so they can point you in at least a general direction. Don't buy anything on your first trip into the store. GW Staff are very persuasive, and you can - or will - often end up buying something you don't even want.
    • If and when you do finally decide on an army, play a few games in an actual GW Store using the Store's models. Otherwise, where possible, use proxy models. This will give you a basic understanding of most of the rules and the turn sequence and a general idea of how your army-of-choice plays. Or, at least give you an idea that an army or unit that you thought was cool, really isn't. Or maybe that particular army just isn't for you. And that unit that 'looks cool' doesn't fit your play style.
    • Read a Codex. Whatever gets said on the internet, means absolutely nothing if you don't have a Codex to understand what's being said. This ties into the above in that it's kind of important that you have played a few games and know the rules.
    • GW doesn't mention it all that much, but; You don't have to use your army's Codex for your army. For example; It's perfectly reasonable to, say, use the Chaos Space Marine Codex to represent a 1st Company of Loyalist Marines. You can, in fact, use Imperial Guard models to represent Tau, or Eldar. Just so long as your models look suitably awesome and your models conform to the rules of a different list (the WYSIWYG rule). If you can also give a background justification - or 'fluffy' reason - for why your Imperial Guard are wielding Shuriken or Pulse Rifles; Even better!
    • In regards to the above; 'Counts as' models can generally be shown to be a fluffy reason for why you have what you have. So, maybe your Imperial Guard regiment has a lot of Ogryns. You can use an Ogryn-holding-a-Lascannon as your 'Heavy Weapon Team'. As long as it's WYSIWYG, and at least makes a passing attempt at conforming to the rules (such as base size/shape), nobody cares. However, GW really doesn't like it when you come into their store and start using a different company's miniatures to play a GW game. However, making a scratch-build from Green Stuff and Plasticard is totally okay. Just so long as you aren't giving their competitors money, eh?
    • With that said; Painting, Green Stuff, Plasticard and Conversions in general, the only way to get better at it, is to practice. Start easy, start small. Start with adding cloaks to troops. Large, rectangular pieces of Green Stuff. Easy. Maybe you'll be confident to add textures. Ability comes with practice. And, there are literally dozens of tutorials to be found on YouTube. And hundreds of tutorials just about everywhere else.
    • Less is more. Don't try to equip your unit to do everything. Assign your units to fulfill a role, and let them do it. Don't waste points on things you aren't going to use.
    • Bodies are far more important than Wargear. Do not spend 100 extra points on Wargear, if you could otherwise spend 100 points on buying a whole unit. Wargear is not a substitute for models. Well, it is. But, it's a poor substitute.
    • In regards to the above two points, very rarely, should you spend more than 200 points on a single model (such as an HQ model), or 300 points on a single unit.
    • Troops. Win. Games. Do not, under any circumstances, skimp out on your Troops selection. More often than not they are the cheapest unit in the Codex, and, Troops are the only units who can capture an objective. Any unit can contest an objective, but, only Troops can claim objectives. All contesting objectives will do is get you is a Draw.
    • Assault on Black Reach. Bad for Space Marine players. Good for Ork Players.
    • Vehicles and You.
    • Cheesegear's Speaking Of Tournaments.... General themes to consider when attending a competitive arena.
    • To Tailor Your List Or Not To Tailor
    • Wraith's Handy-Dandy Guide to Painting and Assembling an Army
    • Closet_Skeleton says:
      "Every Troops choice you spend on a non-Scoring unit is Troops choice wasted."
    • How To Write An Army List | Sample


    Guide to Armies
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    Space Marines (Codex Marines, SMs):
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    Pros: Space Marines are the eponymous 40K army. They are the army by which all other armies are judged. Just about all their units can be outfitted in many different ways to fulfill many different roles (but, in regards to General Advice, they should only try to do one thing at a time). With few exceptions, the entire army selection is plastic for easy conversions and assembly (and, most of the metal models you don't even need). As plastics, the army is also relatively cheap to buy.
    GW Staff are extremely knowledgeable on all things Space Marine.
    Troops unit choice with the ability to Infiltrate and have Sniper Rifles.
    Power Armour and Bolters.

    Cons: Honestly, none. Save for the common misinformation that GW Staff will tell you to get you to buy certain units and sets (like Assault on Black Reach). But, this is by no means bad. As a Space Marine is a Space Marine. And pretty much all the units in the Codex can be useful one way or another.
    One such example is that there is a growing proportion of Space Marine players who feel - despite the fluff and the statline - that Scout Squads are superior to Tactical Squads (the reason why is outside the scope of this guide).
    The only truly bad thing about Space Marines, is that everybody has them. GW sells them at every opportunity. All starter sets ever produced by GW has contained Space Marines as one of the 'learner' armies. By extension, a lot of people turn to Space Marines because that's what they learned the game with, but, what they don't realise, is that the Assault on Black Reach starter kit is weak.

    Recommendation for Newbs; *****. But the Assault on Black Reach kit isn't a good start to a Space Marine army. GW likes misinformation.
    * or ** depending on whether or not you care about being 'just like everyone else'.
    What's so bad about AoBR?

    Codex Space Marines theoretically allows you to build 7 different 'themes' of Space Marines (even though it's 6) based around what colours and which Special Characters you like. However, any special character can be used in any Chapter, painted any colour that you choose. So, really, what Chapter you choose is kind of irrelevant since you can use other Chapters' special characters anyway.

    The common belief is that 'Space Marines is Space Marines'. They all have Power Armour and Bolters. All of the above applies to the below;
    Dark Angels: You will need the Errata/FAQ. Essentially a carbon copy of Codex Marines with the option to play Ravenwing (all bikes) or Deathwing (all Terminators). Both of which, for the most part, can be done much better by Codex: Space Marines and either Grey Knights/Space Wolves, respectively. *
    Black Templars: You will need the Errata/FAQ. Slightly more focused on close combat. With some unique rules. ***
    Space Wolves: Space Wolves are actually the 'most fair' list out of all the Space Marine variants. They're a solid list. They have no actual 'bad' or 'trap' units. ****
    Blood Angels: The only real difference in the List is more options to take Jump Packs, Fast vehicles, and a slight bonus to Deep Striking. Staggeringly similar to Codex Marines otherwise and you wont actually lose much by playing Blood Angels. ****

    What if you like one particular unit more than the others? Which Codex would be best for you?


    Chaos Space Marines (Chaos Marines, CSMs):
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    Like Space Marines, but Evil. So, just about everything that applies to Space Marines applies to Chaos Space Marines.
    Pros: Chaos Space Marines are slightly more focused on close combat than their Imperial counterparts - but, by no means to they have to be. CSMs are not necessarily 'better' than regular SMs. Just...Different. Each faction has different toys at their disposal.
    There are a variety of different ways you can outfit your squads, and it's kind of difficult to find any two CSM armies the same.
    Power Armour and Bolters.
    Converting your 'Starter Box' Space Marine army to Chaos Marines is fairly easy. Just add spikes and arrows and mutations.

    Cons: There are options in the Codex. Too many options some say. It's very easy to get confused on what or what not to get for your squads and characters. And it's even easier to go overboard on wargear and skills and the like (remember; Wargear != Bodies).
    CSMs are also a fairly commonly seen army as they cater to the people who want to play Space Marines, but, think that 'Evil is Cool'. Some do consider who they get associated with as a bad thing.
    The 'some of everything' approach that a lot of new players have when collecting their armies doesn't really work for Chaos Marines. Most of the time, you're best off going all-out on one or two of the Cult units (below).

