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  1. - Top - End - #391
    Firbolg in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: Deathknell Chronicles OOC

    Quote Originally Posted by Nyarai View Post
    I would go for blackout curtains, which I have IRL. (Light sleeper. *ba dum tisch*) One layer lets insanely filtered light in. Two layers let zero light in.
    I've considered them and would pursue if daelrog feels there would be ones available that would be absolute enough.

  2. - Top - End - #392
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    OrcBarbarianGuy

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    Default Re: Deathknell Chronicles OOC

    Those would be fine, but Claire will have to find something else tonight in the meantime until she can get to the store.

  3. - Top - End - #393
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    Default Re: Deathknell Chronicles OOC

    Oh yes a future project.

    Umm you going to want any rolls for rigging up a nice opaque rubber sheet so Claire doesn't fry herself in the bathroom, I'm busy at the moment but was going to put up a big post to wrap up Claire's night some time tomorrow.

  4. - Top - End - #394
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    OrcBarbarianGuy

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    Default Re: Deathknell Chronicles OOC

    No, I don't think rolls are needed. Besides, a botch or something would make things utterly silly.

  5. - Top - End - #395
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    Default Re: Deathknell Chronicles OOC

    Re: wrapping up the night. Two-three posts more from me and then I should be done as well.

    "Tales and dreams are the shadow-truths that will endure when mere facts are dust and ashes, and forgot" - N.Gaiman, The Sandman

  6. - Top - End - #396
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    Default Re: Deathknell Chronicles OOC

    A small ooc consideration: in my experience, moving from a house takes at least two days, an untold number of curses and a LOT more bags. Case in point: me moving from my first room to my first apartment... And I had only lived there six months.

    We'll call it artistic licence, I guess.

    "Tales and dreams are the shadow-truths that will endure when mere facts are dust and ashes, and forgot" - N.Gaiman, The Sandman

  7. - Top - End - #397
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    Default Re: Deathknell Chronicles OOC

    Quote Originally Posted by Strawberries View Post
    A small ooc consideration: in my experience, moving from a house takes at least two days, an untold number of curses and a LOT more bags. Case in point: me moving from my first room to my first apartment... And I had only lived there six months.

    We'll call it artistic licence, I guess.
    You probably have a lot more "stuff you care about" than Amy, not to mention items that a vampire wouldn't need.
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  8. - Top - End - #398
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    Default Re: Deathknell Chronicles OOC

    Quote Originally Posted by Nyarai View Post
    You probably have a lot more "stuff you care about" than Amy, not to mention items that a vampire wouldn't need.
    Not in that apartment I didn't. Still took three trips. Maybe I'm just a hoarder

    "Tales and dreams are the shadow-truths that will endure when mere facts are dust and ashes, and forgot" - N.Gaiman, The Sandman

  9. - Top - End - #399
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    Default Re: Deathknell Chronicles OOC

    I have decided I will try out something new to assist me with playing Danielle ... look for feedback from other players (and the storyteller).

    Just wondering if there is anything about how I play her that you either (a) like or (dislike).

    Not really asking about how your characters feel just you personally when you are reading her segments and your reaction positive or negative.

    I would obviously prefer if anything negative was constructive ... but hey I am asking for criticism on the internet, and I am a realist.

    In case it needs to be stated I this is purely for myself I may adopt pieces but I may not, please don't be offended if I don't adopt something that you say.

  10. - Top - End - #400
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    Default Re: Deathknell Chronicles OOC

    Quote Originally Posted by dancrilis View Post
    I have decided I will try out something new to assist me with playing Danielle ... look for feedback from other players (and the storyteller).

    Just wondering if there is anything about how I play her that you either (a) like or (dislike).

    Not really asking about how your characters feel just you personally when you are reading her segments and your reaction positive or negative.

    I would obviously prefer if anything negative was constructive ... but hey I am asking for criticism on the internet, and I am a realist.

    In case it needs to be stated I this is purely for myself I may adopt pieces but I may not, please don't be offended if I don't adopt something that you say.
    General feedback:
    1. Tendency for run-on sentences and/or lack of commas sometimes makes posts difficult to read.
    2. Danielle, a 17 year-old high school student, is extremely precise in her wording (my character mentioned she speaks like a lawyer). I don't know much about her background so maybe that's something she aspires to and it's intentional, but as a teenager living on the west coast, I would think some slang and references to popular culture would be the norm.

    Other than that, I think it's been pretty good. Each character is different and it is difficult for me, as another player immersed in the game and without really knowing her background, to objectively say whether any RP is good or bad, so the above is just what I've noticed off the top of my head. I'm not sure if this is what you were looking for, but there it is.

    Also, if anyone has feedback (constructive criticism is best; tell me what I need to improve) for my RP or PbP style, please sound off.
    TC for short
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  11. - Top - End - #401
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    Default Re: Deathknell Chronicles OOC

    Quote Originally Posted by dancrilis View Post
    I have decided I will try out something new to assist me with playing Danielle ... look for feedback from other players (and the storyteller).
    Excellent idea. I think I'll do the same with Amy.

    Dancrilis: I guess my one criticism is more or less the same TC had: sometimes Danielle feels older than she's supposed to be, both in the way she talks and acts, but more noticeably in the way she talks. Apart from that, I like the character and the way you are rp-ing her.

