Legend Of Korra: Will It Bend!

[LordVader]

I don't mind you disagreeing with it. Yes, it assumes a fair bit of truth in Amon's speech and capitalizes on our lack of knowledge about Koh and what motivations he could possibly have. But you were saying before that it shouldn't even be discussed because you find it so implausible. From what we know, it's really not that ridiculous of a theory.

Eh, I still disagree. Again, Koh has literally no motivation to turn on the Avatar in this way, or even become involved in the mortal world in this fashion. He seems to be all about punishing individuals, not creating grand social movements, and he actually helped the Avatar the last time they met.

Furthermore, there's no proof Amon has been involved with Koh, since he has a face. People were only suggesting Koh in the first place because Amon wore a mask, but that particular angle was debunked by this episode.

Given those two factors, yeah, sure, it could be Koh if the creators have decided to change his personality or give him a reason to be involved, but there's no evidence for his involvement at the moment. People are just suggesting him because he's one of the few named spirits we've actually met.

[thubby]

but he would have been a much lesser threat personally without that.

his first response to zuko the second firebending was back in the least was dual, near instantaneous lightning blasts.

in terms of raw power he was the still the strongest firebender in the series.

[BRC]

Eh, I still disagree. Again, Koh has literally no motivation to turn on the Avatar in this way, or even become involved in the mortal world in this fashion. He seems to be all about punishing individuals, not creating grand social movements, and he actually helped the Avatar the last time they met.

Furthermore, there's no proof Amon has been involved with Koh, since he has a face. People were only suggesting Koh in the first place because Amon wore a mask, but that particular angle was debunked by this episode.

Given those two factors, yeah, sure, it could be Koh if the creators have decided to change his personality or give him a reason to be involved, but there's no evidence for his involvement at the moment. People are just suggesting him because he's one of the few named spirits we've actually met.

Well, let's look at Amon's story.
Part 1: His family was killed by a Firebender, and his face was burned so he must wear a mask.
Part 2: The Spirits granted him Spiritbending so he could destroy the Benders.

One theory (With no evidence to back it up) could be that, when he learned Spiritbending, Aang created a fifth "Nation", that of Spiritbenders. Amon's upbringing managed to fulfill whatever criteria is needed to have your bending assigned to Spirit (The same way people in the Water Tribes grow up and become Waterbenders), making him a Nation of One.

[pffh]

Oh, I agree completely that Amon's political side is going to be a very huge aspect of what makes him an extremely serious threat.

At the same time, however, the villain needs to pose a threat to the hero on a personal level in order to be truly effective. If we believe that Korra could take on Amon at any time and, at the very worst, escape a little worse for the wear, then he's not as effective a villain as he could be because the tension inherent in the prospect of Korra confronting Amon is defused.

Giving him "energybending" and acute combat prowess greatly ups the stakes of any confrontation between Korra and Amon, and thus the tension for the viewer, as should she lose she runs the risk of losing her bending entirely.

As she's obviously not going to die in any conflict with Amon, this is a marvelous way of still giving him the potential to damage the protagonists immensely.

BREAKING NEWS
AVATAR ATTACKS EQUALIST LEADER. RIOTS BREAK OUT ALL OVER THE UNITED REPUBLIC OF NATIONS!

Earlier today Avatar Korra was seen attacking Amon, the leader of the Equalists, on the streets of Republic City. Witnesses say that she utilized dangerous bending maneuvers and caused severe damage both to Amon and to the city. After this attack anti bending riots have broken out all over the nation and chaos rules the streets. One rioter says "The Avatar [Korra] tries to silence anyone that speaks out against the bending regime but we will not be silenced anymore!".

[BRC]

Really, Amon's greatest weapon is his Charisma. This isn't going to be a conflict solved by violence, in the end it's going to be solved by public opinion. The Mask, the Spiritbending, the Fancy Moves, those are tools that Amon can use to build a Personality Cult. In order to defeat Amon, Korra will need to convince people that he is wrong, and she can't do that by punching him in the Face.
Aang could probably pull it off just fine, he was a charismatic idealist. However, Korra is a thug. She WILL try to solve the Equalist problem by punching somebody in the face, and she dosn't even have a Sokka to come up with plans for her. She needs somebody with enough political savvy to help her counteract Amon's propaganda.

Amon's plan actually makes sense here. He shows off his Spiritbending against the Triad leaders (bad guys), and lets Korra escape to tell the City Leaders. City Leaders then crack down on Equalist meetings, thus adding evidence for Amon's claims that Benders are oppressing everybody.

