Magic: The Gathering XIII: What A Horrible Night To Have An Enchantment- Curse

[Sohala]

Other than not being an Ally, Mentor of the Meek seems like a good fit for draw in an Ally deck.

[9mm]

In more obviously exciting news:

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Yup. They did it. I'm trying to imagine what the RW and GU ones do.

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Inistrad: for when you want bitching effect lands.

[Mystic Muse]

Kazandu Blademaster + Hada Freeblade. Possibly also Talus Paladin, since it gains you some ridiculous life, as well.

My cousins already had Ondu Clerics for the purposes of lifegain in the deck. I just got four Kazandu Blademasters and Freeblaes on Ebay, but I can get Talus Paladins if they're just that much better.

Now that that's out of the way, some basic advice: You need fixing, and you need 2-drop Allies. The deck really needs to lay down an ally each and every turn, and possibly several per turn. Oran-Rief Survivalist is great, Jwari Shapeshifter is a copy of Kazandu Blademaster, which is amazing, and Bojuka Brigand is also a bear. Umara Raptor is more expensive, but has flying. Finally, Kabira Evangelists make all of your creatures unblockable, untargetable, and gets rid of auras. It is a rather good finisher. Finally, Join the Ranks gives you instant speed pump, blockers, and possibly protection from two colors and lifelink to all your creatures.

Would it be worth reducing to 2 colors, or should I keep it at 3?

I have 2 Kabira Evangelists in the deck already. I've got four Oran-rief survivalists, four Harabaz Druids, and four Halimar excavators. I was thinking of taking the Excavators out since I don't think Mill will be effective enough to matter, and I thought maybe reducing it to 2 colors instead of three would be good.

[Fable Wright]

My cousins already had Ondu Clerics for the purposes of lifegain in the deck. I just got four Kazandu Blademasters and Freeblaes on Ebay, but I can get Talus Paladins if they're just that much better.


Would it be worth reducing to 2 colors, or should I keep it at 3?

I have 2 Kabira Evangelists in the deck already. I've got four Oran-rief survivalists, four Harabaz Druids, and four Halimar excavators. I was thinking of taking the Excavators out since I don't think Mill will be effective enough to matter, and I thought maybe reducing it to 2 colors instead of three would be good.

Ondu Clerics do lifegain well, but they have one toughness. So, they die to Arc Trail, Flame Jab, Darkblast, and just about everything else. They are also cheaper to cast, but they're in the critical two-drop slot. Talus Paladin has a 3/4 body and give you life in far bigger bursts than Ondu Clerics, which is nice when you're almost dead and just need the final push to stay alive. Harabaz Druid is even worse than Ondu Cleric because it doesn't do anything when it comes into play, still is in the two-drop slot, and dies to everything. Excavators are bad. They have to churn out a lot of mill and don't work towards the beatdown plan that is the most efficient route to victory, and give decks access to their flashback cards like Lingering Souls and unearth cards like Hellspark Elemental. The only good blue allies are Jwari Shapeshifter and Umara Raptor, and may well be worth including. Also, remember to include room in the deck for efficient removal, like Journey to Nowhere, and maybe O-Ring. And Bant Charm, since you're in that color anyways.

[Callos_DeTerran]

Avacyn Restored Spoilers

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Okay, I guess I'm missing something, but that's why I can safely ask here to avoid the terrible mocking of my RL peers (oh sweet heavens the mocking). What's so good about Desolate Lighthouse? Sure, it has a decent effect but is it really all that? You're still paying 3 mana to draw a single card (and discard another). It's essentially Tibalt, without the randomness and you have to pay for the ability every time you use it.

...What am I missing here?

[IthilanorStPete]

Avacyn Restored Spoilers

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Okay, I guess I'm missing something, but that's why I can safely ask here to avoid the terrible mocking of my RL peers (oh sweet heavens the mocking). What's so good about Desolate Lighthouse? Sure, it has a decent effect but is it really all that? You're still paying 3 mana to draw a single card (and discard another). It's essentially Tibalt, without the randomness and you have to pay for the ability every time you use it.

...What am I missing here?

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It's card selection, for a fairly cheap mana cost, and it doesn't cost you a spell slot in your deck - almost any land with an added effect is worth playing, because the only cost to you is dealing with a colorless land.

[Sith_Happens]

Avacyn Restored Spoilers

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Okay, I guess I'm missing something, but that's why I can safely ask here to avoid the terrible mocking of my RL peers (oh sweet heavens the mocking). What's so good about Desolate Lighthouse? Sure, it has a decent effect but is it really all that? You're still paying 3 mana to draw a single card (and discard another). It's essentially Tibalt, without the randomness and you have to pay for the ability every time you use it.

...What am I missing here?

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Basically, it does exactly what RU (i.e.- Burning Vengeance) wants a repeatable effect to do: Draw cards and put useful things in your graveyard.

