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    Ettin in the Playground
     
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    Default Pathfinder Grab Bag Competition Chat Thread

    Welcome Ladies and Gentleman to the Giant in the Playground Pathfinder Grab Bag competition chat thread. The purpose of this thread is to house any questions, comments or discussions concerning the contest itself and/or the entries for this month's festivities.

    As the title denotes, this is a contest exclusively for Pathfinder material. If you are more of a fan of Dungeons and Dragons (specifically the 3.X editions), please check out one of these wonderful contests:



    This month's contest is...







    Previous Competitions
    Creepy Crawlers
    Path to Castle Ravenloft
    Playgrounders Assemble!
    A Homebrew by any other Name...
    Semper Fi! Do or Die!
    A Day in the Life
    Saturday Morning Nostalgia
    Fear Itself
    On the Origins of Species
    Have a Holly, Jolly Brewmas!
    Oaths and Resolutions
    Homebrew! I choose you!
    Of Dragons and Dungeons
    Spell it Out for Us
    Gamer's Gambit
    Once More; with Feeling!
    Last edited by Tanuki Tales; 2013-07-15 at 12:06 PM.

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    Default Re: Pathfinder Grab Bag Competition Chat Thread

    Past Entries Archive


    Base Classes

    {table=head]Name|Creator|Competition|Notes
    Contractor 1Contractor 2Contractor 3Contractor 4|Milo v3|PGBC XI: Oaths and Resolutions|First Place Winner
    Duel Summoner|Morph Bark|PGBC XII: Homebrew! I choose you!|Incomplete
    Living Hive|Milo v3|PGBC VIII: Fear Itself|First Place Winner
    Monster Trainer|Xammux|PGBC XII: Homebrew! I choose you!|First Place Winner
    Necro-Ranger|masterstalker2|PGBC IV: A Homebrew by any other Name...|Incomplete
    Olympian|Midwoka|PGBC III: Playgrounders Assemble|First Place Winner and Most Likely to See Play
    Pact Bound Warrior 1 Pact Bound Warrior 2|DawnbringerSO|PGBC XI: Oaths and Resolutions|Second Place Winner and Most Likely to See Play
    Pokemaster|Kane0|PGBC XII: Homebrew! I choose you!|Incomplete
    Sanguine Inquisitor|Milo v3|PGBC II: The Path to Castle Ravenloft|First Place Winner
    The Shaman|tallonRook|PGBC IX: On the Origins of Species|First Place Winner
    Spider Blood Assassin|Milo v3|PGBC I: Creepy Crawlers|First Place Winner
    Sumran Warcaster|Milo v3|PGBC V: Semper Fi! Do or Die!|Third Place Winner
    Swarmlord|Tarvon000|PGBC I: Creepy Crawlers|-
    Swift Kinetic|Milo v3|PGBC VII: Saturday Morning Nostalgia|-
    Tainted Scion of Venom|Milo v3|PGBC III: Playgrounders Assemble|Second Place Winner; counterpart to Spider Blood Assassin
    Titan of Steel|masterstalker2|PGBC III: Playgrounders Assemble|Incomplete
    Unamed Class|4th Number|PGBC XII: Homebrew! I choose you!|Incomplete[/table]

    Monsters

    {table=head]Name|Creator|Competition|Notes
    Atavist|grimgrin|PGBC IX: On the Origins of Species|Third Place Winner and Judge's Choice
    Forgotten Memory|SamBurke|PGBC XIII: Of Dragons and Dungeons|First Place Winner
    Grey Men|TARDIS|PGBC II: The Path to Castle Ravenloft|Second Place Winner and Most Likely to See Play
    Happy Hulk|Inuyasha|PGBC XIII: Of Dragons and Dungeons|Second Place Winner
    Hollowed Spirit|Milo v3|PGBC XII: Homebrew! I choose you!|Incomplete
    Myrmaton|Midwoka|PGBC V: Semper Fi! Do or Die!|Second Place Winner and Most Likely to See Play
    Present Surprise|ShadowFireLance|PGBC X: Have a Holly, Jolly Brewmas!|Incomplete
    Quirksteed|Kane0|PGBC IX: On the Origins of Species|Second Place Winner, Most Likely to See Play and Most Unique Entry
    Steelix|DawnbringerSO|PGBC XII: Homebrew! I choose you!|Second Place Winner
    Wasplings|Golden Ladybug|PGBC III: Playgrounders Assemble!|Third Place Winner
    [/table]

