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    Empedocles's Avatar

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    Post Very Simple, Possible Soulknife Fix

    The soulknife is among the crappiest base classes in the game.

    Despite this, I'm wondering if a few very simple things couldn't easily bring it up to Tier 4. Basically, I'm just giving it ACFs without penalties here, and honestly this was very spur of the moment and not super developed.

    Full BAB.

    Grant it the bonus feats (as the soulknife bonus feat ACF from Mind's Eye) at 3rd, 7th, 11th, 15th, and 19th level, but do not remove the sudden strike ability.

    Grant it hidden talent instead of wild talent (ACF from Mind's Eye)

    Grant it a shadow bow and improved shadow bow class features, as the shadow soulknife Racial Substitution levels from Dragon Magazine #330. If you don't have access to that, you definitely shouldn't look it up on 4shared. That would be very unethical.

    That's about it. Getting 5 bonus feats and a bow probably isn't enough though, so here's some further expansion that doesn't just give it ACFs without trading anything in return.

    Give him an adapted version of soulbound weapon (the Psychic Warrior ACF from Mind's Eye) that effects his mind blade whenever he summons it. This brings the total bonus he gets on his mind blade up to +9. You might have to switch the levels around though.

    Possibly manifesting powers as a Lurk (from Complete Psionic) or as a Psychic Rogue.

    Maybe...spamming astral constructs as the Divine Mind ACF (from Mind's Eye...you've got enough links by now ) and flavor it as a sort of creature made out of your mind blade?

    If you give him powers as a Lurk, mantles might also be good to have.

    Feedback on this is appreciated, although I wrote it up in less then twenty minutes
    Last edited by Empedocles; 2012-05-01 at 10:17 PM.
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    Bugbear in the Playground
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    Default Re: Very Simple, Possible Soulknife Fix


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    Post Re: Very Simple, Possible Soulknife Fix

    I know that there're much better fixes. This one was mostly an attempt to use official material for homebrew-skeptical players to make the soulknife playable.

    But thanks for the link. This is awesome
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    Default Re: Very Simple, Possible Soulknife Fix

    Bonus feats certainly help. He should definitely be bumped up to a full BAB, though, at a bare minimum. Maybe add lurk/psionic rogue-progression manifesting, but from the psionic warrior list. The first two might or might not push it up a tier, but the latter certainly would.

    If you want an "official" fix, the Pathfinder version is pretty good. Better enhancement progression, recharge psychic strike as a swift+psionic focus action, and a whole bunch of snazzy "blade skills." Should be easy enough to back-convert.
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    Default Re: Very Simple, Possible Soulknife Fix

    Quote Originally Posted by Grod_The_Giant View Post
    Bonus feats certainly help. He should definitely be bumped up to a full BAB, though, at a bare minimum. Maybe add lurk/psionic rogue-progression manifesting, but from the psionic warrior list. The first two might or might not push it up a tier, but the latter certainly would.

    If you want an "official" fix, the Pathfinder version is pretty good. Better enhancement progression, recharge psychic strike as a swift+psionic focus action, and a whole bunch of snazzy "blade skills." Should be easy enough to back-convert.
    I'll second this one, too. Really don't have to devamp anything save for skills.

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    Post Re: Very Simple, Possible Soulknife Fix

    Quote Originally Posted by Grod_The_Giant View Post
    Bonus feats certainly help. He should definitely be bumped up to a full BAB, though, at a bare minimum. Maybe add lurk/psionic rogue-progression manifesting, but from the psionic warrior list. The first two might or might not push it up a tier, but the latter certainly would.

    If you want an "official" fix, the Pathfinder version is pretty good. Better enhancement progression, recharge psychic strike as a swift+psionic focus action, and a whole bunch of snazzy "blade skills." Should be easy enough to back-convert.
    I forgot full BAB. My bad, good catch!

    As for the PF soulknife, I guess that's an easily available option for anyone who wants
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    Default Re: Very Simple, Possible Soulknife Fix

    I agree with the Pathfinder fix.

    Your fix draws heavily from the Mind's Eye alternate class features, which I do approve of. Giving the soulknife the ability to use its knife as a bow isn't a bad idea, but ranged options aren't exactly the best fix for the soulknife. The soulknife's biggest problem is its lack of versatility, and that's more or less already fixed by the Hidden Talent feat.
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    Post Re: Very Simple, Possible Soulknife Fix

    Quote Originally Posted by Thomar_of_Uointer View Post
    I agree with the Pathfinder fix.

    Your fix draws heavily from the Mind's Eye alternate class features, which I do approve of. Giving the soulknife the ability to use its knife as a bow isn't a bad idea, but ranged options aren't exactly the best fix for the soulknife. The soulknife's biggest problem is its lack of versatility, and that's more or less already fixed by the Hidden Talent feat.
    *Sighs* PF has made my own ideas so much less inspiring

    The bow isn't meant to make it a ranged combatant, but more to give it an option against flying character, even if it isn't a good one.
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    Default Re: Very Simple, Possible Soulknife Fix

    Quote Originally Posted by Vilpich View Post
    *Sighs* PF has made my own ideas so much less inspiring
    Sorry, man.