    TC: Hmmmm.... This is a difficult one. I think I still don't have a clear grasp of what makes Erica tick to be able to judge. It is also a bit difficult to relate to her, but I guess that's an intended effect on your part. Sorry I've got nothing more constructive to add at the moment, I can just say I've got no issues with your roleplaying.

    "Tales and dreams are the shadow-truths that will endure when mere facts are dust and ashes, and forgot" - N.Gaiman, The Sandman

  12. - Top - End - #402
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    OrcBarbarianGuy

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    Default Re: Deathknell Chronicles OOC

    Well, I think for characters (including many, many of my NPCs) need to be seen in a few different situations. I will say one thing I see in all RPing games, and I do this myself is using logic over emotion too much. Sure, there are plenty of timeswhen logic comes first, but emotion makes things more interesting, and throws some curveballs.

    Take Faruq for example. Sure, he fell pretty hard his first night, but when trying to think of how to award Worlok for taking the emotional, not logical road, it made me take a closer look at the setting, and to build new possibilities, in this case with Sean Loveless.

  13. - Top - End - #403
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    Default Re: Deathknell Chronicles OOC

    Dael, just as an idle curiosity: do you plan to open another IC thread for the skip forward (going to chapter 2), or do you want to keep it in the same IC?

    (Yes, I realise I could have waited 3-4 days and found out myself, it's called idle curiosity for a reason )

    "Tales and dreams are the shadow-truths that will endure when mere facts are dust and ashes, and forgot" - N.Gaiman, The Sandman

  14. - Top - End - #404
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    OrcBarbarianGuy

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    Default Re: Deathknell Chronicles OOC

    Still the same thread. This Chapter will end when everyone's more or less established themselves within kindred society, and their antagonists are dealt with.

  15. - Top - End - #405
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    Default Re: Deathknell Chronicles OOC

    Quote Originally Posted by daelrog View Post
    Well, I think for characters (including many, many of my NPCs) need to be seen in a few different situations. I will say one thing I see in all RPing games, and I do this myself is using logic over emotion too much. Sure, there are plenty of timeswhen logic comes first, but emotion makes things more interesting, and throws some curveballs.

    Take Faruq for example. Sure, he fell pretty hard his first night, but when trying to think of how to award Worlok for taking the emotional, not logical road, it made me take a closer look at the setting, and to build new possibilities, in this case with Sean Loveless.
    Rich said something in one of his essays on Rp'ing, about how RP during combat is the most important time to RP. Oftentimes players will RP perfectly out of combat, and once combat starts, statistics and regression analysis take over, with them calculating what actions will give them the best probability for success while consuming the least amount of resources, regardless of that characters' feelings. It's really, _really_ tough to RP your character properly once combat begins, because the natural tendency is to do whatever it takes to preserve this character that you've invested time and effort into bringing to life. It makes for a different sort of game when the players aren't always "trying their best" to survive and the GM isn't always "trying his best" to kill them.
    TC for short
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  16. - Top - End - #406
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    Default Re: Deathknell Chronicles OOC

    Quote Originally Posted by Thundercracker View Post
    It makes for a different sort of game when the players aren't always "trying their best" to survive and the GM isn't always "trying his best" to kill them.
    I agree, and what I feel it takes is a certain level of trust between player and GM. As a player, I have to trust the GM not to needlessly screw me over...or better said, to screw me over in ways I find funny and interesting. As a GM, I suppose, I have to trust the player to go along with me and not intentionally trying to break the game. When this is achieved it makes for really memorable campaigns.

    "Tales and dreams are the shadow-truths that will endure when mere facts are dust and ashes, and forgot" - N.Gaiman, The Sandman

  17. - Top - End - #407
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    Default Re: Deathknell Chronicles OOC

    Okay, I think I might have gotten things under control. At least enough to occasionally drop in again.

    I'll still have to take it easy the next few days, settle in and get things in order, but for the time being, I'm more or less alright, and about to make one Mr al-Assad's return.

    And Strawbs, the virtual hugs did help, so allow me to offer some in return.

  18. - Top - End - #408
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    OrcBarbarianGuy

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    Default Re: Deathknell Chronicles OOC

    No worries. My posting will be sporadic for awhile yet. Found out earlier today I have another trip to make, so I may be gone the next few days.

  19. - Top - End - #409
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    Default Re: Deathknell Chronicles OOC

    WORLOK!!!!!!!!!!! Welcome back! Glad to have helped even a little, and thanks for the hugs. Did you get my e-mail?

    "Tales and dreams are the shadow-truths that will endure when mere facts are dust and ashes, and forgot" - N.Gaiman, The Sandman

  20. - Top - End - #410
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    Default Re: Deathknell Chronicles OOC

    Quote Originally Posted by Thundercracker View Post
    General feedback:
    1. Tendency for run-on sentences and/or lack of commas sometimes makes posts difficult to read.
    That is something I am trying to work on at the moment alright.
    2. Danielle, a 17 year-old high school student, is extremely precise in her wording (my character mentioned she speaks like a lawyer). I don't know much about her background so maybe that's something she aspires to and it's intentional, but as a teenager living on the west coast, I would think some slang and references to popular culture would be the norm.
    This is more deliberate partly because I have always been poor at slang and so having a character say something like "yo dude, what up with that shiz, look bad, bad like a banjaxe not bad like a mofo" to indicate that something has obviously been messed up for the person you are speaking to, has three problems (a) it looks incredible weird to me, (b) I am not sure that anyone anywhere ever spoke like that, (c) takes me longer to write so that even I can read it, understand it and have it roll off the tongue. Let alone having other people have to read it.
    So I had Danielle be well off and have a good education including other languages so that she is used to speaking in a fairly technical fashion.
    Also she is meant to have had a fast growing up period after her sister went missing and has a few decent career paths laid out, so she is possibly more mature then her age would indicate.