    Recommendation for Newbies: ****

    Chaos Space Marines (Cults):

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    Contributions supplied by Winterwind, DaedalusMkV and unknowingly by Myatar Panwar

    World Eaters/Khorne-based/Beserkers:
    Lots of attacks...Aaand...That's about it. Khorne Beserkers have WS 5 and also gain Furious Charge, meaning that when Assaulting, they're hitting and wounding most things on 3s and 2/3s. Their initiative 5 (when Assaulting) helps them a lot when they can strike before most enemies and kill them before they get attacks back. Khorne Berzerkers are fairly good at what they do, but, their individual unit effectiveness is directly proportional to their opponent's armour save.
    Meaning, that, for the most part, you need lots of Beserkers. Lots. Khorne Beserker armies also don't function very well without Rhinos, as their only ranged weapons are Pistols. So, this is a lot of currency. On top of which; As they lack ranged weapons, Obliterators, Vindicators and Defilers are almost required for the army.
    Khorne Lords and Daemon Princes are considered to be the least efficient. The Daemon Weapon gives you double the chance to hurt yourself. As well as +2D6 Power Weapon attacks is pretty much overkill. You don't really need that many.
    Their special character - Kharn - is quite good though.
    *** You will need Rhinos. Luckily, Berzerkers come in boxes of 12 (which is more than the other Cult units) and are plastic. Which is good.

    Thousand Sons/Tzeentch-based:
    All models with the Mark of Tzeentch gain an Invulnerable save. Or, their save gets improved if they already have one. This makes Tzeentch-based lists very tough to kill on the outset.
    Onto specialised units; Thousand Sons are a Troop choice that comes with a 4+ invulnerable save, and have AP3 Bolters. Perfect for objective-squatting. This also makes them deadly in ranged firefights - and their invulnerable save makes them hard to kill on the return. Being Slow and Purposeful, it's a good idea to get as much use our their Bolters as you can get.
    Thousand Sons also have a Sorcerer as their 'Sergeant'. Chaos Psychic Powers being as they are, this is quite good, as most 'shooting' powers tend to be AP3 or better, or allow no save at all. The Sorcerer also comes with a Force Weapon (add Warptime for fun). Meaning units with an Independent Character kind of need to think twice before Assaulting Thousand Sons units.
    However, units without Independent Characters (that you can't target), and other dedicated Assault units will have an easy time. As Thousand Sons are the worst Assault unit in the Codex. But, this isn't saying a whole lot, as they're still Space Marines.
    Tzeentch Daemon Princes and Sorcerers are quite good, able to choose and use two powers in the same turn. As well as receiving a better Invulnerable save. Tzeentch Lords are 'okay'. The Tzeentch special character - Ahriman - is pretty good. But, far too overpoints'd.
    *** Thousand Sons boxes are expensive. But, you get plenty in a box.

    Emperor's Children/Slaanesh-based/Noise Marines:
    Marks of Slaanesh add to Initiative. This means pretty much everything in the CSM army will be functioning at Initiative 5. If you're unit holds Power Weapons, you can do a lot of damage before your opponent even gets to attack.
    Noise Marines. Are. Amazing. Sonic Blasters are essentially Storm Bolters that get an extra shot if you're standing still. A Blastmaster, is a S8, AP3 Blast weapon that causes Pinning. Do you want yet? Just before Assaulting, the Noise Marine Champion has access to a S5, AP3 Flamer. This will kill things dead. Then Assault, at Initiative 5 (if you're opponent didn't fail their Morale check from you shooting the crap out of them, that is) and you can do some serious damage.
    Daemon Princes and Sorcerers gain Lash of Submission. Usually considered one of the more unfair psychic powers as it allows you to move your opponent's models. Where? Into Dangerous Terrain, out of their precious cover, towards your own models into Assault range, or even just moving their Heavy Weapon team out of LoS.
    Chaos Lords with Blissgiver are perfect Character killers as with 3+D6 attacks and Initiative 6, they only need to cause one wound (with a 'Power Weapon') to kill pretty much anything they want.
    Lucius the Eternal is just as good as - if not better than - Kharn. And doesn't even cost that many points.
    **** The Noise Marine box doesn't come with with many Sonic Blasters. They are, however, available in bulk from Mail Order. But, they're not that important. You're really only getting Noise Marines for Blastmasters and Doom Sirens.

    Death Guard/Nurgle-based/Plague Marines:
    Extra Toughness. Might not seem like much. But, it's (usually) the most expensive Mark for units that can take it for a reason. Works best on models in Terminator Armour or models on Bikes.
    Plauge Marines are pretty much exactly the same as regular Chaos Marines, except with Toughness 5 and Feel No Pain. They're extremely hard to kill. On top of which, they have Defensive Grenades. And that's pretty good. Aaand...That's about it actually. Not much can be said about Plague Marines except exactly that.
    The Mark of Nurgle is mostly wasted on Daemon Princes as they don't really need the extra Toughness compared to what else they could take and Sorcerers on gain access to Nurgle's Rot, which, again, compared to other powers, isn't that great. As Nurgle's Rot works best in close combat. But, Nurgle Sorcerers only get one psychic power per turn. So, it's Nova, or use the Force Weapon.
    On Chaos Lords (especially in Terminator Armour), the Mark of Nurgle is alright. Giving access to a reasonably good Daemon Weapon.
    The special character for Death Guard is Typhus. He's pretty damn good. Opinion appears to be divided on whether or not he's worth the points. He has Wind of Chaos, and Nurgle's Rot (otherwise known as Nurgle's Nova). And he auto-passes all psychic tests when using those powers. As well as having the Nurgle-based Daemon Weapon, that also counts as a Force Weapon. As well as Terminator Armour and Defensive Grenades. Whether you like him or not is your choice.
    **** Plague Marines are pretty boring for options. But, Toughness 5 and Feel No Pain are really, really good. And the Mark of Nurgle is usually the most expensive Mark for those who would get any real use out of it.


    Tyranids ('Nids):
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    If you think of the movie Alien, or Starship Troopers, Tyranids aren't far off the mark.
    Pros: Tyranids are primarily seen as a close combat swarm army. The big Tyranids are extremely customisable and immensely powerful in whatever role you want to give them (but you should only choose one role at a time, remember), and, the smaller Tyranids come in massive numbers designed to make your opponent crap themselves on just how many bodies you can put on the table. The Tyranids also possess one of the most deadly close combat units in the entire game.
    A Troops choice that can Infiltrate.
    Most of the army is plastic. And, many of the blister models you only need a few of. So, per box, Tyranids are pretty cheap. Also, the Tyranid Battleforce is generally considered what you need, it's definitely recommended by most of the internet that you should get at least two.

    Cons: Like CSMs, it's often possible to overload your Monstrous Creatures with too many biomorphs (wargear), which gets expensive. Fast. And, many of the smaller Tyranids are designed for one unchangeable role. The smaller Tyranids can't adapt their units for what they want to do. A Tyranid army is usually seen as very shooty-heavy, or very assault-heavy. It very - extremely rarely - can be both. Often, trying to be both is actually a detriment to the Tyranid army.

    Without the bigger Tyranids to back them up, the smaller Tyranids suddenly become a lot more vulnerable, partly because they already have low toughness and high armour saves to begin with. Therefore, you may need to spend a bit of money on the larger, more expensive models.
    As a swarm army, box-per-box, you also don't get very many points in each box. This means you'll probably have to end up spending a lot of money to get a decent amount of points onto the table.