    Prestige Classes

    {table=head]Name|Creator|Competition|Notes
    Alchemical Hunter|Warpwolf16|PGBC VII: Saturday Morning Nostalgia|-
    Axiopact|Kane0|PGBC XI: Oaths and Resolutions|Runner Up and Most Unique Entry
    Defender of the North|Razanir|PGBC X: Have a Holly, Jolly Brewmas!|Second Place Winner
    Fear Eater|Mathias1313|PGBC VIII: Fear Itself|Invalidated
    Fearmonger|Kane0|PGBC VIII: Fear Itself|Second Place Winner
    The Iron Man|ErrantX|PGBC VII: Saturday Morning Nostalgia|First Place Winner and Most Likely to See Play
    Khan|Kon Lesh|PGBC IV: A Homebrew by any other Name...|Second Place Winner
    Legion of One|Realms of Chaos|PGBC V: Semper Fi! Do or Die!|First Place Winner
    Pack Master|BelGareth|PGBC I: Creepy Crawlers|-
    Paranormal Seeker|Golden Ladybug|PGBC II: The Path to Castle Ravenloft|Third Place Winner
    Psionic Dancer|Razanir|PGBC XII: Homebrew! I choose you!|Incomplete
    Returner of Old|Milo v3|PGBC IX: On the Origins of Species|Incomplete
    Rocket Knight|Midwoka|PGBC VII: Saturday Morning Nostalgia|Second Place Winner
    Solarsworn|4th Number|PGBC XI: Oaths and Resolutions|Third Place Winner and Judge's Choice
    Uncontrollable Titan|devilingreye|PGBC VII: Saturday Morning Nostalgia|Third Place Winner
    Winter Warrior|4th Number|PGBC X: Have a Holly, Jolly Brewmas!|First Place Winner, Most Likely to See Play, Most Unique Entry, Judge's Choice
    Worm-Eaten Collective|Golden Ladybug|PGBC I: Creepy Crawlers|Third Place Winner[/table]

    Races

    {table=head]Name|Creator|Competition|Notes
    Bastinoi|Mulletmanalive|PGBC I: Creepy Crawlers|-
    Gatorfolk|Warpwolf16|PGBC V: Semper Fi! Do or Die!|-
    Kithkin|TARDIS|PGBC VI: A Day in the Life|-
    Kylanth|Milo v3|PGBC VI: A Day in the Life|Second Place Winner and Most Likely to See Play
    Lagi|Midwoka|PGBC VI: A Day in the Life|First Place Winner
    Midwokans|Midwoka|PGBC IV: A Homebrew by any other Name...|First Place Winner and Most Likely to See Play
    Mutant|Warpwolf16|PGBC VI: A Day in the Life|-
    Nafairi|Deviston|PGBC VI: A Day in the Life|Third Place Winner
    Rhox|DawnbringerSO|PGBC VI: A Day in the Life|-
    Sainesti|Milo v3|PGBC X: Have a Holly, Jolly Brewmas!|Third Place Winner
    Theg|Kane0|PGBC I: Creepy Crawlers|Second Place Winner and Most Likely to See Play
    Warp Wolves|Warpwolf16|PGBC IV: A Homebrew by any other Name...|Third Place Winner[/table]
    Last edited by Tanuki Tales; 2013-04-18 at 09:34 AM.

    Genie avatar by andres21295.

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    Default Re: Pathfinder Grab Bag Competition Chat Thread

    Spoiler
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    Past Entries Archive 2

    Genie avatar by andres21295.

