Classic Werewolf: The Village of Vilcas

[Gray Mage]

As someone who switched off TF when he claimed Seer, I have to note that that is Town behaviour, not Wolf, even if the outcome was the opposite.

Just wanting to get this said, but switching off from a claiming seer isn't much of a town only behaviour, wolves would also switch, as being of the guys that lynched the seer is a quick ticket to being lynched themselves. All in all, if the wolves didn't know about TF, I'd say that the ones that look the most like wolves would be those that quietly stayed voting for TF, ato not draw attention and have the good excuse of not seeing the claim before day ended.

@52.5's logic: Now, on this I have to agree with Rogue, it's a bit lacking. Point nº1 is more or less "he voted on RL, plus he's bossy/imposing so the other wolves would follow him". That doesn't look very solid, but luckly for us, we can have a second opinion of Grimmace. If I'm not mistaken, Grue Bait also know both of you, right (or am I misremembering)?

The second post is also lacking. Grimmace's first vote was at a moment no one was caring about the 1/3, while on his second vote TF already had 1/3+ votes on him. Plus, it's not like he was the only one not voting on bandwagons on either circumstance. Singling him out for those reasons sounds off to me.

[Murska]

Yeah, I would personally look at people who voted for TigerFang early and then didn't post later on. They're either inactive villagers or wolves. But I can see the problem in Grimmace's actions: He voted, then switched the vote so he clearly was paying attention to the debate, but he didn't switch to the TF counterwagon to save the Seer. Obviously switching onto the TF wagon after the Seer claim would be about the most wolfy thing ever, and no wolf would risk it, but not switching to the counterwagon is a safe way of making it more likely the Seer is lynched anyway.

Or he could've just been offline during that time. *shrug*

I'm voting for superdark mainly because his attitude annoys me - the defense 'I always act like a wolf, regardless of whether I am one' is a very poor defense.

[Gray Mage]

Yeah, I would personally look at people who voted for TigerFang early and then didn't post later on. They're either inactive villagers or wolves. But I can see the problem in Grimmace's actions: He voted, then switched the vote so he clearly was paying attention to the debate, but he didn't switch to the TF counterwagon to save the Seer.

While I think this is a better argument then 52.5 made, the same point could be said from Grue Bait and Lex-Kat. The three voted off wagon "around" the same time (from Grimm's to Lex's and GB's posts there were about 4 hours of difference, hence the "around") and the three were made hours before TF claimed. Heck, Grimm's vote was 7 hours before TF claimed, so way before the debate began.

By the way, does anyone know yesterday's final vote count?

[Murska]

The fact that other people also did it doesn't make it any less suspicious.

[Count Dingdong]

By the way, does anyone know yesterday's final vote count?

Twas:
Tigerfang - 10 (w/ supers change from Reinholdt)
Gray Mage - 8
Grue Bait, 52.5, Rienholdt, Atreyu, Grimace - 1 each

And looking over that... superdark's change vot instead of crosing out is strange. Some reason he doesn't want tie to Reinholt?

Current day:
Superdark - 7
52.5 lemons - 4
Grimmace - 4
Elemetal - 2

17 -> 6 to lynch

[Eldritch Knight]

I vote Gray Mage

[Zar Peter]

While his "arguement" for Grimmace is... somewhat sound*, he did not assuage any of the suspicions towards himself. He was the first and ONLY person to vote for Elemental (who was probabistically speaking the wolf's lynch target). Elemental was "fairly high on [his] radar right now" but he had no backing data. Then he switched to Tiger Fang to avoid a no-lynch. Then when TF claimed seer, he switched off to the "safer" Gray Mage, who is currently an unknown. I have seen times when both targets were wolves, but that is super-rare, at least on day 2.

*Except no, it really isn't. Last time he used the "I know Grimmace in real life" that I can remember, it was because Grimm accidentally let known that he was a wolf when Lemons wasn't. There has been no proof that I can remember, either as a wolf or not, that Grimmace likes to "play leader" as Lemons says. Also, even if he does, then NK'ing his vote target would be a mistake, because it would lead to the sloppy reasoning that Lemon's himself provided as a reason against.

