Beowulf V. Odysseus.

[Doomboy911]

My friends and I were talking this out and to my surprise everyone believes Beowulf would whoop Odysseus. I had to bring this to the forums who do you think would really win.

[ArlEammon]

Beowulf would if they ever got in melee. Odysseus, on the other hand, is an archer.

[Doomboy911]

Yeah but Odysseus is smart he could easily lead the battle as he wants Beowulf is brash. He did take off his armor just to make the fight more epic.

[Dienekes]

Beowolf can fight underwater for days, swim across oceans, out wrestle a giant, and can kill a dragon in his old age.

In physical competitions he's in a whole other league compared to Odysseus. But Odysseus is incredibly devious, ruthless, and has shown himself willing to do the morally repugnant to win, while also being rather fit himself.

Overall though I do have to give it to Beowolf. It's Superman verse Batman if Batman didn't have any of his technology on him.

[Doomboy911]

Beowolf can fight underwater for days, swim across oceans, out wrestle a giant, and can kill a dragon in his old age.
.

Yeah but the part about fighting underwater was a lie told by Beowulf the giant he wrestled was a freak outside of it's territory and the dragon he killed he had 12 men backing him up.

[eyeofsaulot]

Yeah but the part about fighting underwater was a lie told by Beowulf the giant he wrestled was a freak outside of it's territory and the dragon he killed he had 12 men backing him up.

His men (except for good ol' Wiglaf) ditched him in the dragon fight.

[Dienekes]

Yeah but the part about fighting underwater was a lie told by Beowulf the giant he wrestled was a freak outside of it's territory and the dragon he killed he had 12 men backing him up.

While the race fight have been a lie (don't remember honestly) the fight with Grendel's Mom was also entirely underwater and he lasted for hours. Beowulf is near magical in his feats of combat.

[Spacewolf]

Herc would be a better match for Beowulf in a fight, Odysseus isnt really that much of a fighter after all

[Ravens_cry]

I'd give this to Beowulf. Odysseus is indeed clever, but he is also proud, and known for making rash boasts. For example, he would have gotten home a lot sooner, and some of his men had survived, if he hadn't boasted to a blinded Cyclops who he really was, that his name was not Nobody.
Said Cyclops's father was Poseidon, and Odysseus was travelling by sea.
I bet you know how this ends.

[Doomboy911]

Odysseus is a wicked fighter he took down about twenty men with the help of his son. Also of course Alcaeus would beat beowulf he's the son of two gods. But if we're going by heroes of legend Gilgamesh would mop the floor with everyone. I simply put it up to Odysseus and Beowulf because they're very different. Finally Odysseus bragged to the cyclops but he had no way of knowing he was related to Poseidon. I mean it's some cyclopean sheep herder what are the odds and Beowulf bragged even more than Odysseus so much so that he was willing to take on a monster that killed scores of men without armor just to prove that he could.

[shadow_archmagi]

Odysseus is a wicked fighter he took down about twenty men with the help of his son.

Twenty unarmed nobles isn't really an achievement, since he'd spent the last decade adventuring while they had spent the last decade eating his pigs.

[Mauve Shirt]

I want to give this to Odysseus because I like him more, but Beowulf is stronger than Odysseus.

[Othesemo]

Yeah. I much prefer Odysseus, but I'd have to give this one to Beowulf, shame though it is. Assuming, of course, that the stage for combat doesn't involve Odysseus sitting on top of a cliff, hidden, with his bow.

[Doomboy911]

I don't know if I'd say Beowulf is stronger I mean Odysseus was able to hang from a branch by his arms for three days. Also think back to the fight between Beowulf and Grendel's mother, he could've fought to the death and slay her but he took the easy way out and sided with her. He did this because no one would know his secret that he was afraid of this big bad beast.

[Rinvak]

For as much as I'd like to see Beowulf win, my money would be on Odysseus. Even if he can't physically match Beowulf, he doesn't need to, he just needs to outsmart him. What that would look like exactly I can't really say for sure, but I can tell how it would end. Beowulf beaten, and Odysseus not knowing when to leave well enough alone, would probably proceed to enrage some Divine Being because Pride is his thing and be stuck being harassed by said being, again.

[Dienekes]

I don't know if I'd say Beowulf is stronger I mean Odysseus was able to hang from a branch by his arms for three days. Also think back to the fight between Beowulf and Grendel's mother, he could've fought to the death and slay her but he took the easy way out and sided with her. He did this because no one would know his secret that he was afraid of this big bad beast.

