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    Default The Grebblits (Race)

    The Grebblits

    The Grebblits are undead creatures that prey on anyone who wanders too far away from the city, to deep into the wilderness. They lurk around civilization and wait for living creatures to stray to far into their reach. They are carnivorous and eat any meat, but to them the flesh of a human is a savory treat...

    Personality: Grebblits are chaotic evil creatures with a mind of chaos, they only socialize with other Grebblits because its beneficial to them, more hands means more hunting. More hunting means more food.... more humans to eat.
    They care little for anything other then eating, and will eat all day everyday if they can. They don't beat around the bush with trickery, only patience and waiting. Waiting just long enough for them to get out of sight from the others, then they don't play with their food; they swoop in with knives and blades. The only boon is that the Grebblits prefer their meat fresh, and will keep their victims alive until they are cooked- cooked food tastes so much better to them.

    Physical Description: Grebblits look like bipedal rabbits often torn in places with bones sticking out and chunks missing from their sides with bite marks a plenty from squabbles around the cooking pot. They often wear clothes they loot from the bodies they steal away. They are small, and quick creatures with sharp spike like teeth and faded white eyes.
    They always weight anywhere from 50 to 100 pounds and they all stand 3.5 feet tall.
    They are not born, they are made. They are created by the same All Evil the Melbred serve, created as a wicked accomplice in the consumption of the living.

    Alignment: Grebblits are always chaotic evil.

    Adventures: Grebblits sometimes adventure to break away from the pack, to find their own food so there is more for themselves. They'd adventure to seek new flavors, new tastes, new flesh to consume. Grebblits love eating more then anything, and the idea of eating exotic flesh fills their mind and pushes them towards adventuring.


    Grebblits:
    small undead (magical beast)
    +4 Dex, +2 Str*

    *- this already factors strength penalties due to size.
    Small Size
    40ft speed

    Natural Weapons: Grebblits have claws that deal normal claw damage for a creature of its size, and a bite attack that deals damage as if it was two size categories larger (i.e. claws do 1d4 points of damage and bite does 2d6 points of damage).
    Taste of Death (Ex): A grebblit that has done melee damage to a creature can take a swift action to taste its blood, or savor a chunk of its flesh, so long as it could do so (i.e. a grebblit need to be able to lick its blade, or pick up a severed limb; bite attacks do this automatically).
    The grebblit takes on a frenzied state that pushes it to deal extra damage equal to its HD or character level, and takes a fourth of that as a penalty to AC. A 20th level grebblit deals 10 extra damage per attack, and has a -5 penalty to AC.
    Blood Hunt (Su): A grebblit who has tasted a creature always knows its general direction and can sense its presence. A blood-red mist, visible only to the grebblit, emanates from the tasted creature, marking it and foiling any disguise, illusion, and shapechanging effects. A grebblit can can target a tasted creature with spells, spell-like effects and supernatural abilities without line of sight or line of effect. The mist is a mental effect that only affects the grebblit. There is no save and no way to discover this effect, not even by magical or supernatural means. This lasts until either the target or the grebblit is dead.
    Pack Hunt (Su): A grebblit can cut its paw like hand and make a similar cut on the palm of another creature. By shaking these two hands together a pact is made and now both creatures can sense a single creature the grebblit can sense in the same way as the grebblit can through Blood Hunt. If the other creature is also a grebblit, it can share one creature it has tasted as well at the same time.
    Skill Bonuses: A grebblit has a +2 racial bonus to the following skills: Intimidate, Jump, Listen, and Move Silently
    Automatic Languages: Common
    Bonus Languages: Any
    Favored Class: Ranger or Barbarian
    Level Adjustment: 2
    Last edited by Cipherthe3vil; 2012-06-24 at 01:35 PM.

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    Default Re: The Grebblits (Race)

    First, an evil Undead creature shouldn't be a Player Character Race at all. Second, it's Undead (Augmented Magical Beast) as the correct subtype.