[Flickerdart]

Fortunately, the token non-bender is yet to join the group. We can hope that she has more of a head for politics than the Fire Ferrets.

[Morty]

The thing is that Amon isn't entirely wrong. Sure, his methods are pretty much terrorist, but the oppression of the non-benders by benders is there, if only in the form of the organized crime using bending as a weapon. There's a reason he picked a mob leader as the first victim of his bending-nullifying power.

[thubby]

and you're ignoring the organized crime group with one of the largest followings that doesn't use bending because...?

[dehro]

there's no evidence for his involvement at the moment. People are just suggesting him because he's one of the few named spirits we've actually met.

this..very much this. for Koh to turn into some kind of political eminence grise just isn't consistent with how any spirit works..not even him.. so far, we have not ever seen a spirit delegate. when they want something or are pissed about something they step on people directly, they don't send a puppet into an intricate plot.

At the same time, however, the villain needs to pose a threat to the hero on a personal level in order to be truly effective. If we believe that Korra could take on Amon at any time and, at the very worst, escape a little worse for the wear, then he's not as effective a villain as he could be because the tension inherent in the prospect of Korra confronting Amon is defused.

not so.. as a matter of fact, Korra has mastered the arts, maybe..but she isn't all that good at actually fighting with them. from what we've seen. Aang was more effective at bending even when he only knew airbending. yes, results matter..and so far, korra has barely managed to win a match in the arena and hold her own in a fight. I'm not counting the 3 thugs in the first episode, who were clearly at the bottom of the foodchain, as far as bending goes. all in all, the new heroes are rather lame, when it comes to fighting. even Zuko in his first appearances made bigger blasts and did more damage than Mako does.. Bumi is really using fairly basic techniques, compared to any earth bender we've seen in the original series. then again, the season has just started. probably they'll get better with practice... just like Aang and Katara did.
right now, Amon is a pretty big menace, on account of probably being the best chi-blocker in town.

Giving him "energybending" and acute combat prowess greatly ups the stakes of any confrontation between Korra and Amon, and thus the tension for the viewer, as should she lose she runs the risk of losing her bending entirely.

maybe so..but energybending is purely speculation on our part. We haven't actually seen anyone energybend since Aang. hell..even Tenzin doesn't mention it yet, even though he clearly knows about his father's actions. Every form of bending has a visual representation, even air. specifically, energy bending has a spooky green light effect. we just didn't see that happen.
until we do, energybending is to be ruled out or at best considered not confirmed.

Well, let's look at Amon's story.
Part 1: His family was killed by a Firebender, and his face was burned so he must wear a mask.

says he.

Part 2: The Spirits granted him Spiritbending so he could destroy the Benders.

again, says he. he's a scheming criminal with a mask. I wouldn't accept his word just yet. in fact, all we know from the previous series tells us this last fact is highly unlikely to be true, which casts a shadow on the rest.

as for the unconfirmed theory...it's... really farfetched.
I would not be too drammatically surprised if future episodes were to be flashbacks and to reveal that Aang has indeed developed energybending further, maybe even taken on an apprentice or two.. but.. well.. until then, I'll stick to the advanced chi-blocking theory..because we actually have some evidence that that's what's happening. on account of actually seeing it on screen.

[Morty]

and you're ignoring the organized crime group with one of the largest followings that doesn't use bending because...?

I'm not ignoring anything or anyone, but thank you for the implication. In the very first episode, we're shown bending mobsters roughing up citizens. That means there's plenty of ground for Amon to build on. Does it justify nullifying each and every bender? No, that's what makes Amon the bad guy. But that means he's got a sympathetic goal he can then twist into something ugly and Korra can't solve the problem by simply beating him up - because in the eyes of the public, that'd prove his point.

[John Cribati]

People need to stop saying Koh is involved, though. We have seen Amon's eyes.

So... Assuming he was telling the truth in his backstory (And that's a big "assuming," just so we're clear here) His face was burned, and then he went to the spirit world. If his burns were bad enough, he could have founf id very difficult to make facial expressions. And thus, he'd be able to squeeze as much info out of Koh as he wanted.

[Lord Blace]

And didn't he say he'd been wearing a mask ever since? Not saying I'm willing to put too much stock in the Koh theory, but it's sort of hard to see burnt facial expressions through a mask.

[BRC]

Concerning the skill of the Benders in the series, first of all lets remember that this is right at the beginning. Katara wasn't much of a waterbender for a good portion of the first season.

Also, the impression I'm getting is that Bending has become formalized and somewhat overspecialized. Look at Bolin, we see him pulling off Lightninbending, heck we see Lightningbending (The purest expression of Firebending) used for what looks like basic industrial work.