What is more plausible? That Grimmace lead the wolves into killing the person he voted for on day one so that Lemons would think there was no way he would do what he just did and therefore cannot be a wolf, or that NOT happening?

Well, at least now you gave some reasons. I don't know how Lemmons came to his point but at least he reflected about it and explained why he did so. Then you came with the next post and pointed at the person above you without any comment (except RP). Now that you explained I'm sufficiently satisfied and will not point at you in the next hours (except the seer's proxy stands up and says that you are a wolf)

[52.5 Lemons]

I know my reasoning wasn't very sound logically but I wanted to get some debate going rather than just a random bandwagon. Although I think Grue Bait could attest to Grimmace taking a leadership role, especially if he was on a team with mostly new players. I'm not saying he's the best target, I'm just putting those facts out there. Yes I could say similar stuff about other players, but as I know Grimm personally, he sticks out in my mind as a target.

[Reinholdt]

Well I was going to vote elemental, but then I looked back and it was Julian84 I was thinking of, splitting up all the logic. Stupid look-alike avatars.

Not convinced on superdark. Think I'll go 52.5 lemons.

[inky13112]

Well I was going to vote elemental, but then I looked back and it was Julian84 I was thinking of, splitting up all the logic. Stupid look-alike avatars.

Not convinced on superdark. Think I'll go 52.5 lemons.

So if you're not convinced on super dark, what makes you so sure on lemons?

[Reinholdt]

Are you suggesting if one's innocent, so is the other?

[Alarra]

Not convinced about anyone's guilt or innocence currently, but I'm going to point superdark cause I have a headache and he usually makes them worse.

[52.5 Lemons]

Are you suggesting if one's innocent, so is the other?

I think he was merely pointing out the fact that the reason against me is gut feeling, so why would you vote me over someone that has some reasoning?

EDIT: I also can't help but notice that Grimmace hasn't posted on here at all and his personal profile page says he was one about 4 hours ago (estimating).

RE-EDIT: Apparently it is due to a large amount of homework being a priority.

[Reinholdt]

Your posts have you defending yourself heavily with some quasi-logic.

I chose you because to me you've been acting more suspicious and shifty than superdark.

[52.5 Lemons]

My first post today wasn't defending myself. A random bandwagon right off the bat isn't a threat to anybody. I was voting and providing my reasoning. It wasnt intended to be a defense but rather a vote that wasn't random.

[Reinholdt]

3 votes against you.
You immediately declare that they all lacked reasoning and were random.
Then provide an attack on someone else to shift the wagons their way.
Even now you defend yourself.

I'm going to be straight with you. Short of day one, even when I make a short quiet post, there's almost always reason behind it. It is not random. Anyone can agree with it or disagree with it by pointing in red at the person they find most suspicious, but people who call me out for making a post and declaring random, particularly when they get defensive about it make me extremely extra suspicious. I'm more convinced now than when I pointed that you're the right choice.

So no. No gut feeling. No random. I made a distinct choice to pick you.

[Elemental]

I'll go with Elemental for the reasoning that TigerFang wanted to use him in his defense, and Elemental apologized for not acknowledging the PM.

Also, he's the second in the bandwagon against 52.5 Lemons, without any reasoning aside from needing 8 votes to lynch.

Firstly, I was apologising for not being online to respond to an urgent PM.
Nothing to do with the game.

And secondly, that's a place holding vote until I make up my mind. I can remove it if it's bugging you.



Edit:
{table=head]Player|# votes
52.5 Lemons|5
super dark33|7
The Grimmace|4
Elemental|1
Gray Mage|1[/table]

Hmm... Eight votes required for a lynch, forty-one hours left to decide.


Note to self: Remember to convert values from alphabetical to numerical...

[52.5 Lemons]

3 votes against you.
You immediately declare that they all lacked reasoning and were random.
Then provide an attack on someone else to shift the wagons their way.
Even now you defend yourself.