    RIP you funny, funny man.

    I run a Pokemon Wonder Trade blog now, so feel free to take a look.

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    Default Re: Pathfinder Grab Bag Competition Chat Thread

    And with that, the contest is now completely set up and ready to run!

    I'm trying something new and, as far as I'm aware, something that hasn't been attempted by one of these contests before. Hopefully it will turn out quite splendidly and won't end up crashing and burning entirely!

    So let the creative juices flow for the beginning of March everyone!

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    Default Re: Pathfinder Grab Bag Competition Chat Thread

    I think I will join this. I'm thinking I will develop an insectile hive-mind race, mostly for the roleplaying challenge. That, and I have the most experience with races.
    Bearpunch Gunsmoke
    Dungeoning Dragons. All day. Every day.
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    Default Re: Pathfinder Grab Bag Competition Chat Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Bearpunch View Post
    I think I will join this. I'm thinking I will develop an insectile hive-mind race, mostly for the roleplaying challenge. That, and I have the most experience with races.
    Sounds neat! I can't wait to see your entry.

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    Default Re: Pathfinder Grab Bag Competition Chat Thread

    I'll throw my hat into the ring; I was just going to watch until I read over it and got hit by inspiration for a cool bug race.

    I'll figure out the Base Class and PrC as I go along.
    Last edited by Golden Ladybug; 2012-03-01 at 03:59 PM.


    Quote Originally Posted by LTwerewolf View Post
    Forgive me for being ignorant, but how would 15/adamantine protect the dragon from hitting the ground at over 4,4 billion newtons?

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    Default Re: Pathfinder Grab Bag Competition Chat Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Golden Ladybug View Post
    I'll throw my hat into the ring; I was just going to watch until I read over it and got hit by inspiration for a cool bug race.

    I'll figure out the Base Class and PrC as I go along.
    Take your time. There's a whole month in this thing to go and every entry will be a hidden treasure in itself.

    Edit:

    Wait... *just fully read what you wrote*

    You do know that you're entering a Base class or a Prestige class or a Monster or a Race, not all of them or any combination, right?
    Last edited by Tanuki Tales; 2012-03-01 at 04:11 PM.

    Genie avatar by andres21295.

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    Default Re: Pathfinder Grab Bag Competition Chat Thread

    No, no I did not. I was reading it and thinking that the challenge was designing a trio of Base Class, PrC and Race/Monster.

    Well, better scrap my first idea then and think of something that stands on its own


    Quote Originally Posted by LTwerewolf View Post
    Forgive me for being ignorant, but how would 15/adamantine protect the dragon from hitting the ground at over 4,4 billion newtons?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Golden Ladybug View Post
    No, no I did not. I was reading it and thinking that the challenge was designing a trio of Base Class, PrC and Race/Monster.

    Well, better scrap my first idea then and think of something that stands on its own
    Now there's a neat idea. *squirrels it away for later*

    Anyways, yeah, sorry for the confusion! I've updated that rule so hopefully it doesn't happen to anyone else.

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    Default Re: Pathfinder Grab Bag Competition Chat Thread

    I'm in. Can I make something both hive mind- and swarm-related?

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    Default Re: Pathfinder Grab Bag Competition Chat Thread

    All right, you've got my interest. I'll see what I can come up with.
    Prestige Bard, updated for Pathfinder.

    Revamped Spell Resistance system, for use with Spell Points/Psionics.

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    Default Re: Pathfinder Grab Bag Competition Chat Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Tarvon000 View Post
    I'm in. Can I make something both hive mind- and swarm-related?
    Sure! For the themes you don't have to pick only one, those are just the guiding principles for the overarching theme.

    A swarm of Badgerguins is just as valid an entry as a race of constructs who are linked in a Hive Mind. Neither one of those are anthropods but that's ok, these themes are meant to allow a cornucopia of potential entries that aren't tethered to a iron-cast mold. Out of anything I see that as the strength of the set up of my contest.

    @Curious: Huzzah!