    Also, like SMs and CSMs, if a 14 year old kid isn't playing SMs or CSMs, then they're playing Tyranids.

    Recommendation for Newbies: ** to ****. Depending on how much real-world currency you have to spend. If you don't have a lot of money, you wont be able to field a lot of bodies or acquire the larger Monstrous Creatures. If you can field ~50 Termagants and 50 Hormagaunts per battle and have Monstrous Creatures to back them up...Good.

    How to build your Tyranid Army.


    Eldar:
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    Elves. In SPAAACE!
    Pros: The Eldar boast a 'swiss army knife' army. They have a unit for everything and every unit can do their job well. Each and every unit looks vastly different to every other unit, and are actually supposed to be painted in different colours to each other. So, you have a huge variety of models and colours. If variety is important to you.
    Most of the army can Fleet. All Eldar tanks are Fast, Skimmers, and the army contains Eldar Jetbikes (which have different rules to 'normal' Jetbikes). In short, the Eldar army boasts speed and maneuverability.
    As with their Infantry, they also have HQ units to fit certain roles. An Autarch can be outfitted to suit almost any battlefield role. Eldar Farseers and Seer Councils are powerful psykers. And the Avatar is a close combat Monster (literally).
    A lot of the metal models in the range come in reasonable sized boxes at a (fairly) reasonable price. The good news is, you usually don't need too many of the metal models.
    Troops unit choice with the ability to Infiltrate and have Sniper Rifles.
    A Wraithlord is one of the scariest models in the game. An absurdly high Toughness and a reasonable armour save. And can kill troops and heavy armour with equal ease. Often at the same time. It's strength 10 and Monstrous Creature status also means it can rip apart tanks even when it's guns are suited to killing Infantry. It even causes Instant Death on most Infantry that attack it. Including a lot of HQ characters.
    Wraithguard are like smaller Wraithlords high Strength and Toughness, with a good save and toting around deadly guns.
    ...It's possible to build an entire army out of Wraithguard and Wraithlords.

    Cons: Low 'Elf' Toughness.
    The sheer amount of variety can sometimes make it hard to decide which units to take. Especially since some of the units in the Eldar army overlap, but, achieve their role in slightly different ways. And it's these 'slightly different ways' that can make or break the unit depending on your opponent. Some particular units are even useless or near-useless depending on your opponent.
    Every unit fills a role. And is unadaptive. You can't manipulate any squad to do anything other than what it was designed to do (except Dire Avengers). And, in smaller point games where you can't afford to take every unit you want, you'll know that you're missing that unit. Because nothing else you have will be able to perform as well as the missing unit.
    It's these missing units that make of most of the metal models that will be in your army. You'll need the metal models.
    Individual Wraithguard units can often be prohibitively expensive in currency.
    Taking too many Wraithlords in your army will have people crying for curdled dairy products. That is; Cheese. In lower point games, just one Wraithlord is enough for "OMG! Cheese!" cries.

    Recommendation for Newbies: *** or ****. The Eldar army is an army where it's hard - but not impossible - to go wrong. With such a huge mandatory variety in models, an 'I want every unit' mindset (common in newbies) is actually beneficial to the Eldar army setup.

    Wraith teaches you where you should go with your Eldar;
    HQ and Elites
    Troops and Fast Attack (and Wave Serpent)
    Heavy Support and Special Characters


    Dark Eldar (DE):
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    Like Eldar, but evil (there's an argument that Dark Eldar are more evil than 'regular Chaos'). But much, much different in play-style from Eldar, than SM's are from CSM's.

    Stuff About HQ Choices
    Stuff About Everything Else
    Stuff About Special Characters
    Cheesegear says: "The Dark Eldar one is...Fairly out of date. Sliscus rules. Razorwings kick arse and Venoms are potentially the best Transport in the game - oh man was I wrong on that score!"

    Recommendation for Newbies: ** or ***. The Dark Eldar are easy to learn, but hard to master. But, once mastered...The Dark Eldar tend to either win by a significant margin (often by Turn 3 or 4), or lose spectacularly (by Turn 5 or 6).


    Tau:
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    With help provided by Nameless Ghost, Ricky S and Selrahc

    Tau are the archetypal alien race. Very progressive technology and a near-utopic society. Also draws several parallels to Mechs and Exosuits - if you like that sort of thing.
    Pros: Firepower. You want a really 'Shooty' army? You pick Tau.
    Like Necrons and Space Marines, you actually can't go very far wrong with the 'normal' Troop choice; Fire Warriors. They have a decent save of 4+, so they aren't dying en masse to Bolter fire. And they boast the best base-Troop weapon in the game. Yes. Better than Bolters. Easily. Their Transport (Devilfish), similarly, for it's points cost is one of the best in the game. Second only to the Eldar Wave Serpent. You can field a very respectable army fielding nothing but Fire Warriors and Devilfish - just bring some anti-armour weapons.

    HQ and Elites choices field some very respectable units in the form of Crisis Suits and Stealth Teams. Effectively your Mechs/Exosuits/Gears. With their ability to take a wide array of guns, on top of their ability to fire at multiple units at the same time, it makes them a very nice support unit for your Fire Warriors. Or, even a front-line squadron if you're brave enough. Crisis Suits also possess Jet Packs, rather than Jump Packs. Which is a really cool bonus to have. As it allows you to move in the Assault phase for move-shoot-move combos like Eldar Jetbikes.

    Tau Heavy Support though is what you're really looking at. Broadsides are exactly what their name suggests if you're into Naval Warfare. Broadsides carry Railguns; High-strength guns designed to annihilate whatever they're pointed at. And they do it well too.
    This author would be remiss if he didn't also mention Hammerheads. One of the better tanks in the game.

    Cons: Tau fold like paper in Assault. What they do in Shooting, they lose out in Assault. Even worse than Necrons. Low Weapon Skill, low Toughness, low Initiative, and no access to Power Weapons or weapons that don't allow saves in Assault. Their decent armour saves them somewhat, but not much.

    The Tau also have more than their fair share of 'trap' units. Which, outside of Themed Lists, don't actually do very well.
    Like taking Kroot. Kroot are better in Assault than pretty much anything else in the army, but, that's not really saying much. You're best off with more Fire Warriors.
    Ethereals are extremely good. But, your opponent will pretty much always target him first. And then he becomes a massive liability for your army.

    Like Tyranids and Chaos Marines, it's kind of hard not to go overboard on Wargear options on your Crisis Suits, because they're all just so good. Leaving you fewer points to spend on Fire Warriors. Not only that, Crisis Suits are not Terminators, and don't do real well under fire.

    Heavy Support choices are expensive in points. Problem is, if you don't take them, you're seriously missing out on some really impressive firepower options.

    Recommendation for Newbs; *** The Battleforce is one of the better ones around, so long as you remember that the Kroot are essentially 'free'; If you didn't pay currency for them, you're under no obligation to use them. Replace them with Fire Warriors as soon as you can. The Tau way of battle also requires a lot of tactics to use well (similar to Eldar), in that you need to prioritise fire and occasionally you have no choice but to sacrifice the odd unit here and there. Tau often play very static roles, unless you shell out extra currency for Devilfish. Which isn't always the best thing in the world. And no. There really isn't a way around being bad at Assault. The best thing you can hope for is that you've shot the crap out of your enemy before they get there.

    Ricky S tells us how to get started for the Greater Good.