In the first series, what differentiated a Student from a Master was their versatility. There was a lot of talk about specific "Bending Techniques". your standard Earth Kingdom Bender seemed to stick to "Throw Rocks at People", Fire Nation benders just used a basic fireblast most of the time. Even the Dai Li seemed to have a rather limited arsenal of moves.

Master Benders on the other hand just flowed from attack to attack. Their understanding of the art had transcended acting out specific "Moves" and just turned into an understanding of what they could do and so their attacks just flowed from one to the other.

Which brings us to Legend of Korra, specifically Mako and Bolin. They're acting out the motions without any real skill. Their moves are the stuff they learned Pro-Bending (Lift a small rock and shoot it/ Shoot some fire). I have a feeling that, as the series goes on and they get some experience out of the ring, they'll gradually adopt the more flexible bending styles that Masters use. It will probably be different than the stuff we saw benders in the original series doing (Since their bending is based off Boxing/MMA stuff), but they'll get better. I think we're slightly skewed because, of the Benders in the first show, Katara was the only one we ever saw before she hit "Master" status, and that was only for the first season.

[Randomguy]

So... Assuming he was telling the truth in his backstory (And that's a big "assuming," just so we're clear here) His face was burned, and then he went to the spirit world. If his burns were bad enough, he could have found id very difficult to make facial expressions. And thus, he'd be able to squeeze as much info out of Koh as he wanted.

Koh isn't some kind of genie: he isn't forced to answer people's questions. If he saw someone unable to make facial expressions, he would feel no need to help that person in any way. And although it is possible that Amon overpowered Koh through force of strength, I sincerely doubt that that's the case, considering Koh survived an attack from the avatar himself, so he's probably no pushover in a fight.

[Dusk Eclipse]

From what I get from the thread, episode 3 has already been released, and apparently Episodes 1 and 2 where hosted on the nick page...by any chance is episode 3 hosted there too?

I really want to see the the episode and I haven't found it yet in the web, so if anyone has a link I would really appreciate it.

[BRC]

From what I get from the thread, episode 3 has already been released, and apparently Episodes 1 and 2 where hosted on the nick page...by any chance is episode 3 hosted there too?

I really want to see the the episode and I haven't found it yet in the web, so if anyone has a link I would really appreciate it.

Episode 3 was on nick.com as of yesterday. With minimal ads too!

[Kobold-Bard]

Episode 3 was on nick.com as of yesterday. With minimal ads too!

Be warned that this can't be accessed if you're outside the US (or at least not for me).

[Dusk Eclipse]

Be warned that this can't be accessed if you're outside the US (or at least not for me).

Guess what.... "sorry., this video is not available from your location"

[Dusk Eclipse]

Be warned that this can't be accessed if you're outside the US (or at least not for me).

Guess what.... "sorry., this video is not available from your location"

[pffh]

Yeah that's why I'm doing what I did when avatar aired and acquire the episodes through *ahem* means and then buy the dvd sets to show my support when they come out.

[Anarion]

I am concerned at the number of chi blockers we have been shown thus far. Ty Lee was effective in the original series not only because of her chi blocking, but also because of her acrobatic skill, flexibility, and speed. While I can accept Amon and perhaps some of his personal guard having that same level of training and agility, I find it hard to believe that anyone who learns chi blocking techniques also becomes so fast that they can avoid trained benders and close with them. I'm hopeful that they will explain later how Amon has managed to train such a large organization without anybody finding out about them.

Concerning the skill of the Benders in the series, first of all lets remember that this is right at the beginning. Katara wasn't much of a waterbender for a good portion of the first season.

Also, the impression I'm getting is that Bending has become formalized and somewhat overspecialized. Look at Bolin, we see him pulling off Lightninbending, heck we see Lightningbending (The purest expression of Firebending) used for what looks like basic industrial work.

In the first series, what differentiated a Student from a Master was their versatility. There was a lot of talk about specific "Bending Techniques". your standard Earth Kingdom Bender seemed to stick to "Throw Rocks at People", Fire Nation benders just used a basic fireblast most of the time. Even the Dai Li seemed to have a rather limited arsenal of moves.

Master Benders on the other hand just flowed from attack to attack. Their understanding of the art had transcended acting out specific "Moves" and just turned into an understanding of what they could do and so their attacks just flowed from one to the other.