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    Default Re: Pathfinder Grab Bag Competition Chat Thread

    Got a good idea for a Druid Prc that summons a hoard of squirrels gaining a hive mind with them and becoming one with a Squirrel!

    Should be fun to do.
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    Default Re: Pathfinder Grab Bag Competition Chat Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by BelGareth View Post
    Got a good idea for a Druid Prc that summons a hoard of squirrels gaining a hive mind with them and becoming one with a Squirrel!

    Should be fun to do.
    More Squirrel than you could possibly imagine


    Quote Originally Posted by LTwerewolf View Post
    Forgive me for being ignorant, but how would 15/adamantine protect the dragon from hitting the ground at over 4,4 billion newtons?

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    Can I suggest that any attempt to emulate the Geth/Legion from Mass Effect be vetoed? Just cause it was the first thing to come to mind is all...

    Edit: If not then I guess ill make one
    Last edited by Kane0; 2012-03-01 at 10:40 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kane0 View Post
    Can I suggest that any attempt to emulate the Geth/Legion from Mass Effect be vetoed? Just cause it was the first thing to come to mind is all...

    Edit: If not then I guess ill make one
    Heh.

    How many more day is it till launch?

    As much as I want Grunt and Jack back (because he's my Bro and she's my tender puppy in need of gentle care) and as much as I'd love Wrex and Garrus back (miss my old Bro Squad from ME1), I'd like to see Legion back on your crew. I never actually got the chance to do anything with him since if I wanted a perfect game I'd need to recruit and do his mission after I had finished the rest of the game.

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    Default Re: Pathfinder Grab Bag Competition Chat Thread

    Well its 6 days to go here in Australia, so im past even the "I cant wait" stage.

    I went back at the beggining of feb for the explicit purpose of making a perfect game with all survivors to use in ME3, which i preordered last year back in like June

    But anyway I may end up making a 'Theg' humanoid species as a hats off to ME for this comp

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kane0 View Post
    Well its 6 days to go here in Australia, so im past even the "I cant wait" stage.

    I went back at the beggining of feb for the explicit purpose of making a perfect game with all survivors to use in ME3, which i preordered last year back in like June

    But anyway I may end up making a 'Theg' humanoid species as a hats off to ME for this comp
    I look forward to your entry! =D

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    Default Re: Pathfinder Grab Bag Competition Chat Thread

    So pretty much done, just have to stat up the crazy squirrels for summon natures ally and fine tune/spell check etc the rest.

    Hope you like it!
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    Default Re: Pathfinder Grab Bag Competition Chat Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by BelGareth View Post
    So pretty much done, just have to stat up the crazy squirrels for summon natures ally and fine tune/spell check etc the rest.

    Hope you like it!
    I do! ^_^

    Now the break down of what I found;


    Special
    You call the class Pack Lord instead of Pack Master.

    Table
    You have it titled Pack Lord instead of Pack Master.

    Class Features
    You call the class Pack Lord instead of Pack Master.

    Weapon and Armor Proficiencies
    You call the class Pack Lord instead of Pack Master.

    Wildshape
    You call the class Pack Lord instead of Pack Master.

    Spontaneous Summoning
    You call the class Pack Lord instead of Pack Master.

    Horde Empathy
    You've got conflicting genders in the first sentence and call Pack Master "Pack Lord."

    Eyes of the Horde
    There shouldn't be an apostrophe in Eyes. You call the class Pack Lord instead of Pack Master. You might want to clear up the "perceives things" bit of that sentence to be more specific. You forgot the apostrophe for "Companion's" and you should probably change "vision" to "sensory modes" or something similar. Yes, Squirrels rely on sight but by the strictest sense you can only see things and nothing else.

    Summon the Horde
    You call the class Pack Lord instead of Pack Master. And while the ability is poignant, I wonder if it would be out of line to just let the Pack Master become a swarm of squirrels in addition to its normal wildshaping options for this ability.

    Power of the Pack
    Should be "effective" not affective.