[Ninjaman]

I am going to Berlin tomorrow. Does anybody know a good place in Berlin to buy english Magic cards?

[Frankelshtein]

Regarding Allies: I could see Adaptive Automaton being a good fit.

That's all I've got.

[Zombimode]

I am going to Berlin tomorrow. Does anybody know a good place in Berlin to buy english Magic cards?

Der Andere Spieleladen, Prenzlauer Allee 192

It has boosters from many editions in stock, both in english and german, to very fair prices (I recall 2,50 € or 3,00 € for the newer one from my last visit - contrast the 3,99 € I see in many shops). Generally a nice staff and athmosphere. From my experience there are always enough players of young adolescence and older and the kiddies keep to themselves.
Its a rare gem of a shop
Easy to reach from the main station or actually most places in Berlin since its close to the Ring-Bahn.

[Ninjaman]

Der Andere Spieleladen, Prenzlauer Allee 192

It has boosters from many editions in stock, both in english and german, to very fair prices (I recall 2,50 € or 3,00 € for the newer one from my last visit - contrast the 3,99 € I see in many shops). Generally a nice staff and athmosphere. From my experience there are always enough players of young adolescence and older and the kiddies keep to themselves.
Its a rare gem of a shop
Easy to reach from the main station or actually most places in Berlin since its close to the Ring-Bahn.

Awesome, thank you very much. I will definitely drop by there.

[Bucky]

The fine tradition of including an infinite combo in every large expert set continues in Avacyn Restored, and it's been spoiled already.

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With a Tamiyo emblem, Arcane Melee and two basic lands out, Ghostly Flicker generates a mana with each casting and returns itself. Convert it to damage by e.g. recurring Thunderous Wrath.

[flabort]

The fine tradition of including an infinite combo in every large expert set continues in Avacyn Restored, and it's been spoiled already.

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With a Tamiyo emblem, Arcane Melee and two basic lands out, Ghostly Flicker generates a mana with each casting and returns itself. Convert it to damage by e.g. recurring Thunderous Wrath.

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Whoah, it's all Blue, too. Though without proliferate, it'll take 10 turns...
Though there hasn't yet been spoiled a Blue receptacle to this infinite mana in this block. So you'll have to go multicolored if you're just using spoiled cards - Killing Wave is nice, since your combo is creature free. Sac all creatures or die, bucko. Either way, I win.

[tgva8889]

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You do realize that starting your infinite combo with "with this Planeswalker Ultimate active" is kinda highly restricting its usability in constructed, right? Not to say it's not cool, but I have a feeling that it's not going to matter much if at all.

[Sith_Happens]

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You do realize that starting your infinite combo with "with this Planeswalker Ultimate active" is kinda highly restricting its usability in constructed, right? Not to say it's not cool, but I have a feeling that it's not going to matter much if at all.

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I think the "cool" part was the whole point.

[Bucky]

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You do realize that starting your infinite combo with "with this Planeswalker Ultimate active" is kinda highly restricting its usability in constructed, right? Not to say it's not cool, but I have a feeling that it's not going to matter much if at all.

Of all the recent single-set infinite combos I know of, only one the Innistrad one got used at all in serious Constructed, and even that was only because the pieces all fit into the deck by themselves. Contrast with the Lorwyn, Shadowmoor, Scars of Mirrodin (which admittedly saw a bit of casual use), Rise of the Eldrazi, Scars of Alara and Magic 2010 combos...

(as far as I can tell, Zendikar is infinite-free. If anyone knows an infinite damage combo in Zendikar, please tell me.)

[Suedars]

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The discussion about Tibalt strikes me as what you'd get if the only creatures you ever showed someone were sweet, card-advantagey 4 and 5 drops (with the occasional 3 drop mixed in), then one day suddenly showed them Putrid Leech. It doesn't generate card advantage, it doesn't win games by itself, and you have to pay as much life as they lose when pumping it, so what's the point? But the card is still really good.

2 drops just function on a completely different level than midrange plays like every other PW, and don't have to do as much. For instance why is it so important that PWs defend themselves? It's not that you lose the card. Jace3 replaces himself as soon as he comes down, but his lack of defense keeps him from seeing play. It's because you lose a huge expenditure of mana. That's just not as important for Tibalt.

Costing 2 is also a huge advantage in any tapout vs. tapout control matchup. Esper tapout right now is quite bad against UB (draw-go control) because it needs to tap out for its plays, but because they all cost 5+ mana it either needs to blindly play them into countermagic, or wait till it has 7+ mana on board which is often too late. Tibalt can come down with Mana Leak backup turn 4 which is huge.

[Mystic Muse]

My cousin would like me to make him a deck starting with the following, and would like it to remain W/U.

2 Venser the Sojourner
2 Gideon Jura
4 Stonehorn Dignitary
4 Fiend Hunter.

The Vensers, Stonehorns and Gideons are not optional. The deck has to be standard legal. He can't afford Seachrome coasts.