    I'm not sure if this is what you were looking for, but there it is.
    Thanks, it is more are less what I was looking for. I am thinking about ways to make her seem younger for when she is at ease.

    Also, if anyone has feedback (constructive criticism is best; tell me what I need to improve) for my RP or PbP style, please sound off.
    I haven't really seen enough of Erica to be sure, I do like that you put the characters natural reaction above trying to force her to adapt to difficult situations unnaturally ... if she would leave you have her leave, which is great.
    The only thing that did strike me as odd was you seemed to be active during the day which I think is something that even if you have light sleeper and early riser are not supposed to make that the norm (even if light sleeper makes it fully functionally possible, I think it would be the same as a human who wants to sleep badly but can act effectively if needed), but that is a very minor thing.

    Quote Originally Posted by Strawberries View Post
    I think I'll do the same with Amy.
    I think Amy is played excellently, I would say that maybe she is a bit blasé about the nosferatu thing ... but I can hardly complain when Danielle has not been shown with the revulsion expected (in what is shaping up to be a theme for her) when she meets appearance 0 characters.
    But yea, very impressed.

    Which thinking about it is not really constructive or feedback ... so I failed on two counts.

  21. - Top - End - #411
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    Danielle Feedback

    Okay, I will do my damnedest to ignore any grammatical or logical errors unless they somehow relate to the character. I may slip and, for that, I do apologize. (Spoilered for length, as I think I slipped maybe a little more than a little. It's early. )

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    I do like Danielle's sort of “crazy cult” angle, though not the way she uses it to feel morally superior to everyone involved.

    To echo what TC said about dialogue, Danielle sounds very wooden. If you want to spice up your dialogue, this page gives some fine advice.

    How does each of your characters talk? The answer will depend on:
    • Geographic background (a Texan doesn't speak the same as a Bostonian)
    • Educational level
    • Age (Like, is your character, like, a total teenager?)
    • Personality (Is your character nervous, impulsive, aggressive, flirtatious, shy?)
    • Your character's relationship with the person she's speaking with. She wouldn't talk to her boss the same way she speaks to a friend or to her five-year-old son.
    • Your character's attitude to the conversation topic. Does it make him nervous, proud, defensive? Would he rather avoid the subject all together? All this will affect his speaking style.
    I'm guessing you're not originally from an English speaking country, because teenagers do not speak the way you've written. Okay, “Yo dude,” is fine but the rest... Casual speech isn't like learning a whole new language. It's simply a matter of omitting unnecessary words and phrases and using more colloquial turns of phrase. See that last sentence? I don't actually talk like that, unless I'm in SUPER SERIOUS MODE ™. In conversation, I would probably say, “You gotta cut the crap and use some frickin' slang. Then you'll be set.” In short:

    • Use contractions and relaxed pronunciations. Won’t, shoulda, gotta, wanna all add a bit of life and variety to your sentences.
    • In the immortal words of Ocean's Eleven, “Never use seven words when four will do.” Formality and sentence length go hand in hand. Reduce the latter, and the former will follow.
    • Don't feel like every sentence and word that passes through your characters lips must be profoundly deep. Teenagers are self-involved little twerps. Use that to your advantage.
    • Profanity. While the board has rules, hell, damn, frickin', ass, jerk cut the formality.
    Speaking of, Danielle is a jerk. She makes the others feel bad about their new condition so they'll be as miserable as she is.

    Brief bit of pedantry, Danielle would be an interpreter not a translator. Also, I don't think court interpreter is a job a seventeen year old would, let alone could, be hired to perform in the United States. She's just too young.

    I must object to the logic of Danielle and, by extension I suppose, Al's plan to protect the city. Bait is all well and good, but not when you live in the trap with it. Put Danielle on a bus to Seattle? Great idea. Let Danielle live in the same city as you and associate with her regularly? Terrible idea. Tough situation, but them's the breaks, kid. [#67]

    All right. She's in close contact with missing persons groups. That makes sense, given her sister, and is pretty cool. However, I would be curious how she could provide closure without legal involvement. Does she think that she can call Grandma Clover and say, "Hi, your family in Havensworth is dead. Be at peace. Thanks!"? [#76]

    I can't help myself on this one. Kicks above your head are useless in combat. Your hip is so overextended that there's no power behind your leg. When you see demonstrators break boards with overhead kicks, they're ~.25" of weak pine wood.

    When and why did she learn five languages? Danielle seems overly accomplished for a seventeen year old. It comes off a bit... Mary Sueish. (I know, I know. Adversity to foreign languages is part of bein' in Amurika! However, Strawbs and Worlok speak only mother tongue + English.)