There are so many things wrong with this. First, the 3 votes against me were based off 1. Gut feeling, 2. To start a bandwagon to reach the required vote number, also a place holder, and 3. Because I'm not evil (whatever that means). So if you don't call those mostly random, what do you call them?

Second, I did not immediately declare that they lacked reasoning and were random. The first thing I said was "Let's throw some reasoning into the mix, shall we?". I said that because there hadn't been a logical argument yet. Yes I pointed at Grimmace in the post but that was because I had no other leads. I'd rather vote based on slight reasoning than randomness. And I would hardly call 3 votes with no discussion or real reasoning a bandwagon. Mostly they were just placeholder votes.

Third, yes I'm slightly defending myself, but not from those first three votes against me. Those mean practically nothing. I'm defending myself against you and the conclusions you have jumped to. Defense is neither a wolf thing to do or a town thing to do. A villager who gives their self up is in no way helping the town. The wolves win off of villagers dying, yes? So the more villagers the town looses, the greater the advantage for the wolves. In either case, the person being voted for should defend themselves because it helps their team. Assuming that less defense is more likely a villager is wrong because it is just as important for a villager that they stay in the game as it is a wolf. You shouldn't base suspicion off of how much they are defending themselves.

So Reinholdt, your initial reasoning was because the reasoning for SuperDark didn't have you convinced. Could you elaborate?

[Lady Serpentine]

I'm going to vote for Lex-Kat, since her posts are reminding me of what she did when we were wolves in Dragonspire II.

[super dark33]

Twas:
Tigerfang - 10 (w/ supers change from Reinholdt)
Gray Mage - 8
Grue Bait, 52.5, Rienholdt, Atreyu, Grimace - 1 each

And looking over that... superdark's change vot instead of crosing out is strange. Some reason he doesn't want tie to Reinholt?

Current day:
Superdark - 7
52.5 lemons - 4
Grimmace - 4
Elemetal - 2

17 -> 6 to lynch

I just hate crossing.
i always did it.

[Reinholdt]

There are so many things wrong with this. First, the 3 votes against me were based off 1. Gut feeling, 2. To start a bandwagon to reach the required vote number, also a place holder, and 3. Because I'm not evil (whatever that means). So if you don't call those mostly random, what do you call them?

Second, I did not immediately declare that they lacked reasoning and were random. The first thing I said was "Let's throw some reasoning into the mix, shall we?". I said that because there hadn't been a logical argument yet. Yes I pointed at Grimmace in the post but that was because I had no other leads. I'd rather vote based on slight reasoning than randomness. And I would hardly call 3 votes with no discussion or real reasoning a bandwagon. Mostly they were just placeholder votes.

Third, yes I'm slightly defending myself, but not from those first three votes against me. Those mean practically nothing. I'm defending myself against you and the conclusions you have jumped to. Defense is neither a wolf thing to do or a town thing to do. A villager who gives their self up is in no way helping the town. The wolves win off of villagers dying, yes? So the more villagers the town looses, the greater the advantage for the wolves. In either case, the person being voted for should defend themselves because it helps their team. Assuming that less defense is more likely a villager is wrong because it is just as important for a villager that they stay in the game as it is a wolf. You shouldn't base suspicion off of how much they are defending themselves.

So Reinholdt, your initial reasoning was because the reasoning for SuperDark didn't have you convinced. Could you elaborate?

Call it what you will, but you're jumping at shadows.

And no, I will not. There's nothing to elaborate on.

[Matthias2207]

There's a whole lot of debating going on here.
I don't think that Lemons is a wolf and I still want to hear more from Grimmace.
Looks like we could kill super dark today. There's always a chance he's a wolf, especially since he has this 'act like a wolf, whatever your role is' cover.

[Count Dingdong]

Votes:
superdark - 9
52.5 - 5
Grimmace - 2
GrayMage, Lex, Elemetal, Rienholdt - 1 each

Hmm... Eight votes required for a lynch, forty-one hours left to decide.

amount for lynch depends on number voting. Current 20 votes -> 7 for lynch. But above 8 anyway. 17 hrs left?