    Chaos Daemons (Daemons, CDs)
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    Daemons. They come out of the Warp to eat your face. That's about all you need to know.
    Pros: Chaos Daemons, as an army, possess some of the more powerful units in the game. Strong HQs, strong Elites, reasonably impressive Fast Attack, and some strong Heavy Support in the form of Soul Grinders and Daemon Princes.
    The entire army is Invulnerable and sports Eternal Warrior and Fearless on every single unit except the Soul Grinder. But, as a Daemon, the Soul Grinder gets some pretty impressive things on its own. So, Power Weapons and other low AP ranged weapons don't really have any extra effect on Daemons. Your opponent is basically wasting points.
    Very powerful Assault army if you can get it there. It only takes three or four models to wipe out an opposing unit of 10 even on a fairly average day.
    Very fast army. A number of Beasts/Cavalry and Jump Infantry units, and the whole army Deep Strikes.
    High diversity and distinctive imagery of all it's units.
    Most of the army is plastic (or soon will be), which keeps currency costs low.

    Cons: *Deep Breath* Well, deployment. Before any game even starts, you're at a disadvantage. You can't actually plan with Chaos Daemons. Before the game starts, divide your army in half. Half your army arrives on Turn 1 via Deep Strike, and the rest of the army trickles in over the rest of the game.

    ...The really annoying part, is that you don't actually get to pick which half you get on the first turn. The only way to make a 'plan' with Daemons, is to have symmetrical halves, so, no matter what comes down, you've got what you want. Which means, all that diversity in models goes out the window as you now need to duplicate every unit. Leading to 'cookie cutter' units. Which nobody really likes - unless you want that.

    Yeah, the entire army arrives via Deep Strike and reserves. It's both good and bad, it's more often bad. Since Chaos Daemons have a real lack of shooting. The opposite of Tau, who have low Assault. But, due to Deep Striking, and the disallowance of Assault, your army will get shot at before you get to Assault with your units.

    This is solved by 'aggressive Deep Striking', which is ignoring terrain difficulties, and deploying as close to your enemy as you possibly can so you can Assault next turn. This means that you could take casualties from Difficult Terrain, and following Shooting phase from your opponent. To do this, you need lots of models, which costs currency.

    The Codex - like Eldar - has a higher-than-normal amount of unit redundancy. Some of those diverse units that you like, just wont be taken because there are other units that can do the same job, better. Like Necrons, Daemons' Elites and Fast Attack choices are mostly just more powerful versions of the Troops units. Because of this reason, Daemons' Troops are pretty lackluster in comparison to everything else. Except that you have to take Troops...well, because they're your Troops. Which is even worse because those Troops units aren't exactly cheap in points.

    With such a low save, Fearless is quite often a hindrance. And, unlike Orks or Tyranids, Daemons don't usually have the numbers to keep up a sustained losing-assault. But, Daemons don't usually lose Assault (even with such small unit sizes). So, you've got that.

    Recommendation for Newbies: * The deployment rules are like nothing a new player would be able to deal with. Not to mention the complexity and tactics that you need with a Chaos Daemons army in order to win.
    ** If you really like the imagery and painting/conversion opportunities that Chaos Daemons presents.
    Sadly, Daemons are more Cons than Pros unless you build your list a specific way. Which you - a new player - probably wont do.


    Grey Knights (GKs):
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    Super-Massive-Long-Posts-of-DOOOOOOM provided by Cheesegear.


    Recommendation for Newbies: ** or ***
    On the one hand, Grey Knights are very hard to build properly. There's lots of weird and wonderful wargear and squads to choose from and they all look so good.... But it's easy to pick all the wrong ones, for all the wrong reasons, and end up paying through the nose for the privelage.

    On the other: Get the balance right, pick the right units with the right wargear and send them to do the right tasks, and they can easily break almost any other army in the game apart with surprisingly little effort. Grey Knights are tremendously powerful if you use them correctly. They are utterly unforgiving if you get it wrong.


    The Necrons:
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    Tomb Kings IN SPAAAAAAAACE! Legions of soulless, undying automatons cruising around the galaxy, atomizing everything in their path. Except for the senile, insane ones, who invite you to tea and then atomize you after you've finished the biscuits. What's not to like?

    What Winterwind Thinks About Necrons.
    What Cheesegear Thinks About Necrons.
    What Cheesegear Thinks About Necron Special Characters.

    Recommendation for Newbies: ***
    Necrons are tough, with good armour and good guns, so it's hard to really use them "badly". It requires a bit of a knack to get the best out of the units in the book though, as well as needing a very careful understanding of their many special rules work and interact.


    Orks: *** to ***** depending on how much currency you have (horde army). Extra points because it's the more useful of the AoBR Starter Armies. So, a decent Ork army actually comes stock in the 'newbie box'.

    Imperial Guard (IG): * to ***** depending on how much currency you have. A ***** IG army is the single-most expensive army in the entire game. Even more than the old, fully-metal Daemonhunters.
    About Imperial Guard Tanks.


    Still to come;
    Imperial Guard [2009], Witch Hunters [2003], Sisters of Battle [2011 - WD edition] and Orks [2009].
    These armies I have lot of experience with. Send PMs if you believe you have advice that I might leave out.

    Actually looking for, or things I can't write myself;
    More General Advice (I think I've covered most of it).

    SEND PMs. Don't Derail Thread.
    Please submit suggestions for additions to the guide to my PM box as to keep from derailing the thread. Also, try and keep it general. Specifics can be delved into after the aspiring player has picked an army.


    This hobby breeds opinions like no tomorrow. Please read.

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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XV: "More People Should Be Punched In The Head."

    Been thinking of making an illegal all monstrous creature tyranid list. It'd be for a joke game me and an Ork friend of mine plan on playing. He'd roll out his Stompa and some nobs or tankbustas and I'd roll out a Trygon Prime/Swarmlord/OOE/Tyrannofex. Should I get rid of the prime for another Carnifex/Tyrannofex or is it fine the way it is?
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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XV: "More People Should Be Punched In The Head."

    Quote Originally Posted by Cheesegear View Post
    But I'm still upside-down.
    Can't argue with that.

    So, in keeping with the new thread title, I'd like to improve my orky 'ead-stompin' skills, and I'd appreciate it if people would offer advice based on what they've done or seen done with Da Boyz that really worked (or failed hilariously, those are good too).

    Currently I've got the following:
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    Big Boyz
    2 Warbosses (AoBR)
    1 Big Mek, converting from another AoBR Warboss, WIP
    10 Nobz, give or take. Various equipment.
    9 Nob Warbikers, converted from Deffkoptas. Various equipment.

    Boyz & Grots
    60 Choppa Boyz
    40 Shoota Boyz
    6 Big Shootaz
    2 Burna Boyz
    8 Kommandos + Boss Snikrot
    10 Grotz with 1 Runtherd
    1 Grot Tank or Killa Kan
    1 Trukk

    Builds/Conversions Sitting Around Unfinished
    3 Grot Tanks
    3 Burna Boyz
    6 Biker Boyz. For reference, some of my Biker Nobz can be Boyz if I say they are.
    1 Meganob, pieces of which were sacrificed to the glory of my Nob Bikers, but I could always rebuild the rest of him to be awesome.
    4 Warbuggies
    1 Battlewagon (with 3 Papercraft BW's hanging around as well)

    And piles of bits, many of them ork, including all sorts of arms and bodies and weapons. I'm a bit short on legs, but I'll make do.


