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    NinjaGuy

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    Default DnD 3.5 Gestalt Duskblade

    I was looking into the Duskblade class and thought it had some really neat options. Pretty obvious from the Duskblade Handbook that two handed weapons and some choice spells along with power attacking is a good thing. However, I recently joined a tabletop game that allows for gestalt. I have never played a Duskblade before but can see a number of interesting combinations with Wizard, Rogue, Fighter, Swordsage, etc. Please provide some ideas for classes that provide the best synergy and the recommended spells and feats for those builds. In this game we are only allowed three classes total (To include a PrC).

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    Default Re: DnD 3.5 Gestalt Duskblade

    I'm a fan of wu jen for this. Nice gishy spells like giant size and body outside body.

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    Default Re: DnD 3.5 Gestalt Duskblade

    My favorite is Factotum. Skills, different spell pool every day, and it's more Int-based goodness. It's difficult to go wrong.
    Wizard definitely brings toys to the Duskblade, including abjuratoin spells for the Abjurant Champion. A good route for a front-line caster.
    Beguiler is nifty. While it doesn't add a whole lot to the Duskblade's main class feature, it does round it out in the spell department, as well as giving more skills and a good Ref save. They even have Advanced Learning.
    Barbarian/Scout makes for a good charger/skirmisher, and Duskblade is the only way I know of to cast spells into a charge.
    Swordsage is definitely a fun way to add diversity to a Duskblade.
    If you just want to throw down magical damage, Warmage is an option.
    Cleric provides plenty of touch spells and some extra survivability.

    If there's any particular class you've wanted to try, but doesn't seem that good, gestalting it with a duskblade is sure to make it more playable while still letting both shine.
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    Default Re: DnD 3.5 Gestalt Duskblade

    Archivist. Don't look back.
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    MindFlayer

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    Default Re: DnD 3.5 Gestalt Duskblade

    ^ Archivist

    Harm + full attack.. 65+ to 130+ dmg per hit @ lvl 13 that keeps scaling... not to mention ALL the other divine spells. Grab Knowledge Devotion and go.

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    Last edited by Bloodgruve; 2012-06-03 at 09:07 AM.

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    Default Re: DnD 3.5 Gestalt Duskblade

    Archivist is imho the best option hands down:
    - Access to an AMAZING spell list (despite the name, Arcane channeling is not limited to arcane spells)
    - Access to DMM with PRCs
    - Mostly SAD (Wis only for bonus spells, can switch that to STR with AeshKrau Illumian or to Int with the Academic Priest feat [Legedns of the twins 12])
    - No arcane spell failure (despite the name, Armored mage is limited to duskblade casting)
    - Great flavour reasons to pick up knowledge devotion

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    Last edited by docnessuno; 2012-06-03 at 09:21 AM.

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    RedWizardGuy

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    Default Re: DnD 3.5 Gestalt Duskblade

    I'd say that your top choices are Archivist, Wizard, Wu-Jen, Factotum and Beguiler.

    Archivist gets you the cleric spell list but with int based casting, and you can channel divine spells, which clerics have a huge amount of, like harm and inflict X wounds. Remember that two casters can work together to scribe a scroll, so you don't need to meet a paladin with scribe scroll to get a paladin spell, you just need to get a paladin that's willing to spend a few hours scribing one with you.

    If the DM lets you work together with an arcane caster to scribe an arcane spell on a divine scroll (making it uncastable except via use magic device, but it's perfect for archivists) then this invalidates Wizard and Wu Jen. (It's a bit iffy, but legal by RAW).

    Wizards and Wu-Jen both add spells to channel and spells to make you better in melee.

    Factotum and Beguiler both add skill points. Factotum gives you a bunch of extra abilities and beguiler gives you illusion and enchantment spells that you don't have. If you go this route, I'd recommend factotum, since most of it's abilities are passive, but most of a beguiler and duskblades abilities are active.

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    Post Re: DnD 3.5 Gestalt Duskblade

    I'd actually say psychic warrior. He lets you buff yourself up, then duskblade drops megatons of damage.

    Of course, if you just want the most optimization possible, archivist is probably the best choice. Wu jen might be third since it has so many buffing options.
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    WolfInSheepsClothing

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    Default Re: DnD 3.5 Gestalt Duskblade

    I always thought that a Monk//Duskblade with Kung fu Genius would be kind of cool. Is it optimized? Hell no. But I always kind liked the idea of doing something like that. However, at that point, you might as well just do Enlightened Fist.