    Augmented Subtype: creature receives this subtype whenever something happens to change its original type. Some creatures (those with an inherited template) are born with this subtype; others acquire it when they take on an acquired template. The augmented subtype is always paired with the creature’s original type. A creature with the augmented subtype usually has the traits of its current type, but the features of its original type.
    Since we don't have the stats for a living grabbit, it's pretty hard to judge what an Undead grabbit should be.

    I don't understand Taste of Blood. This makes it sound like something it would get if it successfully bites someone. What is the normal damage a bite does (since this adds extra damage, you need a base damage.

    Speed doesn't make a lot of sense. Small creature's usually have a base speed of 20 feet. A fast speed for a Small creature is 30 ft. (40 ft. just strikes me as too fast). If they are so fast, why do they "lurk" and not just chase down their prey. Your text and stats contradict.

    Why does this creature have better than average stats? It gets these adjustments just for being Small-- +1 Size, which applies to Armor Class and Attack Bonus, -4 Grapple, and +4 to Hide. I can see giving it +4 Dex but not +2 Str. These are quick opponents not ones that overpower their enemies. I recommend +4 Dex and -2 Str.

    A grebblit that has done damage to a creature can take a swift action to taste its blood, or savor a chunk of its flesh.
    Since this has the Augmented Magical Beast subtype, it is only proficient with natural attacks. This seems like it has just a bite attack. It is Small, so a Small creature's bite is likely its only attack doing 1d4 damage plus 1 and 1/2 Str damage. It sounds like you just didn't want to call it Rend.

    Giving it additional damage equal to 1/2 it's HD scales but I'm not a fan of it. It's a lot easier if it adds a static amount of damage.

    I do not understand the "frenzied state" It's a rip-off of Rage but without the cool benefits. The extra damage does not off-set the loss of AC. And that AC penalty is way too severe. I'd never play one of these for that alone.

    Blood Hunt is not the best name. Really this is like Bloodsense but with the ooky mist that follows the target. Can everyone see this mist or just the grabbit? How do you get rid of the mist effect? There should be a save to avoid it as well.

    They are not born, they are made. They are created by the same All Evil the Melbred serve, created as a wicked accomplice in the consumption of the living.
    How, then, are these not Constructs rather than Undead? Again, there is a disconnect between the text and the creature's traits.

    Overall, this needs a lot of work to just make sense and be something people want to play rather than be just another adversary to defeat.

    Debby
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    Default Re: The Grebblits (Race)

    Quote Originally Posted by Debihuman View Post
    First, an evil Undead creature shouldn't be a Player Character Race at all. Second, it's Undead (Augmented Magical Beast) as the correct subtype.



    Since we don't have the stats for a living grabbit, it's pretty hard to judge what an Undead grabbit should be.
    ... Because there ARE no living Grabbits.

    Apparently you've never heard of the many players who play evil characters.

    I don't understand Taste of Blood. This makes it sound like something it would get if it successfully bites someone. What is the normal damage a bite does (since this adds extra damage, you need a base damage.
    Yes, I seem to have forgotten to give them Bite. But the ability functions whenever it deals damage, as it says. Ie; you lick the blood soaked blade/axe/dagger. Hmm. But me going back and saying that does bring a different point I'll fix.
    Speed doesn't make a lot of sense. Small creature's usually have a base speed of 20 feet. A fast speed for a Small creature is 30 ft. (40 ft. just strikes me as too fast). If they are so fast, why do they "lurk" and not just chase down their prey. Your text and stats contradict.
    It does NOT contredict. Just because they lurk does not mean they must be slow, just because they are small does not mean they have to be slow.
    They are fast, but their slow, imagine that.