What are you talking about? Beowulf did slay Grendel's mom.

Are you going by the crappy 2007 movie? Cause that's the only one I can think of where Beowulf didn't kill Grendel's mom.

Also, hung from a branch for three days is good, swimming across the ocean in armor is better (also again, can't seem to find anything indicating the fight underwater was a lie, except again, maybe that crappy 2007 movie)

[Dr.Epic]

One killed a monster with no armor or weapons and was only killed as an old man by a dragon, arguably the coolest and deadliest monster in fantasy. The other was too dumb to ask for directions for ten years. My money's on the Bee Hunter.

Now if you want to debate one's CGI film verses the other's mini-series, that's another story.

[Doomboy911]

One killed a monster with no armor or weapons and was only killed as an old man by a dragon, arguably the coolest and deadliest monster in fantasy. The other was too dumb to ask for directions for ten years. My money's on the Bee Hunter.

Now if you want to debate one's CGI film verses the other's mini-series, that's another story.

Well he killed the monster with some help (yes most of them got slaughtered but he did get help. Also Odysseus was not too dumb to get directions he had the gods going against him hindering him at every step. Also think of their reasons (which is just bonus points and has little to do with the actual fight) Beowulf is doing this killing for gold and fame Odysseus is traveling through Tartarus dealing with sorcerors and giants alike for what. To simply go home and see his wife, his kid and his dog and tell them he fought the good fight.)

[McStabbington]

I'll give the edge to Odysseus here. Most people who haven't read The Iliad interpret it through the lens of modern narrative conventions: The Iliad is the story of champion (Achilles) vs. champion (Hector), and Odysseus is naturally the smart guy in Achean League of Heroes.

That's not actually what was happening in the Iliad at all. The thing that kept the Trojans in the war was not Hector. It was the fact that they were all unified under Priam and had a big damn wall. By contrast, the Acheans were hamstrung by the fact that Agammemnon was such a complete tool that the Acheans preferred that Agammemnon lose before Troy did.

But man for man? The Acheans had the biggest assemblage of literary awesomeness until the Justice League. When Odysseus went up against Hector, he beat seven different kinds of crap out of him. The only reason Odysseus isn't more celebrated in the annals of awesome-dom is because he was teammates with Achilles (the best warrior in all of Greece before he got his invulnerability upgrade in later works), Diomedes (the guy who beat down two gods, one of whom was Ares, on the same day as he put Aeneas out of commission by hitting him with a boulder), and Ajax, reputedly stronger than either Achilles or Diomed. So Odysseus vs. Beowulf isn't Batman vs. Superman. It's more like Superman vs. Loki.

[Mando Knight]

Herc would be a better match for Beowulf in a fight, Odysseus isnt really that much of a fighter after all

He's a lover, not a fighter... but he's also a fighter, so don't get any ideas.

He is... The most interesting man in the Aegean.

[dehro]

Odysseus is quite the fighter. Beowulf is "the fighter" in his own epos.
Odysseus on the other hand has several greek gods on his side looking over his shoulder and assisting him when in dire need.

[Dienekes]

I'll give the edge to Odysseus here. Most people who haven't read The Iliad interpret it through the lens of modern narrative conventions: The Iliad is the story of champion (Achilles) vs. champion (Hector), and Odysseus is naturally the smart guy in Achean League of Heroes.

That's not actually what was happening in the Iliad at all. The thing that kept the Trojans in the war was not Hector. It was the fact that they were all unified under Priam and had a big damn wall. By contrast, the Acheans were hamstrung by the fact that Agammemnon was such a complete tool that the Acheans preferred that Agammemnon lose before Troy did.

But man for man? The Acheans had the biggest assemblage of literary awesomeness until the Justice League. When Odysseus went up against Hector, he beat seven different kinds of crap out of him. The only reason Odysseus isn't more celebrated in the annals of awesome-dom is because he was teammates with Achilles (the best warrior in all of Greece before he got his invulnerability upgrade in later works), Diomedes (the guy who beat down two gods, one of whom was Ares, on the same day as he put Aeneas out of commission by hitting him with a boulder), and Ajax, reputedly stronger than either Achilles or Diomed. So Odysseus vs. Beowulf isn't Batman vs. Superman. It's more like Superman vs. Loki.

When did Odysseus ever fight Hector?