    Yeah, Faruq talked some smack, but he tried to save Danielle's life when everyone else was doing a questionable job of it. My overall attitude towards someone speaking out on my behalf would be at least neutral. [#85]

    Danielle, in her maturest and calmest tone, impulsively asks for the phone before she even knows what she's going to say. She doesn't even think to ask the actual vampires for advice! ALSO, this would have been a good time for Al to mention the phony call that went out earlier, but... that's on Glorious Leader, not you.

    Danielle comes off suspicious as hell to her mom, and her goodbye calls to mind Michael Westen, who once said, "You sound like you're about to jump off a bridge." Literally. Those sound like the words of someone about to take their own life. Purity didn't almost ruin your efforts. You nearly ruined hers. I wondered if dael was going to nail you to the wall for this, but he did not elect to do so. Lucky for Madame Leblanc.

    Getting a little too specific, so let me just wind down and say that after hating on Faruq for his "crimes," Danielle goes and befriends an actual, straight-up murderer (He of the Flattened Face). She feels superior to the anarchs, thereby perpetuating the same inequality that nearly brought her the Final Death. Danielle's very haughty in both thought and deed, and she's occasionally very unsympathetic to the plights of others. A little insufferable, all told. If that's what you're going for in a character, cool, but I don't find her a particularly likable person.
    Last edited by Nyarai; 2012-11-08 at 12:03 PM. Reason: better pun
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  22. - Top - End - #412
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    Default Re: Deathknell Chronicles OOC

    Thanks for that appreciate it, I think I may have misrepresented the character somewhat as some of the points that you have are actually fully intentional.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nyarai View Post
    she uses it to feel morally superior to everyone involved.
    I had not intended to show her as a morally superior person (either in her old head or in reality), she more just wants to be left alone.


    I'm guessing you're not originally from an English speaking country
    I am in fact but we never really used slang as kids, or now for that matter (more now to be honest), but different cultures I suppose.

    Speaking of, Danielle is a jerk. She makes the others feel bad about their new condition so they'll be as miserable as she is.
    That was both intentional on my part and unintentional on hers, she was not thinking about the others problems at all (which I would personally see as somewhat forgiveable for any character there).

    Brief bit of pedantry, Danielle would be an interpreter not a translator. Also, I don't think court interpreter is a job a seventeen year old would, let alone could, be hired to perform in the United States. She's just too young.
    This might be to do with the US a nation I am not overly familiar with, however this is not a full time job for her it is a method of easy money now and then which I felt would be appropriate enough, multi-linguals seems rare in America (which would both make it not a full time job and also something where they would take who they could get).

    I must object to the logic of Danielle and, by extension I suppose, Al's plan to protect the city. Bait is all well and good, but not when you live in the trap with it. Put Danielle on a bus to Seattle? Great idea. Let Danielle live in the same city as you and associate with her regularly? Terrible idea. Tough situation, but them's the breaks, kid. [#67]
    I would disagree, the kindred have no certainty that the hunter will follow to Seattle. Further nothing prevents him returning unannounced later, this way they have a person who has it in her best interest to find him, that they don't care about losing, and then if she does they can spring the trap (I suspect that Danielle is not actually intended to take him out personally regardless of what she thinks).

    However, I would be curious how she could provide closure without legal involvement. Does she think that she can call Grandma Clover and say, "Hi, your family in Havensworth is dead. Be at peace. Thanks!"? [#76]
    This here is where I think I have really let the character down.
    She had no plan, no scope and was completely out of her depth she would have had no real way of handling this, and she just did not consider that at the moment it happened ... I didn't want to personally add footnotes to the writeup to highlight this it was meant to be taken as obvious that she was out of her depth and not realising it.

    I can't help myself on this one. Kicks above your head are useless in combat. Your hip is so overextended that there's no power behind your leg. When you see demonstrators break boards with overhead kicks, they're ~.25" of weak pine wood.
    That was more a statement of ability, that she could do it with power was intended to be the idea (and in vampire the masquarade kicks do more damage then fists ... until you work out the difficulty adjustment. An aimed kick to the head that connects is going to hurt) while also not expecting them to care at all.

    When and why did she learn five languages? Danielle seems overly accomplished for a seventeen year old.
    This one is simple, her mother speaks French and grow up in France, many europeans speak multiple languages giving Danielle a teacher from childhood.
    I would personally have no difficult with someone speaking that many languages by adulthood (I have worked with a few people who speak more), on top of that she actually likes languages so has worked on them.

    It comes off a bit... Mary Sueish.
    I would somewhat agree with this, it is difficult to make out a young character that is not far superior then they should be in some areas, try making out a child character and see how multi-talented they end up and you will see what I mean.
    The stats break the character concept.

    Yeah, Faruq talked some smack, but he tried to save Danielle's life when everyone else was doing a questionable job of it. My overall attitude towards someone speaking out on my behalf would be at least neutral. [#85]
    This is a bit of a break in communication, here is how Danielle took the scene:
    'it's jus' a formality' = your dead already the trial is just a show.
    "You people do realise that this is a huge waste of time, basically, don't ya, now?" = Get on with it an kill her so we can move on to other matters.

    Sorry if I didn't get Danielle thoughts across correctly on that, effectively she figured she was dead so the comments were taken as confirmation of that.