    I'm perfectly willing to buy or build (preferably build) anything I might need to make the army work, and I know that Orks are FAR from Tier 1, but if anyone had any ideas to at least compete on the same levels as Vanilla Marines and Necrons, I'd appreciate it.

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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XV: "More People Should Be Punched In The Head."

    From what you've posted, you have just enough models to pull this off.

    More seriously, does your Big Mek have a Kustom Force Field? A 5+ cover save beats a 6+ T-shirt any day.
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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XV: "More People Should Be Punched In The Head."

    Quote Originally Posted by Teln View Post
    More seriously, does your Big Mek have a Kustom Force Field? A 5+ cover save beats a 6+ T-shirt any day.
    Hey! Guard wear T-shirts! Those are 5+!

    I'm not sure what we should call a 6+

    Anyway. New Thread!


    Now, Relevant Discussion. Keep in mind any space wolves army I discuss, until I say otherwise, is purely theoretical. But, anyway, what do you guys think of this as the initial force?

    [10 Gray Hunters (2 Plasmaguns)
    10 Gray Hunters (2 Meltaguns) <== Drop pod here?
    5 Wolf Scouts (Wargear?)]<- Battleforce
    Space Wolves Rune Priest
    5 Devastators Long Fangs
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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XV: "More People Should Be Punched In The Head."

    Quote Originally Posted by Squark View Post
    Hey! Guard wear T-shirts! Those are 5+!
    Except Catachans, who have 5+ MANLY ABS.
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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XV: "More People Should Be Punched In The Head."

    Quote Originally Posted by Teln View Post
    From what you've posted, you have just enough models to pull this off.

    More seriously, does your Big Mek have a Kustom Force Field? A 5+ cover save beats a 6+ T-shirt any day.
    Wow, that's a lot of boyz in one unit. I'd love to field that.

    And yes, of course, the Big Mek has a KFF. However, I've not had much luck with it protecting my vehicles (despite the save being 4+). My boys do benefit a little once they've been kicked out of their Battlewagons, but since they only hop out on purpose when they're going to assault, and the KFF doesn't work on units locked in assault...I've honestly been considering not running it. Maybe field a Shokk Attack Gun instead--then I have no reason to expect victory, and can concentrate on goofing around and Zoink!-ing into trouble.

    Quote Originally Posted by Squark View Post
    [Space Wolves List]
    That looks pretty good to me. Granted, I'm no Space Wolf afficionado, but I know what their strengths are. I believe one of the better set-ups for Wolf Scouts is this:

    Wolf Scouts 5, 115pts
    -Mark of the Wulfen, Meltagun, Power Weapon

    As much as I love my Drop Pod, I would suggest you look into using more traditional transport first, i.e., a pair of Rhinos to ferry your Hunters into the fray. If you don't own any yet, I would definitely suggest you buy Razorbacks, because you can just leave the big weapons off when they're pretending to be Rhinos.

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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XV: "More People Should Be Punched In The Head."

    Quote Originally Posted by Tychris1 View Post
    Been thinking of making an illegal all monstrous creature tyranid list. It'd be for a joke game me and an Ork friend of mine plan on playing. He'd roll out his Stompa and some nobs or tankbustas and I'd roll out a Trygon Prime/Swarmlord/OOE/Tyrannofex. Should I get rid of the prime for another Carnifex/Tyrannofex or is it fine the way it is?
    Do Stompas have D-weapons? If they do all your MCs will turn to crap. I don't really know what to take. What's the points limit? Is there an FO Chart or not? Is this for Apocalypse or do you just need to put an equivalent amount of points to a Stompa on the table? What's happening?

    Quote Originally Posted by Hootman View Post
    I'm perfectly willing to buy or build (preferably build) anything I might need to make the army work, and I know that Orks are FAR from Tier 1, but if anyone had any ideas to at least compete on the same levels as Vanilla Marines and Necrons, I'd appreciate it.
    I can't comment on what you've got already, seems about right. I'm uncertain how I would incorporate what you're planning to build into your current list. But here's some ideas;

    2 Warbosses + 2 Bike Nob Squads.
    2 Big Meks with KFFs and as many Boyz as you can handle.

    As many Lootas as you can possibly fit. If you aren't using Bike Nobz (some people don't, anymore), have 30 causes a lot of problems for most armies.

    Stormboyz. With Zagstruk. Never without.
    Lots of Koptas.
    Lots and lots (minimum 9) Killa Kans. Only if you've got the two Big Meks.
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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XV: "More People Should Be Punched In The Head."

    Quote Originally Posted by Cheesegear View Post
    Do Stompas have D-weapons? If they do all your MCs will turn to crap. I don't really know what to take. What's the points limit? Is there an FO Chart or not? Is this for Apocalypse or do you just need to put an equivalent amount of points to a Stompa on the table? What's happening?
    Default Stompas can't. Mekboy or Kustom Stompas can by way of Da Gaze of Mork (which requires a roll of 11 or 12 for Strength) or the Bursta Cannon (36", StrD, AP2, 7" blast).

    Sounds like they're playing Spearhead, but not.
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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XV: "More People Should Be Punched In The Head."

    Quote Originally Posted by Squark View Post
    Hey! Guard wear T-shirts! Those are 5+!

    I'm not sure what we should call a 6+
    Shirts versus Skins?

    Anyways, I'm posting the 'finished' version of the Glossary here. If it never gets mentioned again and sinks into obscurity, so be it, but if it proves useful then at least it's on the front page and thus easy to find.

    Also, rereading the OP made me realise that I forgot to add the definition for 'Cheese'. A gross oversight, considering how our attitudes tend to go in these threads....

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    Alpha-strike
    Verb; To effectively win the game in the first turn by inflicting a massively disproportionate amount of damage on the enemy from which they cannot recover. Can refer either to the tactic specifically, or as a theme around which an army could be built.

    'Ard Boys
    Noun; A type of formal Tournament where the kid gloves are well and truley 'off'. Whereas an ordinary Tournament expects every player to try to win, an 'Ard Boys tournament expects every player to take advantage of every unit, ability and rule to it's most merciless extreme in the clamour for victory; you will find no 'experimental' lists and there will be no sub-par units in play, only those with a proven kill-ratio. Generally considered to be the pinnacle of tounament play in terms of difficulty and tactical acumen.

    ATSKNF
    Abbreviation; And They Shall Know No Fear - special rule common to most kinds of Space Marines.

    BBB
    Abbreviation; Big Black Book, ie; the 5th Edition's Main Rule Book.

    Blendernaught
    Abbreviation; A Blood Angels Dreadnought that is equipped with two Blood Talons, due to the exponential way in which their attacks can accumulate and thus kill (or 'blend') a large number of enemy models in a single turn.

    Cheese
    Noun or Adjective; A reference to an army or unit as 'cheese' is a criticism against how 'unfair' it is perceived to be.
    While the item in question might be legal according to the rules of the game and the appropriate Codex, being 'cheesey' suggests that the unit is considered 'too powerful' (eg: it has a superior statline for no perceived extra cost, it costs a lot less than another unit that can achieve similar effects, or has a special ability that is very easy to use but very difficult for your opponent to counteract) or - in the case of an army list - that the owner has forsaken all fluff and thematic preferences in order to include only the 'most powerful' units available.

    Note: Being considered 'cheese' are often highly subjective, and it's most common use is as an insult. Please be careful not to use it without good reason, and certainly not just because you were beaten by a better general and deriding his well-crafted army makes you feel better.