    Many are One
    You call the class Pack Lord instead of Pack Master. There also shouldn't be an apostrophe in "Eyes". And what exactly does this ability do? It seems like a limited form of teleportation but really seems to have low utility as a later level ability. I mean, she jumps into her squirrel companion's body and then what? Does she still keep her spell casting?

    One are Many
    You call the class Pack Lord instead of Pack Master. And I feel that the ship example limitation is a little silly. I think it would make more sense (especially as a capstone) to have the Pack Master either become a swarm and then the swarm needs to be killed or have the Pack Master dissolve into a certain amount of squirrels and then every one of those squirrels needs to be killed or the Pack Master will regenerate (like old school Vampires).
    Last edited by Tanuki Tales; 2012-03-02 at 04:37 PM.

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    Default Re: Pathfinder Grab Bag Competition Chat Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Troll Brau View Post
    I do! ^_^

    Now the break down of what I found;


    Special
    You call the class Pack Lord instead of Pack Master.

    Table
    You have it titled Pack Lord instead of Pack Master.

    Class Features
    You call the class Pack Lord instead of Pack Master.

    Weapon and Armor Proficiencies
    You call the class Pack Lord instead of Pack Master.

    Wildshape
    You call the class Pack Lord instead of Pack Master.

    Spontaneous Summoning
    You call the class Pack Lord instead of Pack Master.
    Ah yes, I changed the name half way through and confusled myself.
    Fixed

    Horde Empathy
    You've got conflicting genders in the first sentence and call Pack Master "Pack Lord."
    Copypasta!
    Fixed

    Eyes of the Horde
    There shouldn't be an apostrophe in Eyes. You call the class Pack Lord instead of Pack Master. You might want to clear up the "perceives things" bit of that sentence to be more specific. You forgot the apostrophe for "Companion's" and you should probably change "vision" to "sensory modes" or something similar. Yes, Squirrels rely on sight but by the strictest sense you can only see things and nothing else.
    Added some clarifying text, the vision was specifically referencing the animals vision type (darkvison, lowlight etc.) but as animals all have lowlight I just added that specific type in the description.

    Summon the Horde
    You call the class Pack Lord instead of Pack Master. And while the ability is poignant, I wonder if it would be out of line to just let the Pack Master become a swarm of squirrels in addition to its normal wildshaping options for this ability.
    Ummm....it IS in addition to the regular wildshape.....Not sure what your getting at here.
    Theres wildshape and then theres the limited use of Swarm Shape (max 3/day)

    Power of the Pack
    Should be "effective" not affective.
    This always get's me, fixed.

    Many are One
    You call the class Pack Lord instead of Pack Master. There also shouldn't be an apostrophe in "Eyes". And what exactly does this ability do? It seems like a limited form of teleportation but really seems to have low utility as a later level ability. I mean, she jumps into her squirrel companion's body and then what? Does she still keep her spell casting?
    To answer I quote myself:
    Quote Originally Posted by BelGareth
    Many are One (Su): A Pack Master gains the ability to blur the lines between her body and the bodies of her Animal Companions, all are one to nature. As a full round action the Pack Master can choose an Animal Companion for which she can use the Eyes of the Horde ability on and switch bodies. If the Pack Master is not in the Wildshape form of a Squirrel she automatically activates her wildshape as a squirrel of the same size as she switches body with, if she is already in squirrel form she retains her shape. If the Pack Master has no Wildshape uses left she cannot switch bodies.
    So, the two creatures swap places, and to do so the Pack Master must be in Squirrel form via Wildshape, so all the restrictions of being in wildshape are in affect.
    This is essentially Teleport at will(short ranged) as long as you're in squirrel form, while it loses some power at higher levels, you still retain the ability to get out of places when in a bind. Still, I think, a Great ability.

