Skyrim V: Skyrim

[Calemyr]

hmm... yeah that's a bit absurd, almost reminds me of a pun-pun setup where something gives infinite of everything, not an option... this build sounds like it wouldn't be worth the effort.

It's actually unsettlingly easy to accomplish, and ramps up with exponential effectiveness. The main thing is that it's as close as a console player can get to doing things a PC player can mod in easily, such as setting allies to essential or making unarmed weapons that don't suck.

Otherwise your best bet is Heavy Armor (Iron Fist) + Khajiit Race + Daedric Gauntlets (with Fortify Unarmed) + Ring (with Fortify Unarmed). It's not competitive with max (legit) smithing, but it would be enough to get you through an adept-level run with minimal trouble.

[nhbdy]

It's actually unsettlingly easy to accomplish, and ramps up with exponential effectiveness. The main thing is that it's as close as a console player can get to doing things a PC player can mod in easily, such as setting allies to essential or making unarmed weapons that don't suck.

Otherwise your best bet is Heavy Armor (Iron Fist) + Khajiit Race + Daedric Gauntlets (with Fortify Unarmed) + Ring (with Fortify Unarmed). It's not competitive with max (legit) smithing, but it would be enough to get you through an adept-level run with minimal trouble.

Well the trouble here lies in the fact that I'd have to either use this glitch to ramp my character up (which would take effort to balance properly, then also sets precedent for temptation) or I'd have to go heavy armor khajiit and etc as you've laid out. This wouldn't fit the concept I had in mind, and it would take a tone of equipment slots that would limit my options, in short while it could've been fun I don't think I would enjoy it with my current setup.

[Triaxx]

Light Armor vs. Heavy Armor:

Light armor is, in Skyrim, very advantageous, in most situations. Particularly fighting large foes like dragons, and giants. The big reason being that when you have to run from them, their breath attacks and the big clubs, speed is the key. When you need to move, you need to do it NOW. Most one handed weapons have a short enough range that if you duck back in light armor you'll move quick enough to get clear of the strike and not get hit. It has one massive disadvantage, in that it does not seem to do as much when you're being hit from multiple angles.

Heavy Armor is advantageous in the two most dangerous situations you'll face. One is under attack from two handed weapon users. Heavy armor does much better much earlier to keep those attacks from turning you into paste. The second is under attack from multiple foes. When you're being hit by several enemies at once, the much faster rise in protection from heavy armor means you have precious seconds to crush enemies to slow the incoming damage. The other half of it is that it's heavy, and thus will slow you down. You'll find that your charge is more like a glacier than a rabbit, but that you're also hard to stop.

Both of them equalize at around level 15 or so. On the other hand, Heavy Armor provides stronger weaponry. (Dawnguard Dragon Weapons not withstanding.)

That said, I found myself using a shield more with light armor than I did with Heavy. Mostly to block the blows from the two handed weapons I could neither dodge nor absorb.

[Avilan the Grey]

Okay I am really starting to like my High Elf. Not sure why I never played one before... Of course I really love her looks (for once) especially the eyes.

And the idea of a High Elf that has gone native in Skyrim is fun. Warpaint, bow and arrow, mudcrawling, the works. I don't have a screenshot yet, but I am thinking of changing my avatar when I do

Also, I have decided Alaric will be the assassin. The idea of killing your victim by frenzying him and watching all his closest friends kill him for you...

[Tergon]

Also, I have decided Alaric will be the assassin. The idea of killing your victim by frenzying him and watching all his closest friends kill him for you...

That's one of the things that Skyrim really made fun - the Illusion magic branch. Let's face it, in Oblivion, you made shopkeepers and questgivers like you more, and when you were feeling bored, you mass-frenzied a bunch of townsfolk to watch the slaughter, and that's all you ever did. Now, frenzy-bombing a mob of enemies is a perfectly practical option. The combination of Invisibility and Muffle actually does disguise you. Fear really will shut your enemies down properly for a decent amount of time while you just waltz through the middle of them. It's not only entertaining, they made illusion practical.