[tgva8889]

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The problem I think people are seeing is that Tibalt is Red and doesn't do very much in the red decks that are being played. I foresee Tibalt in a Red Control deck or in a deck that can really make his discard not at all symmetrical.

In terms of mana economy, Tibalt is a lot better than Desolate Lighthouse. This is pretty amusing to me.

Softserve: Tell him to wait about 3 weeks for Avacyn Restored to come out. Then building the deck will be easy.

[Suedars]

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Yeah, I see Tibalt most likely being best in a WUR (maybe Grixis, but not as likely) tapout control deck. I don't think the mana is there to support that right now though, so it'll probably have to wait till Ravnica.

[Lord Seth]

My cousin would like me to make him a deck starting with the following, and would like it to remain W/U.

2 Venser the Sojourner
2 Gideon Jura
4 Stonehorn Dignitary
4 Fiend Hunter.

The Vensers, Stonehorns and Gideons are not optional. The deck has to be standard legal. He can't afford Seachrome coasts.

How about Glacial Fortresses? And why are they not optional?

Best thing you can do in Standard with a U/W build if you can't afford things like Seachrome Coasts is probably make some kind of budget Delver or Humans deck. But if you don't have at least Glacial Fortresses it's going to be pretty tough.

[Bucky]

My cousin would like me to make him a deck starting with the following, and would like it to remain W/U.

2 Venser the Sojourner
2 Gideon Jura
4 Stonehorn Dignitary
4 Fiend Hunter.

The Vensers, Stonehorns and Gideons are not optional. The deck has to be standard legal. He can't afford Seachrome coasts.

Okay.

Day of Judgment, swap some Fiend Hunters for Oblivion Rings, add another Venser, Timely Reinforcements, Think Twice. Maybe Sphere of the Suns to help with mana.

[Mystic Muse]

Okay.

Day of Judgment, swap some Fiend Hunters for Oblivion Rings, add another Venser, Timely Reinforcements, Think Twice. Maybe Sphere of the Suns to help with mana.

How many day of judgment, Timely Reincforcement and Think Twices?

How about Glacial Fortresses? And why are they not optional?

Glacial fortresses are a maybe. The cards I mentioned are not optional because my cousin specifically said so.

Best thing you can do in Standard with a U/W build if you can't afford things like Seachrome Coasts is probably make some kind of budget Delver or Humans deck. But if you don't have at least Glacial Fortresses it's going to be pretty tough.

I'm pretty sure I can get glacial fortresses.

I'll tell him he should consider waiting for Avacyn restored.

[Fable Wright]

Okay.

Day of Judgment, swap some Fiend Hunters for Oblivion Rings, add another Venser, Timely Reinforcements, Think Twice. Maybe Sphere of the Suns to help with mana.

Eh, I think Fiend Hunter could be good enough to get in, especially with the AVR flicker effects. Possibly also Saving Grasp for the rebuy on it and Stonehorn Dignitary. I would also add 4 Mana Leaks and 2-4 Dissipates.

[tgva8889]

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Yeah, I see Tibalt most likely being best in a WUR (maybe Grixis, but not as likely) tapout control deck. I don't think the mana is there to support that right now though, so it'll probably have to wait till Ravnica.

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I've discussed with friends the possibility of playing Tibalt in a deck with Boneyard Wurm and Splinterfright. Break the symmetry. After all, you don't mind putting more cards in your graveyard with those guys around. Tibalt can also be set up with Reforge the Soul.

[Lord Seth]

Glacial fortresses are a maybe. The cards I mentioned are not optional because my cousin specifically said so.

What I meant was, why are they not optional for him?

[Mystic Muse]

What I meant was, why are they not optional for him?

Because he specifically told me he wanted a deck with 2 Gideon Juras, 2 Venser the Sojourners ( Got him 3 because Bucky said, and because it was a better deal than 2) and 4 stonehorn dignitaries in it.

[Lord Seth]

Because he specifically told me he wanted a deck with 2 Gideon Juras, 2 Venser the Sojourners ( Got him 3 because Bucky said, and because it was a better deal than 2) and 4 stonehorn dignitaries in it.

Well, yes, but...why does he want a deck with those?

On an unrelated note, when exactly are the cards in Avacyn Restored legal to play in tournaments (particularly Standard and Legacy)? There's some big tournaments in my area soon after its release date and I'm wondering if they're legal the instant they're officially released or if there's a bit of a wait period to let people get their cards together.

[tgva8889]

Cards are legal the date of their official release.

[Sith_Happens]

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So what's everyones' opinion on Vexing Devil? On one hand, 90% of the time it might as well just say "R - Sorcery - Deal 4 damage to a random opponent." On the other hand, four damage for one mana is nothing to sneeze at.