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    Default The Feast [3.P Creature][PEACH]

    Visaru
    Medium Deathless
    Hit Dice 8d12+3 (55 hp)
    Speed 30 ft. (6 square)
    Initiative: +3
    Armor Class 23 (+3 Dex, +10 natural), touch 13, flat-footed 20
    Base Attack/Grapple +4/+19
    Attack: Bite +11 melee (1d8+10 plus Improved Grab)
    Full-Attack: Bite +11 melee (1d8+10 plus Improved Grab)
    Space: 5 ft./ 5 ft.
    Special Attacks: Improved Grab, Tainted Saliva
    Special Qualities: Damage reduction 5/–, Darkvision 60 ft., Deathless Traits
    Saves: Fort +4 Ref +5, Will +8
    Abilities: Str 24, Dex 16, Con -, Int 10, Wis 14, Cha 6
    Skills: Balance +10, Climb +14, Hide +15, Jump +10, Listen +2, Move Silently +15, Spot +9
    Feats: Alertness, Great Fortitude, Toughness, Improved GrappleB
    Environment: Any
    Organization: Solitary, warden squad (2–4), or guardian detail (6–10)
    Challenge Rating: 5
    Treasure: Standard
    Alignment: Usually Neutral
    Advancement: 9–16 HD (Medium); 17–24 HD (Large)

    The visaru are deathless who have been severely twisted. These abominations now have a vertically split chest, filled with rows of razor sharp teeth leading to a inflated stomach. A vile green ooze drips from the maw which transfers positive energy on contact.

    Combat
    The visaru's most common tactic is to get in close and simply bite opponents forcing them into a grapple. They then drench the foe in their vile saliva which both burns foes and heals the deathless.

    Improved Grab (Ex): To use this ability, a Visaru must hit a Large or smaller opponent with a Bite attack. It can then attempt to start a grapple as a free action without provoking an attack of opportunity. If it wins the grapple check, it establishes a hold and can use its Tainted Saliva. Visaru receive a +4 racial bonus on grapple checks, which is already included in the statistics block.

    Tainted Saliva (Su): Once a turn while grappling, a Visaru can drench his foe in horrid ooze. This deals 1d4 acid damage and 1d8 negative energy damage to the grappled target. In addition the Visaru is healed by one point for each point of damage dealt by Tainted Saliva.

    If use of this ability would heal the target because of the negative energy damage, the Visaru doesn't regain any health.

    This saliva becomes inert after I round. In addition Visaru is immune to the damaging effects of its saliva.
    Last edited by Milo v3; 2012-06-18 at 04:47 PM.
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    Default Re: The Feast [3.P Creature][PEACH]

    How do these guys not hurt themselves with their own Tainted Saliva? Since Deathless take damage from Negative energy.

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    Default Re: The Feast [3.P Creature][PEACH]

    Since it has 8 HD, it should have 3 feats not 4 unless you designate one of the feats as a bonus feat.

    It only has one sole attack so it should add 1½ Str modifier to damage.

    A creature's primary attack damage includes its full Strength modifier (1½ times its Strength bonus if the attack is with the creature’s sole natural weapon)...
    If there is no save to Tainted Saliva special attack, you need to state so. Otherwise it looks like a save is missing. If there is a save to avoid the damage, you should decide what the result of failed is. No damage, half damage, etc. DC is 10 + 1/2 creature's HD + charisma modifier. Supernatural abilities are always based off charisma.

    Debby
    Last edited by Debihuman; 2012-06-17 at 11:08 AM.
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    Default Re: The Feast [3.P Creature][PEACH]

    Quote Originally Posted by Debihuman View Post
    Since it has 8 HD, it should have 3 feats not 4 unless you designate one of the feats as a bonus feat.

    It only has one sole attack so it should add 1½ Str modifier to damage.



    If there is no save to Tainted Saliva special attack, you need to state so. Otherwise it looks like a save is missing. If there is a save to avoid the damage, you should decide what the result of failed is. No damage, half damage, etc. DC is 10 + 1/2 creature's HD + charisma modifier. Supernatural abilities are always based off charisma.

    Debby
    I think the four feats are because it's designed with the pathfinder feat system, where you get one every other level/HD(so 1, 3, 5, and 7 for four).
    Also, I do agree with the others, the negative energy attack is a bit odd, though you could make the visaru immune to it with enough negative energy resistance(postitive energy resistance exists as a feat for undead, so it doesn't seem to far fetched to make a creature with resistance to negative energy).
    edit; also, where does it state that thing about supernatural abilties being based off of charisma?, I can't remember ever having heard abot that rule before.edit2; also i dont mean the question about the charisma based save thing as an insult, I just had't run accross it before, and finding out when it applies would be useful for making binder characters or npcs
    Last edited by Togath; 2012-06-17 at 11:28 AM.
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    Default Re: The Feast [3.P Creature][PEACH]

    Quote Originally Posted by Troll Brau View Post
    How do these guys not hurt themselves with their own Tainted Saliva? Since Deathless take damage from Negative energy.
    The saliva drains positive energy and places it in the Visaru. It creates a complete circuit with the Visaru.