That said, I'm still waiting for the magic school to actually include, y'know, an illusion. Show me the ability where you disguise yourself as an enemy to walk through a group (let's say the illusion breaks from bumping into anyone or performing any action). Or let's see the ability where you conjure up an image to distract your enemies with a copy of yourself standing on the other side of the room, and you cheerfully trot past while they're swinging away at it - or failing that, an illusion of something they like that they go over and admire. Hell, just show me something even more simple, the ability to make your target go temporarily blind and run about in a confusion while you stroll by.

It just strikes me as odd that they'd call the skill tree Illusion, and then not allow you to cast anything that could reasonably be called an illusion, despite the game's mechanics giving you a bunch of situations where a simple illusion would do exactly what you want.

[Grue Bait]

Has anyone here ever played a mage/assassin build? What works best?

[Beowulf DW]

Light Armor vs. Heavy Armor:

Light armor is, in Skyrim, very advantageous, in most situations. Particularly fighting large foes like dragons, and giants. The big reason being that when you have to run from them, their breath attacks and the big clubs, speed is the key. When you need to move, you need to do it NOW. Most one handed weapons have a short enough range that if you duck back in light armor you'll move quick enough to get clear of the strike and not get hit. It has one massive disadvantage, in that it does not seem to do as much when you're being hit from multiple angles.

Heavy Armor is advantageous in the two most dangerous situations you'll face. One is under attack from two handed weapon users. Heavy armor does much better much earlier to keep those attacks from turning you into paste. The second is under attack from multiple foes. When you're being hit by several enemies at once, the much faster rise in protection from heavy armor means you have precious seconds to crush enemies to slow the incoming damage. The other half of it is that it's heavy, and thus will slow you down. You'll find that your charge is more like a glacier than a rabbit, but that you're also hard to stop.

Both of them equalize at around level 15 or so. On the other hand, Heavy Armor provides stronger weaponry. (Dawnguard Dragon Weapons not withstanding.)

That said, I found myself using a shield more with light armor than I did with Heavy. Mostly to block the blows from the two handed weapons I could neither dodge nor absorb.

Interesting. To my knowledge, that's more or less how lighter and heavier armors (like full plate) were suppose to work in real life. You could move faster in light armor, which made it ideal for fighting opponents one-on-one or in skirmishes where you'd only fight a few enemies at a time. Heavier armor was for full scale battles where you'd be packed in with a dozen other people who wanted to kill you. You can't block or maneuver effectively in that situation, so you'd have to trust your armor to protect you.

[The_Jackal]

The trouble is, that with sufficient blacksmithing/forging/perks, the light armours are just as good at absorbing damage as the heavy ones, since they have the same mitigation cap. (80% DR @ 567 shown armour rating). While you could argue that heavier armour will reach that cap first, since you'll also want high levels of smithing to improve your weapons as well, the overall superior perks given to light armour easily trump those of heavy.

[Calemyr]

The trouble is, that with sufficient blacksmithing/forging/perks, the light armours are just as good at absorbing damage as the heavy ones, since they have the same mitigation cap. (80% DR @ 567 shown armour rating). While you could argue that heavier armour will reach that cap first, since you'll also want high levels of smithing to improve your weapons as well, the overall superior perks given to light armour easily trump those of heavy.

At the high end you are right. With the right perks and smithing, you can get 567 with either weight class, and with the right perk you can get 0 effective weight which removes the stealth and speed penalties. So in the end the benefits and penalties are effectively moot, but only with significant work.

Where they differ is the few specific perks they have:
Heavy Armor: increased fist damage, reduced fall damage, chance to reflect damage (still take all of it, they just take some of it as well)
Light Armor: increased stamina regen, chance to evade damage

[hunt11]

If you include blacksmithing into the equation then heavy armour does have a major advantage, it requires less of a perk tax then light armour, as every perk spend on heavy armour also dramatically improves your weapon quality.

[Avilan the Grey]

So... having yet to reach any truly challenging combat with any of my characters: How many of you have used the Realistic Combat mod? It is supposed to make things harder, but I find it much easier. I suspect it is because this is how I have tried to play melee all along, and the reworked mechanics just fits me better.