    Wu Jen are pretty fun. They have a lot of buffs so you can turn yourself into a machine that just squashes stuff. As everyone has already said, Archivist is without a doubt the best option overall. Wizard is also a good option. Factotum probably gives you the most options overall, especially with being able to do everything.

    I would stick away from anything that is going to make you any more MAD. Duskblades already need Strength, Constitution, Intelligence, and some Dexterity. Wouldn't want to add Wisdom or Charisma into the mix.

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    Default Re: DnD 3.5 Gestalt Duskblade

    UA Generic Spellcaster (Int) with Versatile Spellcaster is a strong option if allowed, as it lets you stay SAD, and cherry pick the best Touch spells ever for the Duskblade side of things. A lower power combination, but arguably a more interesting one, is Factotum --> Trapsmith --> Swiftblade 10/Duskblade 20 to laugh at the Action Economy.
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    NinjaGuy

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    Default Re: DnD 3.5 Gestalt Duskblade

    These are all excellent ideas. I didn't even think to use WuJen or Arhivist. What races do you consider the best fits for one of these nifty combos?

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    WolfInSheepsClothing

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    Default Re: DnD 3.5 Gestalt Duskblade

    Hard to beat Human. Free feat, better skills, overall it is the best class in the game. If you are willing to lower your intelligence, a Water Orc adds the most physical stats.

    I say go Human.

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    Default Re: DnD 3.5 Gestalt Duskblade

    Human or Illumian (I'd go human archivist and pick up Academic Priest)

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    Default Re: DnD 3.5 Gestalt Duskblade

    Just a suggestion I haven't seen yet, try out feat rouge or Crusaider.

    Sure, neither actively helps MAD, but Crusader adds maneuvers that don't eat your action economy to get back and can help a lot with both mobility and damage output, not to mention between maneuvers, delayed Damage pool, bigger hit die and Furious Counter strike your survivability goes up a lot.

    Or, alternatively, Feat rouge gives you all the bonus feats of the fighter, a good reflex save, trap finding, lots of skill points, and greatly widens you options for class skills as well as giving you other useful defenses like Uncanny Dodge and Evasion. Passively buffing you up can be a great thing in a gestalt.
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    RogueGuy

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    Default Re: DnD 3.5 Gestalt Duskblade

    I have always wanted to pull off a Duskblade // bard / chameleon / swiftblade. Do a little of everything. Put ranks in hide/move sci, a few social skills. Bardic knack will fill in for everything you don't have ranks in.

    Now for race...

    Human is always just the best, hands down.

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    Default Re: DnD 3.5 Gestalt Duskblade

    Quote Originally Posted by Vilpich View Post
    I'd actually say psychic warrior. He lets you buff yourself up, then duskblade drops megatons of damage.
    That seems like a...peculiar choice. Wis rather than Int synergy, overlapping saves, overlapping hit die, and a tiny PP pool.

    I think Psion is a far better choice. Int synergy, the Duskblade covers the psions small hit die, you still get some bonus feats, but if you pick your discipline carefully (helloooo egoist!) you can pick up some great powers to buff yourself before combat.

    Psychic Rogue might be a reasonable choice also.

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    Default Re: DnD 3.5 Gestalt Duskblade

    Arcane Swordsage.

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    Default Re: DnD 3.5 Gestalt Duskblade

    Quote Originally Posted by Morph Bark View Post
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    Default Re: DnD 3.5 Gestalt Duskblade

    Quote Originally Posted by Fouredged Sword View Post
    I have always wanted to pull off a Duskblade // bard / chameleon / swiftblade. Do a little of everything. Put ranks in hide/move sci, a few social skills. Bardic knack will fill in for everything you don't have ranks in.
    Actually, Chameleon is a decent choice. Int based casting from ANY Arcane list (and Wisdom based divine casting from any list if you can afford the wisdom), though only up to 6th level, a floating bonus feat, a floating +2/+4 to an ability score, . Factotum 8/Chameleon 10/Whatever 2 is solid.
    Last edited by deuxhero; 2012-06-03 at 09:14 PM.

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    PirateCaptain

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    Default Re: DnD 3.5 Gestalt Duskblade

    Dwarf Rogue 1 / Monk 1 / Duskblade 13 / Warblade 3 / Bloodstorm Blade 2 // Wizard 5 / Runesmith 1 / Enlightened Fist 7 / Spellwarp Sniper 5 / Wizard 2

    Awesome gestalt duskblade build. Too bad about stupid houserules.
    Last edited by Kaje; 2012-06-04 at 10:07 AM.