    Crunch
    Noun; General term to refer to the rules and mechanics of the game as printed in the Rule Books. If a situation is described as 'crunchy', it means that it's resolution relies heavily (if not, soley) upon interpretation and application of the games' rules mechanics and taking nothing else into account (See also R.a.W.).

    "Earn Back Your Points Cost"
    Verb (Archaic); In previous editions of 40k, the victor of a game could be decided by Victory Points - for every 100 points of your enemy that you destroyed (or was Falling Back when the game ended), you gained 1 point and whichever player had the most would win the game. To say that a unit would "earn back their points" was an approximation of potential for that unit to kill a higher points value than the unit itself had cost, and thus earn a greater return for their owning player. In the current edition this expression is no longer applied literally, however it still remains in use as a generic way of describing a unit that will kill enough opponents or claim enough objectives to "earn" it's place in an army list, as opposed to one that will be expected to turn out an average or sub-par performance. Units that are more expensive or less effective would be said to "fail to earn back it's points cost".

    Exchange Rate
    Shorthand; The expected ratio of points that a unit costs, versus what it could reasonably be expected to accomplish (usually a direct point-to-point comparison of enemy models killed). A unit with a poor exchange rate is either too expensive, or hasn't killed enough enemies/seized enough objectives to justify it's points cost which could have been more efficiently spent on other units.

    Fluff
    Noun; The 'story' behind the game that has little-to-no baring on the actual rules of the game. Also known as 'flavour text' or 'back story'. Polar opposite of 'crunch'.

    FNP
    Abbreviation; Feel No Pain. Universal special rule, detailed in the Main Rule Book.

    FOC
    Abbreviation: Force Organisation Chart.

    Footslog
    Verb; To make your troops move on foot (usually long distances) without the aid of Dedicated Transports, Jump Packs, Deep Striking or other similar tactics.

    Force Multiply
    Verb; A unit (often HQ choice) that serves to make other units better in ways other than just adding to their firepower or close combat resolution, such as by making them Scoring units or making their ordinary special rules more efficient. They make your army "greater than the sum of it's parts".

    Green Tide
    Noun; An Ork army that consists of a large number of infantry.

    Grimdark
    Adjective; Derived from the opening quote of the 5th Edition Rulebook, "In the grim darkness of the far future, there is only war". Used as a label for any of the particularly depressing and/or outrageously morbid themes and scenes that occur in the 40k fluff. Often cited in parody, the phrase may or may not be a criticism depending on both 1) the author of the piece of fluff in question and 2) the position of the author of the post who cites the subject as being grimdark.
    EG: "A crumbling Empire ruled by a corpse is under attack from it's own traitorous superhuman soldiers, soulless automotons whose only motivation is the annihilation of life even as a concept, an innummerable horde of mega-evolved Space Locusts, a psychopathic race of bloodthirsty fungus and the very denizens of Hell itself whose least unpleasant God-Devil eats Hope.... And it's about to get worse? How very grimdark."

    Magic Hat
    Noun; Usually a Psychic Hood, though often used as shorthand for any piece of wargear or special rules that are used to negate enemy Psychic Powers.

    Mathhammer
    Noun; The art of trying to predict how a game will go by employing statistics.
    EG: If your unit has 20 close combat attacks, with a 50% chance of hitting and 50% chance of wounding, you will be expecting to kill 5 enemy models and thus determining whether or not this will be a 'good' tactical move to make.

    Mech
    Abbreviation; Shorthand for 'Mechanised', which is any army list that makes extensive use of vehicles, Walkers or anything else with an Armour Value rather than a Toughness stat.

    MEQ
    Abbreviation; Marine EQuivalent. Any army, the majority of whose units are approximately T4 with 3+ armour saves. Just like Space Marines.

    MRB
    Abbreviation; Main Rule Book. See also: 'BBB'

    MSU
    Abbreviation; Multiple Small Units.

    Plaserback
    Abbreviation; A popular variant of the Space Marine Razorback tank, which has been equipped with a Lascannon & Twin-Linked Plasmagun turret.

    R.a.I.
    Abbreviation; "Rules As Intended". To interpret the games' rules mechanics in such a way as to make allowances for 'unwritten' situations, or to allow for targets that seems 'fair' or 'sensible' and yet are not specifically mentioned by the literal word of the rules (See also: R.a.W.)

    R.a.W.
    Abbreviation; "Rules as Written". To follow the games' rules literally, without interpretation or account for their 'intended' purpose, whether or not such an action makes sense or is perceived as 'fair' according to the R.a.I.

    Rifleman
    Abbreviation; A Dreadnought that is equipped with two Assault Cannons, two Autocannons, or a mixed combination of the two, to be used for long ranged support.

    S&P
    Abbreviation; Slow & Purposeful. Universal special rule, detailed in the Main Rule Book.

    Spam
    Verb or Suffix; To use the same unit or piece of wargear multiple times in a single army. Named in honour of a particularly popular 'Monty Python' joke.
    EG: "To win this battle, I am going to spam Plasma guns in all of my units. This army is mostly Plasmaspam."

    Suicide-
    Prefix; A unit that is sent to fulfill a specific task, after which it's owned fully expects it to be destroyed, can be known as "Suicide-[unit]". Because apparently, in the grimdarkness of the 41st Millenium, "Kamikaze-[unit]" is considered anti-PC.
    EG: Very often appears applied to Space Marine Sternguard ("Suicide-Sternguard") equipped with a large number of combi-meltas arriving via a Drop Pod in the midst of the enemy army and splitting into two combat squads, with the purpose of taking down priority targets (usually two vehicles). Almost guaranteed to inflict a great deal of damage in the turn in which they arrive and - due to their precarious position in the middle of the enemy deployment zone - almost guaranteed to be wiped out soon after.

    Tailoring
    Verb; To build an army in order to defeat a specific opponent. See the associated article for more details.

    Theoryhammer
    Noun; Akin to Mathhammer, Theoryhammer essentially the measure of a unit or army's effectiveness 'on paper'. Taking into consideration all of the units available in the Codex, the idea is to imagine a number of different scenarios and comparing how well a chosen army will cope with them in a plausible way; strong armies are generally the ones that can handle the most number of different scenarios in an optimum number of units or points cost. Similar, a strong unit is one that can remain effective even when faced with a variety of different situations.
    The danger of theoryhammer is that it often gets stretched to extremes in order to falsely declare an army 'good'. For example, Codex Eldar can provide a different unit that can cope with any situation that the enemy can be expected to create, and thus is theoretically a good army - however, in order for this to be true one would have to include at least one of each unit (which would cost thousands of points to play and hundreds of dollars to collect and paint) and is not legal according to the FOC. As such, while Eldar are in theory a good army, theoryhammer can be applied badly to make them seem better than they really are.

    -Wing
    Suffix; 'Deathwing' is a specific type of Space Marine army that revolves around taking as many Terminators as possible and making them Scoring units, via a force multiplying HQ Choice. In honour of this, any army built to this format is often known as "(Key Component)wing".
    EG: Draigowing (An army comprising of lots of Terminators, led by force-multipling HQ Choice Kaldor Draigo), Loganwing (Space Wolves, led by Logan Grimnir)

    Addendum: One notable exception from the above is "Nipplewing" - a variant army list created using Codex: Blood Angels that comprises mostly of Sanguinary Guard and is usually led by Commander Dante. So called as a combined parody of the "-wing" suffix and two unusually prominent features found on Sanguinary Guard models.....