    One are Many
    You call the class Pack Lord instead of Pack Master. And I feel that the ship example limitation is a little silly. I think it would make more sense (especially as a capstone) to have the Pack Master either become a swarm and then the swarm needs to be killed or have the Pack Master dissolve into a certain amount of squirrels and then every one of those squirrels needs to be killed or the Pack Master will regenerate (like old school Vampires).
    I just disagree with you on this one, I think this is a great ability, but not overpowering, great in specific circumstances. Having it break into a dozen tiny creatures would just drive players and DM's crazy keeping track of, having them disburse if they can, I think, is the best option.

    Thanks for pointing everything out.
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    Default Re: Pathfinder Grab Bag Competition Chat Thread

    Okay, so I want the base class I'm working on to get a hellwasp familiar, but there are no statistics for individual hellwasps. Can I make up statistics for them or would that not be allowed because I'd be creating both a class and a monster?

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    Default Re: Pathfinder Grab Bag Competition Chat Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by BelGareth View Post
    Ummm....it IS in addition to the regular wildshape.....Not sure what your getting at here.
    Theres wildshape and then theres the limited use of Swarm Shape (max 3/day)
    I'm saying, open it up as an option for the regular wildshape. Like how Druids can end up choosing to become plants or elementals as they wildshape. As it is right now, a Druid 4/Pack Master 10 would be able to Wildshape 6/day and can "Swarm Shape" 3/day. Would there be any harm in just opening it up as an option for regular wildshape and keep the extra 3 uses as being only able to be used for "Swarm Shape"? You've got other class features that affect the Druid's normal abilities if they don't or do pick a squirrel so it could fall into that vein.

    I'll have a comment about the entry for the class further down in this post.



    So, the two creatures swap places, and to do so the Pack Master must be in Squirrel form via Wildshape, so all the restrictions of being in wildshape are in affect.
    This is essentially Teleport at will(short ranged) as long as you're in squirrel form, while it loses some power at higher levels, you still retain the ability to get out of places when in a bind. Still, I think, a Great ability.
    Well, that's not exactly how you worded it. The way you have it worded makes it sound like the Pack Master literally switches bodies with an animal companion; her mind enters its body and it enters her's. Which is why I asked what this exactly did and whether or not she could still cast spells. You should probably reword it so that the ability makes them "switch locations" or something similar.


    I just disagree with you on this one, I think this is a great ability, but not overpowering, great in specific circumstances. Having it break into a dozen tiny creatures would just drive players and DM's crazy keeping track of, having them disburse if they can, I think, is the best option.
    Then word it as such? Right now the ability basically works as:
    • Pack Master would die.
    • The Pack Master dissolves into a swarm of squirrels.
    • The ability checks to see if the Pack Master died in a "logical place".
    • If yes, the Pack Master survives and the squirrels reform as him/her in a place 1 mile away. The Pack Master is at 0 hp but stable.
    • If no, the Pack Master dies.


    I just personally think it'd be more interesting and easier to deal with ability if the Pack Master did dissolve into an actual amount of squirrels and they all need to be killed to kill the Pack Master. As it is right now, it's up to the DM's discretion for both the ability to work and for the Pack Master to survive. I mean, that just feels like a "Track feat" kind of ability.


    Now for what I mentioned higher up.

    Generally Prestige classes can't be entered until level 6 or level 7. You can take this class at level 5, only requiring 4 levels of Druid to enter it. What made you decide on allowing an early entry?

    Thanks for pointing everything out.
    You're welcome. Always glad to help where I can.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tarvon000 View Post
    Okay, so I want the base class I'm working on to get a hellwasp familiar, but there are no statistics for individual hellwasps. Can I make up statistics for them or would that not be allowed because I'd be creating both a class and a monster?
    Berp, misread.

    An individual hellwasp is too small to really be a statted creature (which is why you find it in swarm form). And they're mindless. Is there a reason you need the Hellwasp in particular instead of something new made for the class?

    And in the case of your question, you're not statting the creature as a separate entry but as an accessory to an actual entry, so you're good.
    Last edited by Tanuki Tales; 2012-03-03 at 08:00 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Troll Brau View Post
    An individual hellwasp is too small to really be a statted creature (which is why you find it in swarm form). And they're mindless.
    The hellwasp is a familiar. There are already both Diminutive familiars and familiars that would normally be mindless. And judging from the swarm's stats, an individual hellwasp would actually be the most powerful familiar yet, even if I remove its DR.