    Danielle, in her maturest and calmest tone, impulsively asks for the phone before she even knows what she's going to say. She doesn't even think to ask the actual vampires for advice!
    ...
    Danielle comes off suspicious as hell to her mom, and her goodbye calls to mind Michael Westen, who once said, "You sound like you're about to jump off a bridge." Literally. Those sound like the words of someone about to take their own life. Purity didn't almost ruin your efforts. You nearly ruined hers.
    This was also intentional (again on my part), effectively Danielle wanted to let her mother know she was ok ... except she was not ok, and she panicked and messed up.

    Getting a little too specific, so let me just wind down and say that after hating on Faruq for his "crimes," Danielle goes and befriends an actual, straight-up murderer (He of the Flattened Face). She feels superior to the anarchs, thereby perpetuating the same inequality that nearly brought her the Final Death.
    Here Faruq's crimes were secondary to him wanting her dead (in her mind) and Flat Face is a bit of Stockholm syndrome, she needed to adapt and he was there.
    Not really superior to anarchs she just wants to be left alone and they want her to join a cause - they seem decent enough to her ... but opening up with a shotgun didn't ingratiate them to her.

    If that's what you're going for in a character, cool, but I don't find her a particularly likable person.
    Sure to each their own.


    Thanks effectively some of your points seem to stem from the fact that I did not convey what I was intended properly others seem to be because you expect me to play her with the intention of her succeeding at her tasks(calming her mother), seeing all items clearly (Faruq intentions), not falling to hypocrisy (Flat Face, Faruq and her own at times violent nature), and other elements that I feel help define the character.
    I will have to work on how I present her, I would be interested if anyone else actually saw my intentions for what they were so that I can know how much I missed by.

  23. - Top - End - #413
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    Default Re: Deathknell Chronicles OOC

    Quote Originally Posted by dancrilis View Post
    I think Amy is played excellently, I would say that maybe she is a bit blasé about the nosferatu thing ...
    Yeeeeah... that part is HARD for me. I mean, on one hand, she is supposed to not make a big fuss out of it. That is a part of how I imagined the character. On the other hand, when I did imagine the character, she had already been a vampire for a while...so, yeah, how she GETS there is the part that it's difficult to portray. On the third hand (Yeah, I'm a horrible mutant, so what?), I have tried to make so that every time she thinks about it, her mind sorta skirts away from it, and tries to cover with a joke. Guess I wasn't that successful in conveying it.

    Plus, there's something about Amy none of you know yet....

    Quote Originally Posted by Nyarai View Post
    Danielle Feedback
    (in-depth long essay snipped for brevity)
    Awww, I want an essay on Amy, as well!

    However, Strawbs and Worlok speak only mother tongue + English.
    Naaah, don't use me as an example. Italian are almost as bad as Americans with languages... people from other parts of Europe that I know do speak two-three languages with ease, beside their own.

    Quote Originally Posted by dancrilis View Post
    I will have to work on how I present her, I would be interested if anyone else actually saw my intentions for what they were so that I can know how much I missed by.
    The Faruq bit, I didn't get: I thought the same as Nyarai. On the "calming her mother" bit, I had thought you were trying to have the character act a bit irrationally, as well as on the "providing closure" stuff.

    On the "Flat face" issue... I thought the way you were characterizing her was a bit strange. It didn't bother me as much as Nya, but I guess I can count it as another misinterpreted bit.

    So, for me, two of the characterizing bits were on-target and two weren't.

    "Tales and dreams are the shadow-truths that will endure when mere facts are dust and ashes, and forgot" - N.Gaiman, The Sandman

  24. - Top - End - #414
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    Default Re: Deathknell Chronicles OOC

    I see. So your grammar and syntax belie the thought you put into the character. Interesting...

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    Quote Originally Posted by dancrilis View Post
    That was both intentional on my part and unintentional on hers, she was not thinking about the others problems at all (which I would personally see as somewhat forgiveable for any character there).
    Yeah, she's allowed. That was just my gut reaction.

    Quote Originally Posted by dancrilis View Post
    This might be to do with the US a nation I am not overly familiar with, however this is not a full time job for her it is a method of easy money now and then which I felt would be appropriate enough, multi-linguals seems rare in America (which would both make it not a full time job and also something where they would take who they could get).
    A US minor cannot enter a legal contract, nor can they be sued. If Danielle made a mistake, the company and the court would suffer the full consequences.

    Yes, it would be rare that a trial required interpretation. Therefore, a city of half a million could furnish a qualified, bilingual, adult interpreter for each and every instance. Not to mention, courts typically hold session from 9-4, and Danielle attended school.

    Quote Originally Posted by dancrilis View Post
    I would disagree, the kindred have no certainty that the hunter will follow to Seattle. Further nothing prevents him returning unannounced later, this way they have a person who has it in her best interest to find him, that they don't care about losing, and then if she does they can spring the trap (I suspect that Danielle is not actually intended to take him out personally regardless of what she thinks).
    They have no certainty that Jackal will do anything. He could get hit by a bus tomorrow. What they can induce is that, as a hunter, he will follow his current prey. That gives the Primogen control over his movements, and they have no plan ready to assault him now.

    I don't believe the Kindred need help finding Jackal. They need help not being found by him. Al believes he has to die. I feel that, while a nice idea, such action would be neither practical nor beneficial for Havensworth kindred.

    Quote Originally Posted by dancrilis View Post
    This here is where I think I have really let the character down.