    The bow isn't meant to make it a ranged combatant, but more to give it an option against flying character, even if it isn't a good one.
    A better choice might be to increase the range increment of the Throw Mind Blade ability-- maybe extend it to 60 feet.
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    Default Re: Very Simple, Possible Soulknife Fix

    Quote Originally Posted by Vilpich View Post
    *Sighs* PF has made my own ideas so much less inspiring

    The bow isn't meant to make it a ranged combatant, but more to give it an option against flying character, even if it isn't a good one.
    Maybe grant them the ability to spend PP as a swift action for various movement speed effects?
    "...I worry that modern gaming is gradually shrinking the wide spectrum of gameplay mechanics into a single narrow red bar with "KILL" written on it sideways. Exploration, navigation, puzzles, platforming, all gradually shrinking away until only one thing remains, being taken by the hand from room to room, moving on only when nothing remains alive in each one." - Yhatzee Crosshaw

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    Default Re: Very Simple, Possible Soulknife Fix

    Can I suggest a simple fix?

    Make it a prestige class again as it was in 3E. For the psychic warrior, with almost full power progression (say, 8/10) and most of the features condensed down to 10 levels.
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    Default Re: Very Simple, Possible Soulknife Fix

    Even simpler . . .
    1. Mesh the Psychic Warrior and the Soulknife together (as in gestalt).
    2. Play around with feature positions a bit, for a more or less even spread.

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    Default Re: Very Simple, Possible Soulknife Fix

    Quote Originally Posted by Eldan View Post
    Can I suggest a simple fix?

    Make it a prestige class again as it was in 3E. For the psychic warrior, with almost full power progression (say, 8/10) and most of the features condensed down to 10 levels.
    To simplify things, it should let you manifest call weaponry at will and let you tweak the summoned weapon instead of the normal soulknife class features. One issue I have with the Soulknife is its complexity.

    Yeah, I think that's actually a cool idea. If it has full BAB then it could be worth the reduced manifester progression.
    Last edited by Thomar_of_Uointer; 2012-05-02 at 09:46 AM.
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    Post Re: Very Simple, Possible Soulknife Fix

    Quote Originally Posted by nonsi View Post
    Even simpler . . .
    1. Mesh the Psychic Warrior and the Soulknife together (as in gestalt).
    2. Play around with feature positions a bit, for a more or less even spread.
    That seems like it could be a little OP (maybe Tier 2...?)
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    Default Re: Very Simple, Possible Soulknife Fix

    Quote Originally Posted by nonsi View Post
    Even simpler . . .
    1. Mesh the Psychic Warrior and the Soulknife together (as in gestalt).
    I would do monk and soulknife (and then let the monk use his soulknife as a ki strike weapon or imbue his fists with psychic strike/soulknife enhancements); they're more thematically similar.
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    Default Re: Very Simple, Possible Soulknife Fix

    Quote Originally Posted by Vilpich View Post
    That seems like it could be a little OP (maybe Tier 2...?)
    As far as my understanding of the tier analysis goes, there's nothing in the Soulknife's features that I notice that can bring the Psychic Warrior from tier 3 to tier 2. They don't even synergize all that well. The most that'll happen is some wealth saving thanks to mind blade enhancement & Psychic Strike, the never-unarmed bit and all good saves.
    Nothing special to write home about, but it does make a character feel more round and complete, and without the need to multiclass or PrC - which would be a nice change.

    @Yitzi: I suggested the Psychic Warrior mesh because it seems to me like the more versatile and interesting class of the trio. For me, the core Monk is beyong redemption without some serious overhaul. Except for Knife to the Soul, I don't see any of the Soulknife's abilities bringing new options to the gaming table as far as the Monk goes. A bit more offensive kick, but nothing to make it more fun (unless higher numbers are all that one's after). Correct me if I'm missing anything.

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    Default Re: Very Simple, Possible Soulknife Fix

    Quote Originally Posted by nonsi View Post
    @Yitzi: I suggested the Psychic Warrior mesh because it seems to me like the more versatile and interesting class of the trio. For me, the core Monk is beyong redemption without some serious overhaul.
    I don't really see it that way. It definitely needs boosting, but the monk has some interesting options.

    Except for Knife to the Soul, I don't see any of the Soulknife's abilities bringing new options to the gaming table as far as the Monk goes. A bit more offensive kick, but nothing to make it more fun (unless higher numbers are all that one's after). Correct me if I'm missing anything.
    Once you add in offensive kick (more than just a bit more, by the way, as soulknife enhancement bonuses are quite significant) and a few extra options such as Bladewind and throwing mindblades, I'm not sure what's missing (well, assuming we're not judging by full-caster standards.)

    The ranged option in particular is interesting, as it means that a solo soulknife would be extremely good at kiting.
    My general 3.5 balance fix.
    My psionics remix.
    My common-sense houserules.
    More minor homebrew (weapons, races).

    Complete system remake (under construction, barely started)

    Ever want to try your hand at optimizing, but dislike heavy emphasis on splatbooks and/or the rocket tag phenomenon?
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    Default Re: Very Simple, Possible Soulknife Fix

    I recently had someone show me something that I think is a pretty damn good fix.
    Feats.
    I think I've had enough for a while.

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