    Why does a Cheeta slink low through the tall grass? To get closer. To get an opportune strike. Because they can.
    Why does this creature have better than average stats? It gets these adjustments just for being Small-- +1 Size, which applies to Armor Class and Attack Bonus, -4 Grapple, and +4 to Hide. I can see giving it +4 Dex but not +2 Str. These are quick opponents not ones that overpower their enemies. I recommend +4 Dex and -2 Str.
    Because the Grebblits are made that way. They are made to be compact and stronger, with powerful limbs and jaws with which to tear their victims apart.
    Since this has the Augmented Magical Beast subtype, it is only proficient with natural attacks. This seems like it has just a bite attack. It is Small, so a Small creature's bite is likely its only attack doing 1d4 damage plus 1 and 1/2 Str damage. It sounds like you just didn't want to call it Rend.

    Giving it additional damage equal to 1/2 it's HD scales but I'm not a fan of it. It's a lot easier if it adds a static amount of damage.

    I do not understand the "frenzied state" It's a rip-off of Rage but without the cool benefits. The extra damage does not off-set the loss of AC. And that AC penalty is way too severe. I'd never play one of these for that alone.
    It is NOT a rip off of anything.
    Blood Hunt is not the best name. Really this is like Bloodsense but with the ooky mist that follows the target. Can everyone see this mist or just the grabbit? How do you get rid of the mist effect? There should be a save to avoid it as well.
    Like hell there should. It doesn't effect them at all. It effects the Grebblit, the Grebblit sees it, no one else does. Because this mist is not on them at all. Its a mental effect behind the Grebblit itself.
    How, then, are these not Constructs rather than Undead? Again, there is a disconnect between the text and the creature's traits.
    Just because its created does not make it a construct.
    Last edited by Cipherthe3vil; 2012-06-23 at 10:19 PM.

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    Default Re: The Grebblits (Race)

    I'm not going to get terribly into this, but I'd note that Blood Hunt does need some clearing up. Namely, as-written, you could taste somebody once, 12 years ago, and then Fireball them when you next come within one mile of them. You state no duration for it. Is it meant to be a permanent effect? If so, I could easily imagine Grebblits trading around small traces of the blood of important people, each "Collecting" tastes of many. Not sure if that was intended or not.

    As for Range on spells cast on a Blood Hunted creature: Huh? How does this even? Alright, I get that it helps you track them. I could understand overcoming Concealment or Cover, or giving a bonus to Ranged Touch Attacks or something like that. Maybe even something as powerful as doubled range. But.. Your fireball teleports 1 mile to hit them in the face, ignoring the 15-foot steel wall between you? I can't understand how that works out.


    Debi: Do note that the LA on this has yet to be determined, so that alters balance level a bit. But I agree on most of your points.
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    Default Re: The Grebblits (Race)

    Quote Originally Posted by Welknair View Post
    I'm not going to get terribly into this, but I'd note that Blood Hunt does need some clearing up. Namely, as-written, you could taste somebody once, 12 years ago, and then Fireball them when you next come within one mile of them. You state no duration for it. Is it meant to be a permanent effect? If so, I could easily imagine Grebblits trading around small traces of the blood of important people, each "Collecting" tastes of many. Not sure if that was intended or not.

    As for Range on spells cast on a Blood Hunted creature: Huh? How does this even? Alright, I get that it helps you track them. I could understand overcoming Concealment or Cover, or giving a bonus to Ranged Touch Attacks or something like that. Maybe even something as powerful as doubled range. But.. Your fireball teleports 1 mile to hit them in the face, ignoring the 15-foot steel wall between you? I can't understand how that works out.


    Debi: Do note that the LA on this has yet to be determined, so that alters balance level a bit. But I agree on most of your points.

    Yes its all well and intended. Grebblits trading around blood samples would be a trendy blackmarket deal and very useful for assassinations.

    You would have answered your own question, teleports 1 mile to hit them in the face. Why would it be bothered by a 15ft steel wall?

    It'd still be wrong though. The spell is cast through the victim's blood, making them explode with a fireball from the inside out.
    Which brings up another point, I should say that ranged-attack spells all use touch AC.

    The use of blood as curses like this is common in witchy mythos.
    Last edited by Cipherthe3vil; 2012-06-24 at 09:55 AM.