    Wonder Twins (The)
    Noun; Affectionate nickname for Eldrad Ulthuan and Prince Yriel - Special Characters from Codex: Eldar - especially when fielded in both HQ slots at the same time. Can sometimes refer to a pair of Farseers in the same role. Named in honour of a children's cartoon featuring a pair of pointy-eared superheroes who use magic powers to save the day, and as a reference to the characters' generally high rate of effectiveness and reliance on 'magic' (ie: psychic powers) for success.

    WYSIWYG
    Abbreviation; What You See Is What You Get (pronounced 'Wizzywig'). Detailed in the Main Rule Book, this refers to how closely a model physically resembles the equipment that has been assigned to it in the army list. High-profile Tournaments often insist upon 100% WYSIWYG accuracy.

    -Zilla
    Suffix; An army list that makes use of multiple Monstrous Creatures. (Usually this applies to Tyranid armies - colloquially known as 'Nidzilla - as they have access to a large number of such units, though a few other armies can also attempt it.)
    Last edited by Wraith; 2012-02-13 at 05:55 PM.
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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XV: "More People Should Be Punched In The Head."

    I'm still happy with my bit of the OP, its pretty rare for me to be content with something I wrote so I'm happy.

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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XV: "More People Should Be Punched In The Head."

    Quote Originally Posted by Cheesegear View Post
    Do Stompas have D-weapons? If they do all your MCs will turn to crap. I don't really know what to take. What's the points limit? Is there an FO Chart or not? Is this for Apocalypse or do you just need to put an equivalent amount of points to a Stompa on the table? What's happening?
    It's a default stompa so it has no D weapons. The points limit is 1,000 for him and 1,200 for me (Due to the nature of Titans of being super ****ing hard). We've decided to throw the FO chart out of the window and only need to put down the points limit for our units (No apocalypse). Deployment type is spearhead and the objective of the game is to destroy the Stompa. I win by killing it, he wins if it isn't dead. The only rules we have to abide by for Units is that I can only take Monstrous Creatures and he can only take a Stompa and 1 squad of his choice.
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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XV: "More People Should Be Punched In The Head."

    Stompa vs Nidzilla. Sounds interesting.

    Be sure to let us know how it goes Tychris.
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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XV: "More People Should Be Punched In The Head."

    Are crusching claws still usefull? bring crushing claws. Or those Forgeworld scary things.

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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XV: "More People Should Be Punched In The Head."

    Quote Originally Posted by Hootman View Post
    Wow, that's a lot of boyz in one unit. I'd love to field that.

    And yes, of course, the Big Mek has a KFF. However, I've not had much luck with it protecting my vehicles (despite the save being 4+). My boys do benefit a little once they've been kicked out of their Battlewagons, but since they only hop out on purpose when they're going to assault, and the KFF doesn't work on units locked in assault...I've honestly been considering not running it. Maybe field a Shokk Attack Gun instead--then I have no reason to expect victory, and can concentrate on goofing around and Zoink!-ing into trouble.
    Our last local tournament was won by an Ork player with a Shokk Attack Gun. Perfect score, too; he picked up the secondary and tertiary objectives in every game. And he's not really a good player; his dice were just absurdly hot that day.
    "Courage is the complement of fear. A fearless man cannot be courageous. He is also a fool." -- Robert Heinlein


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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XV: "More People Should Be Punched In The Head."

    Quote Originally Posted by Hootman View Post
    As much as I love my Drop Pod, I would suggest you look into using more traditional transport first, i.e., a pair of Rhinos to ferry your Hunters into the fray. If you don't own any yet, I would definitely suggest you buy Razorbacks, because you can just leave the big weapons off when they're pretending to be Rhinos.
    The reason I chose the drop pod was simple. It's already in the battleforce.
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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XV: "More People Should Be Punched In The Head."

    Quote Originally Posted by Renegade Paladin View Post
    Our last local tournament was won by an Ork player with a Shokk Attack Gun. Perfect score, too; he picked up the secondary and tertiary objectives in every game. And he's not really a good player; his dice were just absurdly hot that day.
    In my group we have always called it Shokk Attack Fun, because there hasn't been a bad game with that thing on board.
    On more serious note, You don't have to have really good luck with dices, average scores work just as well. It's just a matter of not-rolling-that-numbers, which depend on situation. It's a lot like psykers, you know how they roll 11 or 12 leadership just at that "you're kidding me?" moment?
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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XV: "More People Should Be Punched In The Head."

    Quote Originally Posted by Tychris1 View Post
    It's a default stompa so it has no D weapons.
    D'oh, I had a complait brain-fart earlier. Stompas have a Titan CCW by default, so if it's not knocked out their close combat attacks are at StrD.
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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XV: "More People Should Be Punched In The Head."

    So how about this:

    HQ
    Coteaz 100

    Ordo Xenos Inquisitor Rourke 88
    Rad Grenades, dude.
    Combi Bolter-melta
    Psyker- Force Sword, hammerhand
    Power Armour (Odds are he'll be diving into the fray to make use of the hammerhand and grenades)

    ELITES
    Purifier squad -198
    2 extra purifiers
    2 Psycannons
    5 Halberds

    Vindicare assassin-145

    Techpriest, or extra purifier squad here?

    TROOPS
    Henchman squad- 140
    2 Jokaero
    10 warriors
    -Storm Bolters

    Henchman squad- 140
    2 Jokaero
    10 warriors
    -Storm Bolters

    Henchman squad- 140
    2 Jokaero
    10 warriors
    -Storm Bolters

    Main problem i'll have with these guys is making the Jokaero look anything resembling decent.

    Henchman squad- 125
    3 Crusaders
    9 Warriors
    -3 Meltaguns
    -6 Storm bolters

    Henchman squad- 125
    3 Crusaders
    9 Warriors
    -3 Meltaguns
    -6 Storm bolters

    And then either a strike squad or more, CC-orientated henchmen. Or terminators, because terminators.

    FAST ATTACK

    Interceptors, if anything? If i use Stormravens, i'm proxying in my inquisitorial vendetta. I hate the Stormraven model. It looks like a bucket with wings.

    HEAVY SUPPORT

    Again, i have no idea. I don't really want vehicles too much. They'd just get shot to bits because of so few.

    Total so far: 1201 points.

    Is this any good? A techpriest and a strike squad could round that off nicely, i reckon. Or splurge it on transport vehicles.

    It's worth noting that my metagame is, well, thick. Two boards worth of terrain were glued onto one, meaning we have one super-awesome board where you have to set up your vehicles on the skysheild landing pad, because there is literally nowhere else big enough*, and one board with whatever trees we can pinch from the fantasy players. Its pretty much "all cover or none".

    *I tell a lie, but i do recall running into problems when every road was filled with a immobilised chimera.
    Last edited by LeSwordfish; 2012-02-11 at 11:48 AM.
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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XV: "More People Should Be Punched In The Head."

    Well, a Stomraven never goes badly with close range henchmen squads but Chimeras may be better for this. I don't know what they cost but you should be able to get at least 4 in and have a bit of change from 1500 points. Then 2 of the monkey squads sets up their deckchairs on an objective while the Purifiers and the melta henchman and the remaining squad with monkeys goes and blows things up. 4 vehicles is quite enough to not lose them all at once. Of course, I'm not sure if Purifiers can use Chimeras, that would be a job for someone with the codex to hand.
    Last edited by Timberwolf; 2012-02-11 at 12:01 PM.