    She had no plan, no scope and was completely out of her depth she would have had no real way of handling this, and she just did not consider that at the moment it happened ... I didn't want to personally add footnotes to the writeup to highlight this it was meant to be taken as obvious that she was out of her depth and not realising it.
    Another pitfall of coming across as a "weak" writer; people tend to assume tactical errors are unintentional. Not to mention you wrote, "Considering carefully" beforehand, which gives the complete opposite impression than you intended.

    Quote Originally Posted by dancrilis View Post
    That was more a statement of ability, that she could do it with power was intended to be the idea (and in vampire the masquarade kicks do more damage then fists ... until you work out the difficulty adjustment. An aimed kick to the head that connects is going to hurt) while also not expecting them to care at all.
    It's actually not possible to deliver a forceful kick above your own head. This man told me so.

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    That's beautiful form and a true feat of flexibility, but not very powerful. The hip muscles do not have the range of motion to create upward force. Have you ever done a split? Ever tried to move your feet? It's really hard with your hips overextended like that, isn't it? It's basically the same concept. If Danielle wants to kick taller people in their heads, she's gonna have to jump for it.

    Quote Originally Posted by dancrilis View Post
    This one is simple, her mother speaks French and grow up in France, many europeans speak multiple languages giving Danielle a teacher from childhood.
    I would personally have no difficult with someone speaking that many languages by adulthood (I have worked with a few people who speak more), on top of that she actually likes languages so has worked on them.
    This underscores a flaw I've seen in a number of game systems. Languages are always binary; you're either fluent or know nothing. I doubt your co-workers had full mastery of every language they knew. Danielle's mum probably doesn't either, so Danielle certainly won't. I can understand her being conversant (at various levels) in five languages, but not proficient. (My linguistics-loving friend, who is 27, currently has ~5 languages under his belt.)

    Quote Originally Posted by dancrilis View Post
    I would somewhat agree with this, it is difficult to make out a young character that is not far superior then they should be in some areas, try making out a child character and see how multi-talented they end up and you will see what I mean.

    The stats break the character concept.
    Did you prioritize Knowledge or something? Otherwise, there are totally enough Knowledges for her to be a seventeen year old with, even allocating all 9 dots.

    Quote Originally Posted by dancrilis View Post
    This is a bit of a break in communication, here is how Danielle took the scene:
    'it's jus' a formality' = your dead already the trial is just a show.
    "You people do realise that this is a huge waste of time, basically, don't ya, now?" = Get on with it an kill her so we can move on to other matters.

    Sorry if I didn't get Danielle thoughts across correctly on that, effectively she figured she was dead so the comments were taken as confirmation of that.
    I think Worlok's intention was clear, and that Danielle would have easily been able to glean it from Faruq's tone.

    Quote Originally Posted by dancrilis View Post
    This was also intentional (again on my part), effectively Danielle wanted to let her mother know she was ok ... except she was not ok, and she panicked and messed up.
    There's a gulf of difference between "I wish to RP panic and ineffectiveness" and "I've just set in motion a string of events that the ST (who cut a guy's tongue out) could easily twist to have my mother hunted down and exsanguinated."

    Quote Originally Posted by dancrilis View Post
    Here Faruq's crimes were secondary to him wanting her dead (in her mind) and Flat Face is a bit of Stockholm syndrome, she needed to adapt and he was there.
    Righto. Still dunno if I'd like Flat Face.

    Quote Originally Posted by dancrilis View Post
    Not really superior to anarchs she just wants to be left alone and they want her to join a cause - they seem decent enough to her ... but opening up with a shotgun didn't ingratiate them to her.
    I wonder... Why would they shoot a cop in the face anyway? The anarchs are aware that a "raid" isn't defined as, "one lone officer who no one will ever miss," yeah?

    Quote Originally Posted by dancrilis View Post
    Sure to each their own.
    Who knows, maybe she has some decency under that hard candy shell.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Strawberries View Post
    Yeeeeah... that part is HARD for me. I mean, on one hand, she is supposed to not make a big fuss out of it. That is a part of how I imagined the character. On the other hand, when I did imagine the character, she had already been a vampire for a while...so, yeah, how she GETS there is the part that it's difficult to portray. On the third hand (Yeah, I'm a horrible mutant, so what?), I have tried to make so that every time she thinks about it, her mind sorta skirts away from it, and tries to cover with a joke. Guess I wasn't that successful in conveying it.
    I don't have the energy for another mega-essay, and I'm not sure I would have the same ammunition about Amy. However, I think her reaction is fine as it is. Everyone handles grief differently, and Amy could either be still in denial about the situation, or she could just be a resilient woman and skipped grief entirely. Human minds are made to adapt to change quickly, positive or negative, so I say keep doing what you're doing. Though if Amy happens to flip out next time she peeks in the mirror, well, no one would fault her for it.
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  26. - Top - End - #416
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nyarai View Post
    A US minor cannot enter a legal contract, nor can they be sued. If Danielle made a mistake, the company and the court would suffer the full consequences.
    Ah ... this I did not know.
    Assuming that daelrog is comfortable with it I will use the idea that the world of darkness is a dark reflection of our own where things are harsher and so the law is relaxed allowing for more exploitation of minors as workers entering into contracts they may not be mentally fit to review.
    - Otherwise opps I guess Havensworth paperwork is a mess.