    Quote Originally Posted by Debihuman View Post
    Since it has 8 HD, it should have 3 feats not 4 unless you designate one of the feats as a bonus feat.
    The B after Improved Grab designated it as a Bonus Feat.

    It only has one sole attack so it should add 1½ Str modifier to damage.
    I'll fix.

    If there is no save to Tainted Saliva special attack, you need to state so.
    Why? If there is a save then it would have details about the save, if it doesn't have a save then it doesn't have a save.
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    Default Re: The Feast [3.P Creature][PEACH]

    Quote Originally Posted by Debihuman View Post
    Supernatural abilities are always based off charisma.

    Debby
    Breath Weapons beg to differ.


    Quote Originally Posted by Milo v3 View Post
    The saliva drains positive energy and places it in the Visaru. It creates a complete circuit with the Visaru.
    And that's alright for fluff. But as is, these guys hurt themselves with their signature ability.
    Last edited by Tanuki Tales; 2012-06-17 at 08:43 PM.

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    Default Re: The Feast [3.P Creature][PEACH]

    Supernatural abilities that are mental in nature are almost always based on charisma. One's that are physical are based off a physical stat, unless that stat is a non-stat for the creature (like an undead with a breath weapon). Then that is based off of charisma.

    I'd just say that he's immune to the effects of his own saliva and call it a day. Also, is he gaining health from the acid and the negative damage, or just the negative?

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    Default Re: The Feast [3.P Creature][PEACH]

    Quote Originally Posted by Troll Brau View Post
    And that's alright for fluff. But as is, these guys hurt themselves with their signature ability.
    How do they hurt themselves...

    Quote Originally Posted by Techwarrior View Post
    Also, is he gaining health from the acid and the negative damage, or just the negative?
    He gains health from acid and negative energy damage, as it he didn't seem to gain enough health to survive long in battle when it was just negative.
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    Default Re: The Feast [3.P Creature][PEACH]

    Quote Originally Posted by Milo v3 View Post
    How do they hurt themselves...
    Deathless are damaged by Negative Energy and your Visaru has no caveats in its mechanics text that it is either immune to Negative Energy damage or that it is immune to its own Tainted Saliva.

    It's really hazy when you get down to the RAW of it, but at some point the saliva is in contact with the Visaru itself and it's in the state of dealing Negative Energy damage and at that point it's also hurting the Visaru. Or, since you never mention when the saliva become inert, the saliva could be smeared back on the Visaru. I can't think of any precedence for something like this or any rules to explain it concretely and it definitely falls under the same kind of RAW as Drowning healing you, but it's there somewhere.

    And trying to figure out exactly where this falls on the RAW is a headache and I would suggest just adding a caveat that the Visaru is immune to its own saliva or that it has flat Negative Energy Resistance or Immunity.

    Edit: At least, I think this is RAW. Are there any examples of creatures dealing energy damage they aren't resistant or immune to?
    Last edited by Tanuki Tales; 2012-06-17 at 10:10 PM.

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    Default Re: The Feast [3.P Creature][PEACH]

    @OP: I'm not at all sure why this is a Deathless, instead of simply a standard undead.

    Quote Originally Posted by Troll Brau View Post
    Edit: At least, I think this is RAW. Are there any examples of creatures dealing energy damage they aren't resistant or immune to?
    Most oozes deal acid damage on their natural attacks, and are not generally immune or resistant to acid.
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    Default Re: The Feast [3.P Creature][PEACH]

    Quote Originally Posted by Troll Brau View Post
    Snip
    The saliva doesn't generate negative energy, which is why it doesn't damage the creature. I'll explain how this works. The saliva functions as a medium for energy transportation. Say the Tainted Saliva ability affects a living wolf. This causes the wolf to be damaged by the acid firstly. Secondly positive energy from the Wolf is removed from the wolf. This energy then enters the body of the visaru.

    When it contact with its own saliva the positive energy within it is removed and transfered through the saliva into its body again, thus creating the completed circuit.

    Basically say he is on 50 HP. He is touching his saliva, dealing himself say 3 negative energy damage (Representing Positive energy being removed). He is then healed 3 points (Representing Positive energy entering Visaru). 50 -3 +3 = 50. I didn't factor in acid as he would be immune to the acid in his own spit.

    Quote Originally Posted by tuggyne View Post
    @OP: I'm not at all sure why this is a Deathless, instead of simply a standard undead.
    It feeds off positive energy firstly. Secondly one of my players is creating a deathless army and I really hate the 3.5e deathless, so we are making new ones from scratch.
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    Default Re: The Feast [3.P Creature][PEACH]

    Quote Originally Posted by tuggyne View Post
    Most oozes deal acid damage on their natural attacks, and are not generally immune or resistant to acid.
    Ah, that they do. But isn't that an Extraordinary attack while this one is Supernatural?

    @Milo: And as I said, that's fine for fluff, but that isn't crunch. Oozes are precedent but they're also doing Acid damage with an Extraordinary attack, while your guy is doing Negative Energy damage with a Supernatural one. I think it'd just be simpler and save possible discussions and headaches if you just included in Tainted Saliva's rule text that a Visaru is immune to it's own Tainted Saliva.

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