Also... For a fresh out of the cave Mage / Thief... Should I switch the apprentice robe to a leather armor or give that to Faendal? Having the quick magicka regen is great, but I will mainly use bows and underhanded spells in combat, not destruction.

Opinions please?

[Tergon]

I'd just about give it to Faendal. You said you were likely going to be a necromancer or an illusionist, no? To me that says, "Support role". If you do it properly the enemy shouldn't even be looking at you, you should be standing back and letting Faendal and your summoned / enraged mooks take the hits. So superior casting ability, along with less weight to help your stealth when being thiefy, is a bigger boost to you than a few more points in armour. Let your follower be the one who gets hit, not you.

[Beowulf DW]

I've taken to running around in ebony armor when I'm not fighting for the Legion (I keep wavering back and forth on that issue; much as I despise religious persecution, I cannot in good conscience put a racist like Ulfric on the throne). I feel like medieval Batman when ever I put ebony on. All I need is a cape. Crushing the rebellion by sunlight. Defending the meek by moonlight.

[Avilan the Grey]

I'd just about give it to Faendal. You said you were likely going to be a necromancer or an illusionist, no? To me that says, "Support role". If you do it properly the enemy shouldn't even be looking at you, you should be standing back and letting Faendal and your summoned / enraged mooks take the hits. So superior casting ability, along with less weight to help your stealth when being thiefy, is a bigger boost to you than a few more points in armour. Let your follower be the one who gets hit, not you.

I changed my mind on her: she will be a mage / thief. So Illusions and probably bound bow among other things.

[BladeofObliviom]

I changed my mind on her: she will be a mage / thief. So Illusions and probably bound bow among other things.

Does that make her some sort of sneaky Witch-Thief?

[Avilan the Grey]

Does that make her some sort of sneaky Witch-Thief?

Sexy sneaky witchthief actually.

[Morty]

A question to the more experienced players - which element available to Destruction is the best? At some point I'm probably going to have to pick one of the perks that increase their damage. I lean towards Lightning, but I'm not sure if it's the best choice.
Also, are horses worth bothering with? I tried riding one once, but gave up when I realized I can't pick up ingredients from the plants this way.

[Flickerdart]

Fire is obviously the best because, I mean, come on. Fireball.

Lightning is good for fighting mages, but ice is better against melee, so it depends. Fire, though? Fire is always good.

[MachineWraith]

I'd lean towards lightning just by virtue of the fact that almost nothing resists it, relative to fire and frost. Your spell will be useful most of the time, and if whatever you're fighting does happen to resist lightning, you can switch for that one fight.

[Morty]

I've been thinking about going with Lightning for that reason. Elemental resistances are a pain in the ass. Right now I'm content to mix it up, but eventually I'll have to decide.
Speaking of spells, I'm wondering about the usefulness of the Ward spells. They seem a little impractical to me.

[Lamech]

So I was fiddling around with the creation kit, the other day and guess what I discovered? The PC gamer's already have a Werewolf perk tree and a Vampire perk tree! Huzzah! Its just stashed in the creation kit. And... they don't have any perks yet. But that's just a minor set back, we have a werewolf perk tree!
(In all serious, it probably is just a minor set back, we can kife the perks from dawnguard if any modder wants to try hard enough.)

[Tergon]

I've been thinking about going with Lightning for that reason. Elemental resistances are a pain in the ass. Right now I'm content to mix it up, but eventually I'll have to decide.
Speaking of spells, I'm wondering about the usefulness of the Ward spells. They seem a little impractical to me.

They're mainly effective against magic, obviously. The big perk comes from when you know an attack is incoming, and you can block the worst of it. In particular, when fighting dragons, their breath comes at predictable times and you can pull up a two-handed ward to keep the damage off yourself. It'll get you past most booby traps without losing too much health as well, and of course, if you're fighting a mage, you ward with one hand and zap lightning with the other to drain their mana.