    What they can induce is that, as a hunter, he will follow his current prey. That gives the Primogen control over his movements, and they have no plan ready to assault him now.
    Here I think that you are fashioning him with supernatural powers of tracking prey that we have no evidence he possesses.

    I don't believe the Kindred need help finding Jackal. They need help not being found by him. Al believes he has to die. I feel that, while a nice idea, such action would be neither practical nor beneficial for Havensworth kindred.
    I would disagree with your analysis, I think if they knew where he was and slept they would be moving against him. I think they are worried because they know next to nothing about him.
    - But time will tell.
    Another pitfall of coming across as a "weak" writer; people tend to assume tactical errors are unintentional. Not to mention you wrote, "Considering carefully" beforehand, which gives the complete opposite impression than you intended.
    Yes (but baring my mind being all over the place) I did not actually write any actual actions to take, but again my bad.

    It's actually not possible to deliver a forceful kick above your own head. This man told me so.
    Sorry you are mixing up the physical reality of the real world with the physical reality of VtM.
    Kick - Dex+Brawl(aimed to the head damage bonus +2).
    This is more powerful* then.
    Punch - Dex+Brawl(aimed to the head damage bonus +1).
    (baring the difficulty adjustment and skill at particular items).

    Danielle learned to fight using the VtM system not the real world system.
    (I have through the years tried to explain this to people in lots of games using lots of combat systems it boils down to the character accepting the rules of reality as they are presented to them not theoretical reality that has no baring on them - if you don't get it cool no worries, I got bored of that conversation years ago).
    - Aerial kicks can have higher difficulty and damage as the storyteller deems appropriate (per the kick text - it also holds true generally).

    This underscores a flaw I've seen in a number of game systems. Languages are always binary; you're either fluent or know nothing.
    We will disagree here, it is not a flaw to me it is simply the rules of reality for the world the characters are in.

    I doubt your co-workers had full mastery of every language they knew.
    Actually yes it was a technical support centre and they were employed to provide technical support in the languages they spoke.

    Did you prioritize Knowledge or something? Otherwise, there are totally enough Knowledges for her to be a seventeen year old with, even allocating all 9 dots.
    But even that is to many in a sense, my seventeen year old has a single dot in everything (baring one knowledge) - this means that she is more more skilled in nearly everything then the average person.
    Take <attribute> 2 + <knowledge> 1 and compare it to someone with <attribute> 5 + <many knowledges> 0.
    The first person can attempt more or less everything, run a company financial system, hack a computer, deal with bureaucracy, build a bomb, preform a ritual, fight a legal battle, discuss world history etc.
    The second cannot unless they happen to have the skill, this means that the first person if they can choose the battlefield can always win, and has more more ability to choose said battlefield by pulling on their abilities.
    Should a seventeen year old be able to outmanoeuvre a 40 year old at most things?

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    I think Worlok's intention was clear, and that Danielle would have easily been able to glean it from Faruq's tone.

    While stressed out and resigned to death?

    There's a gulf of difference between "I wish to RP panic and ineffectiveness" and "I've just set in motion a string of events that the ST (who cut a guy's tongue out) could easily twist to have my mother hunted down and exsanguinated."
    You see this is just it, a player (in my mind) should not run from the negative items that a character brings on themselves, whether it is death for the character, mental anguish etc, the character should be played truly without worrying about if the storyteller will punish you for it.
    But that is just me (a decade ago I would have protected my characters well against bad things: will10, vicissitude 4, serpentis 3, fortitude, potence, celerity, presence, auspex, obfuscate, obtenebration, and generation 5 ... these should be what your character spends their initial few years getting (other then generation which should be 5 starting) - what do you mean it is stupid for a character to regard this as a top priority?
    Righto. Still dunno if I'd like Flat Face.
    Like might be to strong a word, she does not dislike him (but he has not done anything to her).


    Thanks I do like talking about characters (and the world in general) as it give me the ability to correct areas where I am going wrong ... and have areas where I (rather then the character) has been illogical corrected.

  27. - Top - End - #417
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    Ah, I see. I like my game worlds more realistic (in some respects) than perhaps you prefer. In that case, there's little to be done except agree to disagree.

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    But even that is to many in a sense, my seventeen year old has a single dot in everything (baring one knowledge) - this means that she is more more skilled in nearly everything then the average person.
    Take <attribute> 2 + <knowledge> 1 and compare it to someone with <attribute> 5 + <many knowledges> 0.
    The first person can attempt more or less everything, run a company financial system, hack a computer, deal with bureaucracy, build a bomb, preform a ritual, fight a legal battle, discuss world history etc.
    The second cannot unless they happen to have the skill, this means that the first person if they can choose the battlefield can always win, and has more more ability to choose said battlefield by pulling on their abilities.
    However, a quick rules consultation, as I'm not sure we are on the same page. Attributes are calculated on a scale of 1-5

    1 Poor
    2 Average
    3 Good
    4 Exceptional
    5 Outstanding

    While Abilities are on a similar scale labeled as follows.

    1 Novice
    2 Practiced
    3 Competent
    4 Expert
    5 Master

    Behold, the Herculean tasks one must perform to receive a single dot in the following knowledges:

    Academics: Stay awake during history class in high school.
    Computer: Point and click. Child's play.
    Finance: Take a business course.
    Investigation: Read detective novels.
    Law: Watch some courtroom dramas.
    Linguistics: Take a foreign language class in high school.
    Medicine: Take a CPR course.
    Occult: Read some new age books. Or, more embarrassingly, have a Wiccan phase in high school.
    Politics: Be active about a cause.
    Science: Stay awake during chemistry, biology, or physics classes in high school.