Which brings us to Legend of Korra, specifically Mako and Bolin. They're acting out the motions without any real skill. Their moves are the stuff they learned Pro-Bending (Lift a small rock and shoot it/ Shoot some fire). I have a feeling that, as the series goes on and they get some experience out of the ring, they'll gradually adopt the more flexible bending styles that Masters use. It will probably be different than the stuff we saw benders in the original series doing (Since their bending is based off Boxing/MMA stuff), but they'll get better. I think we're slightly skewed because, of the Benders in the first show, Katara was the only one we ever saw before she hit "Master" status, and that was only for the first season.

I also get the sense that Korra herself isn't that well-trained physically. She's in good shape, but her lack of airbending training really hurt her in terms of being able to move quickly and fluidly. She's getting better, but up to this point her technique has been to run straight at whatever she is fighting and punch it, which has only limited efficacy. She's also a fair bit slower than Aang was in his first appearances.

[dehro]

Is there a legit way for non-Americans to watch it? Because if there is I'll happily do so in future.

But for now, For non-Americans & people who missed it. Skip to 1:47:00

Be warned: It's a recording of a stream so there are ad breaks.

bumpbumpitybump

[Kobold-Bard]

Guess what.... "sorry., this video is not available from your location"

Here you go

Not HD, but if you want HD you can get it from itunes or something.

[Dusk Eclipse]

Thanks K-bard, I should bookmark that page for future reference.

[Kobold-Bard]

Thanks K-bard, I should bookmark that page for future reference.

It's what I've done. The one dehro reposted was for those who weren't able to watch it live and wanted to watch it asap after the broadcast (aka. me) because it wasn't up on stream/download sites yet.

[BRC]

I am concerned at the number of chi blockers we have been shown thus far. Ty Lee was effective in the original series not only because of her chi blocking, but also because of her acrobatic skill, flexibility, and speed. While I can accept Amon and perhaps some of his personal guard having that same level of training and agility, I find it hard to believe that anyone who learns chi blocking techniques also becomes so fast that they can avoid trained benders and close with them. I'm hopeful that they will explain later how Amon has managed to train such a large organization without anybody finding out about them.

Well Ty-Lee taught Chi Blocking to the Kyoshi Warriors, so it's possible that helped spread it.
Also, from the Rally it looked like Amon had mister Zappy Sticks and maybe 10-15 Chi-Blockers. His other henchmen seemed to be thugs (Like the doorman) or rabble rousers (like the Protester). It's not like he has an army of chi-blocking gas mask Ninjas.

Hrmm, I'm noticing a lot of things that are reversed from the original series.
In TLA
Aang is very spiritual, but has trouble with direct confrontation and the physical aspects of bending other elements.

The Heroes are a small group battling a large, overt army.

The Antagonists must be defeated through force of arms.
In LoK
Korra is skilled at the physical aspects of Bending, but has trouble with the spiritual side.

Korra is working on the side of the established authority (The City), against a small group of rebels.

The antagonists must be defeated ideologically rather than physically (No amount of fighting is going to stop the Equalist movement unless you can discredit it.).

[memnarch]

Here you go

Not HD, but if you want HD you can get it from itunes or something.

Any suggestions for HD from a not-itunes place?

[Xondoure]

I wonder about energy bending being truly permanent. Surely someone with great chakra control would be able to reawaken their lost abilities in much the same way Aang was supposed to regain the avatar state.

As to Amon's actually having the ability. I don't see why not. The spirit world can't all be in harmony. And a dangerous and powerful villain who claims and then demonstrates a dangerous and powerful technique should reasonably be taken at face value.

All this means is that Korra's true test will be mastering occlumency energy bending.

[MLai]

I'm also quite curious about the proficiency exhibited by the Equalist mooks. While mooks who aren't Cobra/Stormtrooper soldiers is a good thing, these guys in eps 3 are way too good.

Granted the protags aren't experienced in fighting chi-blockers, but it's still not easy to just up and dodge fire/rocks. Zuko couldn't do it when he was flame-less. And, Dim Mak is not some basic martial art. Even in wushia novels with magic kung fu, it was always a highly advanced knowledge. Always.

Each and every single one of Amon's ninja mooks are as good as Ty Lee was. His core troupe better have some special origin. Not just "Oh I trained them for 2 weeks."

[Dusk Eclipse]

Just finished watching episode 3...really intense, much more that what I expected and it shows that the show is targeted towards an slightly older demographic. I definitely like that change.

Though I am not entirely sure these were run of the mill mooks, I mean regardless of Amon's energybending ablity going after benders is risky business, so I think it might be smarter to send some of the best of your troops, perhaps not quirky-miniboss squad level; but something along the lines of that.