[Gray Mage]

Votes:
superdark - 9
52.5 - 5
Grimmace - 2
GrayMage, Lex, Elemetal, Rienholdt - 1 each

Are you sure this is correct? In Elemental's vote count super was at 7 votes, so with Matthias it'd be 8, not 9.

[Count Dingdong]

Are you sure this is correct? In Elemental's vote count super was at 7 votes, so with Matthias it'd be 8, not 9.

Yep, recounted. Previous for my cout was 7, then alarra added one, but Elementals still was 7. So not just Matthias but Allarra as well.

[Elemental]

Did I miscount?
I'll go check that and make a new table.


Also, I say eight because if everyone votes, then eight is the required number, so if we can get to eight, then we've decided.


Yep. I miscounted because I can't count and I'm blind.

{table=head]Player|# votes
52.5 Lemons|5
super dark33|9
The Grimmace|2
Elemental|1
Gray Mage|1
Reinholdt|1
Lex-Kat|1[/table]

About sixteen hours or so left in the day.

[Dragoon]

Well, through me with the super_dark33

[super dark33]

Fine then!
strike me down and the bar goes kapoot!

[Gnomish Wanderer]

Day 3 End!
The town had gathered in the tavern, holding a whole barrel of lemons in shackles. "I sensed something dangerous here, some kind of fruit. It was the cursed lemons! They must be a werewolf!" Gray Mage said, pointing at the insidious fruit.

Super Dark grinned from behind the bar as the town gathered around the lemons, knives menacingly sharp. Without Lemons, his orange juice would flourish! 'This is a win win', he thought as he pulled on his fur coat and joined the crowd.

But Fleeing Chicken, who just didn't manage to flee as the pass was snowed over, glanced suspiciously at SuperDark. "That's an interesting coat you have there."

"It's wolf fur, I always wear a wolf fur coat."

"THERE, HE ADMITTED IT, GET HIM!" The crowd turned on Superdark, quickly tying his arms and legs as he struggled and screamed, "NO! You don't understand! You can't leave the oranges alone for more than a few minutes! Untie me!"

The town just snickered and threw him behind the bar as they left to get more rope. His wolf tricks wouldn't work on them now.

Alone in the bar, Superdark edged towards the oranges as they began to buzz ever so slightly. It was too late. The last thought through his mind was that of regret: 'Why did I invent an unstable combustible orange?'

BOOM!

super dark33 was lynched! He was a Villager!
Players

Spoiler

Show

{table=head]#|Player|Killed|Role
1|Alarra
2|The Grimmace
3|TigerFang|Day 2|Devil
4|Penguinator
5|Grue Bait
6|Gray Mage
7|Atreyu the Masked Llama
8|Zar Peter
9|Elemental
10|usourselves&we|Night 2|Villager
11|Matthias2207
12|Reinholdt
13|Lex-Kat
14|DiscipleofBob
15|Rogue Nine
16|Eldritch Knight
17|Tom the Mime
18|Count Dingdong
19|Fleeing Coward
20|Dragoon
21|Julian24
22|super dark33|Day 3|Villager
23|inky13112
24|C'nor
25|Rules Lawyer #1|Night 1|Mason
26|52.5 Lemons
27|Murska[/table]

Night 3 Start!
Ends in about 24 hours

Official Poll:
How much wood would a werewolf wolf if a werewolf would wolf wood?

• Yes
• No

Ends at the start of Day 4! Vote now!

[Penguinator]

The answer is yes, obviously. Of course, you were expecting me to say that, so the answer is no. Which is what I would have said were I not an intelligent man. Since I am an intelligent man, and you are not an intelligent man, the answer is yes. But, you are an intelligent woman, which means the answer is no. But, the answer to a question a woman asks is almost never no, which means that the answer is yes. But, the question in itself is a trick, so the answer must be no, and you're just testing me. But, you would have expected that I would expect it was a trick, and the answer is yes. But, I can obviously not take the glass in front of me, so the answer is Both.