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    NinjaGuy

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    Default Re: DnD 3.5 Gestalt Duskblade

    I have been sold on the Archivist/Duskblade combo. Some really great ideas here...thanks to all.

    What would you recommend for stats with a 32 point build....Human as race. Any must haves for level one feats? I am thinking the Legend of the Twins Academic Priest for one.

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    RedWizardGuy

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    Default Re: DnD 3.5 Gestalt Duskblade

    Make sure you pick up Knowledge devotion at some point, if not at level 1.

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    Default Re: DnD 3.5 Gestalt Duskblade

    If it's not too late to throw around build ideas, Dread Necromancer gets a spell list full of Touch Attack spells that can be brutal. Harm, Avasculate via Advanced Learning, more Vampiric Touch spells, and potentially higher level spells than the Archivist via Versatile Spellcaster. Plus, your spell list is less reliant on getting cool non-cleric scrolls off the DM. Also, a Fear aura, a Familiar granting you Immunity to Mind-affecting from level 7, and free debuffs (including negative levels) on Charnel Touch attacks (of which you can use by just replacing your Greatsword for one iterive, still full attack channeling the spell), and having access to Magic Jar. It's something to think about, anyways.
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    Default Re: DnD 3.5 Gestalt Duskblade

    For 32 point buy I'd run Str14, Dex14, Con14, Int16, Wis10, Cha10. Push up Int and Str when you can. Throw skills in knowledge's, concentration and spellcraft.

    Look at Knowledge Devotion and take ranks in the six knowledge skills. Also take Collector of Stories skill trick, talk to your DM and make sure it works together with Know Devotion and Dark Knowledge.

    I would also take Versatile Spellcaster because you won't get bonus spells from wisdom and you can use your DB to fuel the prayer book.

    Get Mithral Plate as soon as you can after 4th level. Archivist is a divine caster but I'm not 100% sure that you don't get spell failure.

    If you can get Alter Self you may want to look at +0LA Teifling so you can get the Outsider options like Dwarven Ancestor with +18 Natural AC :P

    You'll have a good time with this :)

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    Last edited by Bloodgruve; 2012-08-24 at 05:58 PM.

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    Default Re: DnD 3.5 Gestalt Duskblade

    I'm gonna go with "What do you really want to do?"

    I personally think Duskblade 13/ Psi-warrior 7// Either Crusader or Warblade/ and then add in some Psion and Totemist for the Incarnum Recharge Trick and pounce.

    More survivability, more damage, more mobility. Not as optimized as some things, but solid none the less for doing a certain couple of things really well.

    Get able learner and keep your knowledge skill checks up.
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    Default Re: DnD 3.5 Gestalt Duskblade

    Wizard3/Swiftblade9-10/Arcane Duelist X//Duskblade13/Stuff

    Get some action economy in there! Give some bonuses on Int and make you good at melee. A good way to be a gish if you don't want to frak things up with fullcasting (which is very easily done in Gestalt).

    You could also grab feats based on your non-magical melee abilities (power attack, tripping, EWP and a weapon style), and pick up casting features from your PrCs. You should be able to operate competitively in a dead magic zone this way.
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    Default Re: DnD 3.5 Gestalt Duskblade

    You know if for some reason your DM lets you apply Carmidine Monk from champions of valor to Swordsage you are in buisness. At 3rd level you get your int mod to AC in light armor. Add a good Dex and you are nigh unhittable. And your get stances. Oh island of blades is so awesome when you can.channel into it. And suddenly you have enough skills to beat the rogue.

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    Default Re: DnD 3.5 Gestalt Duskblade

    Rainbow Warsnake//Duskblade is nice too. Also, I'd like to throw Trickster Spellthief out there as well.

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    Default Re: DnD 3.5 Gestalt Duskblade

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    Is there any way to get Haste into spells know with the Duskblade/Archivist concept....or would that only come from a different choice for a base class? I like the swiftblade prc but the prereq of the haste spell and the lack of that in the Duskblade list kind of messes that up.



    EDIT: I was doing some out of the box thinking on this. As an archivist, can't you select a spell off a cleric's domain? IE take Haste off the Time domain?
    Last edited by Xaragos; 2012-09-01 at 05:01 PM.

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    Default Re: DnD 3.5 Gestalt Duskblade

    I would suggest Factotum and invest heavily in Font of Inspiration. Now you could use several standard actions a turn during combat, get to pick some choice spells for utility, and are good at everything.

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