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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XV: "More People Should Be Punched In The Head."

    Quote Originally Posted by Timberwolf View Post
    Of course, I'm not sure if Purifiers can use Chimeras, that would be a job for someone with the codex to hand.
    Purifiers can only ride a rhino or razorback.

    Four chimeras sets me back 120 points. So i could take them and a strike squad. That really is going to cut into my budget, currency-wise though. A stormraven-proxy and two rhinos is better, but likely less effective. Not to mention the rhinos are too small for my henchmen squads.
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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XV: "More People Should Be Punched In The Head."

    Quote Originally Posted by Squark View Post
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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XV: "More People Should Be Punched In The Head."

    Quote Originally Posted by Ninjaman View Post
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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XV: "More People Should Be Punched In The Head."

    Quote Originally Posted by LeSwordfish View Post
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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XV: "More People Should Be Punched In The Head."

    Quote Originally Posted by LeSwordfish View Post
    Purifiers can only ride a rhino or razorback.
    Not quite exact. They can ride a Chimera just fine, they just can't start the game inside one, as the only way to get Chimeras is to buy them as Dedicated Transports for Inquisitorial Henchmen squads. You can, however, get a Chimera for a Henchmen squad, and have it start empty right next to the Purifiers, having them enter it in their first turn.

    In fact, even Terminators can ride in Chimeras, as Chimeras lack the special rule of Rhinos and Razorbacks that prevents them from doing so.
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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XV: "More People Should Be Punched In The Head."

    Quote Originally Posted by Tychris1 View Post
    It's a default stompa so it has no D weapons. The points limit is 1,000 for him and 1,200 for me (Due to the nature of Titans of being super ****ing hard).
    Quote Originally Posted by Zorg View Post
    D'oh, I had a complait brain-fart earlier. Stompas have a Titan CCW by default, so if it's not knocked out their close combat attacks are at StrD.
    In that case, you don't want to be hitting it with in Close Combat until you take out that weapon. Otherwise every hit is one kill. And for MCs, that's really, really bad.

    You'll need Harpies or Tyrannofii for the S10 Venom Cannons, and just pepper it until you get rid of that Titan Weapon, then go in for attacks. Other than that, go to town. Carnifii are the only reliable Anti-Armour you have and they'll also be one-shotting Nobz so get as many of those as you can. You'll need at least one Tyrant or Trygon Prime for the Synapse if you don't want Instinctive Behaviour all the time.
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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XV: "More People Should Be Punched In The Head."

    Alright my fellow 40k addicts, there is a 2000pt tournament on the 18th. The tournament is three rounds, each round featuring one of the three missions from the main rule book. So I知 looking for feedback on the list I知 working on.

    Blood Angels
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    HQ Mephiston 250
    EL Sanguinary Priests (x3) 240pts
    • Infernus Pistol, Power Weapon

    EL Furioso Dreadnought 165pts
    • Heavy Flamer, Magna-Grapple, Extra Armour

    EL Sternguard Squad (5 Astartes) 230pts
    • x5 Combi-Melta, x1 Power Fist
    • Drop Pod with Deathwind Missile Launcher

    TR Scout Squads (5 Scouts) 100pts
    • x4 Sniper Rifles, x1 Missile Launcher, Camo Cloaks

    TR Scout Squads (5 Scouts) 100pts
    • x4 Sniper Rifles, x1 Missile Launcher, Camo Cloaks

    TR Assault Squad (10 Astartes) 500pts
    • x1 Infernus Pistol, x1 Power Fist, x2 Melta guns, No Jump Packs
    • Land Raider Crusader, Multi-Melta, Storm Bolter, Extra Armour

    TR Tactical Squad (10 Astartes) 170pts
    • x1 Missile Launcher, x1 Flamer

    HS Stormraven Gunship 245pts
    • Twin-Multi-Melta, Hurricane Bolters, Extra Armour

    Total: 2000pts
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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XV: "More People Should Be Punched In The Head."

    Quote Originally Posted by Ceridan View Post
    So I知 looking for feedback on the list I知 working on.
    Honestly, it's seems a little all over the place. There is some good combat stuff in there, but not enough for a heavy hitting assault as it is, and while there are units that can shoot, they aren't going to shoot awfully well.

    Also, you have 2 heavy vehicles that carry the bulk of your force. With 2 lucky shots, your assault force could end up having to march across the field.

    If you want to pursue that route, it might be worth investing in a Librarian for Shield to give your vehicles a bit more protection. I would also recommend swapping the tactical squad for something more assault focused, even if it is just another Assault squad in a transport.
    Also, for fewer points you could swap the Sternguard for Honour Guard with 4 actual Melta guns and jump packs. They have their own Priest bubble, are 1 less Kill Point and can deep strike in without risking the Drop pod "show up on turn 1 when there is no-one to shoot at" syndrome.
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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XV: "More People Should Be Punched In The Head."

    Quote Originally Posted by Ceridan View Post
    Alright my fellow 40k addicts, there is a 2000pt tournament on the 18th. The tournament is three rounds, each round featuring one of the three missions from the main rule book. So I知 looking for feedback on the list I知 working on.
    Ok its looks like its all over the place. I am used to seeing very spammy lists with multiple units of the same thing but that doesnt necessarily mean your list wont work.

    What models do you currently have? Have you had any practise games if you already own them?

    I would change a few things in your current set up anyway.

    -Drop all the Infernus Pistols, they are really expensive for a single 6 inch shot. You can have heaps of meltas which are cheaper and better.
    -Drop the deathwind Missile Launcher and the powerfist. If 5 guys are assaulted they are going to be killed especially if you are using them as suicide sternguard which it seems to be what you are doing.
    -Make the scout squad one unit, you can always combat squad it later if you need them to capture more points.

    By dropping these things you have more points and can afford another unit of scouts or something else. Bodies over equipment every time. The main thing though is to have practise games. Even if you have a subpar list as long as you know how it works you can win. That is why armies like tau or orks can still win at tournaments because the player is very familiar with them.

    If you want to win for sure I would take an army something like this. It has a heap of models and the power to take down anything the enemy has.

    -Librarian - 100pts
    -Assault Squad, 2x melta, powerfist, Rhino - 250pts
    -Assault Squad, 2x melta, powerfist, Rhino - 250pts
    -Assault Squad, 2x melta, powerfist, Rhino - 250pts
    -Assault Squad, 2x melta, powerfist, Rhino - 250pts
    -Assault Squad, 2x melta, powerfist, Rhino - 250pts
    -Assault Squad, 2x melta, powerfist, Rhino - 250pts
    -Devastator Squad, 4x Missile Launcher - 130pts
    -Devastator Squad, 4x Missile Launcher - 130pts
    -Devastator Squad, 4x Missile Launcher - 130pts
    1990pts

    Of course having an army list like this would cost about $1000 (Aus).
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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XV: "More People Should Be Punched In The Head."

    So a friend of mine expressed interest in the Tyranids a long time ago, but was unable to spare the time and money to get into the hobby. Hence, ever since, I have been giving him a mini here, a few minis there, on all sorts of occasions, painted myself.

    Since his birthday is coming up, I wanted to give him a pack of Termagaunts. Now the issue: What is the proper weapon to give to Termagaunts? Leaving them with fleshborers allows for them to be used as Tervigon spawns, but does it make sense to equip Termagaunts that actually start on the table with costlier weapons? Devourers, for instance? Or should I just go with fleshborers instead?
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