[Spacewolf]

I'll give the edge to Odysseus here. Most people who haven't read The Iliad interpret it through the lens of modern narrative conventions: The Iliad is the story of champion (Achilles) vs. champion (Hector), and Odysseus is naturally the smart guy in Achean League of Heroes.

That's not actually what was happening in the Iliad at all. The thing that kept the Trojans in the war was not Hector. It was the fact that they were all unified under Priam and had a big damn wall. By contrast, the Acheans were hamstrung by the fact that Agammemnon was such a complete tool that the Acheans preferred that Agammemnon lose before Troy did.

But man for man? The Acheans had the biggest assemblage of literary awesomeness until the Justice League. When Odysseus went up against Hector, he beat seven different kinds of crap out of him. The only reason Odysseus isn't more celebrated in the annals of awesome-dom is because he was teammates with Achilles (the best warrior in all of Greece before he got his invulnerability upgrade in later works), Diomedes (the guy who beat down two gods, one of whom was Ares, on the same day as he put Aeneas out of commission by hitting him with a boulder), and Ajax, reputedly stronger than either Achilles or Diomed. So Odysseus vs. Beowulf isn't Batman vs. Superman. It's more like Superman vs. Loki.

Ive never heard the story of Odysseus fighting Hector the only person who ive heard who fought hector to a stalemate was Ajax the greater (not bad since he was just about the only hero who never recived devine intervention). In fact the only time i can see them even coming close to fighting was when hector asked for single combat and both Odysseus and ajax volunteered but in the end ajax endied up fighting him.

When he was hanging over Charybdis that was only for at most 1/3rd of a day as charybdis sucked in the sea three times per day. Apart from his bow i carnt really think of anytimes he actually showed any superhuman attributes. Most of the time he just got lucky due to gods looking out for him.

[Ursus the Grim]

So Odysseus vs. Beowulf isn't Batman vs. Superman. It's more like Superman vs. Loki.

My money's still on Superman.

[Ravens_cry]

Odysseus is quite the fighter. Beowulf is "the fighter" in his own epos.
Odysseus on the other hand has several greek gods on his side looking over his shoulder and assisting him when in dire need.

And others who hate his guts.
So, at best, that's a wash. Given the duration of the Odyssey, it seems to be actually a disadvantage.

[dehro]

And others who hate his guts.
So, at best, that's a wash. Given the duration of the Odyssey, it seems to be actually a disadvantage.

they hate his guts and throw stuff at him, but never actually directly try to kill him outright. they put obstacles in his way, some of them lethal, but independent from their direct action once they're put in place. on the other hand, the gods on his side do actively help him out when he's about to kick the bucket giving him energy boosts and rejuvenating him and so on..which has a much more direct impact during or just ahead of a scuffle.
that said, Beowulf is probably a favourite, in outright melee combat.. if he manages to force the situation down that path. Odysseus has enough whiles and ranged weapon skills to make forcing things into melee...really really difficult, if not impossible.

[Ravens_cry]

If the guy can take on a dragon in his dotage, famous for a particular kind of ranged attack, and win, I think he can take care of a guy with a bow.
Odysseus is smart and clever, no doubt about that, but Beowulf is the stronger warrior.

[Doomboy911]

Did Beowulf actually slay the dragon? Because I get the inkling that he hurt it but didn't finish it off. That he left that up for wilgaf but I can't remember exactly.

[WalkingTarget]

Did Beowulf actually slay the dragon because I get the inkling that he hurt it but didn't finish it off. That he left that up for wilgaf but I can't remember exactly.

"Once again the king
gathered his strength and drew a stabbing knife
he carried on his belt, sharpened for battle
he stuck it deep into the dragon's flank.
Beowulf dealt it a deadly wound.
They had killed the enemy, courage quelled his life;
that pair of kinsmen, partners in nobility,
had destroyed the foe. So every man should act,
be at hand when needed; but now, for the king,
this would be the last of his many labours
and triumphs in the world.
Then the wound
dealt by the ground-burner earlier began
to scald and swell; Beowulf discovered
deadly poison suppurating inside him..."

Beowulf dealt the death blow, but had already been injured/poisoned and would later (and it takes him long enough) die from it.

Edit - looking back a bit further, Wiglaf had struck a wound to the dragon's belly just before this passage "and the flames grew weaker" - also helpful.

[Doomboy911]

Ah thank you. Must've missed that part.