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    Default Re: The Grebblits (Race)

    Quote Originally Posted by Cipherthe3vil View Post
    You would have answered your own question, teleports 1 mile to hit them in the face. Why would it be bothered by a 15ft steel wall?
    I was meaning to convey how I thought that a teleporting fireball was absurd. I thought that all it did was make it easier to find/hit the target, because of the red cloud? What's the explanation for it drastically increasing the range of pretty much all spells? This ability alone would make Grebblits the scariest caster ever. You fight one of them years ago, it gets a cut on you (heck, they'd probably engineer a syringe to be more efficient about it) and then they trade your blood around. Any Grebblit you encounter from then on has a chance to be able to bombard you with spells from a ridiculous range. Why would anyone wishing to play a Fullcaster NOT play a Grebblit? The LA ought to be pretty high to compensate for that ability alone.

    Quote Originally Posted by Cipherthe3vil View Post
    The use of blood as curses like this is common in witchy mythos.
    I am by no means an expert on these, but my impression was that such magic (Sympathy Magic, using the blood) usually was confined to Divination and Enchantment spells.
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    Default Re: The Grebblits (Race)

    So, grebblits ignore ranges for spells? That worth a few LA right there.

    This is what I was going to say but it's rather a moot point now:
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cipherthe3vil View Post
    ... Because there ARE no living Grabbits.
    Well, that's just silly. What's happens if you cast true resurrection on one? The grebblit would be resurrected as the Magical Beast it started from. It may not be a "grebblit" per se, but it would be a living creature.
    they don't play with their food; they swoop in with knives and blades. The only boon is that the Grebblits prefer their meat fresh, and will keep their victims alive until they are cooked- cooked food tastes so much better to them.
    They need a weapon proficiency to use blades (Magical Beasts don't have it) and Undead creatures are only proficient with simple weapons so apparently grebblits use daggers. You should note the simple weapon proficiency in the grebblit's traits.

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    Apparently you've never heard of the many players who play evil characters.
    I've heard of munchkins too, but that doesn't necessarily mean it makes for a good game. Sure, I've played evil creatures too and they tend to turn on each other as that is the nature of evil. Nothing like watching the in-fighting to get the blood going. It has real friendship destroying potential (seen it, heard about it, read about too) that should not be taken lightly.

    My players would all want to play grebblit clerics just so they could try to rebuke each other for fun and profit. If they were high enough level, they'd cast true resurrect on each other for the sport of killing and remaking a new grebblit. The one with the most after 24 hours wins. Yeah, my players would try to do that. Worse, I'd let them. It's fun the first time. The second time, it starts to get mean. The only way to keep this in check is to make sure everyone is having fun with it and to end it promptly as soon as someone becomes the "easy" target. I prefer to DM not referee.

    Sorry for the spoiler but this was rather off topic.


    It does NOT contradict. Just because they lurk does not mean they must be slow, just because they are Small does not mean they have to be slow.
    I didn't say that they HAD to be slow. I was pointing out that Small creatures usually have a base speed of 20 ft. A fast small creature has a base speed of 30 ft. A small creature with a base speed of 40 ft that is also a lurker is just strange. To lurk is to move furtively; sneak. It's kinda hard to do that and be fast, just saying. Lurking is not ambushing. They are different things.

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    Cheetahs lie in wait for prey so they can catch them easier. They are fast but have no endurance. They don't ambush their prey because "they can"; it's because they have to or they starve. This creature is Undead so it isn't going to poop out after a short sprint. It may like to eat but because it is Undead it does not have to. This is more like a compulsion than an actual physical need for food, like a ghoul's hunger. Again, this is veering off-topic.


    Here's Rage: In a rage, a barbarian temporarily gains a +4 bonus to Strength, a +4 bonus to Constitution, and a +2 morale bonus on Will saves, but he takes a -2 penalty to Armor Class,

    Here's Frenzied Blood: a grebblit gains extra damage equal to half his hit dice but he takes a -5 penalty to armor class. (You didn't mention whether this was a temporary bonus to damage or not).