    I hit 7/10 of those when I was that age. If I'd taken Economics, had the energy for activism, or given a damn about Wicca aside from those cool necklaces, I'd be 10/10. Take a college-level course in any of those subjects (which I did), and suddenly, you've got two dots. So Danielle is an above-average, but not wildly remarkable, specimen of young adulthood.

    Should a seventeen year old be able to outmanoeuvre a 40 year old at most things?
    Yeah, actually.
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    Default Re: Deathknell Chronicles OOC

    Quote Originally Posted by Strawbs
    WORLOK!!!!!!!!!!! Welcome back! Glad to have helped even a little, and thanks for the hugs. Did you get my e-mail?
    Awww, thank you there. But sadly, no. Allow me to send you a PM, however, and perchance that loss can be undone.

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    Default Re: Deathknell Chronicles OOC

    Quote Originally Posted by Nyarai View Post
    Ah, I see. I like my game worlds more realistic (in some respects) than perhaps you prefer.
    Maybe, effectively I like to take the rules as I understand them.
    My job has changed recently, but previously I was engaged in manager meetings at a daily basic and we would have professional roleplay scenarios.
    If X then how should we act:
    For the purpose of the exercise: We need to treat this in this way and take these actions.
    Practical reality: We ignore it, it is such a rare issue that it is not worth more thought until it happens again within 3 month period.

    For gaming purposes I take reality as it is rather then indroducing external elements that have no baring on the rule structure the characters operate in.

    In that case, there's little to be done except agree to disagree.
    Sure
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    However, a quick rules consultation, as I'm not sure we are on the same page. Attributes are calculated on a scale of 1-5

    1 Poor
    2 Average
    3 Good
    4 Exceptional
    5 Outstanding

    While Abilities are on a similar scale labeled as follows.

    1 Novice
    2 Practiced
    3 Competent
    4 Expert
    5 Master

    Behold, the Herculean tasks one must perform to receive a single dot in the following knowledges:

    Academics: Stay awake during history class in high school.
    Computer: Point and click. Child's play.
    Finance: Take a business course.
    Investigation: Read detective novels.
    Law: Watch some courtroom dramas.
    Linguistics: Take a foreign language class in high school.
    Medicine: Take a CPR course.
    Occult: Read some new age books. Or, more embarrassingly, have a Wiccan phase in high school.
    Politics: Be active about a cause.
    Science: Stay awake during chemistry, biology, or physics classes in high school.

    I hit 7/10 of those when I was that age. If I'd taken Economics, had the energy for activism, or given a damn about Wicca aside from those cool necklaces, I'd be 10/10. Take a college-level course in any of those subjects (which I did), and suddenly, you've got two dots. So Danielle is an above-average, but not wildly remarkable, specimen of young adulthood.



    Yeah, actually. [/QUOTE]

    All true enough in the reality you were raised in, however in the world of darkness even with knowledge primary you only have 13 dots (less for a generic NPC), meaning that the average person cannot undertake those tasks (they can't even roll to try).


    Again this depend on how you view the world, I like my game worlds to have hard and fast rules (to be over thrown by the ST as needed), rather then catch all rules that allow players to abuse them by 'faking' skills they don't have.
    For example a scientist should have science, fair enough I doubt anyone seriously disagrees, a conman who impersonates a scientist should also then have science to achieve the con.
    The conman might be able to use subterfuge for a brief period of time but not for any extended period.
    Similarly politicians should have politics, nobles should have etiquette, musicians should have performance, bruisers should have intimidate etc, and they should not be able to default to 'faking' it to a skill they are actually good at (bruiser and brawl for example).
    Last edited by dancrilis; 2012-11-09 at 07:39 PM. Reason: There were a lot of mistakes in that post (some may remain).

  30. - Top - End - #420
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    Default Re: Deathknell Chronicles OOC

    Sorry you are mixing up the physical reality of the real world with the physical reality of VtM.
    Kick - Dex+Brawl(aimed to the head damage bonus +2).
    This is more powerful* then.
    Punch - Dex+Brawl(aimed to the head damage bonus +1).
    (baring the difficulty adjustment and skill at particular items).

    Danielle learned to fight using the VtM system not the real world system.
    (I have through the years tried to explain this to people in lots of games using lots of combat systems it boils down to the character accepting the rules of reality as they are presented to them not theoretical reality that has no baring on them - if you don't get it cool no worries, I got bored of that conversation years ago).
    - Aerial kicks can have higher difficulty and damage as the storyteller deems appropriate (per the kick text - it also holds true generally).
    This can be resolved by saying part of the difficulty increase of aiming for a more vulnerable spot (head) is getting into a position where an effective kick can be delivered, like doing some kind of sick kung fu movie spin move off a wall or a chair, or punching the guy in the stomach first to get him to double over. A single attack roll doesn't necessarily mean a single attack. Fluff up the combat descriptions a little bit and everyone will be happy. Just don't expect the fluff to have a direct influence on the mechanics.
    Last edited by Thundercracker; 2012-11-09 at 09:46 PM.
    TC for short
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