Obviously it's no match for a proper shield or armour, but for a cloth-wearing mage it's a very effective tactic to take. It gives you that much more survivability in big fights, no matter who you're against, and used properly they can completely negate the more terrifying spells and magic attacks you face. With the perk that lets them regenerate magicka and some items that lower Restoration casting cost, they can even be used against multiple magic attackers to completely re-juice yourself with no fuss.

They have their weaknesses, especially arrows, but they're a cheap and effective way for a mage to become much harder to kill, and at higher difficulty levels, you very much need that.

[Morty]

I see. So far I have Lesser Ward and only the first perk of Restoration. It does seem to protect me when I do put it up... I'll try to use it more often.

[Gwyn chan 'r Gwyll]

I've taken to running around in ebony armor when I'm not fighting for the Legion (I keep wavering back and forth on that issue; much as I despise religious persecution, I cannot in good conscience put a racist like Ulfric on the throne). I feel like medieval Batman when ever I put ebony on. All I need is a cape. Crushing the rebellion by sunlight. Defending the meek by moonlight.

There's a few cape mods, I think. One of them has a whole pile of hidden unique capes which sounds awesome, and also seems pretty lore-friendly, though how a dwemer cape survived the ages will forever confuse me. Maybe they wove dwemer alloy threads through the thing...

[nhbdy]

There's a few cape mods, I think. One of them has a whole pile of hidden unique capes which sounds awesome, and also seems pretty lore-friendly, though how a dwemer cape survived the ages will forever confuse me. Maybe they wove dwemer alloy threads through the thing...

I just hope you don't get strangled by a magnet in that case...

[Wyntonian]

My copy should arrive TOMORROW! I'm super excited. I have about 300 hours on Oblivion, and I've done enough reading to know about the important changes like enchanting and mysticism and such.

Does anyone have any tips for making a dual-wielder work effectively?

[Triaxx]

Effective? Or SUPER EFFECTIVE!?

Effective is to use a powerful main hand weapon and a dagger in your left. The speed of the left hand weapon determines total attack speed.

SUPER EFFECTIVE!, is an Orc Ninja. You'll wield 2 daggers, specialize in sneak to at least 30, which nets you 15x damage for daggers on a sneak attack, double it to 30x with the Dark Brotherhood, then use the berserk power to double the total damage.

On the PC, the New Alchemy and Enchanting Effects (NAEE) will give you the ability to disenchant the Brotherhood gloves and enchant other things for truly horrifying amounts of damage. Enough to one shot the toughest Deadly Dragons has to offer.

[The_Jackal]

At the high end you are right. With the right perks and smithing, you can get 567 with either weight class, and with the right perk you can get 0 effective weight which removes the stealth and speed penalties. So in the end the benefits and penalties are effectively moot, but only with significant work.

Where they differ is the few specific perks they have:
Heavy Armor: increased fist damage, reduced fall damage, chance to reflect damage (still take all of it, they just take some of it as well)
Light Armor: increased stamina regen, chance to evade damage

Yeah, and that's where the problems start. All of the specific perks for Heavy Armor are corner case at best, absolute bunk at worst, whereas the Light Armour perks are fantastically good. Plus there are fewer you need to buy to reach the top of the tree.

[The_Jackal]

If you include blacksmithing into the equation then heavy armour does have a major advantage, it requires less of a perk tax then light armour, as every perk spend on heavy armour also dramatically improves your weapon quality.

Uh.... no.

The best and cheapest perk price for a smith is two points, to get Elven Smithing. That's enough to get 567 with only one point in Agile Defender. If you go up the heavy side of the tree, you don't get a better weapon than Elven until Ebony, 4 perk points up, and the best of the best weapon, Daedric, is a whopping 3 points better than what you'll get from Elven. Woo.

[Beowulf DW]

There's a few cape mods, I think. One of them has a whole pile of hidden unique capes which sounds awesome, and also seems pretty lore-friendly, though how a dwemer cape survived the ages will forever confuse me. Maybe they wove dwemer alloy threads through the thing...

Regrettably, I am a console player, though I've been considering switching to PC for a while, now.