    So, yeah it's a pastiche of rage, albeit with a different effect but with far less bonus and more far more penalty. If you hadn't gotten all bent out of shape over it, you would have realized this yourself. Note: the barbarian gains temporary hit points due to the Con bonus (which the grebblit can't have because it's Undead).

    A barbarian grebblit takes a whopping -7 penalty to AC while raging. Plus he gets no Con bonuses, is destroyed at 0 hit points, and is subject to turning. I think the penalties are outweighing the bonuses here. A grebblit ranger fares a lot better.

    Eating part of your enemy so you can track him down is cool but kinda gross. Only the grebblits can sense the mist this so the rest of the grebblit's party can't even get in on the ambiance, unless you are playing an all grebblit party. Since they only socialize with other grebblits, this make a lot of sense, though it mostly limits PCs to either play all grebblits. Might be hard to get group consensus for that but it might be a fun experiment.

    Blood Hunt is pretty good, just needs little tweaking to make it a bit more concise . It a shame the mist's effects on the victim are only visible to grebblit because it's a generally creepy effect that nobody gets to see. Oh well.... Also, you didn't mention how long the effect lasts. I'm guessing until either the target or the grebbit is dead.

    I think this wording may be more precise:

    Blood Hunt (Su): A grebblit who has tasted a creature always knows its general direction and can sense its presence. A blood-red mist, visible only to the grebblit, emanates from the tasted creature, marking it and foiling any disguise, illusion, and shapechanging effects. A grebblit can sense a tasted creature for up to a mile and can target it with spells, spell-like effects and supernatural abilities without line of sight or line of effect. The mist is a mental effect that only affects the grebblit. There is no save and no way to discover this effect, not even by magical or supernatural means. This lasts until either the target or the grebblit is dead.

    You have so much flavor in your text (pun intended) that it's a shame it isn't reflected in the grebblit traits. Here's the updated grebblit traits for ya (proofread, edited, and all that jazz):

    Grebblit Traits (Ex)
    • Small Undead (Augmented Magical Beast)
    • +4 Dex, +2 Str*
      *- this already factors strength penalties due to size.
    • Small Size
    • Land speed 40 ft.
    • Proficient with Natural Weapons and Simple Weapons
    • Natural Weapons: Grebblits have claws that deal normal claw damage for a creature of its size, and a bite attack that deals damage as if it was two size categories larger (i.e. claws do 1d4 points of damage and bite does 2d6 points of damage).
    • Taste of Death (Ex): A grebblit that has done melee damage to a creature can take a swift action to taste its blood, or savor a chunk of its flesh, so long as it could do so (i.e. a grebblit need to be able to lick its blade, or pick up a severed limb; bite attacks do this automatically).
    • Blood Hunt (Su): A grebblit that has tasted a creature always knows its general direction and can sense its presence. A blood-red mist, visible only to the grebblit emanates from the tasted creature, marking it and foiling any disguise, illusion, and shapechanging effects. A grebblit can sense a tasted creature for up to a mile and can target it with spells, spell-like effects and supernatural abilities without line of sight or line of effect. The mist is a mental effect that only affects the grebblit. There is no save and no way to discover this effect, not even by magical or supernatural means. This lasts until either the target or the grebblit is dead.
    • Skill Bonuses: A grebblit has a +2 racial bonus to the following skills: Intimidate, Jump, Listen, and Move Silently
    • [Automatic Languages: Common
    • Bonus Languages: Any
    • Favored Class: Ranger or Barbarian
    • Level Adjustment: +1


    P.S. I had realized I'd misspelled the creature's name in my earlier post so it's corrected here.

    Debby
    Last edited by Debihuman; 2012-06-24 at 12:46 PM.
    P.E.A.C.H. Please Evaluate And Critique Honestly. Being nicer and kinder doesn't hurt either.

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