    Is there a reason you need the Hellwasp in particular instead of something new made for the class?
    It's mostly for flavor, but my current capstone is that the familiar turns into an entire hellwasp swarm.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tarvon000 View Post
    The hellwasp is a familiar. There are already both Diminutive familiars and familiars that would normally be mindless. And judging from the swarm's stats, an individual hellwasp would actually be the most powerful familiar yet, even if I remove its DR.
    Right, I forgot that Ultimate Magic introduced vermin familiars. But I'm not seeing any familiars as being that small. The scorpion and house centipede are both Tiny.

    Judging from the swarm's stats how? The swarm is made up of 5,000 individual wasps.

    And how do you see a Hellwasp being more powerful than an Imp or Pseudo-Dragon or any of the improved familiars (which it would be contending with)?


    It's mostly for flavor, but my current capstone is that the familiar turns into an entire hellwasp swarm.
    Ah, then I'd suggest just statting up some kind of "Greater Hellwasp" to fit the bill.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Troll Brau View Post
    Right, I forgot that Ultimate Magic introduced vermin familiars. But I'm not seeing any familiars as being that small. The scorpion and house centipede are both Tiny.
    It's true that none of the vermin familiars are Diminutive, but the bat and toad are.

    Judging from the swarm's stats how? The swarm is made up of 5,000 individual wasps.
    Each individual hellwasp has the same physical ability scores as the swarm (Str 1, Dex 22, Con 14), and a poisonous bite attack (otherwise the swarm wouldn't be poisonous either).

    And how do you see a Hellwasp being more powerful than an Imp or Pseudo-Dragon or any of the improved familiars (which it would be contending with)?
    Good point. I forgot about the Improved Familiar feat.

    Ah, then I'd suggest just statting up some kind of "Greater Hellwasp" to fit the bill.
    As in a Tiny hellwasp? Maybe, but it would be hard to explain why the hellwasp shrinks when it becomes part of a swarm.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tarvon000 View Post
    It's true that none of the vermin familiars are Diminutive, but the bat and toad are.
    Shows how much I look into familiars on characters. xD

    Once again, you're right.



    Each individual hellwasp has the same physical ability scores as the swarm (Str 1, Dex 22, Con 14), and a poisonous bite attack (otherwise the swarm wouldn't be poisonous either).
    You mind quoting where that's from. I'm not seeing it in the rules text for the swarm subtype.



    Good point. I forgot about the Improved Familiar feat.
    So you could buff it up if you made it obtainable through the feat. I don't think there's precedence for a non-mundane animal being made into a familiar though without the feat.


    As in a Tiny hellwasp? Maybe, but it would be hard to explain why the hellwasp shrinks when it becomes part of a swarm.

    Magic?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Troll Brau View Post
    You mind quoting where that's from. I'm not seeing it in the rules text for the swarm subtype.
    It turns out I was wrong. That isn't a rule after all.

    So you could buff it up if you made it obtainable through the feat. I don't think there's precedence for a non-mundane animal being made into a familiar though without the feat.
    I statted it out this morning. It's actually only CR 1/2, not worth a feat, and I didn't want to make it any more powerful because the class should get it at 1st level.

    Actually, I posted the whole class earlier today, but I forgot to mention it until now.
    Last edited by Tarvon000; 2012-03-03 at 07:29 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tarvon000 View Post


    I statted it out this morning. It's actually only CR 1/2, not worth a feat, and I didn't want to make it any more powerful because the class should get it at 1st level.

    Actually, I posted the whole class earlier today, but I forgot to mention it until now.
    I saw, I just wanted to finish this line of discussion before jumping onto my take on your entry.

    And I still think it being a Magical Beast is a big thing when the rest are Animals.
    Last edited by Tanuki Tales; 2012-03-03 at 11:28 PM.

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